Redditch Network Review

[sonic84]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

[PM]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

Some really really sensible suggestions here sonic84. Agree totally about the 146 tho I would extend the 143 as it was cut back so as first had a monopoly on bristol road routes to bromsgrove more than anything else and seemed to perform fairly well. The 202 I would extend it to redditch as well and also to merry hill at the other end to give an important regional link. I would also like to see rotala winning some worcestershire tenders and the fact that they are already finding Plymouth Road a bit small and want to expand is promising as they clearly intend to expand the business. Also, not technically a redditch route but could the X3-a successful route be further improved with branded eclipses? Rotala have a really good chance here to take redditch and kidderminster back to how it was in the mrw days and I wish them success in doing it. Some new longer buses would be nice as well

[Cedric]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

Some really really sensible suggestions here sonic84. Agree totally about the 146 tho I would extend the 143 as it was cut back so as first had a monopoly on bristol road routes to bromsgrove more than anything else and seemed to perform fairly well. The 202 I would extend it to redditch as well and also to merry hill at the other end to give an important regional link. I would also like to see rotala winning some worcestershire tenders and the fact that they are already finding Plymouth Road a bit small and want to expand is promising as they clearly intend to expand the business. Also, not technically a redditch route but could the X3-a successful route be further improved with branded eclipses? Rotala have a really good chance here to take redditch and kidderminster back to how it was in the mrw days and I wish them success in doing it. Some new longer buses would be nice as well

and to improve time keeping on x3 cut  it back to Redditch- Kidderminster as the road to stourport is a bottleneck  . and there are already 3 diamond buses a hour going there and 3 whittles   

[D10]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

Some really really sensible suggestions here sonic84. Agree totally about the 146 tho I would extend the 143 as it was cut back so as first had a monopoly on bristol road routes to bromsgrove more than anything else and seemed to perform fairly well. The 202 I would extend it to redditch as well and also to merry hill at the other end to give an important regional link. I would also like to see rotala winning some worcestershire tenders and the fact that they are already finding Plymouth Road a bit small and want to expand is promising as they clearly intend to expand the business. Also, not technically a redditch route but could the X3-a successful route be further improved with branded eclipses? Rotala have a really good chance here to take redditch and kidderminster back to how it was in the mrw days and I wish them success in doing it. Some new longer buses would be nice as well

and to improve time keeping on x3 cut  it back to Redditch- Kidderminster as the road to stourport is a bottleneck  . and there are already 3 diamond buses a hour going there and 3 whittles

Don't forget though that the X3 provides across Kidderminster journeys to the Rail Station and Hospital. Also Whittle incorporate their 192 journeys into their 3 timetable to provide a 15 minute interval service in the Stourport direction from Kiddy, so it might not be a good idea for Diamond to take one bus an hour off the corridor.

[StourportSam]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

Some really really sensible suggestions here sonic84. Agree totally about the 146 tho I would extend the 143 as it was cut back so as first had a monopoly on bristol road routes to bromsgrove more than anything else and seemed to perform fairly well. The 202 I would extend it to redditch as well and also to merry hill at the other end to give an important regional link. I would also like to see rotala winning some worcestershire tenders and the fact that they are already finding Plymouth Road a bit small and want to expand is promising as they clearly intend to expand the business. Also, not technically a redditch route but could the X3-a successful route be further improved with branded eclipses? Rotala have a really good chance here to take redditch and kidderminster back to how it was in the mrw days and I wish them success in doing it. Some new longer buses would be nice as well

and to improve time keeping on x3 cut  it back to Redditch- Kidderminster as the road to stourport is a bottleneck  . and there are already 3 diamond buses a hour going there and 3 whittles

Don't forget though that the X3 provides across Kidderminster journeys to the Rail Station and Hospital. Also Whittle incorporate their 192 journeys into their 3 timetable to provide a 15 minute interval service in the Stourport direction from Kiddy, so it might not be a good idea for Diamond to take one bus an hour off the corridor.

Diamond would be in my opinion stupid to cut back the X3 from Stourport. It is very popular with passengers from Areley Kings and Stourport catching it to the hospital and station also Redditch. In my opinion removing the appetising 15 minute frequency on the route for Diamond would kill it as they are unreliable at the best of times and the X3 can usually be counted on to be within 5/10 minutes of due time. Don't forget the current works at the old sugar beet site will hopefully help congestion. It would open the door for Whittle to steal the route! Loyalty from passengers was already reduced when the evening services were withdrawn in sept 2011.

