West midlands bus franchising

[LD713821]

I think this is part of the idea - either people will just be put off from participating and "having their say" due to the complexity of it, or the only people that complete the survey will be those who wholeheartedly agree, without even looking at any of the associated documents, because they've been sold an idea that buses will "be cheaper and more reliable".
That is undoubtedly true, but those costs will be factored in by operators when it comes to bidding on contracts.

For many companies, it seems like the cheaper or 'easier' option to just outsource or contract-out work.

Whichever way you do it though, you still end up with problems with unions. Franchising won't stop workers from going on strike. Look at refuse collections in Birmingham and Sandwell - Birmingham operate their service themselves, while Sandwell use an external contractor (Serco). As soon as the unions dig their heels in, then the service crumbles.

Since there is loads of routes being ran outside of depots outside of the West Midlands, wouldn't it of been easier to franchise the Routes like London and not the entire system?

[2900]

It appears where Stagecoach Oldbury ran its operations from during the commonwealth games is the new proposed site to replace WB garage, Total park , Birmingham rd oldbury, it's on rightmove some very good aerial shots , ideal new depot site imo.
It will solve our lack of restroom facilities here in oldbury to.

[BlackCountryBusSpotter]

With franchising there will be no 'joint corridor' working on the 50 by different operators. There will be no competition on any route.

No Under Andy Street he had the idea to merge two competitors on one route under the WMB Branding, the new Mayor could have done that/reinstated it on the 50 but no now both NX and Diamond will lose there commercial route the 50 rather than working together

[BlackCountryBusSpotter]

I don't think you've grasped how franchising will work.

Bus operators will be paid a contracted rate to provide a service using a set number of vehicles - a fixed amount determined by operational costs plus a profit margin (no-one's going to get involved unless there's money to be made!).

As long as the service is provided in line with contractual terms, as TfWM would be collecting all the fare revenue, the buses could run around empty as far as the operators are concerned. There won't be any more commercial competition or joint partnerships.

I was saying the New Mayor could have done what Mr Street did before and Routes like the WA4, YW50 he could have branded them under the West Midlands Bus label and both operators accept each others tickets and have a joint return ticket and timetable much like the WA31/32 WB40 42/43/43A, he obviously doesn't like that/care and will now reduce the service and people won't have a choice of which operator to get as the Mayor will make NX and Diamond give it up unless one of them manages to be awarded the contract 

[Stu]

Just reading through the "Assessment of the Proposed Franchising Scheme" document, and noticed that my website is listed as a reference!
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/media/k1ilbwhq/assessment-of-the-proposed-franchising-scheme-for-west-midlands-buses.pdf

See section 3.4.1!

[Stu]

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In a nutshell, if you work for a company that doesn't make profit, then they can't afford to pay you and thus you lose your job.

In the case of the WMCA, if they don't make a profit through bus franchising, then they put up your council tax rates.

Socialist governments traditionally do make a financial mess. They always run out of other people's money.

[Tony]

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In a nutshell, if you work for a company that doesn't make profit, then they can't afford to pay you and thus you lose your job.

In the case of the WMCA, if they don't make a profit through bus franchising, then they put up your council tax rates.

And of course National Express Coventry could still end up running his bus service!

[Stu]

And of course National Express Coventry could still end up running his bus service!

As well as making a profit without having to worry about how many passengers were being carried!

[LD713821]

You cannot view this attachment.

In a nutshell, if you work for a company that doesn't make profit, then they can't afford to pay you and thus you lose your job.

In the case of the WMCA, if they don't make a profit through bus franchising, then they put up your council tax rates.

Someone could argue that Public Transport isn't intended to make a profit though its there to provide the best possible service for its passengers.

Although I still think we would be better off with an even more enhanced bus partnership (not franchising but something more than to what we have now) which could bring: 
Tap and cap for all buses/trams
Unified bus branding with one social media platform/website for all buses (@westmidlandsbus / westmidlandsbus.co.uk)

 

[LD713821]

But more importantly they need to be useable first

Why would you a bus from Acocks Green (as an example) to get into the City Centre which would probably take over 35 minutes 

Its much quicker to get a bus or walk towards the nearest train station even its the opposite direction then get the train to Birmingham City Centre.

They need more bus priority lanes wherever possible in Birmingham - It worked for the A45 (X1/X2)

[Solo1]

Need more bus lanes & if cars caught in the bus lane £1k fine 

[Mike K]

Need more bus lanes & if cars caught in the bus lane £1k fine

A £1k fine is an utterly ridiculous suggestion. With the road layouts and constant changes around Birmingham city centre it's very easy to inadvertently enter a bus lane or bus 'gate'. I've done it myself mistakenly in the past on Sheepcote Street. 

I'm not excusing those who deliberately abuse bus lanes but there are plenty who make honest mistakes. 

[Stu]

Someone could argue that Public Transport isn't intended to make a profit though its there to provide the best possible service for its passengers.

But only by making profits can bus companies invest in new vehicles and technologies.

Even under public ownership, WMCA will still need to make profits, mainly to pay back the initial investment.

[wembley86]

Surely we need to look at who really should be driving.

In my opinion.  Bus driver's, refuse truck drivers, medical staff and emergency services and delivery drivers.

[BlackCountryBusSpotter]

Surely we need to look at who really should be driving.

In my opinion.  Bus driver's, refuse truck drivers, medical staff and emergency services and delivery drivers.

And the cars that take them to Work and the respective other staff who work at the Garages, Hospitals and so on