11A/11C

[Tony]

As I'm not going to get a straight answer from our resident Bus Champion about what goes on or is discussed at these meetings, lets back on topic.

I used the Outer Circle again today for a short shopping trip to and from Kings Heath this afternoon.

No problems with the 11C journey into Kings Heath, app was showing them seemingly running on time.

But on my way back home, there were two 11As following each other.

One issue that causes delays on the 11A service is with the stupid road layout in Selly Oak, in particular the Harborne Lane island where the entrance to the new retail park is.

Northbound 11C journeys aren't affected as much, as they use the slip road onto Harborne Lane which bypasses the island.

The problem is that the southbound 11A journeys have to go round that island, which gets blocked by vehicles queuing up to enter the shopping centre car park. This in turn also causes delays to the 48, X20 and X21 services approaching this island from the A38.

Badly designed road layout. I have seen this myself with my own eyes on various occasions. Even my dad complains to me about this junction, as he drives through Selly Oak to get to my house when he's coming to give me a lift, and he's made the same observation.

This is but one observable explanation of why the 11A/C suffers with reliability, and I'm sure there are others.

On this occasion, on disembarking from the 11A that I caught, I noticed on the ticketer screen that it was showing as 'Late 8', so presumably the one following close behind - which managed to overtake us at Billesley fire station - was about 23 minutes late (or 7 minutes early!).

Looking at the data from the 11A there only seemed to be one bad spot today and that was between Witton and Perry Barr where buses were losing up to 26 minutes!

[ellspurs]

Looking at the data from the 11A there only seemed to be one bad spot today and that was between Witton and Perry Barr where buses were losing up to 26 minutes!

Do the buses get long enough on layover to compensate for this delay on route? Or is this where the truncated services come in, to get buses caught back up to the timetable?

[Tony]

Do the buses get long enough on layover to compensate for this delay on route? Or is this where the truncated services come in, to get buses caught back up to the timetable?

That's the problem with the circle, the delays are so unpredictable, and you cannot park a bus with passengers on for too long on layover

[richardjones210368]

That's the problem with the circle, the delays are so unpredictable, and you cannot park a bus with passengers on for too long on layover

Just a serious question @Tony on the new timetable on the X8 is it usual now into Bham to pick up at 1 Snow Hill call at Colmore Row then do a loop round again past St Chad's to pick up again at 1 Snow Hill  to depart Comore Row on time if so that is very very clever move to keep the X8 on time?

[richardjones210368]

As I'm not going to get a straight answer from our resident Bus Champion about what goes on or is discussed at these meetings, lets back on topic.

I used the Outer Circle again today for a short shopping trip to and from Kings Heath this afternoon.

No problems with the 11C journey into Kings Heath, app was showing them seemingly running on time.

But on my way back home, there were two 11As following each other.

One issue that causes delays on the 11A service is with the stupid road layout in Selly Oak, in particular the Harborne Lane island where the entrance to the new retail park is.

Northbound 11C journeys aren't affected as much, as they use the slip road onto Harborne Lane which bypasses the island.

The problem is that the southbound 11A journeys have to go round that island, which gets blocked by vehicles queuing up to enter the shopping centre car park. This in turn also causes delays to the 48, X20 and X21 services approaching this island from the A38.

Badly designed road layout. I have seen this myself with my own eyes on various occasions. Even my dad complains to me about this junction, as he drives through Selly Oak to get to my house when he's coming to give me a lift, and he's made the same observation.

This is but one observable explanation of why the 11A/C suffers with reliability, and I'm sure there are others.

On this occasion, on disembarking from the 11A that I caught, I noticed on the ticketer screen that it was showing as 'Late 8', so presumably the one following close behind - which managed to overtake us at Billesley fire station - was about 23 minutes late (or 7 minutes early!).

The straight answer @Stu we report what we see and what is reported to us to report I am happy to report anything at the Bus Champion meetings and the other WMCA meetings if and my business email is freely available on this forum a question is raised and I can support the question with evidence I am not the enemy on this forum I will raise any point.

[Stu]

Looking at the data from the 11A there only seemed to be one bad spot today and that was between Witton and Perry Barr where buses were losing up to 26 minutes!

Cheers for that, I still think the rest of my post is valid, but I appreciate that sometimes people find these kinds of explanations hard to believe. For instance a couple of years ago, I tried explaining to someone whining about the 11A on a Sunday that the reason why the bus was late in South Yardley was because of roadworks in Handsworth. "But that's miles away!" was their response. It really is incredible how many people don't realise where the 11 actually goes.

Do the buses get long enough on layover to compensate for this delay on route? Or is this where the truncated services come in, to get buses caught back up to the timetable?

For me, it can be frustrating catching the 11A/C through Acocks Green. If the buses are on time, they have something like an 8 to 10 minute layover in Acocks Green village. I completely understand why they do this, but unfortunately you always get some dickhead who starts ramming the Stop button demanding the bus gets moving again.

