London Midland Trains

[Tony]

Yes but tables are absolutely not needed. And massively reduce the seating capacity. And comfort? You must be joking, they're hot sticky and obviously have a shit load more standees due to the lack of seating.  So no, they aren't comfortable.  At all. I'd rather sit on a less luxurious seat than standard in a crammed carriage

But you wouldn't would you, as Sprinters do not have any more seats, and also have a lot less standing room because of the 3+2 seating, so you'd still be standing in a smaller space!

150s are 19.74m long (each carriage)
170s are 23.61m long
hence why a two car 170 can carry more passengers than a 2 car 150

[Bob]

How many seats are in a two car Sprinter. And how many in a two car 170

[Tony]

How many seats are in a two car Sprinter. And how many in a two car 170

Approximately 120 in both

[busfan2847]

How many seats are in a two car Sprinter. And how many in a two car 170

150/1 - 148
170/5 - 122

[T840MAK]

Yes but tables are absolutely not needed. And massively reduce the seating capacity. And comfort? You must be joking, they're hot sticky and obviously have a shit load more standees due to the lack of seating.  So no, they aren't comfortable.  At all. I'd rather sit on a less luxurious seat than standard in a crammed carriage

You are completely missing the point. Interiors of class 170s are designed for longer distance service - hence the "big" seats, and the tables.

[Bob]

So they're not suitable for non long distance services like the Chase line. With more seats Sprinters were better. A three car Sprinter or two 2 car sets would be better than what we get now. Might get the chance of a seat!

[Bob]

Also begs the question if passenger numbers were increasing why the bloody hell decrease seating capacity????

[Tony]

Also begs the question if passenger numbers were increasing why the bloody hell decrease seating capacity????

I think you will find now that there are a lot more seats now.

I use the line daily as well Bob, and have done for a lot longer than you (24 years, it was still unreliable heritage DMUs terminating at Walsall then). I know it can be awful, I've had to stand all the way from Hednesford, but the booked allocation for the peak when it was 150s was 1x3 car and 3 x 2 car.

Peak allocation now is 1x2car 170;  2x2car170+153 (which adds another 72 seats); 1 x 4car 170.

The 150s were awful, no-one would use the middle seat on the 3 side, any above average person wouldn't physically fit comfortably, and at only an average 6' tall struggled to get my knees in those seats and always had to head for the very end bays with the facing seats.

BR built the 150s with the same layout as the 170s, but without the tables, and the units still in that layout aren't bad trains at all, but someone at Centro decided wedge those awful seating layouts into the WM ones.

London Midland could be better, their control do make some strange decisions in times of delays, but most of the problems are caused by Network Rail, and I don't think any company, public or private would be able to cope with the Amazon shifts and some of the rubbish who work there refusing to pay, threatening conductors, and physical assaults in a couple of cases

[Bob]

It's an awful service Tony. The capacity now is nowhere near enough. If I were a bus  firm I'd be looking at a gap in the market. I have to be at work at 8 this week and should be able to get 6.50 from Hednesford but it's so unreliable look at mon and Tuesday last week I have to get 6.06. No one uses the Chase line because they like it, or because it's good. People have no other realistic option. BTW I don't remember the heritage DMUs being particularly unreliable?  We're they 108s or 101

[Tony]

It's an awful service Tony. The capacity now is nowhere near enough. If I were a bus  firm I'd be looking at a gap in the market. I have to be at work at 8 this week and should be able to get 6.50 from Hednesford but it's so unreliable look at mon and Tuesday last week I have to get 6.06. No one uses the Chase line because they like it, or because it's good. People have no other realistic option. BTW I don't remember the heritage DMUs being particularly unreliable?  We're they 108s or 101

They were anything Tyseley threw out, but usually power car + driving trailer, class 114s were another regular, so, underpowered and no contingency, one failure, service stopped, although it did mean loco haulage, with Bescot sending 20s, 25s, 31s or 47s out to the rescue. The 06:50 is my regular service and performance over 2016 has been around 98%; I think I have only not been in work by 8am on it 4 times. It was right time on Monday; Tuesday was the day it was 120 late because of the points failure. It was on time Wednesday until Duddeston when it got caught up in another Network Rail farce, but I avoided that as I was driving to Dundee

[Bob]

On Monday I was on a 930 start. Planned to get 7.53 which came at something stupid like 8.16 and ran RIDICULOUSLY slowly into brum. I got to work at 940

[Bob]

I can honestly tell you Tony hearing every day what passengers think of the Chase line...it's not positive.  What you think of miss milling getting in the papers? I think she's doing it to further her own agenda

[Tony]

I can honestly tell you Tony hearing every day what passengers think of the Chase line...it's not positive.  What you think of miss milling getting in the papers? I think she's doing it to further her own agenda

She's doing it because people are complaining to her about it. It's what MPs of any party do.

Getting in the papers, and making a fuss to LM won't actually make any difference. With the LM franchise ending in October next year LM will be doing exactly what's required in the current franchise, and no more, and whoever wins the new franchise will just say 'We can increase capacity in December when the wires go live, so for the next 12 months it's just like it or lump it whatever her or anyone else says

[Bob]

Them old heritage DMUS had lovely seats if I remember. Comfy

[Westy]

She's doing it because people are complaining to her about it. It's what MPs of any party do.

Getting in the papers, and making a fuss to LM won't actually make any difference. With the LM franchise ending in October next year LM will be doing exactly what's required in the current franchise, and no more, and whoever wins the new franchise will just say 'We can increase capacity in December when the wires go live, so for the next 12 months it's just like it or lump it whatever her or anyone else says

Still her party's fault though!

I'm with Bob over extra buses as well.