What changes do people believe will be implemented in the dudley review. Hints of a number restructuring due to arrivas: 213/214/217 and igos 240 becoming the 12/13/14 and 17.
Looking at routes run by PE:-
9 should be left largly alone, however is there scope to try running an X9 between Stourbridge & Birmingham City Centre as an experiment. Calling at key stops and running via the expressway, during peak periods this service could compete with rail services between Stourbridge & Birmingham and provide a quicker journey time to the City for other people. Initially this service could be operated with Branded B7Rle's.
120, the frequency should be reduced to every 10 minutes, but all services should run between Birmingham & Dudley with deckers used.
140/141/241 haven't long been altered so i would leave those alone at the moment.
243 i would extend this service to Gornal Wood via 297 route, therefore 297 withdrawn.
244 i would extend this route to Kingswinford via 205 route, therefore 205 withdrawn.
I would like to see the X96 and 276 change routes around Norton/Wollaston so that the X96 goes to Wollaston Junction via Norton & the 276 goes on the loop of Wollaston Farm, then you would be able to put Deckers back on the 276. Route numbers could be changed to 76 & 96.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 15, 2015, 01:51:36 PM
Looking at routes run by PE:-
9 should be left largly alone, however is there scope to try running an X9 between Stourbridge & Birmingham City Centre as an experiment. Calling at key stops and running via the expressway, during peak periods this service could compete with rail services between Stourbridge & Birmingham and provide a quicker journey time to the City for other people. Initially this service could be operated with Branded B7Rle's.
120, the frequency should be reduced to every 10 minutes, but all services should run between Birmingham & Dudley with deckers used.
140/141/241 haven't long been altered so i would leave those alone at the moment.
243 i would extend this service to Gornal Wood via 297 route, therefore 297 withdrawn.
244 i would extend this route to Kingswinford via 205 route, therefore 205 withdrawn.
I would like to see the X96 and 276 change routes around Norton/Wollaston so that the X96 goes to Wollaston Junction via Norton & the 276 goes on the loop of Wollaston Farm, then you would be able to put Deckers back on the 276. Route numbers could be changed to 76 & 96.
The 120 is every 10 minutes, if anything, the frequency should be increased
Quote from: Sh4318 on January 15, 2015, 02:02:21 PM
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 15, 2015, 01:51:36 PM
Looking at routes run by PE:-
9 should be left largly alone, however is there scope to try running an X9 between Stourbridge & Birmingham City Centre as an experiment. Calling at key stops and running via the expressway, during peak periods this service could compete with rail services between Stourbridge & Birmingham and provide a quicker journey time to the City for other people. Initially this service could be operated with Branded B7Rle's.
120, the frequency should be reduced to every 10 minutes, but all services should run between Birmingham & Dudley with deckers used.
140/141/241 haven't long been altered so i would leave those alone at the moment.
243 i would extend this service to Gornal Wood via 297 route, therefore 297 withdrawn.
244 i would extend this route to Kingswinford via 205 route, therefore 205 withdrawn.
I would like to see the X96 and 276 change routes around Norton/Wollaston so that the X96 goes to Wollaston Junction via Norton & the 276 goes on the loop of Wollaston Farm, then you would be able to put Deckers back on the 276. Route numbers could be changed to 76 & 96.
The 120 is every 10 minutes, if anything, the frequency should be increased
Sorry, i always get it in my head that the service is every 7/8 minutes.
The service needs increasing even with deckers used?
I'd spin the Norton and Wollaston Farmbits off to new routes 93, 94 and 95, when's nest to new route 26 and the x96 to route 6 with 276 becoming route 7
222 to become the 2, 243 to become 3 with 140 to become 40, 241 to become 40M and 141 to become 41
I would just leave the lot alone! Especially the 222, can't make a service number easier than that to remember
I like what the Walsall 350 used to be called...999
X96 cut back to Dudley and Stourbridge renumbered 96.
27 changed to cover the old 527 route.
9 cut to halesowen
246 renumbered 6 and extended to halesowen along 9 route.
New 6A route missing Russell's Hall hospital out only running to Stourbridge
276 extended to wollaston farm renumbered 76
243 renumbered 3 serving Dudley - Timbertree estate.
Put most routes back to hartshill dudley days
Quote from: Andrew on January 15, 2015, 05:33:37 PM
X96 cut back to Dudley and Stourbridge renumbered 96.
27 changed to cover the old 527 route.
9 cut to halesowen
246 renumbered 6 and extended to halesowen along 9 route.
New 6A route missing Russell's Hall hospital out only running to Stourbridge
276 extended to wollaston farm renumbered 76
243 renumbered 3 serving Dudley - Timbertree estate.
Extending the 246 to halesowen might make it unreliable as the stourbridge road and brierley hill can get rather congested.
My route renumbering would be
(Agreeing with some ideas already stated)
2 - 222
3 - 243
5 - 246
6 - X96 (stourbridge to dudley)
7 - 276 (stourbridge to dudley)
8C/8A stourbridge, wollaston, norton
9/X9 - 9 (platinum branded)
10 - 244
20 - 120
21/40/41 - 241/140/141
55/56/57 - 255/256/257 (new numbers fit in the wolvo renumbering)
289 - 90
if we are to have route renumbering, then I would like to see the D prefix restored, and perhaps the S prefix for any purely Stourbridge routes. Or perhaps even an M prefix being introduced to Merry Hill routes, as that is arguably more of an important focus for routes nowadays than the other towns in Dudley borough.
This seems to have been successful in the Solihull area after the review there in 2009 allocated S numbers there. It has the benefit of low numbers but without the possibility of confusion with other routes, and gives more of an impression to residents that they are their local routes.
Look at the mess the wolves west brom remembering caused
LEAVE NUMBERS AS THEY ARE
Quote from: karl724223 on January 15, 2015, 09:22:18 PM
Look at the mess the wolves west brom remembering caused
LEAVE NUMBERS AS THEY ARE
Karl, i think we are all in agreement with you, but the renumbering of the 213/4/7 seems to suggest that if a Dudley bus review takes place, then so will the renumberings.
In the early 1970s, the WMPTE renumbered a lot of services "to eliminate the confusing duplication of route numbers throughout it's area" (quote from WMPTE ttimetable book dated August 1976)
What do we have now, a confusing duplication of route numbers throughout the Centro area. Renumbering the Dudley services will only add to it!
I know it's the drivers that have to sort the mess out because it looks good on somebody's laptop ipad
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 15, 2015, 09:29:56 PM
Quote from: karl724223 on January 15, 2015, 09:22:18 PM
Look at the mess the wolves west brom remembering caused
LEAVE NUMBERS AS THEY ARE
Karl, i think we are all in agreement with you, but the renumbering of the 213/4/7 seems to suggest that if a Dudley bus review takes place, then so will the renumberings.
In the early 1970s, the WMPTE renumbered a lot of services "to eliminate the confusing duplication of route numbers throughout it's area" (quote from WMPTE ttimetable book dated August 1976)
What do we have now, a confusing duplication of route numbers throughout the Centro area. Renumbering the Dudley services will only add to it!
Tbh i argee the renumbering is getting stupid. Centro wanted local and easy to understand networks. I thought the old numbers 1-199 birmingham network 200-299 dudley network etc etc were easy to understand.
