Pete's Travel

[PM]

I was talking to an ex Pete's driver about what Pete's travel was like. Just interested to see if anyone else had anything to say about one of the region's larger independant operators. Certainly, the yellow livery was distinctive, services competed by and large effectively with a good mix of tendered and commercial work. However, there were issues in worcestershire with some contracts so just interested to hear what people have to say

[Steveminor]

Petes travel was successful partly due to the range in work that they operated i.e part contract part commercial part competative commercial & partly because the management had clear aims, goals & direction in how to achieve them. Kevin Jones was a ruthless owner when it came to the finances of the business however he listened to his team & to a certain extent gave them a free reign as long as their ideas were profitable. Everything Petes did they had a clear exit stratergy for as with the County Bus attack on Arriva the aim & exit stratergy was to hurt Arriva to such an extent that a financial settlement would be tabled, with a proviso that any route operated by Serverse Travel within Staffordshire could still be operated by Petes Travel. This led to Serverse Travel attacking Arriva within Tamworth (which in turn would allow Petes Travel to attack Arriva in Tamworth) this stratergy only failed when the Directors of Serverse liquidated the business as they wanted more & more money to run the company.
When it came to competing with TWM , Petes knew competing with them could only be effective with sheer numbers of buses, they matched TWM bus for bus on a number of routes whilst ensuring they were on enough routes in the area to form an effective network therefore nullifying the Travelcard to a certain extent. Yes they made cock ups, some pretty big. Telfordfor example with Britannia Travel or the failed attempt to break into coaches themselves under the Petes brand with a well over priced Leyland Leopard that only ever did one hire to Blackpool ( I could. E wrong but I certainly only ever remember the one ) where the coach broke down & the hirers got a full refund. But you can't run a company of that size for that long without making some mistakes.
IMHO I don't think we shall ever see such a successful independantly within the West Midlands again.

[Tony]

Petes travel was successful partly due to the range in work that they operated i.e part contract part commercial part competative commercial & partly because the management had clear aims, goals & direction in how to achieve them. Kevin Jones was a ruthless owner when it came to the finances of the business however he listened to his team & to a certain extent gave them a free reign as long as their ideas were profitable. Everything Petes did they had a clear exit stratergy for as with the County Bus attack on Arriva the aim & exit stratergy was to hurt Arriva to such an extent that a financial settlement would be tabled, with a proviso that any route operated by Serverse Travel within Staffordshire could still be operated by Petes Travel. This led to Serverse Travel attacking Arriva within Tamworth (which in turn would allow Petes Travel to attack Arriva in Tamworth) this stratergy only failed when the Directors of Serverse liquidated the business as they wanted more & more money to run the company.
When it came to competing with TWM , Petes knew competing with them could only be effective with sheer numbers of buses, they matched TWM bus for bus on a number of routes whilst ensuring they were on enough routes in the area to form an effective network therefore nullifying the Travelcard to a certain extent. Yes they made cock ups, some pretty big. Telfordfor example with Britannia Travel or the failed attempt to break into coaches themselves under the Petes brand with a well over priced Leyland Leopard that only ever did one hire to Blackpool ( I could. E wrong but I certainly only ever remember the one ) where the coach broke down & the hirers got a full refund. But you can't run a company of that size for that long without making some mistakes.
IMHO I don't think we shall ever see such a successful independantly within the West Midlands again.

So a company that lost lots of money (How much did Mr Jones actually end up with from the purchase price and how much went to cover the debts?), ran unroadworthy buses(see what Go-Ahead had to do with the fleet within a month of purchasing it) and had no regards for timetables was successful?

