Vehicle Transfers

[PM]

Maybe Coventry could transfer over some B7tls or tridents in the interim until NXWM buy some more new deckers as surely there must be some due.

[Ash]

Tony,

As I see it, at the Sandwell Review from the information you've already provided, unless NXWM won't be operating these new services, then West Brom will be gaining two further services (83 and 129) which will go into the city centre.

Will they have enough Euro3 compliant buses (Volvo Gemini & ALX400) to be able to operate all their Birmingham services (74, 75, 80, 82, 83, 87, 89, 127, 128 and 129) from January 2013?

Stu, I think the overall problem is West Brom garage has had no new buses now for a long time and with this sandwell review approaching there will or could well be a shortage of euro 3 compliant buses becuase of lack of investment the geminis are 06 reg and are the newest buses there since the omnilinks have left every other garage has newer buses and i doubt West Bromwich will have any new double deckers within the near future.

[PM]

Exactly. As I see it, current WB fleet stands at:

11b6s
37mercs
14darts
18 06 reg geminis
28 earlier geminis
31 alx400/volvos
25 presidents

Grand total of 164. Of that, 77 meet the euro3 targets. The question is, what is the current PVR of all WB routes entering the city centre? Also, what will the new PVR be when the changes come into force? Clearly if it is above 77 then NXWM have a problem.

Possible solutions:

Still a couple of 53 reg geminis at AG-could be swapped for presidents
Do AG need all of their geminis that they currently have? If not, transfer across.
Buy WB some new deckers-maybe some Volvos to go with the existing fleet. Or, buy AG new buses to replace geminis and transfer geminis across to WB

[winston]

Exactly. As I see it, current WB fleet stands at:

11b6s
37mercs
14darts
18 06 reg geminis
28 earlier geminis
31 alx400/volvos
25 presidents

Grand total of 164. Of that, 77 meet the euro3 targets. The question is, what is the current PVR of all WB routes entering the city centre? Also, what will the new PVR be when the changes come into force? Clearly if it is above 77 then NXWM have a problem.

Possible solutions:

Still a couple of 53 reg geminis at AG-could be swapped for presidents
Do AG need all of their geminis that they currently have? If not, transfer across.
Buy WB some new deckers-maybe some Volvos to go with the existing fleet. Or, buy AG new buses to replace geminis and transfer geminis across to WB

Taking in to account Merc transfers in to WB from BY, two further Gemini/President swaps with AG & withdrawals reported during September the quantities are actually as follows:

10 x B6LEs
41 x Mercs (a number of earlier non refurb Mercs may now have been withdrawn?)
16 x Darts
18 x 06 reg geminis
30 x earlier geminis (4517 & 4518 are now at WB ex AG, swapped for two further Presidents)
30 x Alx400/volvos
24 x Presidents

78 x Euro 3 double deckers

Total 169

AG doesn't now own any 53 reg Geminis, they are now all at WB

[PM]

Exactly. As I see it, current WB fleet stands at:

11b6s
37mercs
14darts
18 06 reg geminis
28 earlier geminis
31 alx400/volvos
25 presidents

Grand total of 164. Of that, 77 meet the euro3 targets. The question is, what is the current PVR of all WB routes entering the city centre? Also, what will the new PVR be when the changes come into force? Clearly if it is above 77 then NXWM have a problem.

Possible solutions:

Still a couple of 53 reg geminis at AG-could be swapped for presidents
Do AG need all of their geminis that they currently have? If not, transfer across.
Buy WB some new deckers-maybe some Volvos to go with the existing fleet. Or, buy AG new buses to replace geminis and transfer geminis across to WB

Taking in to account Merc transfers in to WB from BY, two further Gemini/President swaps with AG & withdrawals reported during September the quantities are actually as follows:

10 x B6LEs
41 x Mercs (a number of earlier non refurb Mercs may now have been withdrawn?)
14 x Darts
18 x 06 reg geminis
30 x earlier geminis (4517 & 4518 are now at WB ex AG, swapped for two further Presidents)
30 x Alx400/volvos
24 x Presidents

Total 167

AG doesn't now own any 53 reg Geminis, they are now all at WB

Thanks for updating me ;)

[Tony]

Exactly. As I see it, current WB fleet stands at:

11b6s
37mercs
14darts
18 06 reg geminis
28 earlier geminis
31 alx400/volvos
25 presidents

Grand total of 164. Of that, 77 meet the euro3 targets. The question is, what is the current PVR of all WB routes entering the city centre? Also, what will the new PVR be when the changes come into force? Clearly if it is above 77 then NXWM have a problem.

Possible solutions:

Still a couple of 53 reg geminis at AG-could be swapped for presidents
Do AG need all of their geminis that they currently have? If not, transfer across.
Buy WB some new deckers-maybe some Volvos to go with the existing fleet. Or, buy AG new buses to replace geminis and transfer geminis across to WB

Taking in to account Merc transfers in to WB from BY, two further Gemini/President swaps with AG & withdrawals reported during September the quantities are actually as follows:

10 x B6LEs
41 x Mercs (a number of earlier non refurb Mercs may now have been withdrawn?)
14 x Darts
18 x 06 reg geminis
30 x earlier geminis (4517 & 4518 are now at WB ex AG, swapped for two further Presidents)
30 x Alx400/volvos
24 x Presidents

Total 167

AG doesn't now own any 53 reg Geminis, they are now all at WB

16 darts!