With the renumbering of 213/214/217 and 240 coming up centro/NWM haven't done much announcements with leaflets and poster around merry hill and those route. So i see people aren't guna know changes until the 25th January
Quote from: karl724223 on January 15, 2015, 09:34:14 PM
I know it's the drivers that have to sort the mess out because it looks good on somebody's laptop ipad
Think most people agree with you there Karl.
I'd like to see the Wolverhampton, West Bromwich and Walsall renumberings all reversed in the future.
As for 002/4 renumbering, I sincerely doubt that will happen. Diamond changed numbers of competing services in the WB review, yes, easier for passengers. But routes they have to themselves like 401E have stayed like that for ages and show no signs of changing.
Just surprised NXWM let themselves be dictated to by Centro... ::)
Possibly should be on the route suggestions thread but I would extend one journey every hour on the 276 to Hagley instead of going to Wollaston, thereby creating a link to Merry Hill. It is a sizable area with a high school so plenty of potential passengers. I know it is out of the 'area' but it would only add a couple of miles onto the route.
Quote from: DiamondDart on January 15, 2015, 09:39:01 PM
Quote from: karl724223 on January 15, 2015, 09:34:14 PM
I know it's the drivers that have to sort the mess out because it looks good on somebody's laptop ipad
Think most people agree with you there Karl.
I'd like to see the Wolverhampton, West Bromwich and Walsall renumberings all reversed in the future.
As for 002/4 renumbering, I sincerely doubt that will happen. Diamond changed numbers of competing services in the WB review, yes, easier for passengers. But routes they have to themselves like 401E have stayed like that for ages and show no signs of changing.
Just surprised NXWM let themselves be dictated to by Centro... ::)
Pity they didn't hold out and still call the 4, the 404.
It must be difficult for people who are travelling and don't really understand the bus network.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 15, 2015, 09:47:31 PM
Quote from: DiamondDart on January 15, 2015, 09:39:01 PM
Quote from: karl724223 on January 15, 2015, 09:34:14 PM
I know it's the drivers that have to sort the mess out because it looks good on somebody's laptop ipad
Think most people agree with you there Karl.
I'd like to see the Wolverhampton, West Bromwich and Walsall renumberings all reversed in the future.
As for 002/4 renumbering, I sincerely doubt that will happen. Diamond changed numbers of competing services in the WB review, yes, easier for passengers. But routes they have to themselves like 401E have stayed like that for ages and show no signs of changing.
Just surprised NXWM let themselves be dictated to by Centro... ::)
Pity they didn't hold out and still call the 4, the 404.
It must be difficult for people who are travelling and don't really understand the bus network.
I agree, several competing operators have kept old route numbers eg Banga
Can't really think of too many things that I would change to be honest, but some suggestions I have are:
X9 introduced between Halesowen and Birmingham running via the expressway
241 cut back to run Dudley to Halesowen again
99 extended to Hayley Green via the 244 route
X96 cut back to run Stourbridge to Dudley only
244 cut short at Halesowen, but extended to Wrens Nest & Priory Estates
276 hourly service extended to Hagley Village, with main service between Stourbridge & Dudley
293 new service serving Norton, Wollaston Farm & Wollaston Junction
and just for the fun of it...
Two buses per hour on the 18 extended from Bartley Green to Merry Hill via Halesowen, covering the 141/241.
Quote from: sonic84 on January 15, 2015, 10:06:14 PM
Can't really think of too many things that I would change to be honest, but some suggestions I have are:
X9 introduced between Halesowen and Birmingham running via the expressway
241 cut back to run Dudley to Halesowen again
99 extended to Hayley Green via the 244 route
X96 cut back to run Stourbridge to Dudley only
244 cut short at Halesowen, but extended to Wrens Nest & Priory Estates
276 hourly service extended to Hagley Village, with main service between Stourbridge & Dudley
293 new service serving Norton, Wollaston Farm & Wollaston Junction
and just for the fun of it...
Two buses per hour on the 18 extended from Bartley Green to Merry Hill via Halesowen, covering the 141/241.
Reintroduce the old 289/90 service which covered all those areas.
Will the 120, 140 or 141 be renumbered? They fit in with the rest of the services that operate on the Hagley Road
Quote from: Sh4318 on January 15, 2015, 10:10:15 PM
Will the 120, 140 or 141 be renumbered? They fit in with the rest of the services that operate on the Hagley Road
The 120 & 140 have been in existance for as long as i can recollect, so they should stay the same!
Quote from: Matt on January 15, 2015, 11:27:15 PM
Quote from: j789 on January 15, 2015, 09:42:01 PM
Possibly should be on the route suggestions thread but I would extend one journey every hour on the 276 to Hagley instead of going to Wollaston, thereby creating a link to Merry Hill. It is a sizable area with a high school so plenty of potential passengers. I know it is out of the 'area' but it would only add a couple of miles onto the route.
That is one of the best suggestions I have read on here. However if it was extended from Stourbridge it would take up to an hour to get from Hagley to Merry Hill which is not good enough. I would instead have the Hagley 276 turn left at the island at the bottom of Pedmore Lane onto Hagley Road and 318 route down into the centre of Hagley making journey times more like half an hour.
Hagley in fact has two large high schools with 21.7% of residents aged under 16. Another 17% of the population is retirees who would also appreciate a bus link to Merry Hill. Trouble is this means going outside the Centro zone which is quite understandably not something NX like doing.
Aside from this I would also cut both the x96 and non-Hagley 276 as Dudley - Stourbridge, make both routes fully double deck and bring a Wollaston-Stour circular in covering the current 276 and x96 routes around Wollaston and also a Wrens Nest-Dudley circular doing the obvious. Both circulars run with e200s.
Needless to say I would not mess around changing route numbers either.
Renumbering every local network seem to be centros idea. Duno how much say nxwm, arriva and diamond get.
Wouldn't surprise me if the 289 was shortened to stupid terminus, who knows possibly Darby End? Bravo centro
Picking up on the point about Nx not just going outside the Centro area to Hagley, is there any reason why they just dont do that for Essington in South Staffs?
When I looked at the A to Z, there seemed to be a link road off Ashmore Park onto the road that goes into Essington itself.
Surely diverting the odd 59 would be a lot cheaper than a separate Staffs council subsidy but a) I dont live in the area & b) I dont really know how the subsidy etc thing works anyway!
Quote from: Westy on January 16, 2015, 05:41:42 AM
Picking up on the point about Nx not just going outside the Centro area to Hagley, is there any reason why they just dont do that for Essington in South Staffs?
When I looked at the A to Z, there seemed to be a link road off Ashmore Park onto the road that goes into Essington itself.
Surely diverting the odd 59 would be a lot cheaper than a separate Staffs council subsidy but a) I dont live in the area & b) I dont really know how the subsidy etc thing works anyway!
Tbh, I would modify the 69 in that route to serve Essington as:
1) It serves Coppice Farm and therefore, is much closer to Essington
2) For a 59 to Essington, it would need to be first extended to New Invention, something NX might be reluctant to do, as it would involve screwing around with one of the WN flagship
There used to be that once a day 316 operated by TWM.
NX would not operate into Essington. Its 'Outside the Centro Area' and you cannot use N-Bus etc there (Despite being able to use it in Wombourne, Codsall etc.
Maybe the 68 could be increased to Half Hourly to create a more frequent service from Essington to Wednesfield/New Cross Hospital and Wolverhampton
Quote from: Nathan on January 16, 2015, 08:21:31 AM
There used to be that once a day 316 operated by TWM.
