Arriva take over Midland

[Bob]

I wonder if its a possibility that they could be told to sell off one of their garages to keep the Midland operation, and if they did which one would they sell? My money would be on Stafford if they had to get rid of one, i couldnt see them ever selling Delta Way operation

[winston]

I wonder if its a possibility that they could be told to sell off one of their garages to keep the Midland operation, and if they did which one would they sell? My money would be on Stafford if they had to get rid of one, i couldnt see them ever selling Delta Way operation

Doubt it, Midland isn't that big an operation and the majority of it operates within the WM county. Would have thought it would be undertakings at most on certain routes / fares within Staffs that may also include some currently operated by Arriva Midlands

[Discodave]

What happens if the OFT doesn't give the go ahead for the merger?

I suppose 'Midland' will have to be sold, but would Arriva re-register the routes & operate them from a mixture of Cannock & Hill Top depots?

I can't see why it wouldn't get given the go ahead to proceed with the takeover.

I don't see why it was even referred in the first place, worst case scenario Arriva may have to give some undertakings

According to rumour Winston NXWM moaned to OFT as they could not buy anything being too big and Arriva should not have it as they have aquired 2 operators already chase and green bus whom operated in the West Mids.  OFT saw no problem as Arriva are not a huge concern in the West Mids or have a big market but refererred themselves to show all is above board .  If its true Winston I cannot see why NXWM are concerned there is plenty of scope for another larger operator its not as if NXWM could not take on Arriva they could with ease and have already beaten them in Walsall and on the Burntwood routes also most of the work Arriva have is tendered anyway (not Including the Midland routes or cross county runs).  Delta way does not make that much money if delta way had to go most of the long distance stuff could eaisily be run from Stafford and interworked like Tamworth do with 112,765 eg 76/70 and 60/825 as now with a half hour service on 76 and 74/5 running into cannock and doing locals with Walsall stuff run by Wednesfield

[Bob]

What does 'undertakings at most' mean? They might have to stop operating certain routes into the West Midlands?

[Discodave]

May be deregister or not register any routes for a period of time or sell it off it just have to see what OFT say agree with Winston can't see why OFT are involved

[Bob]

Wonder wot theyd deregister, would it have to be a Midland route or 1 of there existing, like the 560, or the 1 or 70 etc

[Discodave]

560 deffo runs on fresh air or wrinklies or the 10 to give NX free reign

[Bob]

Damn i was hopin itd be Cannock to Walsall services, least we'd get a bit of variety then

[winston]

What happens if the OFT doesn't give the go ahead for the merger?

I suppose 'Midland' will have to be sold, but would Arriva re-register the routes & operate them from a mixture of Cannock & Hill Top depots?

I can't see why it wouldn't get given the go ahead to proceed with the takeover.

I don't see why it was even referred in the first place, worst case scenario Arriva may have to give some undertakings

According to rumour Winston NXWM moaned to OFT as they could not buy anything being too big and Arriva should not have it as they have aquired 2 operators already chase and green bus whom operated in the West Mids.  OFT saw no problem as Arriva are not a huge concern in the West Mids or have a big market but refererred themselves to show all is above board .  If its true Winston I cannot see why NXWM are concerned there is plenty of scope for another larger operator its not as if NXWM could not take on Arriva they could with ease and have already beaten them in Walsall and on the Burntwood routes also most of the work Arriva have is tendered anyway (not Including the Midland routes or cross county runs).  Delta way does not make that much money if delta way had to go most of the long distance stuff could eaisily be run from Stafford and interworked like Tamworth do with 112,765 eg 76/70 and 60/825 as now with a half hour service on 76 and 74/5 running into cannock and doing locals with Walsall stuff run by Wednesfield

Discodave,

Thanks for that, hadn't heard that it may have been NXWM that had complained to the OFT, tbh if the OFT have had no issues with the takeover of Midland when first announced, why are they still bothering to go to the time/expense of investigating the takeover, I don't see the point..... Even with that deal going ahead Arriva will still only be relatively small in the West Midlands, as you say most of it being tendered work. The only monopoly Arriva will have is on their traditional patch of Cannock / Lichfield etc. Whether it was aimed to be a stalling tack tick by NXWM or to fire one across Arriva's bow, we'll probably never know.... I don't personally think Arriva are too much of a threat based on what we have seen to date, however, they are now headed by a former TWM/NXWM man Alex Perry, so who knows what future plans they may/may not have. The days of bus wars appear to have long gone which is unfortunate, as it would have made things more interesting for a while.

Rotala are of little threat to NXWM, as they seem to be retrenching left, right & centre, De Courcey have done well off the back of their contract losses also. Rotala seem to have lost all their fight & simply don't have the finances to take NXWM on properly. If Arriva were to acquire the full Diamond WM business off Rotala, that would at least give them a number of established commercial services, scale & a platform to expand from, that said Arriva generally don't come across as being that aggressive with fellow big groups. Stagecoach would be a different story, but they have had numerous opportunities to set-up in the West Midlands, Brian Souter's heart seems to be set upon NXWM or nothing.....

P.s - Hope everyone has a very Merry Christmas!!!  ;)

[Discodave]

Thanks Winston hit the nail on the head About the new boss maybe he may put the fight into arriva wonder though if the oft would put there noses in if Rotals were to sell the West Midland operations would make things interesting though

and thanks for your view and also Merry Christmas

[jarh_9394]

The OFT investigation has nothing to do with NXWM, that was merely a rumour that got out of hand.

[Discodave]

Well its funny the deal was as good as done then OFT like already said Arriva have no monopoly only in there own areas Staffs/Shrops and the true fact is Arriva put themselves to the OFT so must be trying to appease someone

[jarh_9394]

Not disputing OFT involvement or the fact that it was a Third Party referral, but it was not Nat Ex.

[Discodave]

fair enough but does anyone else have anything to gain if oft say no nobody else could really challange NXWM its only them who will gain

[jarh_9394]

It is not necessarily another bus operator.