NX Hybrids

[Tony]

I still maintain that a bus is still only as 'fast' as the driver drives it (or at least 'fast' from a passengers perspective)

I caught a Gemini on the 37 the other evening, and we got from Sparkbrook to Acocks Green in just under 11 minutes. And it felt 'fast' from a passengers perspective, for whatever reasons, maybe the driver was running late and was trying to make up time, because their shift was about to finish etc etc.

Yet the same Gemini could be used at another time of day (with a different driver), and it can 'feel' slow because the driver is running on time, and doesn't have to floor the thing!

Completely correct Stu.

Drivers are taught the most fuel efficient way of driving (and best for passengers) is amongst other things if possible do not physically stop except at bus stops if you can help it. If you see a queue ahead, or a traffic light that will be on red when you get to it immediately take you foot off the accelerator and try and roll up to the back of the queue so you can then accelerate off a rolling start. This in itself saves fuel, but then you do not need to put the accelerator so far down to get back up to traffic speed.
This means the engine makes a lot less noise and 'feels' slower even though the journey takes exactly the same time.

More simply put; Defensive driving.

Yes, and the other employees on here will know what that means, but chances are the under 16s don't.

V Festival is on of the few times drivers actually get to put NXWM through their paces properly with miles of open road to drive down. I used to love putting Metrobuses through there paces on there when the instruction was to get back as fast as possible, and safety was the only other rule, no defensive driving etc. I am supervising again this year so doubt I will get to have a go at fast driving again, although last year was the same, but I still did one trip at 4:30am, 56 minutes Weston Park to Wolverhampton and back, that made a lovely change!

[Liverpool Street]

I still maintain that a bus is still only as 'fast' as the driver drives it (or at least 'fast' from a passengers perspective)

I caught a Gemini on the 37 the other evening, and we got from Sparkbrook to Acocks Green in just under 11 minutes. And it felt 'fast' from a passengers perspective, for whatever reasons, maybe the driver was running late and was trying to make up time, because their shift was about to finish etc etc.

Yet the same Gemini could be used at another time of day (with a different driver), and it can 'feel' slow because the driver is running on time, and doesn't have to floor the thing!

Completely correct Stu.

Drivers are taught the most fuel efficient way of driving (and best for passengers) is amongst other things if possible do not physically stop except at bus stops if you can help it. If you see a queue ahead, or a traffic light that will be on red when you get to it immediately take you foot off the accelerator and try and roll up to the back of the queue so you can then accelerate off a rolling start. This in itself saves fuel, but then you do not need to put the accelerator so far down to get back up to traffic speed.
This means the engine makes a lot less noise and 'feels' slower even though the journey takes exactly the same time.

More simply put; Defensive driving.

Yes, and the other employees on here will know what that means, but chances are the under 16s don't.

V Festival is on of the few times drivers actually get to put NXWM through their paces properly with miles of open road to drive down. I used to love putting Metrobuses through there paces on there when the instruction was to get back as fast as possible, and safety was the only other rule, no defensive driving etc. I am supervising again this year so doubt I will get to have a go at fast driving again, although last year was the same, but I still did one trip at 4:30am, 56 minutes Weston Park to Wolverhampton and back, that made a lovely change!

Fair enough about the under 16 comment.

Sounds fun but with the way BC does vFest recruitment no other drivers get a chance to do it. Not fair at all.

[nitromatt1]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

[Liverpool Street]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

I have to agree with Matt. Some are faster; it's just a fact.

However, what Tony said earlier is also true. For instance, take 41xx and 44xx Tridents.  The 41's feel slower as they dont change gears that often. Yet 44's you think are faster off the line as some scream and bang into gear - also the front raises a bit more as you accellerate giving the impression of speed. But I think you'll find most give the same speed output.

One thing you can be certain of is E40D Hybrids are deffinately faster then any bus I've driven.

[nitromatt1]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

I have to agree with Matt. Some are faster; it's just a fact.

However, what Tony said earlier is also true. For instance, take 41xx and 44xx Tridents.  The 41's feel slower as they dont change gears that often. Yet 44's you think are faster off the line as some scream and bang into gear - also the front raises a bit more as you accellerate giving the impression of speed. But I think you'll find most give the same speed output.

