PD0001111/17 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Wolverhampton to Ashmore Park (circular) and Wolverhampton to Ashmore Park (circular) given service number 59 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/28 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Five Ways and Gospel Lane, Gospel Oak given service number 1 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/29 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Walsall and Mossley or Lower Farm given service number 301/302 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/32 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Saltley and Saltley given service number 8A/8C effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/42 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Walsall and Stowlawn, Willenhall or Bilston given service number 34/37/39 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Route and Timetable.
PD0001111/45 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Birmingham City Centre and Chelmsley Wood given service number 97/97A/97S effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/46 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Yardley Wood Garage and Bartley Green, Romsley Road given service number 18 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/48 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Sutton Coldfield and Walsall given service number 77 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/75 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Walsall to Wolverhampton and Walsall to Wolverhampton given service number 529 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/81 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Birmingham and Dudley given service number 74 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/89 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Walsall and Sutton Coldfield or Castlecroft given service number 6/7/7A effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/99 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between West Bromwich and Wolverhampton given service number 79 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/105 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Wolverhampton and Birmingham given service number 126 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/110 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Birmingham City Centre and Solihull given service number 37 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/121 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between West Bromwich and Bearwood given service number 49 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/131 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Sutton Coldfield to West Bromwich and Sutton Coldfield to West Bromwich given service number 5 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/167 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Landrover Works (Lode Lane) and Birmingham City Centre given service number 876/877/957W effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/195 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Cancellation Accepted: Operating between KEHS, Edgbaston and WALSALL, Bus Station given service number 886 effective from 04-Sep-2016.
PD0001111/196 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Cancellation Accepted: Operating between King Edwards High School (Edgbaston) and Solihull given service number 885 effective from 04-Sep-2016.
PD0001111/353 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between West Bromwich and Wednesbury given service number 47/47A effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/403 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Birmingham and Walsall and Cannock given service number 51/X51 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/639 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Dudley to Stourbridge and Dudley to Stourbridge given service number 246 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/675 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Bushbury Hill to Warstones and Bushbury Hill to Warstones given service number 2 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/676 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Tettenhall Wood to Dudley and Tettenhall Wood to Dudley given service number 1 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/685 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Stuart Bathurst RC School and Tipton Owen Street given service number 731 effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
PD0001111/757 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Registration Accepted
Starting Point: Yardley Wood Bus Garage
Finish Point: Yardley Wood Bus Garage
Via: Longbridge, Northfield, Kings Heath , Acocks Green Bus Garage
Service Number: 801
Service Type: Normal Stopping
Effective Date: 04-SEP-2016
Other Details: New Night Services
Am I correct in saying a majority of these are just coming off summer timetables?
@Dom - most yeah, Winston
Also very intrigued by the 801 Night Service.
PD0001111/89 - WEST MIDLANDS TRAVEL LTD T/A TRAVEL WEST MIDLANDS, 51 BORDESLEY GREEN, BIRMINGHAM, B9 4BZ
Variation Accepted: Operating between Walsall and Sutton Coldfield or Castlecroft given service number 6/7/7A effective from 04-Sep-2016. To amend Timetable.
Castlecroft? Surely a typo for Castlefort? I don't think the 7 goes to Castlecroft somehow...
Quote from: Dom on July 12, 2016, 05:34:10 PM
Am I correct in saying a majority of these are just coming off summer timetables? @Dom - most yeah, Winston
Also very intrigued by the 801 Night Service.
Looks like a registration of the AG & YW staff bus
Quote from: Tony on July 12, 2016, 05:47:08 PM
Looks like a registration of the AG & YW staff bus
Thought so, said it to a couple of mates as soon as I saw it.
Quote from: Tony on July 12, 2016, 05:47:08 PM
Looks like a registration of the AG & YW staff bus
So if it's registered, does that mean the public can travel on it?
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on July 12, 2016, 10:49:53 PM
So if it's registered, does that mean the public can travel on it?
I hope not. That's all drivers need in the middle of the night, all the Pensnett school kids pestering them about gearbox noises, interworking, running boards and cooling fans.
Quote from: Gareth on July 12, 2016, 11:57:16 PM
I hope not. That's all drivers need in the middle of the night, all the Pensnett school kids pestering them about gearbox noises, interworking, running boards and cooling fans.
A friend of mine quite regularly drives the PN staff bus and he says it is normally very quiet.