[PM]

Crap-forgot the wright darts. These are nice buses too....

[winston]

Exactly. As I see it, current WB fleet stands at:

11b6s
37mercs
14darts
18 06 reg geminis
28 earlier geminis
31 alx400/volvos
25 presidents

Grand total of 164. Of that, 77 meet the euro3 targets. The question is, what is the current PVR of all WB routes entering the city centre? Also, what will the new PVR be when the changes come into force? Clearly if it is above 77 then NXWM have a problem.

Possible solutions:

Still a couple of 53 reg geminis at AG-could be swapped for presidents
Do AG need all of their geminis that they currently have? If not, transfer across.
Buy WB some new deckers-maybe some Volvos to go with the existing fleet. Or, buy AG new buses to replace geminis and transfer geminis across to WB

Taking in to account Merc transfers in to WB from BY, two further Gemini/President swaps with AG & withdrawals reported during September the quantities are actually as follows:

10 x B6LEs
41 x Mercs (a number of earlier non refurb Mercs may now have been withdrawn?)
14 x Darts
18 x 06 reg geminis
30 x earlier geminis (4517 & 4518 are now at WB ex AG, swapped for two further Presidents)
30 x Alx400/volvos
24 x Presidents

Total 167

AG doesn't now own any 53 reg Geminis, they are now all at WB

16 darts!

Yep!, forgot those two....

[PM]

So 20 buses needed from somewhere... It would probably be easiest to just buy 20 new deckers and use them to launch the new services to get them going

[Ash]

Crap-forgot the wright darts. These are nice buses too....

I went on 7084 on the 428 the other day and i have never been on a bus that shuck so much everything possible that could rattle did even the passengers were commenting and one said to the driver this is like a tin can and they replied saying this bus is just a bone shaker. When stationary the bus was fine no problems but when it got to any sort of speed was a nightmare as a passenger much prefer the b6le.

[winston]

So 20 buses needed from somewhere... It would probably be easiest to just buy 20 new deckers and use them to launch the new services to get them going

Do they necessarily need to be double deckers? Would the 80 & 89 not cope with full size single deckers? Not sure on loadings but they were operated by Mercs until recently when further Geminis arrived.

Not sure on the proposed routes of new services 83 & 129, but could they not also not utilize full size single deckers?

May be an additional batch of B7RLE's could service those routes, either ordered by NX or whether Volvo have sufficient stock built ones for a quick delivery

[Ash]

Will these new service even need double deckers im sure single deckers on some of them will provide enough capacity. A mad idea would be transfer the 20 omnilinks being debranded from the 404 back to West Brom and transfer the 404 service which will be the 4 service back to WB and operate it using mercs with the now 405/406 service transferring back to Walsall and the now 401/2 going to Pensnett and being interworked with driver changes at Dudley when the 402 is extended from Tipton to Dudley.

[winston]

Wolverhampton will have 21 deckers going spare when the Hybrids get delivered.

Emission zone is Jan 2013 still I assume?

Depends on current plans, the majority seem to think that the Spectras will be for the chop, but NX could still do with increasing the proportion of double deckers in the fleet, Pensnett at least could do with additional deckers for busier routes / peak workings

The other option is WN transfer out 21 Tridents to a Trident garage that also operates compliant Volvo's, the Volvo's in turn transfer in to WB

Euro 3 emission zone is still set for Jan 2013 

[winston]

Will these new service even need double deckers im sure single deckers on some of them will provide enough capacity. A mad idea would be transfer the 20 omnilinks being debranded from the 404 back to West Brom and transfer the 404 service which will be the 4 service back to WB and operate it using mercs with the now 405/406 service transferring back to Walsall and the now 401/2 going to Pensnett and being interworked with driver changes at Dudley when the 402 is extended from Tipton to Dudley.

But then the 404 (4,4H & 4M) passengers revert back to 13 & 14 year old Mercs, mostly non refurbished

[Ash]

Will these new service even need double deckers im sure single deckers on some of them will provide enough capacity. A mad idea would be transfer the 20 omnilinks being debranded from the 404 back to West Brom and transfer the 404 service which will be the 4 service back to WB and operate it using mercs with the now 405/406 service transferring back to Walsall and the now 401/2 going to Pensnett and being interworked with driver changes at Dudley when the 402 is extended from Tipton to Dudley.

But then the 404 (4,4H & 4M) passengers revert back to 13 & 14 year old Mercs, mostly non refurbished

That is an issue but when the next batch of new single deckers are delivered the 404 could be then first in line, also im sure i read somewhere a while ago the 404 was only upgraded to omnilinks because at that time diamond upgrading their 404B/E/H service with new centro's so now they have gone back to the old darts. That could be untrue and maybe could of been in line for new single deckers anyway.