Perhaps a half hourly Kidderminster-Redditch frequency is something to look at? Having never travelled on that part of the route I can speak for whether passenger loadings would support it?

[Cedric]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

Some really really sensible suggestions here sonic84. Agree totally about the 146 tho I would extend the 143 as it was cut back so as first had a monopoly on bristol road routes to bromsgrove more than anything else and seemed to perform fairly well. The 202 I would extend it to redditch as well and also to merry hill at the other end to give an important regional link. I would also like to see rotala winning some worcestershire tenders and the fact that they are already finding Plymouth Road a bit small and want to expand is promising as they clearly intend to expand the business. Also, not technically a redditch route but could the X3-a successful route be further improved with branded eclipses? Rotala have a really good chance here to take redditch and kidderminster back to how it was in the mrw days and I wish them success in doing it. Some new longer buses would be nice as well

and to improve time keeping on x3 cut  it back to Redditch- Kidderminster as the road to stourport is a bottleneck  . and there are already 3 diamond buses a hour going there and 3 whittles

Don't forget though that the X3 provides across Kidderminster journeys to the Rail Station and Hospital. Also Whittle incorporate their 192 journeys into their 3 timetable to provide a 15 minute interval service in the Stourport direction from Kiddy, so it might not be a good idea for Diamond to take one bus an hour off the corridor.

Diamond would be in my opinion stupid to cut back the X3 from Stourport. It is very popular with passengers from Areley Kings and Stourport catching it to the hospital and station also Redditch. In my opinion removing the appetising 15 minute frequency on the route for Diamond would kill it as they are unreliable at the best of times and the X3 can usually be counted on to be within 5/10 minutes of due time. Don't forget the current works at the old sugar beet site will hopefully help congestion. It would open the door for Whittle to steal the route! Loyalty from passengers was already reduced when the evening services were withdrawn in sept 2011.

Perhaps a half hourly Kidderminster-Redditch frequency is something to look at? Having never travelled on that part of the route I can speak for whether passenger loadings would support it?

forgot about the  x3  running past the hospital and whittles having there 192 running in to stourport . but the road works you mention are along way off  yet  and they  will only make it easier for traffic  going to wards Worcester and not in to kidderminste

[StourportSam]

With the Redditch network review now up on the Diamond website, what suggestions if any have you put forward which you would like to see implemented in the future.

One of my ideas was to cut the 143 down to run Bromsgrove to Redditch only to improve reliability, particularly during the afternoon peaks.

Also enhance the 146 during the daytime making it a viable alternative to the train.  At the moment the service ends too early, with the last bus leaving Birmingham at 16.35 towards Redditch, and the first bus arrives in Birmingham at 6.37 with the next one arriving at 9.44, so for 9-5 workers it is not an option at all.  With some changes I'm sure the 146 could be a success. It would need some promotion but I think it can be done.  I'd also like to see the 146 extended to Studley, as this would give more scope for success along the route, linking many more areas of Redditch with Birmingham, and hopefully seeing passenger growth.

I'd also like to see some regularity put into the 70 timetable.  At the moment it is all over the play with the same bus operating the 70, and the 70A.  If it could be made into an half hourly, or hourly route, then at least passengers will know when there bus is due without having to consult a timetable everytime they want to make an adhoc journey.

Finally, I'd like to see the 202 extended from Bromsgrove to Redditch, as this could compliment the 143 quite nicely and restore the link between Halesowen and Redditch again. (Perhaps the 202 and 143 could interwork in Redditch)

Some really really sensible suggestions here sonic84. Agree totally about the 146 tho I would extend the 143 as it was cut back so as first had a monopoly on bristol road routes to bromsgrove more than anything else and seemed to perform fairly well. The 202 I would extend it to redditch as well and also to merry hill at the other end to give an important regional link. I would also like to see rotala winning some worcestershire tenders and the fact that they are already finding Plymouth Road a bit small and want to expand is promising as they clearly intend to expand the business. Also, not technically a redditch route but could the X3-a successful route be further improved with branded eclipses? Rotala have a really good chance here to take redditch and kidderminster back to how it was in the mrw days and I wish them success in doing it. Some new longer buses would be nice as well

and to improve time keeping on x3 cut  it back to Redditch- Kidderminster as the road to stourport is a bottleneck  . and there are already 3 diamond buses a hour going there and 3 whittles