Just had my weekly copy of email from Network West Midlands showing
75 Withdrawn
79 Frequency increased to "up to every 10 mins"
39 To operate between Walsall & Bilston only
25 Off Peak journeys to terminate at Whitburn Close
34 / 37 / 47 /A Timetable alterations due to 79 frequency increase
Wow. NX going for near Arriva levels of chopping and changing there.
Out of curiosity, if enough E200's could be gathered together at Walsall, could the 39 be rerouted deeper into Alumwell thus negating the need for the 36?
Quote from: Gareth on July 12, 2016, 11:57:16 PM
I hope not. That's all drivers need in the middle of the night, all the Pensnett school kids pestering them about gearbox noises, interworking, running boards and cooling fans.
LMAO
I've looked at some of the timetables starting 4th September on the NWM site, here are some frequency changes:
9 Birmingham to Stourbridge - Saturdays reduced to every 10 minutes
65/67 City to Perry Common/Castles Vale - Mon to Friday peaks reduced to every 10 minutes each
74 B'ham to Dudley - up to every 4/5 mins to West Brom and up to every 9 mins to Dudley
Quote from: Steve3229vp on August 08, 2016, 05:42:45 PM
65/67 City to Perry Common/Castles Vale - Mon to Friday peaks reduced to every 10 minutes each
More progress for the NX dumping ground. So all you need is a bit of peak time bunching, which is easy on services using the Lichfield Road and Tyburn Road, and you have no bus for 20 to 25 minutes. A very distinct possibility with current levels of traffic round here.
Quote from: andy41 on August 08, 2016, 07:54:33 PM
More progress for the NX dumping ground. So all you need is a bit of peak time bunching, which is easy on services using the Lichfield Road and Tyburn Road, and you have no bus for 20 to 25 minutes. A very distinct possibility with current levels of traffic round here.
Or the reality which is you leave exactly the same number of vehicles on the road0, but give them more time for a round trip to make the service more reliable
Quote from: Tony on August 08, 2016, 09:21:33 PM
Or the reality which is you leave exactly the same number of vehicles on the road0, but give them more time for a round trip to make the service more reliable
Well I sincerely hope you're right Tony as both services have gone so for backwards in the last 5 years as to be unrecognisable. I know you can't discuss commercially sensitive information here, but I would be utterly staggered if the figures on both of these routes are even two thirds what they used to be. The word neglect doesn't touch it. The Jag factory is the industrial flagship of Birmingham and its main bus route is nothing short of an embarrassment I'm afraid.
A bit like the Washwood heath corridor in my view.
Would the residents of Castle Vale and the workers of JLR like the FD service (City to Fort Dunlop) to be expanded to extend to and from Castle Vale and maybe run more often. This could be numbered 967 ?
When an operator keeps their vehicles to an average age of approximately 8 years, which is lower than the other big groups some routes are going to get buses up to 16 Years old.
That's a fact of life
Quote from: Tony on August 08, 2016, 09:52:08 PM
When an operator keeps their vehicles to an average age of approximately 8 years, which is lower than the other big groups some routes are going to get buses up to 16 Years old.
That's a fact of life
Possibly yes, but in my experience when operators are left with a few vehicles of that age, they share them about a bit, they don't concentrate them all on 1 or 2 routes as that merely serves to convey the impression to those passengers that they really don't matter, especially when they wait on Corporation St and every third bus passing them by is yet another Platinum all singing all dancing bus to Walsall.
I would also point out that I have seen many, many vehicles at 16 years old that look nothing like these do.
Clearly you have to defend your own employer, but as a lifelong bus man I think you know that the current state of things on these routes, both of which have been flagship in recent times, is not acceptable. And I see no plans for it to change? The 67 is well overdue some proper investment. Imagine business folk turning up to board the current offering on their way out to the Jag? It wouldn't happen in any other city I'm afraid.
Quote from: andy41 on August 08, 2016, 10:40:32 PM
Possibly yes, but in my experience when operators are left with a few vehicles of that age, they share them about a bit, they don't concentrate them all on 1 or 2 routes as that merely serves to convey the impression to those passengers that they really don't matter, especially when they wait on Corporation St and every third bus passing them by is yet another Platinum all singing all dancing bus to Walsall.
I would also point out that I have seen many, many vehicles at 16 years old that look nothing like these do.
Clearly you have to defend your own employer, but as a lifelong bus man I think you know that the current state of things on these routes, both of which have been flagship in recent times, is not acceptable. And I see no plans for it to change? The 67 is well overdue some proper investment. Imagine business folk turning up to board the current offering on their way out to the Jag? It wouldn't happen in any other city I'm afraid.
