Whittles

[the trainbasher]

I reckon Whittles won't exist in the bus side by this time 2015. I'm going to place odds on them selling out to NXWM, First or Arriva

[iamwilljh92]

Whittle's are very slowly dying off

Hardly. The bus operation in its current form seems bigger than ever before (pre-September), vehicle standard is the best it has ever been, corporate image has been improved in the past few years, new ticket machines last year, etc.!!

Meh! 

Tom-ato - Tomato

In Kidderminster
Whittle's oldest bus - 2000 / Newest - 2007
Diamond's oldest - 1998 / Newest - 2004

So what?!
So Whittle's have got better buses than Diamond whats your point?!
Correct me if I'm wrong but are Diamond doing better than them answers on a postcard..

@the trainbasher  my point exactly!

[StourportSam]

Whittle's are very slowly dying off

Hardly. The bus operation in its current form seems bigger than ever before (pre-September), vehicle standard is the best it has ever been, corporate image has been improved in the past few years, new ticket machines last year, etc.!!

Meh! 

Tom-ato - Tomato

In Kidderminster
Whittle's oldest bus - 2000 / Newest - 2007
Diamond's oldest - 1998 / Newest - 2004

So what?!
So Whittle's have got better buses than Diamond whats your point?!
Correct me if I'm wrong but are Diamond doing better than them answers on a postcard...

My point was the fact that Whittle have a better fleet.
Diamond do appear to be doing better that Whittle in Kidderminster, I don't dispute that, I think it is just about clear which operator we each prefer...

[iamwilljh92]

Whittle's are very slowly dying off

Hardly. The bus operation in its current form seems bigger than ever before (pre-September), vehicle standard is the best it has ever been, corporate image has been improved in the past few years, new ticket machines last year, etc.!!

Meh! 

Tom-ato - Tomato

In Kidderminster
Whittle's oldest bus - 2000 / Newest - 2007
Diamond's oldest - 1998 / Newest - 2004

So what?!
So Whittle's have got better buses than Diamond whats your point?!
Correct me if I'm wrong but are Diamond doing better than them answers on a postcard...

My point was the fact that Whittle have a better fleet.
Diamond do appear to be doing better that Whittle in Kidderminster, I don't dispute that, I think it is just about clear which operator we each prefer...

Well as a Rotala employee (which I was albeit for 3 days - my decision not theres) I am obliged to stick up for my former employer

[PM]

Out of interest, how much is a Whittle's Network ticket as planning to explore their whole network at some point?

Sorry I don't know exact fare. Have never needed to buy one. It is around the £6.50 mark. Do the trip before end of August!!

1-you reckon the route Diamond picked is better then?

Knowing Kidderminster, without a doubt. It is far, far more logical and saves on pointless doubling back.

Do you see scope to double the frequency to every 20 mins?

Not really, at the moment.

Thanks for the info Sam! Yes, planning to do it next week sometime so I can sample their full network as is. Interesting info re the 1.

Would NX, Arriva or First really want to be bothered with them? Arriva owning EYMS as a whole I'll give you or possibly NX but why would any multinational want a small, possibly loss-making operation? First sold their own more successful KR operation, and closed Truronian Holidays right down after taking over, Arriva could just win work off them anyway and I can't see them being bothered with a 20 bus operation. As for NX, they could have easily bought KR and RH last year had they been interested. I can see and hope to see Whittles still in KR running contracts, the 125, 2A/C etc and its successful coaching side.

[Cheese]

PD1030553/7 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Variation Accepted: Operating between Stourbridge BS and Bridgnorth, Stanmore given service number 125 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Timetable.

PD1030553/62 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Cancellation Accepted: Operating between kidiminster town hall and kidiminster town hall given service number 1 effective from 01-Sep-2014.

PD1030553/78 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between KIDDERMINSTER BUS STATION and BEWDLEY LOAD STREET given service number S15/15 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

PD1030553/83 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between Kidderminster Town Hall and Kidderminster Town Hall given service number 2A/2C effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

Think the 125 is reducing to every 2 hours between Stourbridge and Kidderminster, still hourly or so between Kidderminster and Bridgnorth.

Do you have a source/reasoning for this please Cheese?

The registration document which I was reading last week...