One thing you can be certain of is E40D Hybrids are deffinately faster then any bus I've driven.

Actually, the Y-reg Tridents feel quite fast to me, had 4131 this evening which flew off the line. They do feel like the fastest Voiths to me, with the exception of some BU04's at Wolverhampton.

Due to their complex gearboxes, B5's can either crawl off or shoot off, depending entirely on the driver's style of driving and how accustomed they are to the gears. (I am saying all this from what I can tell as a passenger only)

I wonder if anyone has driven both a BC and WN Enviro-Hybrid yet? Because they would truly be able to tell if the Birmingham ones actually are faster than the Wolverhampton ones. I have ridden almost all of both batches and the BC ones do feel faster; it's nothing to do with the style of road either, as much of the 22/23's route is a similar style to that of the 1

[Stuharris 6360]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

I have to agree with Matt. Some are faster; it's just a fact.



However, what Tony said earlier is also true. For instance, take 41xx and 44xx Tridents.  The 41's feel slower as they dont change gears that often. Yet 44's you think are faster off the line as some scream and bang into gear - also the front raises a bit more as you accellerate giving the impression of speed. But I think you'll find most give the same speed output.

One thing you can be certain of is E40D Hybrids are deffinately faster then any bus I've driven.

Actually, the Y-reg Tridents feel quite fast to me, had 4131 this evening which flew off the line. They do feel like the fastest Voiths to me, with the exception of some BU04's at Wolverhampton.

Due to their complex gearboxes, B5's can either crawl off or shoot off, depending entirely on the driver's style of driving and how accustomed they are to the gears. (I am saying all this from what I can tell as a passenger only)

I wonder if anyone has driven both a BC and WN Enviro-Hybrid yet? Because they would truly be able to tell if the Birmingham ones actually are faster than the Wolverhampton ones. I have ridden almost all of both batches and the BC ones do feel faster; it's nothing to do with the style of road either, as much of the 22/23's route is a similar style to that of the 1

I think the difference between the 1 and the 22/23 is that the 22/23 is busy most of the day and therefore the driver is always trying to keep to time, whereas the 1 is quite lightly loaded during the day at certain times and therefore the dricer isn't in such a hurry.

Interestingly, some London Buses are equipped with a box on the dashboard to help with acceleration. it has read, yellow & green lights. As the bus accelerates it starts with green lights, however if the driver over accelerates, the yellow lights will come on followed by red.

[Liverpool Street]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

I have to agree with Matt. Some are faster; it's just a fact.



However, what Tony said earlier is also true. For instance, take 41xx and 44xx Tridents.  The 41's feel slower as they dont change gears that often. Yet 44's you think are faster off the line as some scream and bang into gear - also the front raises a bit more as you accellerate giving the impression of speed. But I think you'll find most give the same speed output.

One thing you can be certain of is E40D Hybrids are deffinately faster then any bus I've driven.

Actually, the Y-reg Tridents feel quite fast to me, had 4131 this evening which flew off the line. They do feel like the fastest Voiths to me, with the exception of some BU04's at Wolverhampton.

Due to their complex gearboxes, B5's can either crawl off or shoot off, depending entirely on the driver's style of driving and how accustomed they are to the gears. (I am saying all this from what I can tell as a passenger only)

I wonder if anyone has driven both a BC and WN Enviro-Hybrid yet? Because they would truly be able to tell if the Birmingham ones actually are faster than the Wolverhampton ones. I have ridden almost all of both batches and the BC ones do feel faster; it's nothing to do with the style of road either, as much of the 22/23's route is a similar style to that of the 1

I think the difference between the 1 and the 22/23 is that the 22/23 is busy most of the day and therefore the driver is always trying to keep to time, whereas the 1 is quite lightly loaded during the day at certain times and therefore the dricer isn't in such a hurry.

Interestingly, some London Buses are equipped with a box on the dashboard to help with acceleration. it has read, yellow & green lights. As the bus accelerates it starts with green lights, however if the driver over accelerates, the yellow lights will come on followed by red.

I dont think the 22/23 is busy most of the day. Peaks yes, but off peak it is quite lightly loaded. Unless of course you're already 8 minutes down.

