South Birmingham Consultation 2017

[RobQuinton]

I suspect that the reason is that coming from the QE, at the junction of Church Rd/Edgbaston Park Road there is no right hand turn allowed. My more cynical view is that this would be a better routing as being nearer towards Five Ways. How a 20 minute frequency to Five Ways in Peak Periods is considered enough, with schools and businesses will remain to be seen.
How the QE terminal point will work with more buses using it is also likely to lead to delays.

[MasterPlan]

But he's asking why it couldn't turn left at Edgbaston Old Church (not the QE), and serve Edgbaston Park Road instead of the Bristol Road.

Yeah that's what I meant.

[2206]

I suspect that the reason is that coming from the QE, at the junction of Church Rd/Edgbaston Park Road there is no right hand turn allowed. My more cynical view is that this would be a better routing as being nearer towards Five Ways. How a 20 minute frequency to Five Ways in Peak Periods is considered enough, with schools and businesses will remain to be seen.
How the QE terminal point will work with more buses using it is also likely to lead to delays.

I thought that it could be that (i've seen the no right hand turn sign on some of the traffic lights round there in the past), but looking at the timetable on Traveline WM it seems to show the X21 will turn right of Edgbaston Park Road onto Church Road going towards the City Centre?
http://www.travelinemidlands.co.uk/wmtis/XSLT_GEOOBJECT_REQUEST?language=en&command=bothDirections&line=cen:33X21:B:H:y11:5:5::1:2&hideBannerInfo=1&coordOutputFormat=MRCV

Also:
Google Maps shows that you can turn right of Edgbaston Park Road onto Church Road
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/52.4596621,-1.9227762/52.4611488,-1.9170401/@52.4605149,-1.9221005,17z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m2!4m1!3e0

Unlike the other right hand turns there.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/dir/Edgbaston+Old+Church,+Birmingham+B15+3TB/52.4617504,-1.9182596/@52.4631826,-1.9240497,16z/data=!3m1!4b1!4m9!4m8!1m5!1m1!1s0x4870bc4f8f867271:0xcceb59770a7285eb!2m2!1d-1.917678!2d52.461044!1m0!3e0

The traffic light on Edgbaston Park Road doesn't seem to have the no right hand turn sign.
https://www.google.co.uk/maps/@52.4610958,-1.9189518,3a,75y,12.3h,76.49t/data=!3m6!1e1!3m4!1sahAj5goju3p4WG2mJLrYPA!2e0!7i13312!8i6656

I'm sure i've seen cars and a Johnsons Coach turn right there in the past as well.

[sonic84]

U can definitely turn right from the QE at that junction. I have done it many a time.

[Tony]

Yeah I know that but it could still get to the QE that way like the 98 and X64 do now. Or is the Bristol Road quicker?

Why though.

People up there have got the X21 to the hospital. People on Bristol Road will have a service this way as well

[2206]

How the QE terminal point will work with more buses using it is also likely to lead to delays.

There won't be more buses using it @RobQuinton .
The 244, 1A, 48 and 76 will use the stops outside the QE.
Buses to/from the City Centre - the X20, X21 and X22 will use the stops outside the University Station - round the corner.
With the 27 also stopping close by on Metchley Lane.

[Dom]

I think it's fair to say that also the poor frequency of the remaining all stops service didn't help, 63 should have had more buses at least to Northfield

I think the frequency is okay, its the reliability that's been the issue but with the amount of roadworks which have caused considerable delays pretty much since the X61 was introduced, its been fighting a loosing battle.

Regarding Selly Oak, if they were so keen to avoid Selly Oak they'd need to make it worth while by possibly sending it up to the QE. This would've provided quicker links to the QE from Northfield and a link to the QE from Frankly and Balaam Wood and the Bristol Road. That would've then made it worth while instead of taking a bypass that actually takes longer.

[Kevin_Brum12]

There won't be more buses using it @RobQuinton .
The 244, 1A, 48 and 76 will use the stops outside the QE.
Buses to the City Centre - the X20, X21 and X22 will use the stops outside the University Station - round the corner.
With the 27 also stopping close by on Metchley Lane.