[richardjones210368]

You see Mr Jones, exactly what I have said, the best defence is to attack.

You are a bus champion, nothing more, nothing less which means you attend meetings and discuss bus services. You have been asked by members of this forum to make known there comments about the state of the 11A/C which you refuse to do because you say the service is perfect when you use it.

Then there is the 9, I have to travel to Birmingham regular and I always catch the 9 even though the train station to me is just as close as the bus station (me supporting local bus services). Ever since they closed off the Five Ways tunnels, especially the City bound one, the 9 gets caught up in traffic there along with all the other Hagley Road routes. This means that 9s get bunched together and it isn't uncommon to see 2 or 3 9s together. Whether you choose to believe me is irrelevant, it happens. There is nothing NX can do about it, however to say that it doesn't happen is scandalous. If your office is on Hagley Road, I suggest you oipen the blinds and see what is happening in real time.

Your talking rubbish @Stuharris 6360 no one on this forum have emailed and my business email is freely available to anyone on the forum to raise a question on the Outer Circle if they did I would be happy to do as other members of this forum have done and I have raised thier points and they have recieved responses from TfWM and frankly your talking b*******s about 5 ways island in my 51 years daily on the 140 there has always been Quinton 9s in 2s it's an FI service nothing to do with roadworks do you not understand what that means I really do wonder if the you and others on this forum use the same TfWM network as me by the way you still haven't answered fully do you support the overnight Quinton 9s as I do and frankly @Stuharris 6360 I am much more than a Bus Champion ever wondered who gave our gracious leader the idea for West Midlands Bus.............

[2206]

Cheers for that, I still think the rest of my post is valid, but I appreciate that sometimes people find these kinds of explanations hard to believe. For instance a couple of years ago, I tried explaining to someone whining about the 11A on a Sunday that the reason why the bus was late in South Yardley was because of roadworks in Handsworth. "But that's miles away!" was their response. It really is incredible how many people don't realise where the 11 actually goes.

Think that is because people mostly use the 11 for short local journeys, a lot of people who use it in Yardley, probably wouldn't even know where Handsworth is and have never had any need to go there @Stu,not really incredible or surprising that some of the general public aren't familiar with the whole route, particularly one that long.

Similarly I think some of the general public on the 55/94 routes probably have no clue where they go after    Ward End/Washwood Heath Road and wouldn't know the difference between the two. I've overheard people claiming that they are the same thing and that there's no difference between them a few times.

Looking at the X8 Running Boards they are timed to have layover time in Birmingham City Centre. As this is limited to 8 minutes, then yes any bus with more than that time is meant to loop around and await time in Snow Hill before proceeding onto Colmore Row.

I did catch an X8 a few weeks back from Long Lane and remember I noticed it had 16 minutes layover time in the City Centre (more than 8 minutes), so perhaps not a new thing then @richardjones210368 . This was Wednesday 22nd January board X8/09 at about 1PM.

[Stu]

Your talking rubbish @Stuharris 6360 no one on this forum have emailed me to raise a question on the Outer Circle if they did I would be happy to do as other members of this forum have done and I have raised thier points and they have recieved responses from TfWM and frankly your talking b*******s about 5 ways island in my 51 years daily on the 140
there has always been Quinton 9s in 2s it's an FI service you idiot do you not understand what that means I really do wonder if the idiots on this forum use the same TfWM network as me by the way you still haven't answered fully do you support the overnight Quinton 9s as I do and frankly @Stuharris 6360 I am much more than a Bus Champion ever wondered who gave our gracious leader the idea for West Midlands Bus.............

But I go back to my point that I initially raised, what mechanism is there is in place for 'ordinary bus users' to raise concerns about particular services for these to be raised in these meetings that you attend in your capacity as 'bus champion'?

Not everyone has your private email address in order to express these concerns, so what other avenue is there?

You are not doing yourself any favours by insulting other members of this forum by the way, and are you really demanding that people get up out of their beds and travel on night journeys on the 9 service when they have no need to?

[richardjones210368]

But I go back to my point that I initially raised, what mechanism is there is in place for 'ordinary bus users' to raise concerns about particular services for these to be raised in these meetings that you attend in your capacity as 'bus champion'?

Not everyone has your private email address in order to express these concerns, so what other avenue is there?

You are not doing yourself any favours by insulting other members of this forum by the way, and are you really demanding that people get up out of their beds and travel on night journeys on the 9 service when they have no need to?