NX would not operate into Essington. Its 'Outside the Centro Area' and you cannot use N-Bus etc there (Despite being able to use it in Wombourne, Codsall etc.
Maybe the 68 could be increased to Half Hourly to create a more frequent service from Essington to Wednesfield/New Cross Hospital and Wolverhampton
As the 68 is wholly supported at present, that is unlikely to happen in the near future. Not that long ago there were 2 buses per hour from Essington to Wolves with the 68/69 but that really aren't enough passengers to justify 2 per hour at present.
What about this link road then?
Quote from: sonic84 on January 15, 2015, 10:06:14 PM
Two buses per hour on the 18 extended from Bartley Green to Merry Hill via Halesowen, covering the 141/241.
Extending the 18 to Halesowen was an idea which seemed to be doing the rounds during last years South Birmingham Bus Review not sure whether it was the network planners or the drivers who suggested it, while Merry Hill would be useful can't see a complete Yardley Wood - Merry Hill service being operated reliably, its bad enough just with Northfield on the route.
Quote from: Chris2301 on January 15, 2015, 09:22:18 PM
So i see people aren't guna know changes until the 25th January
Waiting patiently...
Is it announced tomorrow?
@Chris2301
So we may see some changes introduced today? As the 25th is today
Todays changes have already been discussed here elsewhere, but here is the information again:
http://www.networkwestmidlands.com/bus/FatherlessBarnchanges.aspx
Quote from: Trident 4194 on January 25, 2015, 10:58:54 AM
So we may see some changes introduced today? As the 25th is today
It was mention on a press release last year when the 289 got reinstated to merry hill. A review in dudleys service will happe n in 2015
I'm sorry but have it missed something here? Has it even been announced that there is for definite going to be a review of the bus network in and around Dudley? Or is this thread entirely just speculation and what people want to happen?
Quote from: Kevin on January 25, 2015, 11:05:14 AM
I'm sorry but have it missed something here? Has it even been announced that there is for definite going to be a review of the bus network in and around Dudley? Or is this thread entirely just speculation and what people want to happen?
It's been mentioned in a couple of news articles relating to changes to the 297 and 289 services recently, that a major review of services in Dudley will take place in 2015. But as of yet, nothing has been announced, and no consultation has yet started. So will probably happen later in the year, probably late summer at a guess.
Quote from: Kevin on January 25, 2015, 11:05:14 AM
I'm sorry but have it missed something here? Has it even been announced that there is for definite going to be a review of the bus network in and around Dudley? Or is this thread entirely just speculation and what people want to happen?
About the 12, 13, and 14 service?
Quote from: BN on January 25, 2015, 11:33:42 AM
Quote from: Kevin on January 25, 2015, 11:05:14 AM
I'm sorry but have it missed something here? Has it even been announced that there is for definite going to be a review of the bus network in and around Dudley? Or is this thread entirely just speculation and what people want to happen?
About the 12, 13, and 14 service?
Nope, the 12/13/14 have been introduced seperately, but there will be a review of the whole Dudley bus network later this year
I asked Network West Midlands about this on their Facebook page and this is their reply:
QuoteThere is a review of the Dudley network scheduled to start early summer which will be completed in the autumn. The format has not been finalised yet but we will keep you posted as soon as there is any news.
;)
Quote from: Stu on January 27, 2015, 09:06:28 PM
I asked Network West Midlands about this on their Facebook page and this is their reply:
QuoteThere is a review of the Dudley network scheduled to start early summer which will be completed in the autumn. The format has not been finalised yet but we will keep you posted as soon as there is any news.
;)
I do hope that the review is better than the last Birmingham review where they just published a list of suggestions and asked people on there thoughts to these suggestions.
As
@Roy has mentioned that there will definitely be a review this year, let's discuss the potential changes here as they happen.
I'm just hoping that the 140 stays as it is, nice quick route into birmingham.
@bususer12 Or shall was just use the existing thread.....
Is the 140 the quickest way to Brum from Dudley? Is the 74/87 not quicker?
Quote from: Dutsey on March 25, 2015, 11:28:57 AM
Is the 140 the quickest way to Brum from Dudley? Is the 74/87 not quicker?
The 140 & 87 both take 51 minutes. The 74 takes over an hour.
Quote from: bususer12 on March 25, 2015, 09:17:39 AM
As @Roy has mentioned that there will definitely be a review this year, let's discuss the potential changes here as they happen.
I'm just hoping that the 140 stays as it is, nice quick route into birmingham.
I don't think the 140 will ever change, route wise
Quote from: Sh4318 on March 25, 2015, 11:59:05 AM
The 140 & 87 both take 51 minutes. The 74 takes over an hour.
I don't think the 140 will ever change, route wise
Isn't the 126 quicker to Brum from Dudley?
I notice that a number of tendered services are up for renewal in October this year in the Dudley area, wonder whether the Dudley Bus Review will coincide with this. Can't see some services surviving with the cut backs Centro will no doubt have to make.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on March 25, 2015, 09:01:05 PM
I notice that a number of tendered services are up for renewal in October this year in the Dudley area, wonder whether the Dudley Bus Review will coincide with this. Can't see some services surviving with the cut backs Centro will no doubt have to make.
Where abouts is the list of those up for renewal this year? I thought much of the initial Arriva Hill Top work won in April 2012 ie 229 etc is for 5 year contracts?
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on March 25, 2015, 09:01:05 PM
I notice that a number of tendered services are up for renewal in October this year in the Dudley area, wonder whether the Dudley Bus Review will coincide with this. Can't see some services surviving with the cut backs Centro will no doubt have to make.
When I asked NWM about the Dudley Review on their Facebook page, they told me it would be happening in 'summer'. I guess this to be late August, before the schools go back.
Sorry it's me, it's March and can't remember it's 2015.
From what i can see the following Dudley routes are up for renewal
81. 243, 288, 298/9, 267, 208, 124, 282.
226 is also up for renewal
Quote from: the trainbasher on March 25, 2015, 09:45:44 PM
226 is also up for renewal
@the trainbasher My list must be out of date as it says 26 Oct 2014 for the 226!
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on March 25, 2015, 09:49:42 PM
@the trainbasher My list must be out of date as it says 26 Oct 2014 for the 226!
It was let as a 12 month contract I believe
Quote from: the trainbasher on March 25, 2015, 09:56:32 PM
It was let as a 12 month contract I believe
That makes sense and makes you think that the 226 will be altered in some way to!
maybe it will become a circular service once more going from Merry Hill to Dudley via the X96 route, therefore enabling the X96 to be curtailed to run between Merry Hill and Wollaston Farm.
Certainly i think the X96 needs to be made more reliable, at the moment it just seems to run in a circle with very little time at either Wollaston or Wrens Nest and the punctuality can be very poor.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on March 25, 2015, 10:04:55 PM
That makes sense and makes you think that the 226 will be altered in some way to!
maybe it will become a circular service once more going from Merry Hill to Dudley via the X96 route, therefore enabling the X96 to be curtailed to run between Merry Hill and Wollaston Farm.
Certainly i think the X96 needs to be made more reliable, at the moment it just seems to run in a circle with very little time at either Wollaston or Wrens Nest and the punctuality can be very poor.