The current Sutton Enviros would be perfect for the 65/67 with a bunch left over. Although realistically I reckon they'll end up at BC
Quote from: MW on August 08, 2016, 11:26:48 PM
The current Sutton Enviros would be perfect for the 65/67 with a bunch left over. Although realistically I reckon they'll end up at BC
Or, maybe the Crimson Gemini could be used on the 65/67?
Quote from: andy41 on August 08, 2016, 10:40:32 PM
Possibly yes, but in my experience when operators are left with a few vehicles of that age, they share them about a bit, they don't concentrate them all on 1 or 2 routes as that merely serves to convey the impression to those passengers that they really don't matter, especially when they wait on Corporation St and every third bus passing them by is yet another Platinum all singing all dancing bus to Walsall.
I would also point out that I have seen many, many vehicles at 16 years old that look nothing like these do.
Clearly you have to defend your own employer, but as a lifelong bus man I think you know that the current state of things on these routes, both of which have been flagship in recent times, is not acceptable. And I see no plans for it to change? The 67 is well overdue some proper investment. Imagine business folk turning up to board the current offering on their way out to the Jag? It wouldn't happen in any other city I'm afraid.
It does happen in every other city. Go to Glasgow you will find routes being operated by16 year old ex London with only19 seats downstairs. Go to Manchester 16 year old ex London Tridents from Stagecoach and First. Newcastle - knackered old unreliable MANs. Leeds and Arriva using tired Spectras
Quote from: andy41 on August 08, 2016, 10:40:32 PM
Possibly yes, but in my experience when operators are left with a few vehicles of that age, they share them about a bit, they don't concentrate them all on 1 or 2 routes as that merely serves to convey the impression to those passengers that they really don't matter, especially when they wait on Corporation St and every third bus passing them by is yet another Platinum all singing all dancing bus to Walsall.
I would also point out that I have seen many, many vehicles at 16 years old that look nothing like these do.
Clearly you have to defend your own employer, but as a lifelong bus man I think you know that the current state of things on these routes, both of which have been flagship in recent times, is not acceptable. And I see no plans for it to change? The 67 is well overdue some proper investment. Imagine business folk turning up to board the current offering on their way out to the Jag? It wouldn't happen in any other city I'm afraid.
Totally agree with the points made here, in particular the points about concentrating on certain routes etc. I think it really is shocking how it's become like that.
Quote from: andy41 on August 08, 2016, 10:40:32 PM
Possibly yes, but in my experience when operators are left with a few vehicles of that age, they share them about a bit, they don't concentrate them all on 1 or 2 routes as that merely serves to convey the impression to those passengers that they really don't matter, especially when they wait on Corporation St and every third bus passing them by is yet another Platinum all singing all dancing bus to Walsall.
I would also point out that I have seen many, many vehicles at 16 years old that look nothing like these do.
Clearly you have to defend your own employer, but as a lifelong bus man I think you know that the current state of things on these routes, both of which have been flagship in recent times, is not acceptable. And I see no plans for it to change? The 67 is well overdue some proper investment. Imagine business folk turning up to board the current offering on their way out to the Jag? It wouldn't happen in any other city I'm afraid.
Are you sure? Using First Sheffield as an example here, when our B10BLEs were being withdrawn last year, they were all on certain routes, and when the numbers diminished to a couple on extended time because of delays with bringing other buses in these went on one route and one route only...oh yeah, lets not forget some of them looked exceptionally shabby, two hadn't even had a repaint since they were new in 1999!
It's a fact of life that some routes are going to get older buses than others, and some are going to look really tatty and thats simply because of their age. Our oldest buses now are still 16 years old but they don't look too bad compared to their 13 year old counterparts (some of which again haven't been painted since new) which they work alongside...which hey, guess what, work on certain routes and certain routes only, and do not get shared around.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 12:06:44 AM
Totally agree with the points made here, in particular the points about concentrating on certain routes etc. I think it really is shocking how it's become like that.
Yes, but you complained when a route you admit you don't use got fully refurbished, reliable buses
Quote from: andy41 on August 08, 2016, 10:40:32 PM
Possibly yes, but in my experience when operators are left with a few vehicles of that age, they share them about a bit, they don't concentrate them all on 1 or 2 routes as that merely serves to convey the impression to those passengers that they really don't matter, especially when they wait on Corporation St and every third bus passing them by is yet another Platinum all singing all dancing bus to Walsall.
I would also point out that I have seen many, many vehicles at 16 years old that look nothing like these do.
