Alexander Dennis Enviro400 Discussion

[monkeyjoe]

Been told via NXWM Head office after complaint that 94 is getting upgraded, weather that means cascaded or new buses was not clear.

Will probably be cascades. Are Geminis the usual allocation now then? And if so, what's so wrong with them that people are complaining?

I wouldn't mind having a few more Geminis at Acocks Green, if only to get shot of a few more Presidents! (which are really starting to show their age)

This was before they started getting Geminis, with the competition from Claribels and volumes definately deserves brand new branded bus, last time i recall was 2002.

[Liberator9]

I'd happily have Geminis - good buses for their age. I'd rather have them than some ADL stuff - build quality on the 14 regs are shocking.

[Sayeed]

Really you're better off sending enviros to a depot that already has the type and has the spares.

Realistic options are:
Send them to Yardley and you could see off some tridents to Coventry, cascading Gemini's to Acocks Green and also see off presidents.
Send them to Birmingham and you could give Yardley tridents to see off presidents.
Keep them at Pensnett to see off Mercs
Send them to wolverhampton to see off mercs
Send them to Walsall to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green
Send them to Perry barr to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green.
Send them to west brom to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green
Send them to Coventry to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green

and send 4680 - 86 to Dundee, I'd add

[lauren1993]

Really you're better off sending enviros to a depot that already has the type and has the spares.

Realistic options are:
Send them to Yardley and you could see off some tridents to Coventry, cascading Gemini's to Acocks Green and also see off presidents.
Send them to Birmingham and you could give Yardley tridents to see off presidents.
Keep them at Pensnett to see off Mercs
Send them to wolverhampton to see off mercs
Send them to Walsall to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green
Send them to Perry barr to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green.
Send them to west brom to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green
Send them to Coventry to cascade Gemini's to Acocks Green

and send 4680 - 86 to Dundee, I'd add

I hope Coventry do NOT lose their geminis! They're by far the best buses at Coventry at the moment!
It'd make more sense to send 4680 - 4686 to Coventry, to keep the fleet numbers together with 4687-4696, as Coventry already operates the type anyway, so I don't see why they couldn't receive more geminis.

[winston]

I would think the 9 will get brand new vehicles, and then the e400s which used to be on 9 can go on 141/241/140 and 246

If the 9 gets new vehicles, i would expect the Enviros to be transferred out to another garage and the Tridents be kept for the 140/1/241!

Why?

Being as the Enviros are still "relatively" new, would have thought they would replace older buses at another garage, eg: Presidents at AG for the 11? Do the 140/1/241 really need Enviro 400s?

Or they could just be cascaded on to the 120 or 276 to release B7RLE to replace Mercs?

[don]

Hercules Poirot suggests:-
12 months = October 2014 to September 2015

4961-4995 = 35
831-860 = 30
751-764 = 14
Plus 171 = 250

And
4911-4995 = 85
831-860 = 30
751-764 = 14
Plus 171 = 300 (meeting Centro pledge)

Hercules Poirot needs to retire....  :P

4914-4995 = 82 (only the 26 x PB E400's were included in the Centro Agreement i.e. 63 plate onwards)
831-860 = 30
751-764 = 14
Plus 171 = 297 (3 short of meeting Centro 300 pledge being petty)

Hercules Poirot is outraged at such a suggestion  :D however not so much as to not make a couple more suggestions:-

Perhaps when Walsall receives its platinum E400 (major model change) buses (surely ADL will come up with a better name for the production run) - they may like to send some 56 reg B7RLEs to Dundee to replace their aging single deckers.

He also predicts Wolverhampton might receive a batch of E400s for the 126 and replace those fabulous Spectras. Wolverhampton has endured around 35 (or more) of the oldest vehicles in the fleet for so many years now it will seem strange when the Spectras and B6s are gone.

[Liverpool Street]

@don - What's with all the 'Hercules Poirot' crap?

[don]

@don - What's with all the 'Hercules Poirot' crap?

Is that a technical term, boss!! It was simply that these predictions of what buses will go where and how many, and some of the other mysteries like is it 171 or 250 buses, and how many Spectras are really out of service are rather like a Hercules Poirot mystery.

[Stu]

That's presuming that 29 Enviros elsewhere frees up 29 Geminis to cascade to Acocks Green. To completely upgrade the 11 with new buses would require approx 42 new vehicles.

Why couldn't AG have Enviro 400s?

At some point, it is inevitable that AG will end up with Enviro400s, probably more likely new ones though if they do.

