Fare rise and ticket changes July 2023

[JPC]

Thanks @j789 - that paints a much clearer picture, a rule 'embargoed' by either TfWM or NX or the other operators collectively is the probable reason why the 'extra' ticket now exists - can anyone explain why it is named 'extra'?, residents outside the nBus zone can still avail of the nBus season tickets.
The wording on the NX website has been amended with improved clarity since last night.

[Stu]

Thanks @j789 - that paints a much clearer picture, a rule 'embargoed' by either TfWM or NX or the other operators collectively is the probable reason why the 'extra' ticket now exists - can anyone explain why it is named 'extra'?, residents outside the nBus zone can still avail of the nBus season tickets.
The wording on the NX website has been amended with improved clarity since last night.

The way I'm reading this now, they're both basically the same thing?

Day Saver

Unlimited travel on all bus operators within the nBus zone and on all National Express buses.

Our drivers are unable to give change so if you pay with cash please use the exact fare.

Adult NX Day Saver extra ticket

Tickets for any National Express bus service that travels to, from or between locations outside the nBus zone. These tickets are only valid on National Express bus services.

But the 'Daysaver Extra' is only valid on NX Buses?

So surely you can then just buy a Daysaver on the X3 from Lichfield (for example), and then use it on the Diamond 16 or 50 from Birmingham?

Then what is the point of the Daysaver Extra?

[JPC]

It seems the day ticket you receive will depend on where you board the NX bus....

If you buy a £4.50 day ticket on a NX bus within the nBus zone it will be a 'One Day nBus' which is valid on all participating operators within the nBus zone plus NX buses outside the nBus zone.

If you buy a £4.50 day ticket on a NX bus outside the nBus zone it will be a 'Daysaver Extra' which is valid on NX buses only (same as a NX Daysaver).

Same applies with the Child and Group day tickets.

[Gareth]

That doesn't make sense either as a one day nBus can be used on all NX services, so why would I only get a daysaver extra? The only advantage is a few extra pence for NXWM and zero advantage for the passenger.

[Westy]

Whilst there are obvious complications with these tickets I don't think the issue will be as large as people seem to be imagining.

Currently, passengers outside the west Mids boundary can purchase a NX Daysaver that can be used on all their buses but not on other companies in the West Midlands. They would need to them buy another ticket should they wish to use another operator's services.

This situation is however surely not changing with the Daysaver+. That still allows passengers outside the West Midlands access to all the NX bus network as it does now. These passengers won't notice the difference therefore (apart from the 50p increase over the current day ticket price).

I think very few current passengers in those areas would have any confusion about being able to use that ticket on any operator's services. They can't now snd they can't in the future - no change.

Yes it would be easier for there to be one day ticket for ease but it is well known that journeys outside the West Midlands are generally less well subsidised than within the county so it is understandable for operators to want to have restrictions on usage in those areas. Ultimately, £4.50 on the Daysaver + goes to NX whereas if they sold a Nbus ticket a % would go elsewhere. The difference may well make these cross county services financial viable so passenger do benefit in that way.

I just don't think many people are going to be a confused by this as really the situation for current passengers has not changed with these tickets.

I think the thing that's confusing people is that there's 2 Daysaver tickets both at the same price!

[sonic84]

That doesn't make sense either as a one day nBus can be used on all NX services, so why would I only get a daysaver extra? The only advantage is a few extra pence for NXWM and zero advantage for the passenger.

My guess is that technically the nbus boundary hasn't changed, only that nxbus have decided to accept it on all there buses.... and therefore the new nbus ticket can't be purchased outside of the nbus boundary.

Instead there is the daysaver extra for nxbuses only.

[Rachvince53]

The way I'm reading this now, they're both basically the same thing?
But the 'Daysaver Extra' is only valid on NX Buses?

So surely you can then just buy a Daysaver on the X3 from Lichfield (for example), and then use it on the Diamond 16 or 50 from Birmingham?

Then what is the point of the Daysaver Extra?

The daysaver extra is not valid on other operators, it is only valid on NX buses but does allow travel to places such as Cannock and Lichfield which are outside of the nBus area.  You would not be able to buy a nBus in Lichfield but instead buy a Daysaver extra for the same price. 

[Westy]

Right, let's look at this again.

I now have a Nbus Regional pass, which I can use on any operator within the Wm county boundary, plus Codsall & Wombourne.