Don't forget though that the X3 provides across Kidderminster journeys to the Rail Station and Hospital. Also Whittle incorporate their 192 journeys into their 3 timetable to provide a 15 minute interval service in the Stourport direction from Kiddy, so it might not be a good idea for Diamond to take one bus an hour off the corridor.

Diamond would be in my opinion stupid to cut back the X3 from Stourport. It is very popular with passengers from Areley Kings and Stourport catching it to the hospital and station also Redditch. In my opinion removing the appetising 15 minute frequency on the route for Diamond would kill it as they are unreliable at the best of times and the X3 can usually be counted on to be within 5/10 minutes of due time. Don't forget the current works at the old sugar beet site will hopefully help congestion. It would open the door for Whittle to steal the route! Loyalty from passengers was already reduced when the evening services were withdrawn in sept 2011.

Perhaps a half hourly Kidderminster-Redditch frequency is something to look at? Having never travelled on that part of the route I can speak for whether passenger loadings would support it?

forgot about the  x3  running past the hospital and whittles having there 192 running in to stourport . but the road works you mention are along way off  yet  and they  will only make it easier for traffic  going to wards Worcester and not in to kidderminste

Yes, you are quite correct. One completion date I heard was 2014/15.

[the trainbasher]

Well would making the X3 Kiddy Centre - Redditch and a 3/3A Kiddy Centre to Areley Kings every 10 combined work (3A via Kiddy General Hosp every 20 with the 3 via the existing route every 20) work? (This would introduce competition and also mean 1 bus less on the X3 needed)

Also would it make sense for Diamond to interwork the 143 and 202 at Bromsgrove (run from Redditch with branded B7s advertising the 2 routes?) with Studley being served by a extended 146 (using the ex Preston tridents?) and Princess Wales Hosp by a extended 141 (using a dart?)

Also another suggestion generally would be a 252 (example number) from Kiddy centre to Merry
Hill via Stourbridge (possibility for operation by the current 226 branded 02 plate pointers?). Between Stourbridge & Merry Hill this could run via the former 300 route to Merry Hill via Vicaridge Road or via the 246/Mill Street route

[Kevin]

How far does this review reach? Is it just the Town itself or the services in the surrounding area as well, such as the 145?

[PM]

How far does this review reach? Is it just the Town itself or the services in the surrounding area as well, such as the 145?

Everything I think

[sonic84]

Also would it make sense for Diamond to interwork the 143 and 202 at Bromsgrove (run from Redditch with branded B7s advertising the 2 routes?) with Studley being served by a extended 146 (using the ex Preston tridents?) and Princess Wales Hosp by a extended 141 (using a dart?)

Oops.   I meant in my original post for the 143/202 to interwork in Bromsgrove. :-)  Got Redditch on the brain. :)

I agree with DiamondDart that it may well be time to try an extension of the 202 to Merry Hill as well. Ludlows tried this before running it similar to Hansons original 004 route (Hasbury - Colley Gate - Lye - Merry Hill),  but the corridor was already saturated with their own 002/004/007 routes, which quicker.

As only Diamond service between Merry Hill and Halesowen is the 002, perhaps extending the 202 to Merry Hill was strengthen their presence in Halesowen, whilst restoring the link to Merry Hill with Frankley and Bromsgrove.

Had a brainwave, and could the 146 be improved further by re-routing it between Cotteridge and Birmingham, via Linden Road through Bournville, up to Selly Oak and then along the Bristol Road.  As it is at the moment, I can't see the 146 picking up many passengers at all between Birmingham and Cotteridge since NXWM have the monopoly on the Pershore Road and the 146 does not stop at every stop along the Pershore Road either. 

Since there is no direct bus linking Bournville and Birmingham, this could open up a new avenue of revenue for the service and teamed up with the extension to Studley has the potential to turn the 146 around.

