Sprint Signed Off

[richardjones210368]

You should listen to yourself, you're starting to sound like a politician!  ;D

My point was about where this 'funding' comes from. If our Government is sitting on billions of pounds of 'cash' that it can allocate as 'funding' for vanity projects like Sprint, why aren't they spending this money on funding vital public services like our police, hospitals and schools, as well as building much needed social housing?

Taxation, whether through corporation tax or private individual income tax, or VAT or whatever, is necessary in order to service the huge debts that government racks up through 'borrowing' money to fund public services and infrastructure projects.

Our government is in debt, our country is massively in debt. Our whole economy is built on debt.

The money for this 'funding' doesn't exist, not until it is 'borrowed' from central banks. Then once it is 'borrowed' it can be 'spent' but has to be paid back, with interest of course. And yes, it ends up being the taxpayers who have to pay this back.

I don't have any problem with taxpayers money being spent in the West Midlands, as long as it is spent on worthwhile projects and causes that will benefit everyone in the West Midlands.

If you accuse me of sounding like a politican I take great offense at that & will report it to the moderator as I am only trying to explain matters without resulting to insults

[Stu]

If you accuse me of sounding like a politican I take great offense at that & will report it to the moderator as I am only trying to explain matters without resulting to insults

Calm down, I wasn't accusing you of anything, I thought the smiley face might have given away the fact I was just jesting.  ;)

[Stu]

Yeah like you giving me a formal warning for calling someone "The 99p Man" when it was clearly related to the thread and posts so your post is highly offesnsive if not more when as an qualified accountant you have as part of your practicing certificate to remain independent of political issues as I always do therefore I take your comment as offensive.

OK, I apologise if you feel offended by what I said, and on reflection this forum isn't the place to be debating political issues really, but having said that I do think it is important that ordinary people understand how things like 'funding structures' work and where 'public money' really comes from.

You have presented one side of an argument, and I believe I have presented the other side. It's up to the people to look into this further for themselves and make up their own mind as to who is wrong or is right.

Anyway, lets get this back on-topic now, do you or anyone else really believe that the demolition of Perry Barr flyover and the construction of this new Sprint route along the Walsall Road can realistically be completed before the Commonwealth Games open in 2022?

[richardjones210368]

OK, I apologise if you feel offended by what I said, and on reflection this forum isn't the place to be debating political issues really, but having said that I do think it is important that ordinary people understand how things like 'funding structures' work and where 'public money' really comes from.

You have presented one side of an argument, and I believe I have presented the other side. It's up to the people to look into this further for themselves and make up their own mind as to who is wrong or is right.

Anyway, lets get this back on-topic now, do you or anyone else really believe that the demolition of Perry Barr flyover and the construction of this new Sprint route along the Walsall Road can realistically be completed before the Commonwealth Games open in 2022?

On paper yes  in reality we will have to see and this is not a political comment The Mayor is on record against the demolition of the flyover everything may change anyway if there is a change of Mayor in May who knows?

And on that i am off to take 10 non bus users out on NXWM to an 80s night for New Years Eve..............................

[Stu]

On paper yes  in reality we will have to see and this is not a political comment The Mayor is on record against the demolition of the flyover everything may change anyway if there is a change of Mayor in May who knows?

And on that i am off to take 10 non bus users out on NXWM to an 80s night for New Years Eve..............................

Yes, for once I actually agree with Andy Street's stance, and it is interesting to see that he is coming up against Birmingham City Council, who have already decided themselves that they want to demolish this flyover, and no doubt numerous cash-filled brown envelopes have already been passed around in order to secure contracts to carry out the work. But it does seemingly make a mockery of the devolved 'power structure' that was put in place with the creation of the WMCA, which really - with the exception of the metro Mayor role - is actually nothing more than an unelected quango. As the indie-rock band British Sea Power once sang, "Who's In Control"?

Enjoy your night out! I'm going to enjoy my night in, though I think I might need to slow down the beer intake  8)

[Kevin]

Still of the opinion that the route would be much better off a tram line than Sprint, that way it could be incorporated into a proper tram network instead of being a standalone vanity project.
But, obviously, having lived in Perry Barr 30 years my opinion is irrelevant

[Kevin_Brum12]

Sprint is going to be a commercial flop.   The reason, as every bus company manager will know is very simple – passengers do not like spending long periods standing on buses and if you make them do that and they have a car, then guess what – they'll just use their car instead.

