septmember re WCC subside cuts

[SEVERNLINK]

On Diamond's website are changes not on the Council's site. It suggests that Diamond will be running a new 62 service even though the Council say that Green Bus will be running it. There will also be a 145A Longbridge to Bromsgrove even though WMSNT won the Council's service. There is a new 149 service Bromsgrove to Webbs. The 247 is to have service changes ('some shorter journeys to Alcester'), the few 26 journeys are dropped, as is the 70A. Interesting!
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html

think the diamond changes  are results of the Worcestershire network review

Hmmmm, interesting that suggests Diamond are operating the 62 & 145A commercially, potentially with the intention that WCC could withdraw funding for the tendered versions at a later date if there are adequate commercial services. Thus pushing TGB out of Redditch and WMSNT back out of Worcestershire.  :-\ The 149 is also interesting & appears to be a commercial venture further linking Bromsgrove with Droitwich.

Yes, it appears that Diamond are being quite aggressive. I recall that on Tony's tender list published on here over a month ago Diamond had initially won the 62. Also what was surprising about WMSNT's new 145 was the upping of the frequency. Would the Council have asked for that when they are looking to save money? I feel there's a lot in the background here. Even the new 149 seems to be aimed at First's 144A.

Fair play to Diamond I say, business is business. Nice to see them fight back if that is the intention.

Don't forget that the 141/145 were combined and we don't actually how much subsidy WCC are contributing to the new 145 with its increased frequency, that could be a part commercial venture by WMSNT.

Is the 149 aimed at First or WMSNT as per a shortened version of the current 141?

Well, I don't know the route of the 149, and assumed it would go along the main road, but it might more or less go along the 141 route to Wychbold. All these changes are subject to the Traffic Commissioner agreeing them for 1 September at shorter notice than usual. Diamond as far as I can tell have not deregistered the old 60/61/141/145 so come September they could still be running the old services.

I've just suggested on the Midland Red forum that the 149 could be aimed at retaining some of the current 141 clientele (not that there's a great deal of them) seems I'm not alone in that thinking...time will tell  :-\

[winston]

On Diamond's website are changes not on the Council's site. It suggests that Diamond will be running a new 62 service even though the Council say that Green Bus will be running it. There will also be a 145A Longbridge to Bromsgrove even though WMSNT won the Council's service. There is a new 149 service Bromsgrove to Webbs. The 247 is to have service changes ('some shorter journeys to Alcester'), the few 26 journeys are dropped, as is the 70A. Interesting!
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html

think the diamond changes  are results of the Worcestershire network review

Hmmmm, interesting that suggests Diamond are operating the 62 & 145A commercially, potentially with the intention that WCC could withdraw funding for the tendered versions at a later date if there are adequate commercial services. Thus pushing TGB out of Redditch and WMSNT back out of Worcestershire.  :-\ The 149 is also interesting & appears to be a commercial venture further linking Bromsgrove with Droitwich.

Yes, it appears that Diamond are being quite aggressive. I recall that on Tony's tender list published on here over a month ago Diamond had initially won the 62. Also what was surprising about WMSNT's new 145 was the upping of the frequency. Would the Council have asked for that when they are looking to save money? I feel there's a lot in the background here. Even the new 149 seems to be aimed at First's 144A.

Fair play to Diamond I say, business is business. Nice to see them fight back if that is the intention.

Don't forget that the 141/145 were combined and we don't actually how much subsidy WCC are contributing to the new 145 with its increased frequency, that could be a part commercial venture by WMSNT.

Is the 149 aimed at First or WMSNT as per a shortened version of the current 141?

Well, I don't know the route of the 149, and assumed it would go along the main road, but it might more or less go along the 141 route to Wychbold. All these changes are subject to the Traffic Commissioner agreeing them for 1 September at shorter notice than usual. Diamond as far as I can tell have not deregistered the old 60/61/141/145 so come September they could still be running the old services.

I've just suggested on the Midland Red forum that the 149 could be aimed at retaining some of the current 141 clientele (not that there's a great deal of them) seems I'm not alone in that thinking...time will tell  :-\

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

[111 Roughley]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

[winston]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The CEO of Rotala is on the forum plus others from Diamond  ;D

Diamond are simply protecting their interests, additionally the 141/145 may have provided Diamond buses with work during the day that would normally only be required on peak / school services.

Overall the WCC changes haven't been as bad as first suggested, in some instances services have improved & new links have been provided

[tank90]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The CEO of Rotala is on the forum plus others from Diamond  ;D

Diamond are simply protecting their interests, additionally the 141/145 may have provided Diamond buses with work during the day that would normally only be required on peak / school services.

Overall the WCC changes haven't been as bad as first suggested, in some instances services have improved & new links have been provided

Granted but some of the changes could have been done more tastefully. On another note with the changes to the 55/56 the 143 needed to go back to Headless Cross on its way to Bromsgrove but it might not.