Clearly you have to defend your own employer, but as a lifelong bus man I think you know that the current state of things on these routes, both of which have been flagship in recent times, is not acceptable. And I see no plans for it to change? The 67 is well overdue some proper investment. Imagine business folk turning up to board the current offering on their way out to the Jag? It wouldn't happen in any other city I'm afraid.
who knows may be there is grand plan for castle vale services, bendy double deckers might be a surprise route upgrade and why not tried nearly every type of bendy in the last two decades,
Joking aside being as the 33 got refurbed E40D,s I can only assume the same for this corridor.
Quote from: T840MAK on August 10, 2016, 08:51:04 AM
Are you sure? Using First Sheffield as an example here, when our B10BLEs were being withdrawn last year, they were all on certain routes, and when the numbers diminished to a couple on extended time because of delays with bringing other buses in these went on one route and one route only...oh yeah, lets not forget some of them looked exceptionally shabby, two hadn't even had a repaint since they were new in 1999!
It's a fact of life that some routes are going to get older buses than others, and some are going to look really tatty and thats simply because of their age. Our oldest buses now are still 16 years old but they don't look too bad compared to their 13 year old counterparts (some of which again haven't been painted since new) which they work alongside...which hey, guess what, work on certain routes and certain routes only, and do not get shared around.
Same happens everywhere nowadays, all operators tend to have batches of buses for individual routes. And NX Bus do share their 0old buses around
AG - presidents
BC - 41xx Tridents
YW - Presidents
WA - presidents/41xx Tridents
WN - 41xx Tridents
WB - presidents
PN - 41xx Tridents
CV - 41/42xx - Tridents
DU - Presidents
Ironically the garage being complained about is the only one with a double deck allocation that hasn't got any buses from the two oldest batches!
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 09:08:19 AM
Same happens everywhere nowadays, all operators tend to have batches of buses for individual routes. And NX Bus do share their 0old buses around
AG - presidents
BC - 41xx Tridents
YW - Presidents
WA - presidents/41xx Tridents
WN - 41xx Tridents
WB - presidents
PN - 41xx Tridents
CV - 41/42xx - Tridents
DU - Presidents
Ironically the garage being complained about is the only one with a double deck allocation that hasn't got any buses from the two oldest batches!
a good rebuttal Tony, there you have it in black and white folks
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 09:08:19 AM
Same happens everywhere nowadays, all operators tend to have batches of buses for individual routes. And NX Bus do share their 0old buses around
AG - presidents
BC - 41xx Tridents
YW - Presidents
WA - presidents/41xx Tridents
WN - 41xx Tridents
WB - presidents
PN - 41xx Tridents
CV - 41/42xx - Tridents
DU - Presidents
Ironically the garage being complained about is the only one with a double deck allocation that hasn't got any buses from the two oldest batches!
The main issue with the buses in question (PB's - 42-- B7TL/ALX400's) is a number were early repaints during a period when they weren't refurbished internally, and they also now fall outside of the range of 4425+ that will be treated to Crimson repaints/refurbs due to their age.
Precisely, the age of buses people don't care about, it's the condition that's important. The B7TL/ALX400 have been a neglected batch of buses and even by 2009 buses fresh out paint shop were horrible inside.
Preston Bus' s tridents for example, older buses but look pretty showroom inside and out. A lot of First and Stagecoach buses have received more interim retrims along the way.
Quote from: Winston on August 10, 2016, 10:46:06 AM
The main issue with the buses in question (PB's - 42-- B7TL/ALX400's) is a number were early repaints during a period when they weren't refurbished internally, and they also now fall outside of the range of 4425+ that will be treated to Crimson repaints/refurbs due to their age.
good point winston there's a few at west brom like that still on there original interiors, many are great drivers just awful looking, I often feel these ALX400 B7TL,s voith,s have had a rough ride when coming to refurbs same as many merc,s did.
Quote from: DiamondDart on August 10, 2016, 11:00:05 AM
Preston Bus' s tridents for example, older buses but look pretty showroom inside and out. A lot of First and Stagecoach buses have received more interim retrims along the way.
Stagecoach maybe, First unlikely. There are large numbers of B7L / B7TL & so forth still in daily service at various subsidaries W-reg & above that have newer had a retrim since new, similariy some ex First London Tridents were never re-trimmed either, and just had extra seats added where converted from single door.
Some PB ALX400's fell in to the trap where NXWM were investing much in their local fleet both refurbishing existing & buying new in favour of expanding Travel London, then of course NX Group came close to collapse / takeover being strangled with massive debts.