Why would NX give up part of a commercial service in the X96? That would make sense if the 226 was a supported service or run by NXWM but it is mostly commercial Mon-Sat daytimes so think the chance of what you've outlined happening is nil.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on March 25, 2015, 10:04:55 PM
That makes sense and makes you think that the 226 will be altered in some way to!
maybe it will become a circular service once more going from Merry Hill to Dudley via the X96 route, therefore enabling the X96 to be curtailed to run between Merry Hill and Wollaston Farm.
Certainly i think the X96 needs to be made more reliable, at the moment it just seems to run in a circle with very little time at either Wollaston or Wrens Nest and the punctuality can be very poor.
The x96 sometimes gets problems during rush hours, off peak they are normally fine. I catch them 6 days a week and only a few have been late or not turned up. The merry centre doesn't help once its gridlocked its hard for buses to move. And tbh its well used throughout the route.
or you could withdraw the X96, extend the 297 to Wrens Nest via the X96 route from Merry Hill and extend the 222 to Wollaston Farm.
And make them unreliable at the same time!
Quote from: the trainbasher on March 26, 2015, 06:39:53 PM
And make them unreliable at the same time!
I suppose we just have to wait until the bus review takes place, i just feel that they need to make the X96 more reliable. The Merry Hill can cause serious traffic chaos around christmas especially and it's not fair on people who want to travel to Norton & Wollaston when every 276/X96 is terminated short at Stourbridge. Maybe the solution is to bring back the 293/4/5.
I agree with splitting them at Stourbridge but the Wollaston routes need to be at least every 20 minutes otherwise they'd be degrading the service
Quote from: the trainbasher on March 26, 2015, 06:52:37 PM
I agree with splitting them at Stourbridge but the Wollaston routes need to be at least every 20 minutes otherwise they'd be degrading the service
Agreed which unfortunately would mean an increased PVR, plus you would be breaking links between Wollaston & Norton and Merry Hill and Dudley.
Centro staff (or volunteers) are out in force this week in Brierley Hill and Cradley Heath counting the number of people on buses - possibly the first stages towards the Bus Review.
Quote from: Roy on April 22, 2015, 12:06:03 PM
Centro staff (or volunteers) are out in force this week in Brierley Hill and Cradley Heath counting the number of people on buses - possibly the first stages towards the Bus Review.
Any idea why there were a group of Centro officials standing by stand C in merry hill bus station yesterday ?
Is there a chance the 126 could be split?
Would this make Wolverhampton the only depot without a Birmingham route?
@Westy the only depot without a Birmingham route is Coventry!
(thinking about it though dundee doesn't have one either but it's not a NXWM depot as it's a different nx company)
Quote from: the trainbasher on April 26, 2015, 03:30:22 PM
@Westy the only depot without a Birmingham route is Coventry!
(thinking about it though dundee doesn't have one either but it's not a NXWM depot as it's a different nx company)
As is Coventry.
Quote from: NXDom on April 26, 2015, 04:08:40 PM
As is Coventry.
No it's not.
NXC is part of West Midlands Travel Ltd
Quote from: Winston on April 26, 2015, 04:10:55 PM
No it's not.
NXC is part of West Midlands Travel Ltd
Also I am pretty sure Coventry falls under the Area Director / Management group or what ever they called as Yardley wood & Acocks Green.
I was under the impression Coventry had its own Managing Director albeit acting.
Centro have three exhibitions scheduled for people to give their views on changes to the Dudley and Sandwell Bus Network. They are at Oldbury on Friday, Monday at Stourbridge and the following Monday (22nd) at Dudley.
Full details at http://www.networkwestmidlands.com/busreview/busreview.aspx (http://www.networkwestmidlands.com/busreview/busreview.aspx)
Why Olkdbury, seems a bit odd when it is a Dudley bus review.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on June 09, 2015, 03:11:19 PM
Why Olkdbury, seems a bit odd when it is a Dudley bus review.
It now seems to be a Dudley and Sandwell Bus Review. The on line questionnaire mentions areas of Sandwell as well as Dudley.
I'm disappointed, I shared this on my Facebook page earlier, and I was expecting the first response to be 'renumber the 141 as the 139'. Instead, the first response I got was 'be on time'. :(
Which is a standard response that crops up on the Birmingham Mail Facebook page when a bus related story gets published. Do people really not understand how traffic works and what causes it? ???
Quote from: Stu on June 09, 2015, 07:36:02 PM
I'm disappointed, I shared this on my Facebook page earlier, and I was expecting the first response to be 'renumber the 141 as the 139'. Instead, the first response I got was 'be on time'. :(
Which is a standard response that crops up on the Birmingham Mail Facebook page when a bus related story gets published. Do people really not understand how traffic works and what causes it? ???
You really shouldn't expect anything with the even smallest element of sense to appear on Facebook.
The worst half of the Facebook users have the combined intelligence of Harry Styles, and that's saying something.
Quote from: NXWM Spectra on June 09, 2015, 08:14:09 PM
You really shouldn't expect anything with the even smallest element of sense to appear on Facebook.
The worst half of the Facebook users have the combined intelligence of Harry Styles, and that's saying something.
We're not all that bad.
Any updates on when this review might be completed? Saw a good few people from network West Midlands or national express in Orange fluorescent jackets seemingly monitoring goings on at the boulevard in merry hill the other day.
Quote from: s94 on July 12, 2015, 09:00:47 PM
Any updates on when this review might be completed? Saw a good few people from network West Midlands or national express in Orange fluorescent jackets seemingly monitoring goings on at the boulevard in merry hill the other day.
The changes will not be implemented until early 2016.
April 2016
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 19, 2015, 07:25:04 PM
Hi Roy
I am pretty sure that the review will happen in Oct or early Nov this year. I will ask my contact in Centro to tell me and I'll post tomorrow again.
I think Centro will change the X96 to run more frequent and as an ani-clockwise and Clockwise service around Wollaston and Wrens Nest.
In my reply to the Dudley Bus Review, i have said the X96 should be withdrawn, i don't think it works as a service.
The two end portions (Wrens Nest & Wollaston Farm) often end up with no service in order to keep the main portion on time. Christmas before last i waited 1 hour and 20 mins for an X96, 2 buses turned up but were E journeys to Stourbridge only.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 19, 2015, 07:25:04 PM
Hi Roy
I am pretty sure that the review will happen in Oct or early Nov this year. I will ask my contact in Centro to tell me and I'll post tomorrow again.
I think Centro will change the X96 to run more frequent and as an ani-clockwise and Clockwise service around Wollaston and Wrens Nest.
My NXWM contacts tell me it is definitely NOT happening this year, it has been put back to 2016.
As for the X96, as this service operates on a mainly commercial basis, Centro would have to agree any changes with NXWM
The X96 has to have timetable changes regularly because it struggles with reliability.
I would also say that it is very stressful on the buses used, it just goes round and round all day with very little room for a break, i know a few summers ago, the Mercs were struggling badly.
I can't see NE complaining if Centro want to withdraw it and replace it with other services.
The 276 can probably accommodate any Stourbridge changes to the x96 well. Will never happen but as mentioned some time ago, would be good to see it extended to hagley or similar too.
Maybe the 276 could be extended from Wollaston Junction to do a circle of Wollaston Farm to replace the X96, although it would mean an extended journey time between Stourbridge & Wollaston Farm.
Certainly at the moment, the 276 terminating at Wollaston Junction sometimes blocks the bus stop up for 5 mins or more.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 21, 2015, 03:27:13 PM
My contact in Centro says it is probably going to happen when the contracts/tenders for all operators are up for renewal which will happen on 25th October 2015. So I don't know whether you want to talk to your contact?