I cannot use this pass for a trip to Lichfield or Cannock. I would have to pay extra.

The day ticket, the one I had on Saturday, to go to Wolverhampton & basically have a ride around, it says 'One Day Nbus', which let's you use it within the Wm County boundary & Codsall & Wombourne on any operator. Again I cannot use that ticket to Cannock & Lichfield.

If I want to have a day ticket for Cannock & Lichfield, I need to have this 'Daysaver Extra' for the same price, & presumably state to the driver 'I want a Daysaver Extra' (What does the ticket actually say?)

In other words, a bash involving a trip to Lichfield from Walsall, returning via Sutton & Brum, is not possible on the 'One Day Nbus', but is possible on the 'Daysaver Extra' but restricted to Nx buses only.

(But once I'm back in the Wm county, there is nothing stopping me using my normal Nbus Regional instead, to use other operators!)

Is that basically it?

[2206]

If I want to have a day ticket for Cannock & Lichfield, I need to have this 'Daysaver Extra' for the same price, & presumably state to the driver 'I want a Daysaver Extra' (What does the ticket actually say?)

In other words, a bash involving a trip to Lichfield from Walsall, returning via Sutton & Brum, is not possible on the 'One Day Nbus', but is possible on the 'Daysaver Extra' but restricted to Nx buses only.

@Westy I think it might be that if you ask for a daysaver in Birmingham or the Black Country, you will get a daysaver N Bus that can be used on all operators that accept N Bus in the West Midlands and all NX services outside of the N Bus Zone.
If you ask for a daysaver in Coleshill, Lichfield, Cannock you will get a daysaver extra as the N Bus can't be purchased in those areas

[Westy]

@Westy I think it might be that if you ask for a daysaver in Birmingham or the Black Country, you will get a daysaver N Bus that can be used on all operators that accept N Bus in the West Midlands and all NX services outside of the N Bus Zone.
If you ask for a daysaver in Coleshill, Lichfield, Cannock you will get a daysaver extra as the N Bus can't be purchased in those areas

OK.

Thinking about it again, I'm probably wrong about what I said about the Regional, as the 'old' Regional was valid to Cannock & Lichfield, but the old Walsall Zone  wasn't, so it makes sense I could use my new Regional pass instead?

(In fact, do I actually need to purchase a day ticket in future? I'm guessing not!)

[Rachvince53]

OK.

Thinking about it again, I'm probably wrong about what I said about the Regional, as the 'old' Regional was valid to Cannock & Lichfield, but the old Walsall Zone  wasn't, so it makes sense I could use my new Regional pass instead?

(In fact, do I actually need to purchase a day ticket in future? I'm guessing not!)

According to the NX website, your pass is valid on ALL NX Bus services as well as operators in the nBus scheme within the nBus Zone.  This implies that you could travel on NX buses only to Cannock and Lichfield at no extra cost.

[Westy]

According to the NX website, your pass is valid on ALL NX Bus services as well as operators in the nBus scheme within the nBus Zone.  This implies that you could travel on NX buses only to Cannock and Lichfield at no extra cost.

Sounds good to me!

[j789]

So it seems it is pretty simple really - if you catch the bus outside the West Mids area into the county you'd be given a Daysaver+ valid only on NX (as is the situation now so no change for those passengers).

Anyone catching the bus on a NX bus within the West Mids get an Nbus day ticket no matter where they travel to, including cross boundary services. Those tickets would then be accepted by NX in those other counties for return journeys back to the West Mids.

So really it is only passengers currently outside the West Midlands that will need this alternative ticket - a very small % in the grand scheme of things.

The only issue I could see would be whether an Nbus issued by another operator would be accepted by NX for a journey starting outside the West Midlands boundary. I would assume it would be though otherwise that would be more confusing.

[Rachvince53]

nBus tickets issued by other operators will have the same validity as one issued by NX. However like the Daysaver Extra it would only be valid on NX buses outside the nBus zone. 

[Westy]

How does the ticket machine know which ticket is valid & where?

Taking a guess, there's some sort of GPS on the machine, else you would have a driver pleasing themselves which ticket they issue?

How would the ticket machine have worked out the difference, for example, with 2 Low Fare Zone tickets sharing the same road, like the Walsall & Sandwells sharing part of the 4, 5, 45 & 11?