Relient

[Ginger66]

Now the strike is in full swing I haven't missed catching regular buses but it as highlighted how heavy we rely on them and when we have one operator dominating 93% of routes it's shows something is wrong as not every area is covered during strikes.

Hopefully somethings can change like an overall of routes so other operating companies can have a fair share of the routes

[Rachvince53]

Now the strike is in full swing I haven't missed catching regular buses but it as highlighted how heavy we rely on them and when we have one operator dominating 93% of routes it's shows something is wrong as not every area is covered during strikes.

Hopefully somethings can change like an overall of routes so other operating companies can have a fair share of the routes

Unfortunately it doesn't work like that as NX are not going to give up viable routes just to stop the virtual monopoly on commercial services. Perhaps if WMPTE had been split up like GMPTE was then we might have genuine competition and not one major dominant operator.  

[j789]

Now the strike is in full swing I haven't missed catching regular buses but it as highlighted how heavy we rely on them and when we have one operator dominating 93% of routes it's shows something is wrong as not every area is covered during strikes.

Hopefully somethings can change like an overall of routes so other operating companies can have a fair share of the routes

What a ridiculous statement. When was the last major bus strike in the West Midlands? Like 20+ years ago. It's hardly a common occurrence.

The vast majority of time, the West Midlands has a very good network of services run mostly by NX. Having one operator here has meant travel cards and fares have traditionally always been cheaper than other similar metropolitan areas with multiple operators. Try living in Worcestershire with the increasingly poor service from multiple operators there - you don't know how lucky you are in the West Midlands.

You no doubt support a franchising system with those views, which would shout from the rooftops 'guaranteed cheap fares' but quickly bury the fact EVERY council tax payer (bus user and non-bus user) would be subsidising it at great cost and EVERYONE would be paying far more for such a system than they do now.

Don't let a once in a generation problem like this strike blind you to the reality - bus travel in the West Midlands is far superior to many other areas in this country. 

[Stu]

Now the strike is in full swing I haven't missed catching regular buses but it as highlighted how heavy we rely on them and when we have one operator dominating 93% of routes it's shows something is wrong as not every area is covered during strikes.

Hopefully somethings can change like an overall of routes so other operating companies can have a fair share of the routes

What a ridiculous statement. When was the last major bus strike in the West Midlands? Like 20+ years ago. It's hardly a common occurrence.

The vast majority of time, the West Midlands has a very good network of services run mostly by NX. Having one operator here has meant travel cards and fares have traditionally always been cheaper than other similar metropolitan areas with multiple operators. Try living in Worcestershire with the increasingly poor service from multiple operators there - you don't know how lucky you are in the West Midlands.

You no doubt support a franchising system with those views, which would shout from the rooftops 'guaranteed cheap fares' but quickly bury the fact EVERY council tax payer (bus user and non-bus user) would be subsidising it at great cost and EVERYONE would be paying far more for such a system than they do now.

Don't let a once in a generation problem like this strike blind you to the reality - bus travel in the West Midlands is far superior to many other areas in this country.

It is my opinion that once the strikes are over and the dust has settled down a bit, the local politicians and unelected bureaucrats at WMCA/TfWM will use this episode as a way to psychologically manipulate the general public into becoming more 'accepting' of the notion of bus franchising.

Their argument will be along the lines of "we shouldn't be beholden to one operator dominating bus services in the region", which to an extent is true, however I don't think that's enough justification to try and force through bus franchising.

For several years now, Andy Street and TfWM have been keen on keeping and developing the current 'partnership model' that is the West Midlands Bus Alliance. It suits them because it means they can keep 'hands off' from actually operating the bus services, leaving them in the hands of private companies to operate as a paid-for public service.

One of the Labour mayoral candidates, Richard Parker, has already announced to the media that he will seek to introduce franchising, and I have been told that Andy Street will also make a similar pledge as part of his re-election campaign next year.

So it is going to happen, whether we like it or not, and no amount of public 'consulting' is going to change that.

Just because London already do it, and Manchester and Liverpool are planning to do so, does that mean that the West Midlands should automatically follow suit?

I can imagine there are a fair few people who would gleefully welcome the dismantling of NX's commercial bus network and see an end to their 'dominance', but you do have to be careful what you wish for.

[Ginger66]

It is my opinion that once the strikes are over and the dust has settled down a bit, the local politicians and unelected bureaucrats at WMCA/TfWM will use this episode as a way to psychologically manipulate the general public into becoming more 'accepting' of the notion of bus franchising.

Their argument will be along the lines of "we shouldn't be beholden to one operator dominating bus services in the region", which to an extent is true, however I don't think that's enough justification to try and force through bus franchising.