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 08:54:03 AM
Yes, but you complained when a route you admit you don't use got fully refurbished, reliable buses
The 94 still gets the unrefurbished B7TL ALX400 quite often, there were around 4/5 of them on there yesterday including 4282.
Quote from: Winston on August 10, 2016, 11:07:29 AM
Stagecoach maybe, First unlikely. There are large numbers of B7L / B7TL & so forth still in daily service at various subsidaries W-reg & above that have newer had a retrim since new, similariy some ex First London Tridents were never re-trimmed either, and just had extra seats added where converted from single door.
Some PB ALX400's fell in to the trap where NXWM were investing much in their local fleet both refurbishing existing & buying new in favour of expanding Travel London, then of course NX Group came close to collapse / takeover being strangled with massive debts.
Stagecoach's policy on standard vehicles is generally repaint at 4, repaint/retrim at 8, repaint at 12, withdrawn at 16. So Stagecoach run buses with 8 year old trim.
Although some buses including around a dozen of PBs 42xx avoided a retrim due to what Winston mentioned above, in general NX trim is replaced after a shorter time than all of First, Stagecoach & Arriva.
Quote from: 2206 on August 10, 2016, 11:29:00 AM
The 94 still gets the unrefurbished B7TL ALX400 quite often, there were around 4/5 of them on there yesterday including 4282.
There wasn't 4/5 unrefurbished 42xx on the 94 yesterday, as most of the 42xx on there were refurbished!
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 11:31:55 AM
There wasn't 4/5 unrefurbished 42xx on the 94 yesterday, as most of the 42xx on there were refurbished!
I meant there were about 4/5 B7TL ALX400 including a couple of unrefurbished 42**, it still seems to get unrefurbished B7TL ALX400 on there quite often.
I know NX have no plans to put the 42xx in crimson but it would be nice to see a couple gain a quick touch up to the existing paint and retrim the seats
My beef is the lack of spread of resources in nxwm I do not see in the area where I used to live. Same old routes and that is what I see and doesn't look like it's going to change. I think the 33 is due another rebranding and up grade in the time I've written this.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 06:38:47 PM
Same old routes and that is what I see and doesn't look like it's going to change.
That's because you've got your eyes shut and just enjoy a moan
First route upgraded this year
529 - last new buses, 41xx Tridents
Second Route
126 - last new buses - never actually received a dedicated fleet of new buses
Other routes
Bristol Road - last new buses 43xx Tridents
X10 (ex 141 last new buses Presidents when it was the 99)
966 - last new buses Timesaver Metrobuses (and it runs into East Birmingham)
960 - last new buses 46xx Tridents ( and again an East Birmingham route)
yes same old routes!
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 06:48:47 PM
That's because you've got your eyes shut and just enjoy a moan
First route upgraded this year
529 - last new buses, 41xx Tridents
Second Route
126 - last new buses - never actually received a dedicated fleet of new buses
Other routes
Bristol Road - last new buses 43xx Tridents
X10 (ex 141 last new buses Presidents when it was the 99)
966 - last new buses Timesaver Metrobuses (and it runs into East Birmingham)
960 - last new buses 46xx Tridents ( and again an East Birmingham route)
yes same old routes!
Did the 126 not have route branded 04 Tridents the 4 speed voith ones when they were new
@Tony?
Quote from: Squiz1971 on August 10, 2016, 06:57:44 PM
Did the 126 not have route branded 04 Tridents the 4 speed voith ones when they were new @Tony?
Didn't get branded till sometime in 2005 (was only 10 of them aswell which is only about half the PVR). 4535-609 were new at WN to see off older Metrobuses so were spread about across many routes (like they still are now)
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 06:48:47 PM
That's because you've got your eyes shut and just enjoy a moan
First route upgraded this year
529 - last new buses, 41xx Tridents
Second Route
126 - last new buses - never actually received a dedicated fleet of new buses
Other routes
Bristol Road - last new buses 43xx Tridents
X10 (ex 141 last new buses Presidents when it was the 99)
966 - last new buses Timesaver Metrobuses (and it runs into East Birmingham)
960 - last new buses 46xx Tridents ( and again an East Birmingham route)
yes same old routes!
So the last couple of years their have not been a core certain routes that have received a least 2 min lots of buses and make overs upgrades , whilst others still get nothing. I'm entitled to my view I know what I see and I've been around long enough to witness it.