The Sprint vehicles are essentially standee buses.  Compared to NXWM's Platinum buses specification they are a step down in quality.   At present if you are travelling from Walsall – Birmingham you get a comfy seat, wifi, fairly smooth ride (depending on how well the local council have maintained the roads).   Sprint offers standing up, on a less comfortable vehicle, which will make more stops than the X51 has.

The X51 is a success.  So to build on it you'd order more buses for it, provide the Park and Ride and increase the peak frequency.  Much more commercial, sensible and cost effective than Sprint.

Sprint is a vanity project and its a disgrace the unelected LEP has thrown funding at this rather than something which is a much more pressing need, getting new industry into the West Midlands and addressing the skills gap (something urgent because of Brexit).

If NXWM do not get the Sprint contract (though if they had any sense they wouldn't touch it with a bargepole) then any threats of removing services and choice, by introducing the QEP's and EP's should be challenged.   NXWM could, if it wanted to, walk away from any partnership if it felt would be bad for its business.  Or, NX plc could sell the West Midlands operations if the political meddling is going to affect the groups bottom line, and opportunities elsewhere that offer more potential growth than a Andy Street blunderbus present themselves.  For Andy Street, Ian Ward and co. better the devil you know (NX) than the devil you don't. 

We are living in interesting times. We have a relatively decent network and quality of service in the West Mdlands, compared to other cities such as Manchester and Sheffield.  Do we want to throw it all away for a vanity blunderbus?

[Busboy105]

Sprint is going to be a commercial flop.   The reason, as every bus company manager will know is very simple – passengers do not like spending long periods standing on buses and if you make them do that and they have a car, then guess what – they'll just use their car instead.

The Sprint vehicles are essentially standee buses.  Compared to NXWM's Platinum buses specification they are a step down in quality.   At present if you are travelling from Walsall – Birmingham you get a comfy seat, wifi, fairly smooth ride (depending on how well the local council have maintained the roads).   Sprint offers standing up, on a less comfortable vehicle, which will make more stops than the X51 has.

The X51 is a success.  So to build on it you'd order more buses for it, provide the Park and Ride and increase the peak frequency.  Much more commercial, sensible and cost effective than Sprint.

Sprint is a vanity project and its a disgrace the unelected LEP has thrown funding at this rather than something which is a much more pressing need, getting new industry into the West Midlands and addressing the skills gap (something urgent because of Brexit).

If NXWM do not get the Sprint contract (though if they had any sense they wouldn't touch it with a bargepole) then any threats of removing services and choice, by introducing the QEP's and EP's should be challenged.   NXWM could, if it wanted to, walk away from any partnership if it felt would be bad for its business.  Or, NX plc could sell the West Midlands operations if the political meddling is going to affect the groups bottom line, and opportunities elsewhere that offer more potential growth than a Andy Street blunderbus present themselves.  For Andy Street, Ian Ward and co. better the devil you know (NX) than the devil you don't. 

We are living in interesting times. We have a relatively decent network and quality of service in the West Mdlands, compared to other cities such as Manchester and Sheffield.  Do we want to throw it all away for a vanity blunderbus?

Manchester's tram network runs circles around ours

[richardjones210368]

Sprint is going to be a commercial flop.   The reason, as every bus company manager will know is very simple – passengers do not like spending long periods standing on buses and if you make them do that and they have a car, then guess what – they'll just use their car instead.

The Sprint vehicles are essentially standee buses.  Compared to NXWM's Platinum buses specification they are a step down in quality.   At present if you are travelling from Walsall – Birmingham you get a comfy seat, wifi, fairly smooth ride (depending on how well the local council have maintained the roads).   Sprint offers standing up, on a less comfortable vehicle, which will make more stops than the X51 has.

The X51 is a success.  So to build on it you'd order more buses for it, provide the Park and Ride and increase the peak frequency.  Much more commercial, sensible and cost effective than Sprint.

Sprint is a vanity project and its a disgrace the unelected LEP has thrown funding at this rather than something which is a much more pressing need, getting new industry into the West Midlands and addressing the skills gap (something urgent because of Brexit).