[Cedric]

PD1030553/7 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Variation Accepted: Operating between Stourbridge BS and Bridgnorth, Stanmore given service number 125 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Timetable.

PD1030553/62 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Cancellation Accepted: Operating between kidiminster town hall and kidiminster town hall given service number 1 effective from 01-Sep-2014.

PD1030553/78 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between KIDDERMINSTER BUS STATION and BEWDLEY LOAD STREET given service number S15/15 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

PD1030553/83 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between Kidderminster Town Hall and Kidderminster Town Hall given service number 2A/2C effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

Think the 125 is reducing to every 2 hours between Stourbridge and Kidderminster, still hourly or so between Kidderminster and Bridgnorth.

Do you have a source/reasoning for this please Cheese?

The registration document which I was reading last week...

the Kidderminster to Stourbridge part of the 125 is well used.  if any of the 125 is going to be cut to every 2 hours  think it would be more the bridgnorth to Kidderminster section  as it always used every 2 hours

[Cedric]

diamonds  and whittles 3 run different ways from  stourport to areley kings and back  so they only  complete  between Kidderminster and stourport  .

Actually Cedric, Whittle and Diamond still serve exactly the same stops on the 3 in Areley Kings and the Walshes, its just once they have served them they turn different ways back to Stourport.

knew they where slightly different  but not quite sure how it was thank Sam for clearing that up for me

[Cedric]

I reckon Whittles won't exist in the bus side by this time 2015. I'm going to place odds on them selling out to NXWM, First or Arriva

Arriva where interested in buying the Kr & Rh operation of first the same as NXWM did  . so I do not think they well be interested  and also they run most of the routes around Shropshire that Whittles once did. , and can not see first coming back  in to Kidderminster . nor go ahead as they once owned diamond. Stagecoach might  be the one  it sold too ?

[winston]

PD1030553/7 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Variation Accepted: Operating between Stourbridge BS and Bridgnorth, Stanmore given service number 125 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Timetable.

PD1030553/62 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Cancellation Accepted: Operating between kidiminster town hall and kidiminster town hall given service number 1 effective from 01-Sep-2014.

PD1030553/78 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between KIDDERMINSTER BUS STATION and BEWDLEY LOAD STREET given service number S15/15 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

PD1030553/83 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between Kidderminster Town Hall and Kidderminster Town Hall given service number 2A/2C effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

Think the 125 is reducing to every 2 hours between Stourbridge and Kidderminster, still hourly or so between Kidderminster and Bridgnorth.

Do you have a source/reasoning for this please Cheese?

The registration document which I was reading last week...

the Kidderminster to Stourbridge part of the 125 is well used.  if any of the 125 is going to be cut to every 2 hours  think it would be more the bridgnorth to Kidderminster section  as it always used every 2 hours

I thought that section of the route carried decent loads at times. If it is being cut back to 2 hourly, It could always provide Diamond or possibly even Hanson's with an opportunity?

I reckon Whittles won't exist in the bus side by this time 2015. I'm going to place odds on them selling out to NXWM, First or Arriva

Arriva where interested in buying the Kr & Rh operation of first the same as NXWM did  . so I do not think they well be interested  and also they run most of the routes around Shropshire that Whittles once did. , and can not see first coming back  in to Kidderminster . nor go ahead as they once owned diamond. Stagecoach might  be the one  it sold too ?

I don't really see anyone other than Rotala/Diamond being interested in Whittle's operation on its own, the bus operations will have shrunk come 1st Sept, none of the bus groups are interested in coaching & Whittle only operate 6 coached on NX work. At last count, the business was loss making, whether the streamlining has any impact remains to be seen.

[Cedric]

PD1030553/7 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Variation Accepted: Operating between Stourbridge BS and Bridgnorth, Stanmore given service number 125 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Timetable.

PD1030553/62 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
    Cancellation Accepted: Operating between kidiminster town hall and kidiminster town hall given service number 1 effective from 01-Sep-2014.

PD1030553/78 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between KIDDERMINSTER BUS STATION and BEWDLEY LOAD STREET given service number S15/15 effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

PD1030553/83 - WHITTLE COACH & BUS LTD, FOLEY BUSINESS PARK STOURPORT ROAD, KIDDERMINSTER, DY11 7QL
        Variation Accepted: Operating between Kidderminster Town Hall and Kidderminster Town Hall given service number 2A/2C effective from 01-Sep-2014. To amend Route and Timetable.