Quote from: Nathan on August 10, 2016, 07:00:23 PM
Didn't get branded till sometime in 2005 (was only 10 of them aswell which is only about half the PVR). 4535-609 were new at WN to see off older Metrobuses so were spread about across many routes (like they still are now)
Oh right ok thanks
@Nathan I knew some tridents on the 126's had been branded similar to the metrobus mk2a styling
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 07:08:42 PM
So the last couple of years their have not been a core certain routes that have received a least 2 min lots of buses and make overs upgrades , whilst others still get nothing. I'm entitled to my view I know what I see and I've been around long enough to witness it.
Last Year
Coventry 2/3 - never before
Walsall 335/6; 70 - last new B6s
several WN routes - never
71/72 - B7RLEs, but that doesn't count as buses in your area never get upgraded
243/244 - never
X51 - Timesaver Metros
9 - 8 years previous E400s
50 - 9 years previous
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 07:08:42 PM
So the last couple of years their have not been a core certain routes that have received a least 2 min lots of buses and make overs upgrades , whilst others still get nothing. I'm entitled to my view I know what I see and I've been around long enough to witness it.
Were the 44** Geminis not "made over" or the recent repainted ex CV Geminis?
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 07:19:05 PM
Last Year
Coventry 2/3 - never before
Walsall 335/6; 70 - last new B6s
several WN routes - never
71/72 - B7RLEs, but that doesn't count as buses in your area never get upgraded
243/244 - never
X51 - Timesaver Metros
9 - 8 years previous E400s
50 - 9 years previous
Shouldn't that be E200MMC's not B7RLE's as they were 12 plates??
@Tony
Quote from: Squiz1971 on August 10, 2016, 07:23:57 PM
Shouldn't that be E200MMC's not B7RLE's as they were 12 plates?? @Tony
No before the E200 MMC the last new buses were the B7RLE's.
Quote from: Sh4318 on August 10, 2016, 07:21:22 PM
Were the 44** Geminis not "made over" or the recent repainted ex CV Geminis?
Yes but the 94 as well as the 65 and 67 still regularly get 42** B7TL ALX400 some of which have never been internally refurbished.
Quote from: 2206 on August 10, 2016, 07:30:43 PM
No before the E200 MMC the last new buses were the B7RLE's.
Ah right I see what Tony is getting at now cheers
@2206
O here we go 71/72 is not in my ex area. My opinion won't change, sorry lol.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 07:42:27 PM
O here we go 71/72 is not in my ex area. My opinion won't change, sorry lol.
The 72 cannot be far away if you are always moaning about the 94, the 72 is never more than 1/2 mile away from it
I'm not saying the areas not had any, my local routes were 70/94 and could inc 28 which was impressed had a upgrade which I noticed when back in Brum. However compared to when I was living in Brum distribution of resource then and still seems to be evident winds me up. That is my view. Anyway off to the gym now. Loads of new buses in Ealing lol.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 08:03:57 PM
I'm not saying the areas not had any, my local routes were 70/94 and could inc 28 which was impressed had a upgrade which I noticed when back in Brum. However compared to when I was living in Brum distribution of resource then and still seems to be evident winds me up. That is my view. Anyway off to the gym now. Loads of new buses in Ealing lol.
Is the 94 your local route, never would have guessed..... You've got new buses on the 94, they're supplied by Claribels and you still don't use them.
I did used to use them before Uber came out. I love Claribels just wish they would extend their network, there could be more operators like them and Dragons Den could fund more enterprises like them.
Granted took them long enough.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on August 10, 2016, 08:34:40 PM
I did used to use them before Uber came out. I love Claribels just wish they would extend their network, there could be more operators like them and Dragons Den could fund more enterprises like them.
Granted took them long enough.
Operators like Claribels & Central Buses are few & far between in the current climate.... Claribels have come a long way from the days of using Coaches to compete of the 55 & 94 against WMT
Everyone forgets the 11A/C Outer Circle; upgraded circa 2004 from Metrobuses with brand new Wright Geminis and given Showcase route status, then circa 2012 was 'upgraded' with refurbished Presidents bought in 1999/2000.
Why does no-one moan about the 11? ;D
Quote from: Stu on August 10, 2016, 08:38:58 PM
Everyone forgets the 11A/C Outer Circle; upgraded circa 2004 from Metrobuses with brand new Wright Geminis and given Showcase route status, then circa 2012 was 'upgraded' with refurbished Presidents bought in 1999/2000.
Why does no-one moan about the 11? ;D
The big problem with upgrading the Outer Circle with a new fleet , is its high pvr
Quote from: Winston on August 10, 2016, 08:48:28 PM
The big problem with upgrading the Outer Circle with a new fleet , is its high pvr
And it avoids all the areas currently putting emission restrictions on!
