First Midlands

[winston]

Since First Group have announced that they intend on making £100million worth of disposals in UK bus, does anyone have any thoughts on whether First Midlands will still be under First Group ownership for much longer?

As I understand it, they are one of the subsidiaries that doesn't contribute much to First Groups profits

If they were to be sold on who could potentially acquire them?

[arrifirststage]

I think that First Midlands is an enigma,it was cobbled together for administrative reasons purely geographically.
There is absolutely no correlation between Wyvern and Leicester,and not much more between Leicester and Northampton.
Unless things have recently changed,Leicester,Worcester and Hereford (City Services ) are quite good,with the rest probably a drag.
Any disposal would likely be piecemeal,not as a block.Places like Northampton and Kidderminster will perhaps be simply deregistered,not sold.
The rest would surely be attractive to neighbours Arriva and Stagecoach,but MMC andOFT may not agree.

[winston]

Sorry, when I meant First Midlands, I only meant the former FMR garages i.e. Kidderminster, Hereford, Redditch & Worcester. I knew Worcester had always made decent money with its higher frequency city services, but I thought the other areas in particular Kidderminster & I believe Redditch isn't very profitable with ongoing competition from Diamond.

First Group are struggling under a mountain of debt along with falling margins from UK bus, in order to raise the quoted £100million from asset sales, it has been suggested in a number forums that they may well have to sell some entire subsidiary's, not just the unprofitable garages in order to attract a buyer with a decent offer. Northampton, Cornwall, Sheffield (or entire FSY) & East Scotland keep being suggested (East Scotland is now being scaled down due to no suitable offer). I think Wyvern has cropped up a few times as well

I think that First Midlands is an enigma,it was cobbled together for administrative reasons purely geographically.
There is absolutely no correlation between Wyvern and Leicester,and not much more between Leicester and Northampton.
Unless things have recently changed,Leicester,Worcester and Hereford (City Services ) are quite good,with the rest probably a drag.
Any disposal would likely be piecemeal,not as a block.Places like Northampton and Kidderminster will perhaps be simply deregistered,not sold.
The rest would surely be attractive to neighbours Arriva and Stagecoach,but MMC andOFT may not agree.

[arrifirststage]

I can speak with some knowledge of Midland Red West,since my brother was managing director of the company for many years.
While never being the most profitable company in the land it made regular profits and was quite successful.The rot set in when it was acquired by First,whose remote and rigid management style stifled any local initiative.Even now,the group are sticking with a corporate livery with limited local control for the subsidiaries.Much more is required than putting local fleetnames on the buses.

[winston]

I've seen comments to that effect on Midlandred.net, basically decisions on routes/timetables etc which should be made at local level are being decided by FMR HQ at Essex, and none of the decision makers have any knowledge of the local area.

It seems that this is the one major factor across all the struggling First subsidiary's that dates back to the Lockhead era where everything was decided from Aberdeen and it now coming back to bite First Group on the arse. First Group are now in a similar position to how NX were after the Bowker era East Coast Main Line fiasco. It seems First Group overstretched themselves when times were good taking over Laidlaw and have bitten off more than they can chew. If their share price drops much further they themselves could be prone to a takeover by a large European transport group looking to get in to the UK & America on scale

I can speak with some knowledge of Midland Red West,since my brother was managing director of the company for many years.
While never being the most profitable company in the land it made regular profits and was quite successful.The rot set in when it was acquired by First,whose remote and rigid management style stifled any local initiative.Even now,the group are sticking with a corporate livery with limited local control for the subsidiaries.Much more is required than putting local fleetnames on the buses.

[arrifirststage]

Certainly,First have a mountain of problems at the moment.I am sure that senior management are making changes internally as fast as they can but to outsiders I think the brand 'First' has acquired a bad reputation.
It is still beyond me why each subsidiary has to have the same livery,for example.This works when the perception of the Company is good (as for Stagecoach ) but is a drag when the Company has a poor perception with the public.
Obviously circumstances change,but can no one remember the BET federation who allowed their Companies a very individual approach.Might be worth a try?

[Stevo]

I saw a First B7TL or B9TL in Doncaster in the new livery - horrible, just washed-out mauve stripes on white. Bring back local liveries!

[winston]

Bringing back local liveries would be nice, but it doesn't look as though it's going to happen now. The new livery isn't very inspiring considering the ex Blazefield man is now in charge of UK bus, leather seats as standard is a nice touch though.

First needs to go back to the drawing board as regards management structure, the majority of the decisions re timetables / routings / network changes etc all needs to be decided by local management, not by people miles away at HQ with no knowledge of the local area / competition

I saw a First B7TL or B9TL in Doncaster in the new livery - horrible, just washed-out mauve stripes on white. Bring back local liveries!

[Ossie]

I know First issue timetable booklets for Worcester and Hereford town services, but I was bit suprised to find a real lack of information at Redditch.  I wandered down to the general office by the depot entrance, and was told that any public timetables could be found in Arden News in the Kingfisher Centre.

I went back to that store in the shopping centre and eventually located a display stand that was totally bare, barring a few leaflets for the 145 (Redditch - Longbridge).  And that was it!!

I'd have thought they could have done with sprucing up the publicity a bit, to be honest .....

[D10]

Couldn't agree more, First's publicity is appalling, a far cry from the old MRW days! And apart from Whittles, I can't think of other operators who produce their own publicity.

What makes things worse in Worcestershire is that the County Council don't ready bother to do anything either. It makes getting hold of any kind of bus info very difficult for those who don't have ready Internet access.

I did contact the Council and suggested they could reintroduce the area Timetable books and maybe charge a small amount to cover the cost, but they said they couldn't do this because timetables change so often, which surely makes the point for better info more of a priority?

[vinh1000]

Hate first
Not my experience of First

[Discodave]

Bringing back local liveries would be nice, but it doesn't look as though it's going to happen now. The new livery isn't very inspiring considering the ex Blazefield man is now in charge of UK bus, leather seats as standard is a nice touch though.

First needs to go back to the drawing board as regards management structure, the majority of the decisions re timetables / routings / network changes etc all needs to be decided by local management, not by people miles away at HQ with no knowledge of the local area / competition

Arriva are the same all decisions done in leciester have no clue thats why the ex chase routes failed Cannock is a scrapyard and Stafford is stuffed up and the Midland businesses will fail they have no idea as quoted

[Bob]

I think the same theres only what 2 or 3 chase routes still running? a lot of midlands routes cant make that much money surely & arriva are gona inherit a load of tat. midland clapped out T/reg MPD broke down in Walsall yesterday

[Discodave]

The sign of things to come bob

[nitromatt1]

42405 seen being towed along Manor Way towards Birmingham near Halesowen about 08:05 this morning.