Pete's travel was cheap and Nasty. If you want successful indepandants try looking in Henley in Arden, Cheslyn Hay. Lye, Solihull, Marston Green, and next door to Coventry Airport/Miller Street. May not be as big, but far more successful

[PM]

Petes travel was successful partly due to the range in work that they operated i.e part contract part commercial part competative commercial & partly because the management had clear aims, goals & direction in how to achieve them. Kevin Jones was a ruthless owner when it came to the finances of the business however he listened to his team & to a certain extent gave them a free reign as long as their ideas were profitable. Everything Petes did they had a clear exit stratergy for as with the County Bus attack on Arriva the aim & exit stratergy was to hurt Arriva to such an extent that a financial settlement would be tabled, with a proviso that any route operated by Serverse Travel within Staffordshire could still be operated by Petes Travel. This led to Serverse Travel attacking Arriva within Tamworth (which in turn would allow Petes Travel to attack Arriva in Tamworth) this stratergy only failed when the Directors of Serverse liquidated the business as they wanted more & more money to run the company.
When it came to competing with TWM , Petes knew competing with them could only be effective with sheer numbers of buses, they matched TWM bus for bus on a number of routes whilst ensuring they were on enough routes in the area to form an effective network therefore nullifying the Travelcard to a certain extent. Yes they made cock ups, some pretty big. Telfordfor example with Britannia Travel or the failed attempt to break into coaches themselves under the Petes brand with a well over priced Leyland Leopard that only ever did one hire to Blackpool ( I could. E wrong but I certainly only ever remember the one ) where the coach broke down & the hirers got a full refund. But you can't run a company of that size for that long without making some mistakes.
IMHO I don't think we shall ever see such a successful independantly within the West Midlands again.

So a company that lost lots of money (How much did Mr Jones actually end up with from the purchase price and how much went to cover the debts?), ran unroadworthy buses(see what Go-Ahead had to do with the fleet within a month of purchasing it) and had no regards for timetables was successful?

Pete's travel was cheap and Nasty. If you want successful indepandants try looking in Henley in Arden, Cheslyn Hay. Lye, Solihull, Marston Green, and next door to Coventry Airport/Miller Street. May not be as big, but far more successful

I must say that I have been a fan of Pete's-they gave NXWM a run for their money with young, low floor buses and a co-ordinated network. They had a far younger fleet than TWM at the time and seemed to be popular and well-used. Pete's was profitable however I imagine the fleet maintainance issue was down to the fact that ppl gave up when they knew go ahead was buying them anyway. And to be honest, is not running to timetables really how to compete and make money. This is what seems to be holding diamond back now is this inability to fight hard and get in front of NXWM buses. This is what is needed to make money however unprofessional this can seem

[Tony]

Pete's Travel was profitable? I bet if you go to Companies House website you could probably buy the last couple of years accounts and you might get a different story.

If I remember correctly the Company called Pete's Travel was put into liquidation (bankrupt?) with some assets transferred to a company called Lionspeed Limited, this also went into liquidation (bankrupt) and the assets transferred to a company called People's Express. This is the one purchased by Go-Ahead group who found what they purchased wasn't what they expected

[Steveminor]

Tony in their heyday Petes were untouchable yes I agree in their later days problems started to creep in however as Peter suggested this was down to staff giving up as the company was being sold off & ppl were unsure of their future employment. Plus as the company was being sold they were on stop with several suppliers which led to a shortage of parts.
As to the profitability of the company well it's an open forum so I can't & won't really comment however I will say that Petes did have several limited companies & the business was very profitable upon its sale to Go Ahead.

Just to touch on the point of their timekeeping well I'm sure everyone on here would agree most companies could be guilty of that from time to time including NXWM. In fact I seem to remember several times when Petes & NXWM went head to head both sides just tore up the timetable to try & beat each other.

[Steveminor]

Tony they had more than just those 3 limited companies

[Tony]

Tony they had more than just those 3 limited companies

Oh I know there were about 7 altogether, but those three had the bulk of the operations on, most of the time. As for very profitable when sold to Go-Ahead, that is debatable, The debts were about the same as the purchase price weren't they? Didn't some of the leasing companies put big claims in at the same time about incomplete repairs etc.