[winston]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The CEO of Rotala is on the forum plus others from Diamond  ;D

Diamond are simply protecting their interests, additionally the 141/145 may have provided Diamond buses with work during the day that would normally only be required on peak / school services.

Overall the WCC changes haven't been as bad as first suggested, in some instances services have improved & new links have been provided

Granted but some of the changes could have been done more tastefully. On another note with the changes to the 55/56 the 143 needed to go back to Headless Cross on its way to Bromsgrove but it might not.

With any changes you'll never please everyone, just have to aim to please the majority.

It would be better for Diamond to try and take on more tendered services commercially and try & grow them if the figures stack up with only small risks being taken. The workload will be far more stable going forward and no risk of it being lost at tender due to a lower bid being submitted.

[111 Roughley]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The CEO of Rotala is on the forum plus others from Diamond  ;D

Diamond are simply protecting their interests, additionally the 141/145 may have provided Diamond buses with work during the day that would normally only be required on peak / school services.

Overall the WCC changes haven't been as bad as first suggested, in some instances services have improved & new links have been provided

Granted but some of the changes could have been done more tastefully. On another note with the changes to the 55/56 the 143 needed to go back to Headless Cross on its way to Bromsgrove but it might not.

With any changes you'll never please everyone, just have to aim to please the majority.

It would be better for Diamond to try and take on more tendered services commercially and try & grow them if the figures stack up with only small risks being taken. The workload will be far more stable going forward and no risk of it being lost at tender due to a lower bid being submitted.

Yes, people from Diamond do come on these boards. There are also a number of posters who are very pro or anti Diamond. I think that the verdict on Diamond will come with time. In Redditch for the first time they dominate an area. What will the outcome for passengers be? Understandably they cut duplication on the 51 and 57/58, but they did it so badly that there were many complaints: nevertheless it was a cut for passengers, understandable, though the chaos wasn't. They gave a proper link to the Hospital on the 57/58, and they have restored the 146 to at least a proper service- hope it survives the rail restoration. Against them, they have cut the 55/56, despite the Sunday service- it is a cut, it is not really about creating more links. Stephen from Diamond justified the changes on here by saying that there would be 'better links' to Studley- perhaps the short 247 journeys to Alcester are additional, but it may be they have cut the 247 somewhat- we don't know yet. First, after their retreat from Redditch and Kiddi, show signs of innovation and developing services: they have put together adequate services around Upton on a commercial basis and created the 147. The verdict on Diamond will be whether, overall, services in Redditch increase over say 3 years, or if they decline. In the 57/58, they have a wonderful route, an exclusive bit of road with the houses mostly built to be served by it. As has been noted, it is pity the same plan wasn't followed on the western side of Redditch. Their near monopoly has been allowed in Redditch by the Competition Commission. We will find out Diamond do with that position and so whether that is justified.

[winston]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The CEO of Rotala is on the forum plus others from Diamond  ;D

Diamond are simply protecting their interests, additionally the 141/145 may have provided Diamond buses with work during the day that would normally only be required on peak / school services.

Overall the WCC changes haven't been as bad as first suggested, in some instances services have improved & new links have been provided

Granted but some of the changes could have been done more tastefully. On another note with the changes to the 55/56 the 143 needed to go back to Headless Cross on its way to Bromsgrove but it might not.

With any changes you'll never please everyone, just have to aim to please the majority.

It would be better for Diamond to try and take on more tendered services commercially and try & grow them if the figures stack up with only small risks being taken. The workload will be far more stable going forward and no risk of it being lost at tender due to a lower bid being submitted.

Yes, people from Diamond do come on these boards. There are also a number of posters who are very pro or anti Diamond. I think that the verdict on Diamond will come with time. In Redditch for the first time they dominate an area. What will the outcome for passengers be? Understandably they cut duplication on the 51 and 57/58, but they did it so badly that there were many complaints: nevertheless it was a cut for passengers, understandable, though the chaos wasn't. They gave a proper link to the Hospital on the 57/58, and they have restored the 146 to at least a proper service- hope it survives the rail restoration. Against them, they have cut the 55/56, despite the Sunday service- it is a cut, it is not really about creating more links. Stephen from Diamond justified the changes on here by saying that there would be 'better links' to Studley- perhaps the short 247 journeys to Alcester are additional, but it may be they have cut the 247 somewhat- we don't know yet. First, after their retreat from Redditch and Kiddi, show signs of innovation and developing services: they have put together adequate services around Upton on a commercial basis and created the 147. The verdict on Diamond will be whether, overall, services in Redditch increase over say 3 years, or if they decline. In the 57/58, they have a wonderful route, an exclusive bit of road with the houses mostly built to be served by it. As has been noted, it is pity the same plan wasn't followed on the western side of Redditch. Their near monopoly has been allowed in Redditch by the Competition Commission. We will find out Diamond do with that position and so whether that is justified.