My business email address is avaliable to everyone on my profile and as TfWM Bus Champion I give my business card out to all Blackheath bus users in the town bus stops and many contact me to raise thier concerns and my contact details are avaliable to our constituency member of parliament for his surgerys as for this forum just look for the letter icon under my name you are a moderator are you not aware of that @Stu that is most odd @Stu and a number of forum members have contacted me and I have raised thier concerns to TfWM and there concerns been resoluted direct by TfWM. The WMCA runs public  bus forums for the public throughout the year the public can attend I will post the dates on the forum as and when & The Mayor runs his "Ask Andy" public meetings across the West Midands regularly I think that's enough to get involved and if there is a successful night bus in both Birmingham and Stourbridge such as WMT's Quinton 9 then why is a poster getting a taxi which I would never do I am proud to support the West Midlands Bus Network 24hrs a day unlike others on this forum I practice what I preach & I do not insult others as you suggest I simply give my frank views about thier so called bus use & also replying to @Stuharris 6360  who seems to use a different  Quinton 9 to me funny that @Stuharris 6360 who appears to be an occasional user seems to know more than a daily user of X8 PN9 X10 or 13A so what do I know about Hagley Rd bus servics I am p*****g myself laughing mind you I've an op coming up to curtail that anyway at the QE!! @Stu your not suggesting censorship are you @Stu I was proud to attend a memorial service on behalf of our Accounting Institute last week to honour the fight for equality after the problems some had from 1939 to 1945 with one of our former EU partners because of thier views and religion are you suggesting differently?

[D10]

Just a serious question @Tony on the new timetable on the X8 is it usual now into Bham to pick up at 1 Snow Hill call at Colmore Row then do a loop round again past St Chad's to pick up again at 1 Snow Hill  to depart Comore Row on time if so that is very very clever move to keep the X8 on time?

Looking at the X8 Running Boards they are timed to have layover time in Birmingham City Centre. As this is limited to 8 minutes, then yes any bus with more than that time is meant to loop around and await time in Snow Hill before proceeding onto Colmore Row.

[richardjones210368]

Looking at the X8 Running Boards they are timed to have layover time in Birmingham City Centre. As this is limited to 8 minutes, then yes any bus with more than that time is meant to loop around and await time in Snow Hill before proceeding onto Colmore Row.

Thanks @D10 I hadnt been on an X8 before that did this I applaud this in making the service more reliable.

[richardjones210368]

Think that is because people mostly use the 11 for short local journeys, a lot of people who use it in Yardley, probably wouldn't even know where Handsworth is and have never had any need to go there @Stu,not really incredible or surprising that some of the general public aren't familiar with the whole route, particularly one that long.

Similarly I think some of the general public on the 55/94 routes probably have no clue where they go after the Washwood Heath Road and wouldn't know the difference between the two. I've overheard people claiming that they are the same thing and that there's no difference between them a few times.
I did catch an X8 a few weeks back from Long Lane and remember I noticed it had 16 minutes layover time in the City Centre (more than 8 minutes), so perhaps not a new thing then @richardjones210368 . This was Wednesday 22nd January board X8/09 at about 1PM.

Interesting  @2206 I had never come across it in the peaks before Cheers for that

[GeminiFan1991]

I catch the 11 to and from Stechford, and the layover at Acocks Green Village is a lifesaver for me ! If they didn't have that, I'd be waiting too long for my liking.

Some instances with the 11 can be infuriating, at times, I'll check the app before I leave and it'll say the bus is due in a 2 minutes, then the next 3 buses are after 25+ minutes ! Since being on this forum and having taken an active interest in how the operations work, I can't say I genuinely get frustrated at the company, the buses, or drivers, its a case of the notion of waiting that long for a bus isn't what I'd consider ideal.

I remember when the 98 used to run, I was at a stop and someone asked me whether it like the 97, also went to Chelmsley Wood ! Most end to end journeys are well over 30+ minutes and many people who take bus journeys exceeding that, are often making a connecting journey via another bus.

[MasterPlan]

As I'm not going to get a straight answer from our resident Bus Champion about what goes on or is discussed at these meetings, lets back on topic.

I used the Outer Circle again today for a short shopping trip to and from Kings Heath this afternoon.

No problems with the 11C journey into Kings Heath, app was showing them seemingly running on time.

But on my way back home, there were two 11As following each other.

One issue that causes delays on the 11A service is with the stupid road layout in Selly Oak, in particular the Harborne Lane island where the entrance to the new retail park is.

Northbound 11C journeys aren't affected as much, as they use the slip road onto Harborne Lane which bypasses the island.

The problem is that the southbound 11A journeys have to go round that island, which gets blocked by vehicles queuing up to enter the shopping centre car park. This in turn also causes delays to the 48, X20 and X21 services approaching this island from the A38.

Badly designed road layout. I have seen this myself with my own eyes on various occasions. Even my dad complains to me about this junction, as he drives through Selly Oak to get to my house when he's coming to give me a lift, and he's made the same observation.

This is but one observable explanation of why the 11A/C suffers with reliability, and I'm sure there are others.

On this occasion, on disembarking from the 11A that I caught, I noticed on the ticketer screen that it was showing as 'Late 8', so presumably the one following close behind - which managed to overtake us at Billesley fire station - was about 23 minutes late (or 7 minutes early!).

New Fosse Way isn't any better than Harborne Lane.. It gets absolutely rammed at rush hour with traffic backing up all the way back to the QE Island and sometimes all the way past Uni Station. It's awful.