Karl724223 works at PE garage, so i assume he has been told by management.
Can't see the timetables etc now being ready for October 2015.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 21, 2015, 05:16:28 PM
I also have a contact in NXWM which happens to be a manager. I'll contact him/her and I'll post again when they get back to me. So The date and month will be confirmed and put to bed so to speak.
Is that allowed?
I was told 2016 by senior Centro Black Country managers at a meeting and this was endorsed by three very senior NXWM Black Country managers who were at the same meeting.
Any contracts due for renewal in October will be given a short term extension.
This isn't a rumour - it's come from people who know.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 21, 2015, 05:33:32 PM
I have contacted my contact in NXWM to make sure it will be in Oct not early 2016. If it is in 2016 I'll contact my contact in Centro and tell him/her.
remember the consultation didn't close till July 12th, that gives only just over 3 months for everything to be sorted, just doesn't make sense that it will still happen this year.
Timetables etc would need to be ready by mid Sept at the latest so that they can be sent for printing, notices can go out with info for passengers, timetables at stops and flags need to be altered, so to me October is a no no.
Then with Xmas approaching you don't want key bus services altered in late Nov/Early Dec potentially causing problems for Christmas Shoppers.
Quote from: Roy on July 21, 2015, 05:21:26 PM
I was told 2016 by senior Centro Black Country managers at a meeting and this was endorsed by three very senior NXWM Black Country managers who were at the same meeting.
Any contracts due for renewal in October will be given a short term extension.
This isn't a rumour - it's come from people who know.
I've heard the same info
@Roy as you about the April date being given for the Dudley Review.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 21, 2015, 06:29:57 PM
You are completely correct for the changes to be implemented in Oct, the timetables and Flags/timetables for stops would have to be completed by mid/late Sept. According to my contact in Centro the changes should be implemented by Oct 25 15, as the changes would only be amending/changing some route numbers, amending the times of the route and amending/changing the rour itself.
And how would all of this be already known when the consultation, only closed on the 12 July 2015, you seem to know an awful lot of information.
Several other senior members have told you 2016 for the review, i tend to believe them!!!
On a related note, is this Centro admitting that any bus review takes s long time to process and implement and that they can't get away with doing what they have for previous reviews where the public only find out about two weeks before their buses change
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 21, 2015, 06:29:57 PM
You are completely correct for the changes to be implemented in Oct, the timetables and Flags/timetables for stops would have to be completed by mid/late Sept. According to my contact in Centro the changes should be implemented by Oct 25 15, as the changes would only be amending/changing some route numbers, amending the times of the route and amending/changing the rour itself.
Basically a full review then? Can't see October happening at all for the changes. Far too much to do and agree about Christmas wrt to it potentially causing disruption. The last Dudley review began in April 2008 so April again sounds sensible.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 21, 2015, 06:44:52 PM
I only have the word of my contact from Centro. I'm only thinking that there may be some major changes but mostly they will be minor e.g route extension/curtailment, route number changes.
Yes but things like this take an awful long time to preocess.
Rememeber when routes have been decided, they have to look for operators, either comercially or through tender. Many things have to be discussed and arranged, tbh if it was just to be a few minor changes, what was the point in ordering a review. For a start i can see numerous number changes eg:276 becoming 76 to put them in the new Centro numbering policy.
It's quite possible that some changes had already been decided in advance of the public consultation.
My guess is we'll see some changes in October, due to tender renewals, which have already been worked on, and then we'll see more wholesale changes next year, which will have been determined from the public consultations.
We already saw some renumbering of Old Hill services earlier this year, I expect there'll be more of the same come October.
If i'm honest I fully doubt there will be any changes this year especially considering that all changes have to be put up 56 days in advance which will mean they have to be registered in around a month and considering the questionare stuff was only completed around 2 weeks ago they have to take all the info and data into account, create the changes sort out timetables ect.
I hope that there can be 3/4 bph between Smethwick and bearwood if this a Dudley/sandwell review.
Quote from: Dylan4579 on July 21, 2015, 09:49:55 PM
I hope that there can be 3/4 bph between Smethwick and bearwood if this a Dudley/sandwell review.
I agree with you there. Links between Smethwick and Bearwood have been poor in some areas since the 444 was withdrawn
From my experience don't be to surprised to see changes in November it's happened before with introduction of the 53/83 changes to 89/128 , oh what joy this was, members of the public getting very irate with Us drivers for being lazy for terminating the 128 in oldbury, even on 127 terminating in blackheath, I,ve had women accuse me of all sorts there.
That sounds about right. However I'm guessing there could be a list of proposed changes made available by November or December maybe?
Would be nice to see two circular routes for the black country? Bit like the old 247/248?
Quote from: Chris on July 23, 2015, 07:36:33 PM
Would be nice to see two circular routes for the black country? Bit like the old 247/248?
Don't think circular routes are a very popular option anymore. I personally struggle
To envisage many major changes to services in the review. Maybe just a couple of extensions/withdrawals. Perhaps the Merry hill area unsurprisingly seeing the greatest number of changes. Hopefully no more Halesowen to merry hill services though...
Quote from: s94 on July 23, 2015, 07:46:34 PM
Don't think circular routes are a very popular option anymore. I personally struggle
To envisage many major changes to services in the review. Maybe just a couple of extensions/withdrawals. Perhaps the Merry hill area unsurprisingly seeing the greatest number of changes. Hopefully no more Halesowen to merry hill services though...
The services need to more spaced out in merry hill bus station especially stand B , i normally see a 141 at stand with a 53/289 behind it normally waiting to alight. Maybe move the west brom sevices to C with the 208. X96 to wollaston with the 276 to wollaston like stourbridge. And 243 to stand G or with 276 to dudley?
Would be nice if intu let centro rebuild the bus station and provide better access to prevent traffic jams.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 27, 2015, 07:17:54 PM
I also think the circular routes are popular anymore, that is why Centro withdrew the 247/248 in 2008. Regarding the Halesowen route I think they will re-number the 141/241 to just 41/42.
why
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 27, 2015, 07:35:15 PM
It would be nice for Intu to let Centro up-grad the bus station, but it would probably mean closing the bus station altogether and re-locating it. Which would mean a lot of hassle for organizing a temp bus station, and the closest pace for the temp station would either be where the Mc Donald's play place is or up on Two Woods Lane.
With regards to the stand allocation at the currant t/t. There is only two alighting stands, which are the first and second stand before the 226 (Stand H). They should have three unload only stands if and when they do get the green light to re-build the bus staton.
when Westfield was going to build a new bus station they was going to build it on the car park by asda petrol station keeping old bus station open till new one was complete then when new one was finished close old one
Thought your contact in centro might have told you that
Quote from: karl724223 on July 27, 2015, 10:06:12 PM
when Westfield was going to build a new bus station they was going to build it on the car park by asda petrol station keeping old bus station open till new one was complete then when new one was finished close old one.
Thought your contact in centro might have told you that
The problem is intu now owns the centre so any plans that westfield had have gone. So centro will have to have discussions with intu about any plans. The problem is where can they put the new station without causing major disruption. I reckon they could use a bit of the car park next to the current one. Develop 3 new stands I/J/K and when they are finished move on to A/B/C so on. New stands would create room to accomdate the current stand H creating 3 unloading stands. Would be better if they raised the kerb on unloading stands so its not such a big step down for pushchairs and the elderly.