I had hoped to have seen more positive route developments by now than there has been from Diamond, especially following the long drawn out network review/customer feedback. Given their dominant position in Redditch, I had hoped they they may have increased the number of services / added new links / created new journey opportunities to exploit their position, I appreciate there was always going to be rationalization of duplicating services, but you can't afford to be took careful regardless of your position, as you never know who is watching from the sidelines....

The surprise appears to be the Kidderminster operation, I gather that op didn't really spark much interest at the time of First's sale, but it appears Diamond seem to be growing patronage & routes there more than Redditch.

It's good to see Diamond protecting their interests with the introduction of commercial routes 145A & 149, hopefully we may see more to come over time potentially further linking Droitwich town services in to the Diamond network along with possibly further services within Bromsgrove, maybe even town services added and whether there's cope to add further commuter routes in to B'ham?

[StourportSam]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The 125 reduction is not the result of council cuts. It is an attempt by Whittle to improve what is still poor reliability on this lengthy route. Perhaps it is also a cut in the sense it might reduce driver hours/overheads.

[winston]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The 125 reduction is not the result of council cuts. It is an attempt by Whittle to improve what is still poor reliability on this lengthy route. Perhaps it is also a cut in the sense it might reduce driver hours/overheads.

Perhaps Diamond could pick up the 125 services dropped by Whittle's between Kidderminster & Stourbridge if demand makesit viable, it may also help to position buses for the 142 between S'bridge & Halesowen?

[Cedric]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

i

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The 125 reduction is not the result of council cuts. It is an attempt by Whittle to improve what is still poor reliability on this lengthy route. Perhaps it is also a cut in the sense it might reduce driver hours/overheads.

Perhaps Diamond could pick up the 125 services dropped by Whittle's between Kidderminster & Stourbridge if demand makesit viable, it may also help to position buses for the 142 between S'bridge & Halesowen?

if Kidderminster depot runs the 142, a good route for it to chanllange whittles 125 and 192  would be Kidderminster-Stourbridge- Halesowen-Kidderminster and maybe  a 142A  going the other way around


te]

[the trainbasher]

@Winston or even extend alternate 142s to Kidderminster via Norton Road

[winston]

The Diamond news page has been updated today to show the 141 being cancelled & replaced by the 149 & 145 cancelled & replaced by the 145A

http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_255.html
http://www.diamondbuses.com/news/ForthcomingchangestotheDiamondBusWorcestershireNetwork_256.html

i

Thanks for that. I have the feeling that someone at Diamond is reading these boards. I wonder Diamond are that bothered about these particular subsidised routes. If Diamond is willing to run a commercial service, then of course the Council service should cease. Perhaps Diamond are unhappy with the tender process. I just hope that it is not a short term tactic to discourage anyone else from tendering on their patch. After all it takes some planning, some commitment of vehicles and staff, to tender, and when this happens, it must seem not worth the effort, though I don't rule out a fight from WMSNT on the new 145, or Green Bus on the 62.
Overall the Council have saved a lot of money and surprisingly a number of routes have gone commercial with a better service. I just hope that they last. Of the cuts, I think that the 125 reduction is the most regrettable.

The 125 reduction is not the result of council cuts. It is an attempt by Whittle to improve what is still poor reliability on this lengthy route. Perhaps it is also a cut in the sense it might reduce driver hours/overheads.

Perhaps Diamond could pick up the 125 services dropped by Whittle's between Kidderminster & Stourbridge if demand makesit viable, it may also help to position buses for the 142 between S'bridge & Halesowen?

if Kidderminster depot runs the 142, a good route for it to chanllange whittles 125 and 192  would be Kidderminster-Stourbridge- Halesowen-Kidderminster and maybe  a 142A  going the other way around

te]

KR does run the 142 along with the 202

@Winston or even extend alternate 142s to Kidderminster via Norton Road

It's always possible, just depends if the timetable would still work or whether they'd be better as separate services that interwork?

[111 Roughley]

The point about the link to Stourbridge is that Stourbridge has a lot of links itself which are very useful. It sort of connects up Kidderminster and it's not a long journey. Undeniably there is a good train service, but that's not always convenient for everyone. If Stourbridge was still in Worcestershire, I'm sure that the Council would ensure that there was an hourly bus link between two towns of this size so close.

[Cedric]

The point about the link to Stourbridge is that Stourbridge has a lot of links itself which are very useful. It sort of connects up Kidderminster and it's not a long journey. Undeniably there is a good train service, but that's not always convenient for everyone. If Stourbridge was still in Worcestershire, I'm sure that the Council would ensure that there was an hourly bus link between two towns of this size so close.

agree  with you about the train service I can not manage all the steps at Stourbridge junction when returnining to Kidderminster , the bus is far easier for me and lots of others as well  ,  till whittles  extend  the 125 to Stourbridge  there had not been  a bus service to Stourbridge for years