[tank90]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

I can agree with that as MRW G1xxHNP Leyland Lynxs where faster at accellerating than most other buses due to on fact, they had the wooden block removed from under the peddle. Also MRW had a Turbo National that was faster than the other Nationals they had.
But also depends on how the bus has been maintanied too, as some of the E300's at Redditch seemed slower than others due to having a poorly engine (Ie had been thrashed and was going to brake down at some point).

[Tony]

No reaction to the under 16 comment.

Yes, how fast a bus accelerates clearly depends on how far the driver puts his foot down. But as I have previously stated, certain buses are faster than other buses. Even examples in the same batch, which on paper should be identical. Anyone who denies that is clearly rather unobservant.

I can agree with that as MRW G1xxHNP Leyland Lynxs where faster at accellerating than most other buses due to on fact, they had the wooden block removed from under the peddle.

There was no 'wooden block' under the accelerator pedal of a Lynx to remove. Lynx were just fast full stop. They are certainly the fastest accelerating bus I have driven in 25 years. Since the Lynx most vehicles have engine management systems in place which equals them all out, hence my comment about most types being fairly even in a drag race up to 30.

[Gareth]

TWM obviously knew of the 'fastness' of the lynx and used it in advertising. The 993/4 leaflets advertising them as 'fast and efficient vehicles'.

[Kevin]

Apologies for keeping "off topic" (before I get slated for doing so - it's just where the conversation is heading at the moment)...

A case point about some buses being faster / not being faster than others:
On me way home from work on Friday I caught 4309 (Trident) on the X51 from town at about 6pm. It was full to the brim, so had a good few extra tonnes of weight to move. Pulling away from the Bartons Arms lights in Newtown it managed to outpace a fairly empty Gemini.
Not trying to say "I know these buses are faster than others", just stating what happened.

[winston]

TWM obviously knew of the 'fastness' of the lynx and used it in advertising. The 993/4 leaflets advertising them as 'fast and efficient vehicles'.

QN Lynx's used to shift along Quinton Expressway on the 19S when they were really opened up, especially if you had a driver running late who was flooring it....... Only problem with the Lynx was the internal rattles & the suspension didn't seem to absorb pot holes very well, a few times the rear wheels would bang and sound like they'd come through the floor

[Tony]

Apologies for keeping "off topic" (before I get slated for doing so - it's just where the conversation is heading at the moment)...

A case point about some buses being faster / not being faster than others:
On me way home from work on Friday I caught 4309 (Trident) on the X51 from town at about 6pm. It was full to the brim, so had a good few extra tonnes of weight to move. Pulling away from the Bartons Arms lights in Newtown it managed to outpace a fairly empty Gemini.
Not trying to say "I know these buses are faster than others", just stating what happened.

4309 is OK pulling away, but is limited to 37mph, bet it seemed slow on the flyovers then! The thing is your driver may have put his foot to the floor and the gemini driver decided they were in no hurry and just pulled away gently. That is why drivers will normally know good and bad buses but passengers don't

[Tony]

TWM obviously knew of the 'fastness' of the lynx and used it in advertising. The 993/4 leaflets advertising them as 'fast and efficient vehicles'.

QN Lynx's used to shift along Quinton Expressway on the 19S when they were really opened up, especially if you had a driver running late who was flooring it....... Only problem with the Lynx was the internal rattles & the suspension didn't seem to absorb pot holes very well, a few times the rear wheels would bang and sound like they'd come through the floor

I actually had the rear axle come out of place on an AG Lynx on the 71 and had the pleasure of a ride in a tow truck while the Lynx had a backwards suspend tow back

[winston]

TWM obviously knew of the 'fastness' of the lynx and used it in advertising. The 993/4 leaflets advertising them as 'fast and efficient vehicles'.

QN Lynx's used to shift along Quinton Expressway on the 19S when they were really opened up, especially if you had a driver running late who was flooring it....... Only problem with the Lynx was the internal rattles & the suspension didn't seem to absorb pot holes very well, a few times the rear wheels would bang and sound like they'd come through the floor

I actually had the rear axle come out of place on an AG Lynx on the 71 and had the pleasure of a ride in a tow truck while the Lynx had a backwards suspend tow back

Was that from hitting a deep pot hole? Or just a failure?