That car park just been resurfaced 4 weeks ago. So it wouldn't go there now. Merry hills roads have not changed much over the years. It just can't cope with the traffic anymore. Hence the occasional stand still
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 27, 2015, 07:17:54 PM
I also think the circular routes are popular anymore, that is why Centro withdrew the 247/248 in 2008. Regarding the Halesowen route I think they will re-number the 141/241 to just 41/42.
I doubt that very much, considering the 241 goes to Dudley Bus Station and will after the review no doubt, as does the WB 42 so in an attempt not to confuse passengers, despite centro liking to do that.
From what I'm being told merry hill bus station is here to stay as it is
Look at the state of it glass missing wooden boards in place of glass or a white Ballard every shelter has damage to it from buses hitting them pot holes starting to reappear in the bus station again
Quote from: karl724223 on July 27, 2015, 10:38:27 PM
From what I'm being told merry hill bus station is here to stay as it is
Look at the state of it glass missing wooden boards in place of glass or a white Ballard every shelter has damage to it from buses hitting them pot holes starting to reappear in the bus station again
@karl724223 well because the land is owned my Intu its down to them. The main reason the don't want to rebuild the bus station is because they believe it will result in a loss of revenue for intu. Eventually there will be a state when Merry Hill (although I and i imagine many others believe it is already) will be unfit for use, if I'm honest Merry Hill was more of a candidate for a new bus station than Cradley Heath.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 27, 2015, 07:35:15 PM
It would be nice for Intu to let Centro up-grad the bus station, but it would probably mean closing the bus station altogether and re-locating it. Which would mean a lot of hassle for organizing a temp bus station, and the closest pace for the temp station would either be where the Mc Donald's play place is or up on Two Woods Lane.
With regards to the stand allocation at the currant t/t. There is only two alighting stands, which are the first and second stand before the 226 (Stand H). They should have three unload only stands if and when they do get the green light to re-build the bus staton.
Sorry if I seem rude here but that is absolute bo**ocks! When Wolverhampton was rebuilt there was no temp. bus station just temp. terminus' dotted around the town and Merry Hill is no different, but it is doable.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 03:23:24 PM
I meant to say they may change the 141/241 to 24 and 41 not the 41/42.
There is a 24 that serves Dudley Bus Station too, Merry Hill-Foxyards Estate (Operated by iGo)
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 03:41:22 PM
Hi Nathan yes I know there is already a 24 which operate Merry Hill-Dudley but Centro have been known to duplicate routes and as it would probably be operated by NXWM it wouldn't matter if there were two 24 routes.
It would as you would then have two 24's serving the same termini. This would be very confusing for passengers.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 03:36:14 PM
Hi Dom there no need to have language like that. with regard to the temp stops I don't think they would work very well as they would be dotted around the centre. I also think it would make customers moan even more as at the moment some of the buses don't rune to time e.g X96. As it gets held up around Wrens Nest and or Wollaston Farm.
Does it ?
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 03:41:22 PM
Hi Nathan yes I know there is already a 24 which operate Merry Hill-Dudley but Centro have been known to duplicate routes and as it would probably be operated by NXWM it wouldn't matter if there were two 24 routes.
Ok so you have some little old lady oe gentleman and they see the number 24, not meaning to be stereo typical, but they are known, in Dudley especially, thinking they are getting on the '24 to Quinton for example when they couldn't been further away and end up in foxyards!
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 03:36:14 PM
Hi Dom there no need to have language like that. with regard to the temp stops I don't think they would work very well as they would be dotted around the centre. I also think it would make customers moan even more as at the moment some of the buses don't rune to time e.g X96. As it gets held up around Wrens Nest and or Wollaston Farm.
1) There is no argument there as when Wolverhampton was re-built the stops were dotted around the centre.
2) Do you have proof of this?
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 04:27:05 PM
Hi pndriver I regularly get the X96 and over the last couple of years the X96 has got better. I have had times where there was no bus for over 20 minutes and considering it's supposed to be a 20 minuets frequency it bad for customers.
It is a 20 min frequency so your not going to get one within the 19 minutes so it doesn't go over the 20 mins, hence the bus is running early, which NXWM strongly disapprove.
Quote from: Dom on July 28, 2015, 04:29:23 PM
It is a 20 min frequency so your not going to get one within the 19 minutes so it doesn't go over the 20 mins, hence the bus is running early, which NXWM strongly disapprove.
Considering he works for centro it doesn't look promising! I know more than him!
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 04:38:14 PM
1) Yes they were but that was over a bigger area where as Merry Mill is congested at the best of times especially at/around peak times. So it wouldn't be a great idea for the stops to be dotted around Merry Hill centre.
2) what do you mean?
Have you got proof that the X96 gets delayed around Wollaston and Wrena? Without using the 'I live on the route reason'
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 04:33:51 PM
The little old lady or gentleman would have to look at the destination blind on the front of the bus, look at the station map/at stop info as there is RTI at the bus station, or ask at the travel shop for the right 24 service then.
Hi KarlX96
If what you're saying is going to be imposed, then surely this is going to bring a great deal of inconvinence to passengers? Suppose if the destination blind wasn't working correctly, or if a passenger catches the bus from the wrong stand, and someone accidently boards the wrong 24 service? I thought the whole point of Centro renumbering service was to reduce confusion for the public - surely having two 24's in one place is only going to contradict that?
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 04:55:09 PM
To mop this matter up. just a few weeks ago I waited up at the bus station at Dudley for the 10 minutes past three and according to the inspector they it had got stuck up at Wrens Nest due to the schools around there. I have been on the 10 to three before in term time and it has never got held up due to the school so tell me something different. I also live on the route and travel on the route to work every Mon and Tues.
Does the fact that schools broke up occur to you, Wolverhampton was exactly the same, and I should know considering I was inspecting on my work experience that day.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 05:08:21 PM
Hi Trident 4194. What do you know that I ma not know?
The frequencies of buses
Quote from: Nathan on July 28, 2015, 03:27:42 PM
There is a 24 that serves Dudley Bus Station too, Merry Hill-Foxyards Estate (Operated by iGo)
@KarlX96 this is getting complicated, Will there be two number 12's for the 120 and 126 ?
Karl your numbering system doesn't make sense. If you say have the 24 that is the first two digits, so why is the 141 the 41? Shouldn't it be the 14? Oh wait that also exists. Centro do like confusing folks
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 28, 2015, 05:32:49 PM
Hi 979 There may be two 12's I just don't know yet.
Good job they're operated by different garages then
So when the 99 come to pensnett it will be renumbered 9
222 will go to 2
53 will go to 3 or 5
289 will go to 2 or 8 or another 9
X96 will go to X or oh no another 9 or 6
Couldn't they just merge the 140 and 141 into the 9 corridor numbering by calling it 9D for the 140 and 9M for the 141?
241 could become 10
X96 becomes 6
276 becomes 7
222 becomes 3
246 becomes 2
226 becomes 5
243/4 become 8H/8M
Then you have your key corridors above with the 1 and 4 staying as they are
257/5/6 become 12/M/S
Isn't there a company up Birmingham called centro that deals with rubbish
@Dom sorry I should have resisted! Although the idea for the 9/140/141 was based upon the 4 corridor
Quote from: the trainbasher on July 28, 2015, 05:59:54 PM
Couldn't they just merge the 140 and 141 into the 9 corridor numbering by calling it 9D for the 140 and 9M for the 141?
