Diamond Bus - Discussion

[John]

A red and white Diamond Dart (VGX reg maybe) was involved in an Accident while on the 43 today, on Oxford Road, West Brom, at the traffic lights at Lodge Road, just down from NX West Bromwich garage. Looks like a car had run the red light and smashed into the drivers side at the front. Not major damage though, but the bus was still in situ blocking Lodge Road with police and paramedics there

[winston]

03 plate Enviro 300 for sale

http://www.southdownpsv.co.uk/sales/bus_details.php?bus=247

[Ash]

I haven't seen W905JNF on any of the Tividale services for a bout a week now I wonder if this bus has gone back to Long Acre or possibly Redditch or Kidderminster.

[tank90]

One of the Ex First Enviros has been painted blue I think as Im sure I saw one on the M42 yesterday afternoon. Im quite sure it was VX54 MSU.
Its a shame the R reg Darts havent had ramps put in them as they would have gone on for a few more years with diamond no problem.

[winston]

One of the Ex First Enviros has been painted blue I think as Im sure I saw one on the M42 yesterday afternoon. Im quite sure it was VX54 MSU.
Its a shame the R reg Darts havent had ramps put in them as they would have gone on for a few more years with diamond no problem.

It seems that buses don't need to have built-in ramps to be DDA compliant, folding portable ramps will suffice.

The revised Oft decision date is set for Fri this week (23rd) unless it gets put back again???

[PM]

One of the Ex First Enviros has been painted blue I think as Im sure I saw one on the M42 yesterday afternoon. Im quite sure it was VX54 MSU.
Its a shame the R reg Darts havent had ramps put in them as they would have gone on for a few more years with diamond no problem.

It seems that buses don't need to have built-in ramps to be DDA compliant, folding portable ramps will suffice.

The revised Oft decision date is set for Fri this week (23rd) unless it gets put back again???

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

[winston]

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

That's what I also thought.......

From a reply on another forum & further investigation it seems that they don't have to have built-in wheelchair ramps (unless anyone's differently), the current folding portable ramps comply. The only issues that I can see where NX's B6LE, B10L & Mercs don't meet DDA is the lack of side destination equipment other than the one's that have been fitted with LED's (front & side)

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/bus-coach-accessibility-faq

Relevant extracts from the above for your info:

Lifts and ramps
Wheelchair accessible vehicles are fitted with a lift, or a ramp (powered, manual or portable i.e. a detachable, usually folding ramp) stowed in a convenient place on the vehicle. If a portable ramp is used, a driver or conductor must ensure at the start of the service that it is being carried on the vehicle.

Whatever type of lift or ramp is provided, a driver or conductor must be familiar with the method of operation and must always ensure that a lift or ramp is returned to its correct stowage position and is secure in that position before the vehicle is driven. Power operated ramps will usually return to a safe stowage position automatically.

Safety of wheelchair users in transit
If a wheelchair user needs to travel seated in their wheelchair they must only be carried in a wheelchair space and facing either forwards of rearwards according to the instructions or diagram for the use of the space. Buses will usually be constructed with a backrest to enable a wheelchair to travel rearward facing. Coaches are likely to be designed for a forward facing wheelchair.

Route and destination displays
Drivers and conductors must ensure that the correct route number (if any) and the destination is correctly displayed in the positions provided on the vehicle.
If the route number and destination displays are provided with a means of illumination then they must be illuminated between sunset and sunrise.
If the vehicle is providing a temporary service (e.g. rail replacement) or is an emergency replacement vehicle on the route in question it may not be possible to display the route and destination in all the usual places. In such cases a temporary sign must be displayed and must show the correct route number (if any) and the correct destination displayed on the front or nearside of the vehicle as close as practicable to the front entrance. The route and destination need not be illuminated at night. These relaxations apply only for the first 21 days of operation of such services.

In summary:

• Low floor bus with kneeling suspension
• Designated wheechair space with back board / suitably positioned hand poles etc
• Fixed or portable wheelchair ramp must be carried
• Front & nearside destination equipment

[PM]

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

That's what I also thought.......

From a reply on another forum & further investigation it seems that they don't have to have built-in wheelchair ramps (unless anyone's differently), the current folding portable ramps comply. The only issues that I can see where NX's B6LE, B10L & Mercs don't meet DDA is the lack of side destination equipment other than the one's that have been fitted with LED's (front & side)

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/bus-coach-accessibility-faq

Relevant extracts from the above for your info:

Lifts and ramps
Wheelchair accessible vehicles are fitted with a lift, or a ramp (powered, manual or portable i.e. a detachable, usually folding ramp) stowed in a convenient place on the vehicle. If a portable ramp is used, a driver or conductor must ensure at the start of the service that it is being carried on the vehicle.