For several years now, Andy Street and TfWM have been keen on keeping and developing the current 'partnership model' that is the West Midlands Bus Alliance. It suits them because it means they can keep 'hands off' from actually operating the bus services, leaving them in the hands of private companies to operate as a paid-for public service.

One of the Labour mayoral candidates, Richard Parker, has already announced to the media that he will seek to introduce franchising, and I have been told that Andy Street will also make a similar pledge as part of his re-election campaign next year.

So it is going to happen, whether we like it or not, and no amount of public 'consulting' is going to change that.

Just because London already do it, and Manchester and Liverpool are planning to do so, does that mean that the West Midlands should automatically follow suit?

I can imagine there are a fair few people who would gleefully welcome the dismantling of NX's commercial bus network and see an end to their 'dominance', but you do have to be careful what you wish for.

The West Midlands Bus brand was a good idea but only a handful of routes and agreements need resorted to suit both operating companies on the route 

Hopefully if passengers have returned to sustainable levels where operators are keeping routes rather than getting rid, hopefully if there are routes such as the (4/4M/4H) could be done as a joint operation either using a mix of single and double deckers.

[MW]

I think this is the beginning of demise for West Midlands Travel, and going forward franchising will be pushed to break the monopoly.

*on a side note, I think the drivers should have been protesting for paid breaks and/or a maximum unpaid break such as 45 mins, and not a "pay rise".

[Lukeee]

I have said this from the beginning of the strike talks. In an ideal world all duties would be paid book on to book off

[j789]

I have said this from the beginning of the strike talks. In an ideal world all duties would be paid book on to book off

Very few jobs have paid lunch breaks though so I can't see this being realistic on a large scale. Also, how would split shifts work unless you're suggesting the company should pay drivers an additional 4-5 hours pay for not doing anything.

[Lukeee]

Plenty of coach firms pay like this, split shifts could be put into 3 part duties the way diamond do to avoid so much standing around time, tbh I've not met many drivers that like splits anyway 

[Tony]

Plenty of coach firms pay like this, split shifts could be put into 3 part duties the way diamond do to avoid so much standing around time, tbh I've not met many drivers that like splits anyway

If it was that simple splits would have gone years ago. I don't see how a 3 part duty eliminates splits

[j789]

I've always found that split shifts have an attraction for certain types of drivers, particularly those who live near the garage or a changeover point. Some people like being able to go home for lunch or to see the wife, go shopping, to the bank etc etc and it suits them.

Some drivers also like not having to drive for 8-10 hours straight through too. I never was a fan but they could be useful shifts to swap a duty on if you needed to do something in the daytime that a normal shift wouldn't allow.

[MW]

Do we know roughly how many peak boards there are? The bulk of the boards will be 7AM-7PM.

Theoretically, you could have three types of shifts.

Mornings - 4/5AM till 9/10AM - These would cover early morning runs and the AM peak only runs.

Normals - anytime between 7AM & 7PM

Lates - 3PM till midnight - These would cover PM peak runs and late nights.

I know that's overly simplified for a company with 1500 buses, but the idea would also mean getting rid of this 7hr36 nonsense. Once that's out the window, you'll find drivers are more inclined to actually want to work longer shifts, as it'll mean more pay, rather than wanting to get rid of the shifts that have more driving for the same amount of money.

I disagree that there is an appeal for split shifts. I think the vast majority want to see the back of them.

[Straightlines]

Try living in Worcestershire with the increasingly poor service from multiple operators there - you don't know how lucky you are in the West Midlands.

Don't forget that the poor service in Worcestershire was ultimately as a result of longstanding mismanagement and decline from the one large dominant operator!  Leaving the waste ground to be picked up by other operators.

Ultimately, you are comparing apples and pears as usual but one thing is certain. Each day that this strike goes on is a day closer to the 'increasingly poor' Worcestershire bus network!

[j789]

Don't forget that the poor service in Worcestershire was ultimately as a result of longstanding mismanagement and decline from the one large dominant operator!  Leaving the waste ground to be picked up by other operators.

Ultimately, you are comparing apples and pears as usual but one thing is certain. Each day that this strike goes on is a day closer to the 'increasingly poor' Worcestershire bus network!

Whilst the management does need to accept a certain level of blame for not being innovative or taking more commercial risks in Worcestershire, the principal blame lies with anti-bus county council there who have never really supported bus travel as a genuine alternative to the car - just look at the Worcester park and ride fiasco.

The councils of the West Midlands have been a lot more supportive of their local bus companies than Worcestershire ever was.

[Coventrybususer95]

Wonder if we will see coventry sold off so nx group can concentrate on one area