Quote from: Tony on August 10, 2016, 09:09:17 PM
And it avoids all the areas currently putting emission restrictions on!
Exactly, things like that must be a juggling act with such a high concentration of Euro 3 deckers still on fleet
11 is fine thank you very much. Wasn't fine a year or two ago with the Plaxtons, but it's great now. Keep your MMCs and StreetDecks.
Strictly speaking I would say Geminis on the 11 is a good combination 8) I'm sure it would be nice if it had all crimsons but I like its current branding and it goes well and it's a nice upgrade compared to the shoddy plaxtons that were on it a while back !
Quote from: Winston on August 10, 2016, 10:46:06 AM
The main issue with the buses in question (PB's - 42-- B7TL/ALX400's) is a number were early repaints during a period when they weren't refurbished internally, and they also now fall outside of the range of 4425+ that will be treated to Crimson repaints/refurbs due to their age.
Winston, this has been my point all along. I see with interest the various discussions that have gone on while I wasn't looking. Most of it is around age profile and share around depots etc which is fine. But my point has never been the age of these vehicles, it is the condition and neglect of them over the years. There are vehicles in the fleet older than these that have had 2 refurbs in their life where some of these have had none. And the other point was that these routes had new vehicles in the past and should be higher profile than others that get treated better, particularly in the case of the 67
In terms of concentrating one vehicle type on a route, there is simply no need to do it. Drivers at PB are type trained on the full allocation so please explain why the 67 needs a full compliment of this tat every day?
Thankyou for at least understanding my point, regardless of whether you agree with my opinion.
Quote from: andy41 on August 11, 2016, 10:26:18 AM
Winston, this has been my point all along. I see with interest the various discussions that have gone on while I wasn't looking. Most of it is around age profile and share around depots etc which is fine. But my point has never been the age of these vehicles, it is the condition and neglect of them over the years. There are vehicles in the fleet older than these that have had 2 refurbs in their life where some of these have had none. And the other point was that these routes had new vehicles in the past and should be higher profile than others that get treated better, particularly in the case of the 67
In terms of concentrating one vehicle type on a route, there is simply no need to do it. Drivers at PB are type trained on the full allocation so please explain why the 67 needs a full compliment of this tat every day?
Thankyou for at least understanding my point, regardless of whether you agree with my opinion.
I can see your point, I think Tony said around a dozen were affecetd (repainted during 2008/9) in the then new NXWM red/white livery with radiator bars, which back then didn't included internal retrims. NXWM during that period weren't spending much money on the existing fleet or buying new buses in quantity, due to being distracted expanding Travel London & then the ECML/group debt crisis.
The 67 does deserve better presented vehicles, maybe a consiuous effort could be made at PB to confine those in the worst condition (internally/externally) to peak extras & schools work to miminze the amount of time they are in service, visible to the general public?
I doubt they have enough life in them to warrant being spruced up in existing livery, unless they could be sold on for further service & it adds value to them.
edit - The 65 & 67 fleet will need to be replaced prior to May 2017, as they will need to be min Euro 4 from then onwards
Changes and timetables are now up on the NX website.
http://nxbus.co.uk/west-midlands/information/service-changes/black-country-service-changes-from-4th-september
Good to see that the 39 will use the bus station and the frequency increase on the 79.
Quote from: Dom on August 12, 2016, 03:16:36 PM
Changes and timetables are now up on the NX website.
http://nxbus.co.uk/west-midlands/information/service-changes/black-country-service-changes-from-4th-september
Good to see that the 39 will use the bus station and the frequency increase on the 79.
Bloody hell, don't they proof read?!
Quote from: MW on August 12, 2016, 03:22:16 PM
Bloody hell, don't they proof read?!
''Darlaston and Walsall will now new to change buses at Darlaston interchange''
It's not even a simple typo
Quote from: Dom on August 12, 2016, 03:16:36 PM
Changes and timetables are now up on the NX website.
http://nxbus.co.uk/west-midlands/information/service-changes/black-country-service-changes-from-4th-september
Good to see that the 39 will use the bus station and the frequency increase on the 79.
Will the curtailment of the 39 free up any buses at Walsall for transfer? But obviously WN will need more buses for the 79 but deckers
Quote from: Dom on August 12, 2016, 03:16:36 PM
Changes and timetables are now up on the NX website.
http://nxbus.co.uk/west-midlands/information/service-changes/black-country-service-changes-from-4th-september
Good to see that the 39 will use the bus station and the frequency increase on the 79.