Reading realised they had some badly maintained lemons pretty soon after buying those Tridents as well!

[Steveminor]

The Tridents were lemons from day one. One of them had the emergency door fall off on delivery another had a gearbox go after a week. That's partly why they didn't stay long, the metros were more reliable. As I have said I can't & won't go into finances on open forum, but yes the operation was profitable upon sale to Go Ahead.
I wonder if Go should have purchased one of the other limited companies!!!

[winston]

The Tridents were lemons from day one. One of them had the emergency door fall off on delivery another had a gearbox go after a week. That's partly why they didn't stay long, the metros were more reliable. As I have said I can't & won't go into finances on open forum, but yes the operation was profitable upon sale to Go Ahead.
I wonder if Go should have purchased one of the other limited companies!!!

Was it more of a case that the limited companies chosen to operate Pete's Travel under were made to look as though they weren't doing so well, as profits were being channeled through to the other less familiar limited companies?

[PM]

The Tridents were lemons from day one. One of them had the emergency door fall off on delivery another had a gearbox go after a week. That's partly why they didn't stay long, the metros were more reliable. As I have said I can't & won't go into finances on open forum, but yes the operation was profitable upon sale to Go Ahead.
I wonder if Go should have purchased one of the other limited companies!!!

Was it more of a case that the limited companies chosen to operate Pete's Travel under were made to look as though they weren't doing so well, as profits were being channeled through to the other less familiar limited companies?

I wouldnt put it past them to be honest and if people can get away with it... On a different note someone mentioned leasing-how many/which buses were leased?

[sonic84]

Pete's Travel was profitable? I bet if you go to Companies House website you could probably buy the last couple of years accounts and you might get a different story.

If I remember correctly the Company called Pete's Travel was put into liquidation (bankrupt?) with some assets transferred to a company called Lionspeed Limited, this also went into liquidation (bankrupt) and the assets transferred to a company called People's Express. This is the one purchased by Go-Ahead group who found what they purchased wasn't what they expected

I remember this happening, as all the sunday services and subsidised services they ran in worcestershire were taken over on an emergency contract by First Midland Red at the time.

I also remember there being outrage as well as there were up to 25% price hikes on commercial services in worcestershire, such as the X33 and the 303.  I also believe were they operated evening versions of routes ran by First in the day time, the council had said that they were to take return tickets of the main service operator, but Pete's also pulled out of this too.

I also remember that they withdrew off the X33 Kidderminster - Redditch service all together, (they ran the daytime service at the time too), and when first took it over on request of the council, they re-registered on it again commercially.

Can anyone remember when they shut down the Redditch garage, and then ran all there local routes from West Brom...many a time I followed there buses down the M5 towards Bromsgrove.

[fleetline6477]

Pete's was a great operator for passengers and drivers and I had 5 very happy years driving routes out of Hill Top around the West Midlands.

In my opinion 2 main things lead to the downfall of the company.

1. A great influx of Polish drivers. Whilst these drivers were generally very competent drivers there were great issues relating to communication, especially when Pete's had a general policy where alot of drivers were on regular routes and duties and therefore known to passengers. When all regular drivers were taken off key routes like the 97 and 404E, largely because they are simple routes to follow, passenger numbers went down.

2. Sadly, as can often be the case with family businesses, especially when there is an odd number of members, disputes can lead to problems in the future. When Pete Jones, the Company founder, was paid off and forced out of the business great financial pressures were created.

[Steveminor]

When Pete Jones was forced out!!! Didn't Kevin Jones threaten to have his father arrested if he didn't leave the premises.
I remember my time at Petes & one directive that kept coming up was "Don't tell my father".
Oops kept f&@king up on that one.

[Ash]

When Pete's operated the 404E and used X631/2/4/6-9/41AKW each driver had the same bus day in/day out and never swapped. The same for the 401E when S771-3RNE was used always the same drivers.