Whatever type of lift or ramp is provided, a driver or conductor must be familiar with the method of operation and must always ensure that a lift or ramp is returned to its correct stowage position and is secure in that position before the vehicle is driven. Power operated ramps will usually return to a safe stowage position automatically.

Safety of wheelchair users in transit
If a wheelchair user needs to travel seated in their wheelchair they must only be carried in a wheelchair space and facing either forwards of rearwards according to the instructions or diagram for the use of the space. Buses will usually be constructed with a backrest to enable a wheelchair to travel rearward facing. Coaches are likely to be designed for a forward facing wheelchair.

Route and destination displays
Drivers and conductors must ensure that the correct route number (if any) and the destination is correctly displayed in the positions provided on the vehicle.
If the route number and destination displays are provided with a means of illumination then they must be illuminated between sunset and sunrise.
If the vehicle is providing a temporary service (e.g. rail replacement) or is an emergency replacement vehicle on the route in question it may not be possible to display the route and destination in all the usual places. In such cases a temporary sign must be displayed and must show the correct route number (if any) and the correct destination displayed on the front or nearside of the vehicle as close as practicable to the front entrance. The route and destination need not be illuminated at night. These relaxations apply only for the first 21 days of operation of such services.

In summary:

• Low floor bus with kneeling suspension
• Designated wheechair space with back board / suitably positioned hand poles etc
• Fixed or portable wheelchair ramp must be carried
• Front & nearside destination equipment

Oh right proved wrong then and thanks for posting this as i genuinely didnt realise. Guess it ensures that buses like diamonds crusaders such as the one with select will be able to operate longer

[winston]

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

That's what I also thought.......

From a reply on another forum & further investigation it seems that they don't have to have built-in wheelchair ramps (unless anyone's differently), the current folding portable ramps comply. The only issues that I can see where NX's B6LE, B10L & Mercs don't meet DDA is the lack of side destination equipment other than the one's that have been fitted with LED's (front & side)

https://www.gov.uk/government/publications/bus-coach-accessibility-faq

Relevant extracts from the above for your info:

Lifts and ramps
Wheelchair accessible vehicles are fitted with a lift, or a ramp (powered, manual or portable i.e. a detachable, usually folding ramp) stowed in a convenient place on the vehicle. If a portable ramp is used, a driver or conductor must ensure at the start of the service that it is being carried on the vehicle.

Whatever type of lift or ramp is provided, a driver or conductor must be familiar with the method of operation and must always ensure that a lift or ramp is returned to its correct stowage position and is secure in that position before the vehicle is driven. Power operated ramps will usually return to a safe stowage position automatically.

Safety of wheelchair users in transit
If a wheelchair user needs to travel seated in their wheelchair they must only be carried in a wheelchair space and facing either forwards of rearwards according to the instructions or diagram for the use of the space. Buses will usually be constructed with a backrest to enable a wheelchair to travel rearward facing. Coaches are likely to be designed for a forward facing wheelchair.

Route and destination displays
Drivers and conductors must ensure that the correct route number (if any) and the destination is correctly displayed in the positions provided on the vehicle.
If the route number and destination displays are provided with a means of illumination then they must be illuminated between sunset and sunrise.
If the vehicle is providing a temporary service (e.g. rail replacement) or is an emergency replacement vehicle on the route in question it may not be possible to display the route and destination in all the usual places. In such cases a temporary sign must be displayed and must show the correct route number (if any) and the correct destination displayed on the front or nearside of the vehicle as close as practicable to the front entrance. The route and destination need not be illuminated at night. These relaxations apply only for the first 21 days of operation of such services.

In summary:

• Low floor bus with kneeling suspension
• Designated wheechair space with back board / suitably positioned hand poles etc
• Fixed or portable wheelchair ramp must be carried
• Front & nearside destination equipment

Oh right proved wrong then and thanks for posting this as i genuinely didnt realise. Guess it ensures that buses like diamonds crusaders such as the one with select will be able to operate longer

It does, but existing buses may still need the internal layout modifying / folding ramps / LED's front & side at least t comply. 

[Tony]

One of the Ex First Enviros has been painted blue I think as Im sure I saw one on the M42 yesterday afternoon. Im quite sure it was VX54 MSU.
Its a shame the R reg Darts havent had ramps put in them as they would have gone on for a few more years with diamond no problem.

