Timetable Changes 15/11/20

[Tony]

Regarding 82/87 if everyone followed the government guidelines essential travel only apart from peak hours I'm sure the bus wouldn't be rammed.

I personally have not seen one rammed, and our commercial team are monitoring figures on all routes to adjust service levels. Odd journies will overload, but because it is a lot of non-esential journies the times can vary each day making providing duplicates harder

[Steveminor]

NO journeys should be overloaded dft have been clear we should have a maximum capacity of 50% seated capacity to comply with social distancing

[Tony]

NO journeys should be overloaded dft have been clear we should have a maximum capacity of 50% seated capacity to comply with social distancing

And of course you can stop people turning up at a particular time,  and then marching on the bus when it is loading and giving the driver abuse if he tries to stop yhem

[MW]

And of course you can stop people turning up at a particular time,  and then marching on the bus when it is loading and giving the driver abuse if he tries to stop yhem

I'm currently down South driving in Bristol and our maximum capacity is 35. If anymore, we're told not to move until they've got off the bus. If they do not remove themselves, then police assistance is requested. I'm not sure if INIT has passenger numbers integrated within the ticket machine where you count them off, but this makes it very easy to know how many are onboard.

[Steveminor]

It has always been the drivers responsibility to ensure his vehicle does not exceed its plates capacity. In essence all that has happened is that capacity has been reduced. Yes at the terminus stop I.e city centre West Bromwich etc it can be tricky as everyone will just rush on: however along the route when it is obvious a bus is at its capacity the driver should not be stopping to allow more people to get on & if a passenger needs to get off then the agreed protocol was for the bus to stop short or long of the stop. I have seen very little evidence of this happening.

Other operators can do it I dont see why nx dont seem to be able to given the amount of monitoring of drivers  cctv & etm data that they have

[MW]

It has always been the drivers responsibility to ensure his vehicle does not exceed its plates capacity. In essence all that has happened is that capacity has been reduced. Yes at the terminus stop I.e city centre West Bromwich etc it can be tricky as everyone will just rush on: however along the route when it is obvious a bus is at its capacity the driver should not be stopping to allow more people to get on & if a passenger needs to get off then the agreed protocol was for the bus to stop short or long of the stop. I have seen very little evidence of this happening.

Other operators can do it I dont see why nx dont seem to be able to given the amount of monitoring of drivers  cctv & etm data that they have

I think part of the issue is NX's insistence that the driver is simply attending the steering wheel, and is always in the wrong for having a voice. I've noticed that drivers are generally more respected amongst passengers down here. The driver actually has authority here whereas they're abused in the West Midlands. Of course it's not perfect but it's significantly noticeable. An example was, I was the first bus after 10pm before this lockdown in the City Centre, so immediately after the bars/pubs were shut. There were at least 200 passengers waiting to board my bus. As soon as I hit my 35 capacity, I told them I was full and could take no more, and they listened and stopped boarding. In Birmingham, I know that they'd keep piling in, because what's the driver gonna do?

Another example is, the particular vehicles I'm driving have a maximum of 6 standing. This is rigorously enforced by both operators and drivers in this city, and the passengers actually listen. 

[John]

I think part of the issue is NX's insistence that the driver is simply attending the steering wheel, and is always in the wrong for having a voice. I've noticed that drivers are generally more respected amongst passengers down here. The driver actually has authority here whereas they're abused in the West Midlands. Of course it's not perfect but it's significantly noticeable. An example was, I was the first bus after 10pm before this lockdown in the City Centre, so immediately after the bars/pubs were shut. There were at least 200 passengers waiting to board my bus. As soon as I hit my 35 capacity, I told them I was full and could take no more, and they listened and stopped boarding. In Birmingham, I know that they'd keep piling in, because what's the driver gonna do?

Another example is, the particular vehicles I'm driving have a maximum of 6 standing. This is rigorously enforced by both operators and drivers in this city, and the passengers actually listen.