Having seen the layout in action (more like inaction) and having been stuck on buses going that way during peak times until the city council and hospital authorities sort out the main entrance layout to make it easier for buses this makes perfect sense.

[Sh4318]

The 4A is more frequent than I expected on Sundays - every 15 minutes along with the 4 - interestingly Sunday and evening journeys are extended to Robin Hood Island

The 31 timetable has surprised me, I didn't think there would be a Sunday service, especially at the same frequency as the Mon-Sat

The timetable for the 1 and 1A is now online, the strange thing is that the 1 and 1A combine to provide a bus every 10 minutes on Monday to Friday and ALSO Sundays, but only every 15 minutes on Saturdays, could it be that they've got Saturday and Sunday the wrong way around !

The 1 & 1A are every 40 minutes individually. I made that mistake at first. Personally I thought the 1 would be 2 per hour, with a 1A every hour to make an 20 minute frequency

[MasterPlan]

I thought that it could be that (i've seen the no right hand turn sign on some of the traffic lights round there in the past), but looking at the timetable on Traveline WM it seems to show the X21 will turn right of Edgbaston Park Road onto Church Road going towards the City Centre?
http://www.travelinemidlands.co.uk/wmtis/XSLT_GEOOBJECT_REQUEST?language=en&command=bothDirections&line=cen:33X21:B:H:y11:5:5::1:2&hideBannerInfo=1&coordOutputFormat=MRCV

That looks a bit weird to me. Why would it go a different way into the City than it does outbound? Is this the definite route? When will the exact routes be out on the NX website as when you search X21 0 results come up.

[2206]

That looks a bit weird to me. Why would it go a different way into the City than it does outbound? Is this the definite route? When will the exact routes be out on the NX website as when you search X21 0 results come up.

It makes sense a bit due to the one way system around there, as they can't go direct across from Wheeleys Road onto Bath Row towards the City Centre, so you can't go via Arthur Road, without going via Five Ways. The 98 and X64 currently go via Five Ways.
So it seems instead of going round Five Ways they're  only serving Arthur Road and Wheeleys Road in one direction and in the other going down Wellington Road and Bristol Road direct.

The X20/X22 route maps are similar serving Bath Row in one direction only.
It seems to be the route they'd take unless there's a mistake with it?

[MasterPlan]

It makes sense a bit due to the one way system around there, as they can't go direct across from Wheeleys Road onto Bath Row towards the City Centre. The 98 and X64 currently go via Five Ways.
So it seems instead of going round Five Ways they're going down Wellington Road and Bristol Road direct.
It seems to be the route they'd take unless there's a mistake with it?

It doesn't serve Bath Row in bound though, according to that map. Also, why is the X21 the only one out of the 3 serving The Vale? With the other two going via the Bristol Road? The amount of comments I've seen on here talking about the importance of links to the Uni, and maintaining the 10 minute frequency, to then reduce it to 15 mins would be a bit weird.

[Tony]

That looks a bit weird to me. Why would it go a different way into the City than it does outbound? Is this the definite route? When will the exact routes be out on the NX website as when you search X21 0 results come up.

The X20/X22 being limited stop can vary their route depending on traffic

[sonic84]

It doesn't serve Bath Row in bound though, according to that map. Also, why is the X21 the only one out of the 3 serving The Vale? With the other two going via the Bristol Road? The amount of comments I've seen on here talking about the importance of links to the Uni, and maintaining the 10 minute frequency, to then reduce it to 15 mins would be a bit weird.

That's what I thought as well. There have been so many comments about the QE to City being the busiest part of the route I am surprised they are not only reducing the frequency but that Five Ways looks as if they will no longer have a direct link to the QE.

[2206]

That's what I thought as well. There have been so many comments about the QE to City being the busiest part of the route I am surprised they are not only reducing the frequency but that Five Ways looks as if they will no longer have a direct link to the QE.

A link will remain:
The offpeak 10H operates between the QE and Five Ways.
Stops outside Five Ways shopping Centre towards the QE and just up the road form Morrisons on Highfield Road from the QE.
Though I agree @MasterPlan it most likely won't be much of a replacement and very useful for many.