[111 Roughley]

On the 146, I can remember when there were 5 buses an hour between Brum and Redditch: X5, X6, X7 and two 147s, admittedly before the train was improved. I can't see the attraction of the current 146 when it's not consistently every hour. I agree that Linden Road is not well served by buses from the city centre. Also going via Selly Oak is a good idea because it's more of a destination than Selly Park. Also the University would be more on the route. I do think that a bus service and the train can live together: the lack of buses along the corridor across the 'border' is partly an unfair consequence of the NXWM monopoly on one side.
I would also route the 146 via Sainsburys i.e. it should stop right outside the door. I also think that passengers from Redditch have to come mainly from the areas where the train is not convenient, so extending to Studley is a good idea, though the timings are awkward for an hourly service. Whilst a long route may throw up reliability issues, extending the 146 to Evesham, replacing the 247, though going via Greenlands etc is an old route.
On the 70/70A I would have thought that passenger numbers would have been improved by a regular time, particularly up to Crabbs Cross. However this may be difficult to change since the variable times are a Diamond idea. It really needs a half hour service, though I guess Diamond would say numbers don't justify it, but if the 247 was replaced.........
I've never been on them, but do 55/56 really work as circulars?

[sonic84]

I'm almost certain that the 70/70A would see increased patronage if it was put to a regular timetable.  Even if reduced to every hour, so that between Redditch and Crabbs Cross the 70/247 provide a combined 30 minute frequency.

When First ran the 70 it ran to an every 30 minutes, timetable.  Diamond then introduced their 70 in competition with First, at every 20 minutes. So at one point there were 5 buses an hour running between Redditch and Astwood Bank, yet once First withdrew off Diamond reduced their frequency to every 40 minutes, and now it is all over the place.  Putting it back to a regular timetable may help it win back some passengers.

The 55/56 work better as circulars than if they are end to end routes.  Anyone remember the 51 Batchley - Oakenshaw from 2002/2003?

I agree that the 146 needs to attract people from Redditch where the train isn't so convenient for it to be a success running to Redditch... which I guess is why Johnsons have done a U-turn on the 178 withdrawal and rerouted the 150 back around to Redditch New Town. 

Another option could be to extend the 146 to Studley via Headless Cross and Crabbs Cross and the Hospital, since passengers wanting Birmingham already have the 150 along the Studley Road to get to Birmingham.  Then re-route the 247 between the Hospital and Redditch as per the current 143 route.  This would benefit a larger number of residents in getting to the city centre.

[tank90]

I'm almost certain that the 70/70A would see increased patronage if it was put to a regular timetable.  Even if reduced to every hour, so that between Redditch and Crabbs Cross the 70/247 provide a combined 30 minute frequency.

When First ran the 70 it ran to an every 30 minutes, timetable.  Diamond then introduced their 70 in competition with First, at every 20 minutes. So at one point there were 5 buses an hour running between Redditch and Astwood Bank, yet once First withdrew off Diamond reduced their frequency to every 40 minutes, and now it is all over the place.  Putting it back to a regular timetable may help it win back some passengers.

The 55/56 work better as circulars than if they are end to end routes.  Anyone remember the 51 Batchley - Oakenshaw from 2002/2003?

I agree that the 146 needs to attract people from Redditch where the train isn't so convenient for it to be a success running to Redditch... which I guess is why Johnsons have done a U-turn on the 178 withdrawal and rerouted the 150 back around to Redditch New Town. 

Another option could be to extend the 146 to Studley via Headless Cross and Crabbs Cross and the Hospital, since passengers wanting Birmingham already have the 150 along the Studley Road to get to Birmingham.  Then re-route the 247 between the Hospital and Redditch as per the current 143 route.  This would benefit a larger number of residents in getting to the city centre.

The 70/247 idea wouldnt work as its more the fact the 70 needs to go back to every 30mins and the 70A extended to feckenham and re numbered and runs every hour via astwood business park.
The 55/56 works perfectly as it is, we dont need it changing. Once we had the 53 54 55 and 56 all going a differing route but around the same area. the 51 extended route never worked which is why it went back to the 55/56. If anything increasing it to every 15 mins would be a lot better though.
The 146 does need to go to studley but via Lakeside not headless cross, the 143 needs to go back via headless cross though and leave the 247 alone.