241 could become 10
X96 becomes 6
276 becomes 7
222 becomes 3
246 becomes 2
226 becomes 5
243/4 become 8H/8M
Then you have your key corridors above with the 1 and 4 staying as they are
257/5/6 become 12/M/S
That would mean that pensnett would need more mmcs
@Dom...I meant resisted humour wise...it was a satirical idea :)
Quote from: the trainbasher on July 28, 2015, 05:59:54 PM
Couldn't they just merge the 140 and 141 into the 9 corridor numbering by calling it 9D for the 140 and 9M for the 141?
241 could become 10
X96 becomes 6
276 becomes 7
222 becomes 3
246 becomes 2
226 becomes 5
243/4 become 8H/8M
Then you have your key corridors above with the 1 and 4 staying as they are
257/5/6 become 12/M/S
Very sensible, although I don't think the 140/141 will become variants of the 9
I'm sorry but I'm going treat this renumbering stupidity with the contempt it clearly deserves
So lets renumber the 9 to lets say ......... erm ............... 9 !
the 120 to ......................120 !
126 to ...........................126 !
in other words......LEAVE THE NUMBERS ALONE !!!
I've seen comments (not on here) from CENTRO, NWM and NXWM saying that the new numbers are easier for passengers to understand ......... total crap !!!
Considering people get on the 98 (or was it the 99) from various points along the route and expect it to go to Small Heath as per the diamond route, I wouldn't put anything past the idiots who use public transport on a daily basis.
By this basis, leave well enough alone.
Karl X96
you said: I think if they just left the numbers alone it wouldn't bring in more custom or for passengers to remember the number. OK the 120/126/140/141 are easy to remember but the only trouble with those routes are two have variations to the daytime route e.g. 120 (120E) and 126 (126E) this complicates things. Where as if they changed the 120 (120E) and 126 (126E) to single or double figures then it might have an effect on people getting on the wrong bus.
I don't accept that at all.....
You have a 46 West Bromwich to Scott Arms or Queslett and ANOTHER 46 City to Perry Barr which are very close to each other (the City to Perry Barr 46 used to go to Queslett which confuses passengers even now).
Even after nearly 3 years after the 451 (West Bromwich to Sutton) become 5, passengers of all ages at bus stops still say "when's the next 451" and mainly OAP's still say why re-number the 451 to 5 it's confusing !!!
[/quote]
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 11:52:07 AM
Hi pndriver I have been out today and according to the Real Time Info board at Stourbridge Interchange (Stand E) the 11 o'clock was late and didn't turn up until after the Hansons 251 came and when. So it must get held up somewhere along the route. So yes it doesis the answer to the question.
Doesn't mean it got held up at either wrens neat or wollaston farm though does it
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 12:24:18 PM
Hi Steve3229pv where have you seen comments from Centro, NWM and or NXWM about the new easy to remember numbers for passengers to understand. I can understand the frustration with remembering the new numbers, but after a few months it would become the norm for regular users of the route and for some not all new users of that route.
I Don't think it's total crap!!! if the figures show patronage has rosin for that particular service since the number was changed.
With regards to what you said about the re-numbering of lets say .......erm....... 9 the 120 and 126. I think that's the wrong attitude towards the numbering system.
I think if they just left the numbers alone it wouldn't bring in more custom or for passengers to remember the number. OK the 120/126/140/141 are easy to remember but the only trouble with those routes are two have variations to the daytime route e.g. 120 (120E) and 126 (126E) this complicates things. Where as if they changed the 120 (120E) and 126 (126E) to single or double figures then it might have an effect on people getting on the wrong bus.
I think they should have left the number alone it was a pretty good system 2xx - Dudley, 3xx Walsall, 4 West Bromwich, 5 Wolverhampton. Why mess with a system that was clearly running.
How do you know it is the number change that has increased patronage? I would hazard a guess that the increase has come because of better frequency and newer buses not changing the numbers from 3 digits to 1.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 02:06:06 PM
Hi Dutsey
the 5 service hasn't had new buses on the route yet so the patronage must of come from changing the number from 3 to 1 digit, and also maybe changing the times has helped. But the new numbering system could of helped a bit.
Or could the increase have come from the branding?
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 02:06:06 PM
Hi Dutsey
the 5 service hasn't had new buses on the route yet so the patronage must of come from changing the number from 3 to 1 digit, and also maybe changing the times has helped. But the new numbering system could of helped a bit.
You cannot say that patronage has increased just becuase they have renumbered a service from 3 digits, to 1.
In 1976, the WMPTE changed all route numbers in the Dudley area it said to avoid the confusing duplication of numbers around its area, now 40 years later Centro are saying they don't mind having a confusing duplication of numbers. MADNESS in my opinion.
You don't go to London and go to Golders Green and see the number 13, then go to say Streatham and there is a version of the 13 there to.
The old system of 2xx series for Dudley/Stourbridge, 5xx for Wolverhampton etc was much much better!
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 02:54:48 PM
Hi Stuharris 6360 I'm not just saying that patronage has come from dropping numbers off routes, but some patronage may have come from that. Also it could of come from route branding.
One question? Do you know patronage on the 451/5 has increased?
Ahh, this old argument again. People in Sandwell have seemed to remember the new route numbers pretty well, so I'm sure they will in Dudley
@KarlX96 Would you care to explain how you think a NUMBER CHANGE would make more people want to get a bus, therefore increasing the patronage.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 04:32:44 PM
Hi Sh4318
Thanks for backing me up. Although we were talking about patronage not numbers. You wouldn't happen to know about patronage on the 451/5 route?
All I know is that they increased the Sunday frequency a few months back to every 20 minutes, I can only presume this was as a result of an increase in patronage (on Sundays anyway).
The arguments about renumbering services are mainly invalid. How many people are still wandering around West Bromwich bus station looking for the 451 stop? With the plethora of information at bus stops and interchanges now, passengers may initially grumble about the renumbering of their bus route, but they soon adapt and get used to it. Yes, I remember the old 451 route, but when I get to West Bromwich bus station now, I can see that if I want to get to Sutton Coldfield, it is the 5 that gets me there and that's the bus I need to catch. It doesn't bother me that there is also a 5 between Birmingham and Solihull, because they are clearly two different routes in different areas.
In defence of shorter 1 or 2 digit route-numbers, the advantage is that they allow for destinations to be displayed clearer on LED displays, as longer route numbers take up much more room.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 04:32:44 PM
...You wouldn't happen to know about patronage on the 451/5 route?
Hi Karl X96
Can't really comment on whether patronage has increased since its renumbering but generally passenger numbers seem fine. Only see the West Bromwich side of the route really but it does run quite frequently so I rarely ever see standing loads, very busy workings, etc.
If changing the route number of a bus increased patronage, then surely the bus companies would be doing it all the time.
Bodies like Centro are trying to promote bus travel, ideas as already mentioned like branding and 24 hour services all increase patronage.
Would be interested to know whether customer numbers have increased on routes where new buses have been recently introduced.
Quote from: KarlX96 on July 30, 2015, 02:00:00 PM
It must of got held up somewhere along the route as it wasn't far behind the 251. As I got off the 251 it was right behind it and on the destination blind it said Dudley only. Before you say it could of been the next one along, it couldn't of been as the next one along would't of left Stourbridge until 20 past 12. I know i only takes 5 minutes to get to the stop that I get off at but there would of been people who missed the 251 nd had to get the X96.