[winston]

Hercules Poirot is outraged at such a suggestion  :D however not so much as to not make a couple more suggestions:-

Perhaps when Walsall receives its platinum E400 (major model change) buses (surely ADL will come up with a better name for the production run) - they may like to send some 56 reg B7RLEs to Dundee to replace their aging single deckers.

He also predicts Wolverhampton might receive a batch of E400s for the 126 and replace those fabulous Spectras. Wolverhampton has endured around 35 (or more) of the oldest vehicles in the fleet for so many years now it will seem strange when the Spectras and B6s are gone.

I suspect some B7RLE of some description may get cascaded to Dundee to see off B10L / B10BLE's this year, it could be a mixture of 56 plate from WA & possibly 12 plate from AG. As AG's remaining batch is already down to 15 (from 23 delivered new). I wonder if the 37 might get new double deckers as part of the Warwick Rd Gold Corridor improvements

[arrifirststage]

Can our resident sleuths hazard a guess as to fleet numbers?..........I predict 3001 upwards.

[Stu]

Hercules Poirot is outraged at such a suggestion  :D however not so much as to not make a couple more suggestions:-

Perhaps when Walsall receives its platinum E400 (major model change) buses (surely ADL will come up with a better name for the production run) - they may like to send some 56 reg B7RLEs to Dundee to replace their aging single deckers.

He also predicts Wolverhampton might receive a batch of E400s for the 126 and replace those fabulous Spectras. Wolverhampton has endured around 35 (or more) of the oldest vehicles in the fleet for so many years now it will seem strange when the Spectras and B6s are gone.

I suspect some B7RLE of some description may get cascaded to Dundee to see off B10L / B10BLE's this year, it could be a mixture of 56 plate from WA & possibly 12 plate from AG. As AG's remaining batch is already down to 15 (from 23 delivered new). I wonder if the 37 might get new double deckers as part of the Warwick Rd Gold Corridor improvements

I did suspect that myself also. I can't help but feel that with the seeming increase of Geminis on the 37 service, as well as helping out peak-time loads, I wonder whether the use of double-decks is being scoped out, with regards to concerns about increased anti-social activity.

20-odd new double-decks for the 37 could see AG's remaining B7RLEs being transferred elsewhere to replace other older single-decks (Coventry's Mercs spring to mind!) along with a handful of Omnilinks to WA (to replace B10Ls?). The remaining Omnilinks would then be used on the 71 and 72 services, however this would then break NX's agreement with Centro to use new buses on that corridor.

The Smart Route works are underway in Acocks Green and are due for completion sometime in May, which would fit in with the timescale of new bus deliveries, bulk of which are due in July.

I personally don't think the 37 will see new buses this year though, though I'd be happy to be proved wrong! Under the Birmingham Connected proposals, the 37 route is proposed as one of the 'City Link' bus routes (number 13), so could potentially become a Platinum service in future.

[winston]

I did suspect that myself also. I can't help but feel that with the seeming increase of Geminis on the 37 service, as well as helping out peak-time loads, I wonder whether the use of double-decks is being scoped out, with regards to concerns about increased anti-social activity.

20-odd new double-decks for the 37 could see AG's remaining B7RLEs being transferred elsewhere to replace other older single-decks (Coventry's Mercs spring to mind!) along with a handful of Omnilinks to WA (to replace B10Ls?). The remaining Omnilinks would then be used on the 71 and 72 services, however this would then break NX's agreement with Centro to use new buses on that corridor.

The Smart Route works are underway in Acocks Green and are due for completion sometime in May, which would fit in with the timescale of new bus deliveries, bulk of which are due in July.

I personally don't think the 37 will see new buses this year though, though I'd be happy to be proved wrong! Under the Birmingham Connected proposals, the 37 route is proposed as one of the 'City Link' bus routes (number 13), so could potentially become a Platinum service in future.

Stu, have you got a link to the 'Cink Link' bus routes proposals please?

Is there currently enough B7RLE left at AG to cover all 71/72 requirements?

With 10 Gold Corridors planned, I doubt they will all be implemented within the deliveries of the the 2015 (171 bus order), so you could find the implementation of some could run in to 2016.

[Rob H]

@Winston  I think the pvr for the 71 & 72 is around 20 the current allocation is a mixture of Omnilinks/B7RLE's it can be half/mostly Omnilinks hope this helps :)

[Stu]

Birmingham Connected website:
http://www.birmingham.gov.uk/cs/Satellite?c=Page&childpagename=SystemAdmin%2FCFPageLayout&cid=1223486345242&packedargs=website%3D4&pagename=BCC%2FCommon%2FWrapper%2FCFWrapper&rendermode=live

See document Technical Package 2, the City Link info is on pages 29 and 30, and a map is shown on page 42