If NXWM do not get the Sprint contract (though if they had any sense they wouldn't touch it with a bargepole) then any threats of removing services and choice, by introducing the QEP's and EP's should be challenged.   NXWM could, if it wanted to, walk away from any partnership if it felt would be bad for its business.  Or, NX plc could sell the West Midlands operations if the political meddling is going to affect the groups bottom line, and opportunities elsewhere that offer more potential growth than a Andy Street blunderbus present themselves.  For Andy Street, Ian Ward and co. better the devil you know (NX) than the devil you don't. 

We are living in interesting times. We have a relatively decent network and quality of service in the West Mdlands, compared to other cities such as Manchester and Sheffield.  Do we want to throw it all away for a vanity blunderbus?

Thank you @Kevin_Brum12   for such well constructed and well argued comments on the subject I will download your excellent pionts and pass them to The Mayor  and the other stakeholders prior to the meeting and yes you are quite right we are not elected members at Birmingham & Solihull LEP but give our services free for the greater good of Brum representing the various stakeholders in the City in my case my Accountancy Institute.

[richardjones210368]

Still of the opinion that the route would be much better off a tram line than Sprint, that way it could be incorporated into a proper tram network instead of being a standalone vanity project.
But, obviously, having lived in Perry Barr 30 years my opinion is irrelevant

@Kevin thank you for your comments and in no way is your opinion  irelevant I hope you have attended the consultation meetings and will continue to make your opinions known to TfWM on the Sprint feedback pages of WMCA as the project continues unfortunatly there was no funding for a Metro along the route which I fully agree would be benefical the funding was not for light rail but a bus rapid transit route.

[richardjones210368]

Yes, for once I actually agree with Andy Street's stance, and it is interesting to see that he is coming up against Birmingham City Council, who have already decided themselves that they want to demolish this flyover, and no doubt numerous cash-filled brown envelopes have already been passed around in order to secure contracts to carry out the work. But it does seemingly make a mockery of the devolved 'power structure' that was put in place with the creation of the WMCA, which really - with the exception of the metro Mayor role - is actually nothing more than an unelected quango. As the indie-rock band British Sea Power once sang, "Who's In Control"?

Enjoy your night out! I'm going to enjoy my night in, though I think I might need to slow down the beer intake  8)

The WMCA is answerable to the Metro Mayor and is not an unelected quango but is made up locally elected councillors such   as the excellent Cllr Kath Hartley and other stakeholders, the corporate management of TfWM & WMCA is appointed by them in no way are they an unelected quango and I would be happy to forward to The Mayor any evidence you hold of "cash filled brown envelopes" in regard with this matter I like you will not tolerate any unseemingly behaviour and would report any such behaviour to the appropriate moderator as you would yourself in your forum moderator role to the WMCA

[the trainbasher]

Yes, for once I actually agree with Andy Street's stance, and it is interesting to see that he is coming up against Birmingham City Council, who have already decided themselves that they want to demolish this flyover, and no doubt numerous cash-filled brown envelopes have already been passed around in order to secure contracts to carry out the work. But it does seemingly make a mockery of the devolved 'power structure' that was put in place with the creation of the WMCA, which really - with the exception of the metro Mayor role - is actually nothing more than an unelected quango. As the indie-rock band British Sea Power once sang, "Who's In Control"?

Enjoy your night out! I'm going to enjoy my night in, though I think I might need to slow down the beer intake  8)

You mean misc outgoings, extra contractual payments, agents' fees and management authorised expenses?

Bribery is such a...dirty word.

[richardjones210368]

You mean misc outgoings, extra contractual payments, agents' fees and management authorised expenses?

Bribery is such a...dirty word.

I do not think this forum is appropriate for this kind of comment if you have any evidence feel free to forward to me by private message & I will see it gets to the appropriate place or forward it direct to the WMCA.

[the trainbasher]

I do not think this forum is appropriate for this kind of comment if you have any evidence feel free to forward to me by private message & I will see it gets to the appropriate place or forward it direct to the WMCA.

Have you never heard of sarcasm or humour?

[richardjones210368]

Have you never heard of sarcasm or humour?

I think I have upset enough people on this site in 2019 my new years resolution is to be as professional on the forum as I am at work and I dont want to drive @Winston into therapy. This is off topic sorry @Stu but I think your photos @the trainbasher of Diamond Bus and other operators on flickr are excellent.