Interesting to read that "Due to severe traffic congestion,
in particular along the Soho Road and across the M5 motorway at the Hawthorns, this has lead to poor reliability on the 74 and 75 over the past 12 months. This has resulted in buses being unable to operate as reliable as planned and has significantly impacted customer journeys."
So why isn't the 74 being withdrawn and replaced by a service between Birmingham and West Bromwich and another one between West Bromwich and Dudley.
Because more people use the 74 plus the 75 runs along side the metro
Quote from: Winston on August 12, 2016, 03:37:07 PM
Will the curtailment of the 39 free up any buses at Walsall for transfer? But obviously WN will need more buses for the 79 but deckers
Depends on interworking. Looking at the timetable it looks like the 34, 37 and 39 will interwork.
WN won't need more buses as the Platinums will be in service by then so the number going out will just be slightly less, I would imagine.
Quote from: Dom on August 12, 2016, 05:13:51 PM
Depends on interworking. Looking at the timetable it looks like the 34, 37 and 39 will interwork.
WN won't need more buses as the Platinums will be in service by then so the number going out will just be slightly less, I would imagine.
Re-phrasing my comment - WN's Pvr will increase with the frequency doubling on the 79, therefore, fewer deckers will be cascaded out as a result of new Platinum deliveries
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on August 12, 2016, 05:03:23 PM
Interesting to read that "Due to severe traffic congestion, in particular along the Soho Road and across the M5 motorway at the Hawthorns, this has lead to poor reliability on the 74 and 75 over the past 12 months. This has resulted in buses being unable to operate as reliable as planned and has significantly impacted customer journeys."
So why isn't the 74 being withdrawn and replaced by a service between Birmingham and West Bromwich and another one between West Bromwich and Dudley.
This would never happen. There's no good reason to withdraw a core, well used frequency route with no alternative. The 75 has an alternative, so the impact of withdrawal is a lot less
Quote from: MW on August 12, 2016, 03:22:16 PM
Bloody hell, don't they proof read?!
Another one:
As a result of the above we are changing services 39, 75, 75 & 79 to prove a simpler and more effective network of buses, that will hopefully benefit the majority of our customers.
With the 75 been replaced by 74E's and more 79's I think this could be the start of future service changes involving splitting more longer routes to improve reliability. With traffic congestion as it is now this is the only way to improve reliability, long routes just don't work anymore.
Quote from: Steve3229vp on August 12, 2016, 06:28:15 PM
With the 75 been replaced by 74E's and more 79's I think this could be the start of future service changes involving splitting more longer routes to improve reliability. With traffic congestion as it is now this is the only way to improve reliability, long routes just don't work anymore.
And nothing atall to do with achieving twice the hits under ENCTS if passengers are continually changing buses....
Long routes can work perfectly well when managed properly, and NX have invested in a state of the art control centre to do just that. That argument just doesn't stack up I'm afraid.
Now what doesn't work is long routes run only by 1 depot at one end of them in my experience. Or at least it makes it much harder.
Quote from: Steve3229vp on August 12, 2016, 06:28:15 PM
With the 75 been replaced by 74E's and more 79's I think this could be the start of future service changes involving splitting more longer routes to improve reliability. With traffic congestion as it is now this is the only way to improve reliability, long routes just don't work anymore.
There are definitely some that don't, but others that do work, the 87, 120 and 126 (which is going Platinum) are examples of these.
Quote from: Sh4318 on August 12, 2016, 06:50:42 PM
There are definitely some that don't, but others that do work, the 87, 120 and 126 (which is going Platinum) are examples of these.
Plus the 71 and 900.
Quote from: Sh4318 on August 12, 2016, 06:50:42 PM
There are definitely some that don't, but others that do work, the 87, 120 and 126 (which is going Platinum) are examples of these.
I agree the 120 is generally busy and it goes through residential areas why there isnt similar routes in larger roads by it I have no idea. The 87 bypasses the dualcarriageway as congestion in Smethwick high street is rare despite double parking. I use the 74 and to be honest I think most who use the 75 will switch to cars adding to congestion. On the 74 it will lead to bunching as it will run every 5mins. Currently without traffic there enough buses in busy periods 74s will bunch. I was on one and traffic at Hawthorns (nothing to do with long routes) took 30mins to west brom at matchdays even worse. The answer to congestion is better local buses as many have no Birmingham Oldbury buses etc near them so cars are better