Hit the nail on the head there. We're just looked as scum by some of the people we carry. Seems to be even more so now with this virus. We're told we won't get penalised if we carry more than the limit, so I really don't care. I want to go home without stress and getting abuse and that is how it's done. People can see the bus is full but they still get on so it's their choice

[Trident 4194]

And of course you can stop people turning up at a particular time,  and then marching on the bus when it is loading and giving the driver abuse if he tries to stop yhem

You condoning overloaded buses? If the buses are frequent then there should be no issue with people being told to wait for the next bus

Sigh- and then we wonder why we are in a second lockdown

[Trident 4194]

Hit the nail on the head there. We're just looked as scum by some of the people we carry. Seems to be even more so now with this virus. We're told we won't get penalised if we carry more than the limit, so I really don't care. I want to go home without stress and getting abuse and that is how it's done. People can see the bus is full but they still get on so it's their choice

To be honest though, while NX drivers are essentially robots - and as you say don't have a voice, customers aren't going to respect them. I will say thankyou to nx drivers but I know full well I won't get a reply. At diamond most drivers will say thankyou or thanks mate or your welcome.

[Jack]

To be honest though, while NX drivers are essentially robots - and as you say don't have a voice, customers aren't going to respect them. I will say thankyou to nx drivers but I know full well I won't get a reply. At diamond most drivers will say thankyou or thanks mate or your welcome.

In my general opinion, some of the buses uses I had been on (before 2nd lockdown) were overloaded and the drivers just kept loading up. Especially around peak times but as well during the day on the busy single deck routes. The drivers don't care and still let their buses fill up, even with the bus full destination on.

It depends with NX drivers, the majority of good and nice onesbut there's a few who don't give a toss, same with fare dodgers and smoking, I respect the drivers who actually challenge it, even though its not in their job title to challenge it, its their job to drive the bus, and ensure passengers are safe. But I agree the drivers in the West Midlands are treated like a piece of rubbish but then again they just let it go and don't do much about it.

[2206]

It depends with NX drivers, the majority of good and nice but there's a few who don't give a toss, same with fare dodgers and smoking, I respect the drivers who actually challenge it, even though its not in their job title to challenge it, its their job to drive the bus, and ensure passengers are safe. But I agree the drivers in the West Midlands are treated like a piece of rubbish but then again they just let it go and don't do much about it.

I agree about the drivers that challenge smoking and fare dodging.

Also I saw people fare dodging at Truro Bus Station on the First Kernow 47 a few years back, so definitely happens elsewhere as well i'd think.

If the buses are frequent then there should be no issue with people being told to wait for the next bus

No excuse on a regular service I think.

[Jack]

I agree about the drivers that challenge smoking and fare dodging.

Also I saw people fare dodging at Truro Bus Station on the First Kernow 47 a few years back, so definitely happens elsewhere as well i'd think.

Definitely it can happen everywhere, but of course in the West Midlands most drivers do let it go, rewind back to 10-12 years ago I remember it was challenged a lot more than now.

[Trident 4194]

In my general opinion, some of the buses uses I had been on (before 2nd lockdown) were overloaded and the drivers just kept loading up. Especially around peak times but as well during the day on the busy single deck routes. The drivers don't care and still let their buses fill up, even with the bus full destination on.

It depends with NX drivers, the majority of good and nice but there's a few who don't give a toss, same with fare dodgers and smoking, I respect the drivers who actually challenge it, even though its not in their job title to challenge it, its their job to drive the bus, and ensure passengers are safe. But I agree the drivers in the West Midlands are treated like a piece of rubbish but then again they just let it go and don't do much about it.

I disagree in a sense with the comment the drivers in the West Midlands are treated like shit. Diamond operate the 4H (same route as NX), the 16(same route) , 50(same route). Yes I understand that diamond get less passengers, but still the people that do board the bus never are any trouble. It's almost like nx vehicles attract riff raff. And a price of a nbus really isn't much more anymore before that excuse is give.

[Jack]

You condoning overloaded buses? If the buses are frequent then there should be no issue with people being told to wait for the next bus

Sigh- and then we wonder why we are in a second lockdown

And theres still rammed 997's during the peaks, full of school/college students, essential workers never socially distanced, never any duplicates.

I disagree in a sense with the comment the drivers in the West Midlands are treated like shit. Diamond operate the 4H (same route as NX), the 16(same route) , 50(same route). Yes I understand that diamond get less passengers, but still the people that do board the bus never are any trouble. It's almost like nx vehicles attract riff raff. And a price of a nbus really isn't much more anymore before that excuse is give.

I know they are treated like that but they just let it go in my opinion, I wouldn't stand for it. But yes I agree, same with Claribels on the 94, attract barely any trouble and run the exact same route.

[Tony]

I wouldn't stand for it.

As you are an expert on all aspects of bus operations please advise us on how you would deal with these people then.