I've been on the X96 today..... I've had no problems, left merry hill bus station 3 mins late but what can you expect with diamond using it
Quote from: pndriver on July 30, 2015, 08:47:45 PM
I've been on the X96 today..... I've had no problems, left merry hill bus station 3 mins late but what can you expect with diamond using it
National express are no saints!
@pndriver
Quote from: Trident 4194 on July 30, 2015, 08:56:52 PM
National express are no saints! @pndriver
Never said they were ::) but nx drivers will circle the station instead of blocking it
lets hope when the Dudley Bus review takes place, they allocate stands by operator, then if Diamond or any other operator want to block a stand, then they are only blocking other services they run!
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 12:19:51 PM
They only started circulating the station a few weeks ago. They never used to. I don't know if it's because Centro or the operations manager for the station has said to? Also I have noticed that all operators are supposed to turn off the engine if on stand for more than five minutes. I haven't noticed that especially NX drivers don't?
your only allowed 3 min on stand at merry hill didn't you know that as you work for centro
Quote from: karl724223 on August 02, 2015, 01:37:28 PM
your only allowed 3 min on stand at merry hill didn't you know that as you work for centro
Nx don't obey that rule on the 241/141
Quote from: Trident 4194 on August 02, 2015, 01:42:53 PM
Nx don't obey that rule on the 241/141
Proof?
People can't make accusations with out proof, that's libel.
Have you physically timed them
Dudley has a five min open door policy didn't you know that either
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:03:57 PM
Yes. I have also timed them there.
And what did you find?
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:00:27 PM
Yes only a few times. I have also noticed that at Dudley.
So as a 'Centro Volunteer' have you reported them? or are you not doing your job?
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:13:42 PM
When they were more that 5 minutes early (at Dudley) or 3 minutes early (at Merry Hill) they didn't turn the engine off nor did they pull in to the waiting bay. Some of the drivers do but some don't.
I bet you cannot give me one specific example I can check
Quote from: Tony on August 02, 2015, 02:17:35 PM
I bet you cannot give me one specific example I can check
How do you check if a bus is on stand or in the bus station?
Quote from: Trident 4194 on August 02, 2015, 02:23:10 PM
How do you check if a bus is on stand or in the bus station?
By it's traffilog recorder, yes the GPS is that accurate, and yes it records if the engine is running
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:13:42 PM
When they were more that 5 minutes early (at Dudley) or 3 minutes early (at Merry Hill) they didn't turn the engine off nor did they pull in to the waiting bay. Some of the drivers do but some don't.
i work from merry hill bus station and I have got to totally disagree with you 141/241 have 15 min drop back so engines would not be left on drivers usually go to the toilet so buses would not be left with engines running and engine turn themselves off after 5 min
222 usually running a bit late so usually in and out of merry hill
297 the same as above
53/289 the same
Merry hill is a centro and nx inspector manned station
Do you work for centro at all ??
Quote from: karl724223 on August 02, 2015, 02:26:24 PM
i work from merry hill bus station and I have got to totally disagree with you 141/241 have 15 min drop back so engines would not be left on drivers usually go to the toilet so buses would not be left with engines running and engine turn themselves off after 5 min
222 usually running a bit late so usually in and out of merry hill
297 the same as above
53/289 the same
Merry hill is a centro and nx inspector manned station
Do you work for centro at all ??
The 255 occasionally has a few mins if it runs on time if not in and out
The 81 gets 7 mins (if on time) and they always pull up on the lay-by and engine off.
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:31:06 PM
I am a volunteer for Centro, so most times I do report back to centro and I don't know if they report back to NX.
I could try to give an example if anyone wants one.
Shouldn't it be all times?
Yes go ahead and give an example.
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:31:06 PM
I am a volunteer for Centro, so most times I do report back to centro and I don't know if they report back to NX.
I could try to give an example if anyone wants one.
post 204 you said you can't remember but now you can
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:41:33 PM
I can only recall it if I think very hard and as I stated in post 210 if yo read now it give you a very vague description.
very vague description not even a day or date or where you cought the bus so tony could check
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:37:55 PM
I try to report back on a weekly basis.
Example:
I regularly get the X96 through to Wrens Nest. A couple of weeks ago I was on the 08:35 it was running on time I think, when it got to Dudley though it waited at stand N for more than 5 minutes and didn't turn the engine off as it's supposed to.
What was the exact time? Otherwise this isn't really a valid example.
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 02:53:04 PM
It got to Dudley at 09:10 and ti waited on the stand without turning the engine off. The day would of been Monday or Tuesday. I seam to recall it could of been the 20 July.
A Centro volunteer who doesn't know when the review is or isn't happening, that doesn't pay attention to when buses actually run, doesn't know how long open door policies are and we're supposed to believe what you write ?
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 12:13:48 PM
Which way were you travelling and what time. you mention that Diamond use it, no Diamond don't operate or use the stands that the X96 does unless you were travelling after 6pm?
I'm not disclosing any details, diamond don't use the same stands but that doesn't stop them blocking the whole station does it ?
Have you ever actually been to merry hill ?
Quote from: pndriver on August 02, 2015, 03:26:24 PM
I'm not disclosing any details, diamond don't use the same stands but that doesn't stop them blocking the whole station does it ?
Have you ever actually been to merry hill ?
What diamond services block stands? As they have middle or end ones. 002 never blocks stands and the 226 doesn't. It sounds as if you are against diamond for false reasons
Quote from: Trident 4194 on August 02, 2015, 04:13:08 PM
What diamond services block stands? As they have middle or end ones. 002 never blocks stands and the 226 doesn't. It sounds as if you are against diamond for false reasons
002 pulls in on stand A leaving its back end out so nothing on stand B or C can move till it's loaded up and goes buses on the 226 block buses from getting out of the park up bays don't tell me you've never seen this happen or was you in school when it happens
Quote from: karl724223 on August 02, 2015, 04:18:55 PM
002 pulls in on stand A leaving its back end out so nothing on stand B or C can move till it's loaded up and goes buses on the 226 block buses from getting out of the park up bays don't tell me you've never seen this happen or was you in school when it happens
I must be in school 😀
Oh and national express 243 never block a stand I suppose. How long is the 002 on stand for? 2 minutes? I
The 002 only leaves it rear out because it's got fed up of waiting for a nx bus to depart and decided to go round to avoid delays.
Nx timetable is stupid too for the 141/241.
The 226 is a small enough bus to manouevre around. I'm sure best driver at nx can manouevre around them easily 😎
Quote from: KarlX96 on August 02, 2015, 04:24:05 PM
I also agree with you I think pndriver is against Diamond regardless of what we can say. I think he is against all other operators as he may work for NX.
That's what's wrong with this forum. Everybody seems to think nx can do no wrong. I'm sure other non nx suck ups will agree. I'm surprised no ones mentioned hansons
Another 30 postings of riveting excitement........if this is the level of debate that so called bus enthusiasts indulge in,surely even the most lax of moderators can understand the disillusionment felt by serious minded posters
Quote from: arrifirststage on August 02, 2015, 04:45:30 PM
Another 30 postings of riveting excitement........if this is the level of debate that so called bus enthusiasts indulge in,surely even the most lax of moderators can understand the disillusionment felt by serious minded posters
Agreed.
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