London Midland Trains

[T840MAK]

Ridiculous situation

How is it? It's not a problem that London Midland have caused themselves, and it's not a problem that just LM suffer. It's well known that there's a nationwide stock shortage.
If you think LM is bad then try TransPennine in the peaks, then maybe you'll realise that you've not got it anywhere near as bad as you think you have.
Seriously. Just quit your complaining for once in a while.

[Bob]

How is it? It's not a problem that London Midland have caused themselves, and it's not a problem that just LM suffer. It's well known that there's a nationwide stock shortage.
If you think LM is bad then try TransPennine in the peaks, then maybe you'll realise that you've not got it anywhere near as bad as you think you have.
Seriously. Just quit your complaining for once in a while.

I meant it's a ridiculous situation to be at a point when there's no bloody spare stock. And no thanks I wont

[Stu]

Forgive my ignorance if I don't know all the facts here (and please do correct me if I'm wrong), but is the problem with the way that train services are supposedly privatised?

My understanding is that it is actually our government that buys the trains, and then leases them to the operators?

With bus operators, if for example NX needs more buses, they go out and buy them, with the profits they've made from running the services privately.

With the huge profits that the TOCs are raking in, should they not invest these profits into purchasing more rolling stock, if they are needed?

Its also worth pointing out that while London Midland are the subject of much discontent here in the Midlands, there is nowhere near the same level of press coverage as given to Southern Rail, who are also owned by Govia.

Its no wonder people are so pissed off with train companies and their excuses for running such poor services, while raking in excessive profits from exhorbitant fares, and not investing those profits back into the services they operate.

[Tony]

Forgive my ignorance if I don't know all the facts here (and please do correct me if I'm wrong), but is the problem with the way that train services are supposedly privatised?

My understanding is that it is actually our government that buys the trains, and then leases them to the operators?

With bus operators, if for example NX needs more buses, they go out and buy them, with the profits they've made from running the services privately.

With the huge profits that the TOCs are raking in, should they not invest these profits into purchasing more rolling stock, if they are needed?

Its also worth pointing out that while London Midland are the subject of much discontent here in the Midlands, there is nowhere near the same level of press coverage as given to Southern Rail, who are also owned by Govia.

Its no wonder people are so pissed off with train companies and their excuses for running such poor services, while raking in excessive profits from exhorbitant fares, and not investing those profits back into the services they operate.

But they are not making the profit on Southern. It is odd in the fact it is in in the same way as London Buses where the Government takes all fare revenue and pays Southern a fixed fee.

The Government doesn't buy the stock, private leasing companies do that, although the Government does give these companies a guarantee that the stock will be used for a certain length of time after the initial franchise has ended so that leasing costs are lower due to be spread over a longer time.

The current rolling stock will be sorted soon as there is more stock currently on order than ever before. It just normally takes two years for any new stock to get into service after being ordered.

There are currently large rolling stock orders in for the following companies
Scotrail
Virgin East Coast
Anglia (entire stock being replaced)
Northern
Trans-Pennine
First Great Western
South West Trains
Hull Trains
C2C

I would be very surprised if the new Franchise for London Midland doesn't include new stock as well as cascades with how cheap money is at the moment

[Bob]

Assuming they win it?

[Tony]

Assuming they win it?

Someone's got to win it

[T840MAK]

Forgive my ignorance if I don't know all the facts here (and please do correct me if I'm wrong), but is the problem with the way that train services are supposedly privatised?

My understanding is that it is actually our government that buys the trains, and then leases them to the operators?

With bus operators, if for example NX needs more buses, they go out and buy them, with the profits they've made from running the services privately.

With the huge profits that the TOCs are raking in, should they not invest these profits into purchasing more rolling stock, if they are needed?

Its also worth pointing out that while London Midland are the subject of much discontent here in the Midlands, there is nowhere near the same level of press coverage as given to Southern Rail, who are also owned by Govia.

Its no wonder people are so pissed off with train companies and their excuses for running such poor services, while raking in excessive profits from exhorbitant fares, and not investing those profits back into the services they operate.

Your understanding is spot on. Using TransPennine as an example again, First and Keolis wanted 60x 5-car units (300 carriages). The DfT said no - TPE ended up with half that - 51x 3 car units, with options to extend. TPE lobbied for these for years - DfT said no, and now look at the situation. Services that are constantly F&S with no spare stock to remedy, and this is only just been started to be solved.

[midlandred2003]

Last night after attending the Blues game went to Bordesley station for the 19:51 a quick check on my phone discovered it was cancelled between dorridge & moor street.A walk to moor street later the platform is packed train arrives 15 minutes late on arriving at snow hill the train is severely overcrowded, we then arrived at the hawthorns after the Albion had played we were there 20 minutes trying to squeeze more on. This is not a criticism of London midland but there was a Chiltern train waiting at snow hill to follow us to Stourbridge, in the not to distant past it would have been used to clear the crowds, progress?

[Stuharris 6360]

Last night after attending the Blues game went to Bordesley station for the 19:51 a quick check on my phone discovered it was cancelled between dorridge & moor street.A walk to moor street later the platform is packed train arrives 15 minutes late on arriving at snow hill the train is severely overcrowded, we then arrived at the hawthorns after the Albion had played we were there 20 minutes trying to squeeze more on. This is not a criticism of London midland but there was a Chiltern train waiting at snow hill to follow us to Stourbridge, in the not to distant past it would have been used to clear the crowds, progress?

[/b]

Have contacted Chiltern several times regarding services from London Marylebone to Birmingham on Saturdays' which then travel ECS to Stourbridge. They said they have no plans to turn them into passengers services in one reply and in the other reply they said there was no available path. Strange there is a path for the ECS???

[Kevin]

Just to throw an alternative viewpoint out there on that one, not a genuine opinion
Do football fans expect current services to cope with their extra footfall? Would they expect services to be empty so they can all get on board?
Could they not organise chartering a train or hiring buses?

[mikestone]

[/b]

Have contacted Chiltern several times regarding services from London Marylebone to Birmingham on Saturdays' which then travel ECS to Stourbridge. They said they have no plans to turn them into passengers services in one reply and in the other reply they said there was no available path. Strange there is a path for the ECS???

It is possible they would argue that a terminating passenger train has to be checked for oversleepers/bashers trying to get the sidings in the book

[midlandred2003]

I would expect that every one travelling into Birmingham for xmas shopping and the German market would anticipate being able to get home as well as footie fans,incidentally an extra train was put on from the hawthorns to Kidderminster but that didn't help the several hundred in Birmingham.

[Dom]

I go to a lot of Walsall, wolves, blues, West brom matches as part of my line of work, I have to say travelling back on the train is quite horrid at times, I mean if a decent away following goes to Bescot and, similar to how burton did last season, get the train back to Birmingham it is dangerously over crowded, and thats even when the service is practically empty from Walsall. West brom is a difficult one as well, whilst I mainly use the metro, which still get very busy the trains do seem quite bad. Wolves I've never had an overly busy train coming from molinuex if I'm honest.

[Ashley 60171]

On a slightly different note. I've heard London Midland or whoever's in charge when this happens. Something about splitting the Wolves-Walsall in two. Euston to Crewe no longer serving Stoke on Trent to be replaced by a Birmingham to Crewe service. Sorry if this is common knowledge already, all I can see in the previous few pages are the words "ridiculous situation" and "overcrowded".

[Westy]

Must admit havent used local trains for ages.

Last time I used a train, was down to the Burnham area for May Bank Holiday week & before that, Scouse land for a few days.

After all these stories, why aint the bus companies taking advantage?