Think the 125 is reducing to every 2 hours between Stourbridge and Kidderminster, still hourly or so between Kidderminster and Bridgnorth.

Do you have a source/reasoning for this please Cheese?

The registration document which I was reading last week...

the Kidderminster to Stourbridge part of the 125 is well used.  if any of the 125 is going to be cut to every 2 hours  think it would be more the bridgnorth to Kidderminster section  as it always used every 2 hours

I thought that section of the route carried decent loads at times. If it is being cut back to 2 hourly, It could always provide Diamond or possibly even Hanson's with an opportunity?

I reckon Whittles won't exist in the bus side by this time 2015. I'm going to place odds on them selling out to NXWM, First or Arriva

Arriva where interested in buying the Kr & Rh operation of first the same as NXWM did  . so I do not think they well be interested  and also they run most of the routes around Shropshire that Whittles once did. , and can not see first coming back  in to Kidderminster . nor go ahead as they once owned diamond. Stagecoach might  be the one  it sold too ?

I don't really see anyone other than Rotala/Diamond being interested in Whittle's operation on its own, the bus operations will have shrunk come 1st Sept, none of the bus groups are interested in coaching & Whittle only operate 6 coached on NX work. At last count, the business was loss making, whether the streamlining has any impact remains to be seen.

the none NX coach side  is losing  money as well, some of the holiday tours passangers  have switch to a EYMS  coach .  and the same goes for EYMS tours they have to switch to a whittles  coach ,   so is EYMS losing money themselves   

[D10]

Sadly I could see EYMS closing the Whittles operation down. Being an Independent group, I don't see why they would want to risk Whittles being a financial drain on their operations in Yorkshire. Unless EYMS wanted to sell out as a whole, but they seem quite proud of being Independent still (as per the Channel 5 series).

No, I could see EYMS pull out and then let everyone else fight it out to replace their services, which would mainly be to the benefit of  Diamond. But, to be fair with the whole area being under Rotala control, they might be able to carve out a successful complete local Network of town and interurban services. 

[winston]

The last accounts for Whittle's I saw, they're weren't making a massive loss but that could have since got worse since competition on the 1 & 3 has intensified with Diamond.

Even EYMS profit are fairly small, the last accounts (end of 2012) show it has an operating profit margin of 3.9%, after interest/tax etc the retained profit margin was 2.6% margin. I suspect it may have deteriorated further since then with all the cuts etc in East Yorkshire

The remaining Whittle's bus operation would be better being sold to Rotala, KR isn't really big enough//busy enough to support two operators. At least if Whittle's tendered/commercial routes were brought in to the Diamond network, it would make the network tickets more useful & open up new journey opportunities

[Cedric]

The last accounts for Whittle's I saw, they're weren't making a massive loss but that could have since got worse since competition on the 1 & 3 has intensified with Diamond.

Even EYMS profit are fairly small, the last accounts (end of 2012) show it has an operating profit margin of 3.9%, after interest/tax etc the retained profit margin was 2.6% margin. I suspect it may have deteriorated further since then with all the cuts etc in East Yorkshire

Just out of interest  was Finglands losing money as well ?  and if  so did EYMS sell for that reason ? Whittles have just got the contract to supply the Kidderminster football team with the team coach for the 2014/15 season using the whittles gold coach

[winston]

The last accounts for Whittle's I saw, they're weren't making a massive loss but that could have since got worse since competition on the 1 & 3 has intensified with Diamond.

Even EYMS profit are fairly small, the last accounts (end of 2012) show it has an operating profit margin of 3.9%, after interest/tax etc the retained profit margin was 2.6% margin. I suspect it may have deteriorated further since then with all the cuts etc in East Yorkshire

Just out of interest  was Finglands losing money as well ?  and if  so did EYMS sell for that reason ? Whittles have just got the contract to supply the Kidderminster football team with the team coach for the 2014/15 season using the whittles gold coach

Yes Finglands was loosing money, I believe the sale was down to the losses it was making. Plus not including the buses in the sale to First has helped EYMS to replace step entrance deckers & early low floor single deckers.