It seems that buses don't need to have built-in ramps to be DDA compliant, folding portable ramps will suffice.

The revised Oft decision date is set for Fri this week (23rd) unless it gets put back again???

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

One of the biggest problems some early low floor buses have with being DDA compliant is the gap between the wheelarches. There is a minimum width of wheelchair that must be able to be carried and on some vehicles the gap between the wheel arches is less than this. At least solos do not have this problem!

[winston]

One of the Ex First Enviros has been painted blue I think as Im sure I saw one on the M42 yesterday afternoon. Im quite sure it was VX54 MSU.
Its a shame the R reg Darts havent had ramps put in them as they would have gone on for a few more years with diamond no problem.

It seems that buses don't need to have built-in ramps to be DDA compliant, folding portable ramps will suffice.

The revised Oft decision date is set for Fri this week (23rd) unless it gets put back again???

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

One of the biggest problems some early low floor buses have with being DDA compliant is the gap between the wheelarches. There is a minimum width of wheelchair that must be able to be carried and on some vehicles the gap between the wheel arches is less than this. At least solos do not have this problem!

Thanks Tony,

Is that issue more likely confined to Midi's B6LE & Dart SLF's.

Is that why full size buses were increased to 2.55M wide?

[PM]

One of the Ex First Enviros has been painted blue I think as Im sure I saw one on the M42 yesterday afternoon. Im quite sure it was VX54 MSU.
Its a shame the R reg Darts havent had ramps put in them as they would have gone on for a few more years with diamond no problem.

It seems that buses don't need to have built-in ramps to be DDA compliant, folding portable ramps will suffice.

The revised Oft decision date is set for Fri this week (23rd) unless it gets put back again???

Do they not have to be fitted ramps? In that case, nx's mercs/b6s/b10s are all dda compliant? Im sure the ramps have to be fitted and headboards fitted for wheelchair users.

One of the biggest problems some early low floor buses have with being DDA compliant is the gap between the wheelarches. There is a minimum width of wheelchair that must be able to be carried and on some vehicles the gap between the wheel arches is less than this. At least solos do not have this problem!

Oh right didnt know this Tony but with pointers they must all be dda as isnt the aisle width the same on old/new ones. Do crusaders not qualify then-i mean both the dart/b6 ones as I am just interested. And dont worry solos have plenty of other problems to contend with :P To be fair, pointers seem to have a very clever entrance layout with the gap underneath the cab allowing better accessibility but I saw a wheelchair on an EBD dart a few weeks ago and it was quite a big one and fitted in fine so maybe no real rush to scrap buses of this type. Having said that, I dont think travel express's carlyle darts qualify unfortunately :P

[Ash]

I know not that relevant but went on T443EBD on the 4 today and the bus flew with ease, there was an omnilink in front of us at the bus stop we both pulled off at the same time and we had to break and slow down as 30432 accelerated to quick for it. Hopefully these will stay a while longer.

W336VGX parked up at Long Acre now.

[PM]

I know not that relevant but went on T443EBD on the 4 today and the bus flew with ease, there was an omnilink in front of us at the bus stop we both pulled off at the same time and we had to break and slow down as 30432 accelerated to quick for it. Hopefully these will stay a while longer.

W336VGX parked up at Long Acre now.

Yeah its a great one T443EBD and the interior is in good condition as well and these are good on the 4 where competitive driving is absolutely necessary. Is W336VGX the one that was involved in an accident that was mentioned on here or is that 337?? Shame its a great bus in fact this batch is brilliant full stop.

With the 4, your best strategy is in a 4 hour shift or so, from walsall, watch all the NX ones bunch-there were 4 sat there the other week-is to drive straight off and discount any hope of getting any passengers there unless they flag the diamond one down and then drive fairly slowly and by reaching walsall u can get a full load by west brom and by doing this strategy for a 4 hour shift you're looking at taking over £50 which isnt bad

[Ash]

Im sure I have seen W337VGX in service recently so probably W336VGX was the dart involved in an accident. When I was on 30432 today people were moving out the way at several bus stops letting the NXWM bus past to use the diamond bus as they had passes and a couple wanted returns, was the same with me I let the NXWM bus pass to get a cheaper diamond return. NXWM always seem to bunch up in Walsall taking both stands as they take a while to change drivers and a few diamond buses leave empty and fill up on the way to West Brom or Hayley Green/Merry Hill.