West midlands bus franchising

[Rachvince53]

All we need to run buses in the Midlands is Transport UK/Abellio, Transdev, RATP, Wellglade and ComfortDelGro and all the main groups will have ran here

Actually Abellio do already run in the West Midlands as they are part of the consortium operating West Midlands Trains and North Western Trains. 

[2900]

Rather than start a new thread thought i,d place my question here, if franchising were to happen in the West Midlands a new livery would be on the cards, London has the iconic red, Manchester gone for a crap yellow, West Midlands  any ideas folks?  a single colour does look smart if done correctly 

[karl724223]

Rather than start a new thread thought i,d place my question here, if franchising were to happen in the West Midlands a new livery would be on the cards, London has the iconic red, Manchester gone for a crap yellow, West Midlands  any ideas folks?  a single colour does look smart if done correctly

The iconic wmpte blue n cream

[Stu]

Rather than start a new thread thought i,d place my question here, if franchising were to happen in the West Midlands a new livery would be on the cards, London has the iconic red, Manchester gone for a crap yellow, West Midlands  any ideas folks?  a single colour does look smart if done correctly

They have one already...

[Tony]

I was sampling Manchester yesterday, there's a lot of hard work to do up there for them to succeed, huge gaps in services, drivers not trained on ticket machines so giving everyone free rides, buses looking like some of the worst independants are running them. The picture was running on the 163 route which should be TfGM spec doubles. The doubles on there were ex London Scanias, which although refurbished, & converted to single door and repainted yellow do not meet the spec that was in the tender documents I read. The best routes I saw were the Diamond ones although one solo was on the 74 with the service on A4 paper in the windscreen http://wmbusphotos.com/Rotala/20885.html

[Rachvince53]

I was sampling Manchester yesterday, there's a lot of hard work to do up there for them to succeed, huge gaps in services, drivers not trained on ticket machines so giving everyone free rides, buses looking like some of the worst independants are running them. The picture was running on the 163 route which should be TfGM spec doubles. The doubles on there were ex London Scanias, which although refurbished, & converted to single door and repainted yellow do not meet the spec that was in the tender documents I read. The best routes I saw were the Diamond ones although one solo was on the 74 with the service on A4 paper in the windscreen http://wmbusphotos.com/Rotala/20885.html

True. Also Go North West have had to hire in buses from across the country due to having insufficient vehicles of their own.

[winston]

True. Also Go North West have had to hire in buses from across the country due to having insufficient vehicles of their own.

And drivers, Go North West have at least 85 drivers on loan from other Go-Ahead subsidiaries.

This is what happens when one operator moves in to a depot & another out overnight, it's never going to work no matter how much pre-planning has been done.

[Tony]

True. Also Go North West have had to hire in buses from across the country due to having insufficient vehicles of their own.

What's a bit ironic is the TfGM spec for vehicles was, apart from doors mostly TfL spec for CCTV  seats etc, yet they don't have any Go-Ahead London vehicles on hire. I photographed Go North East, Metrobus & Go South from both Swindon & Poole

[winston]

What's a bit ironic is the TfGM spec for vehicles was, apart from doors mostly TfL spec for CCTV  seats etc, yet they don't have any Go-Ahead London vehicles on hire. I photographed Go North East, Metrobus & Go South from both Swindon & Poole

GNW have taken quite a few ex London E400's & Volvo  B9TL's from London & coverted them to single door etc.

[Tony]

GNW have taken quite a few ex London E400's & Volvo  B9TL's from London & converted them to single door etc.

And E200s and Scania Omnicitys, although none seem to have the two wheelchair spaces the tender spec said refurbs should have

[winston]

And E200s and Scania Omnicitys, although none seem to have the two wheelchair spaces the tender spec said refurbs should have

I'm not sure to what degree all the ex London buses were refurbished, do they have the TfGM Bee Network interiors?

[Tony]

I'm not sure to what degree all the ex London buses were refurbished, do they have the TfGM Bee Network interiors?

I didn't look that closely, the 3 vehicles I travelled on yesterday were
1) new electric on the 35, bus great, driver having lots of problems with the ticket machine due to bad internet connection.
2) former Diamond StreetDeck on the 8 no problems
3) new electric on the 471, driver not yet trained on ticket machine so everyone got a free ride.

I had a look through the windows of one of the Omnicities on the 163 and could see only 1 wheelchair space, so certainly not full TfGM spec

[Tony]

I wanted photographs of the Scanias, but when I got to Bury I didn't see one for 45 minutes which is pretty awful for a 12 minute frequency service.

Bus times shows this was happening at various times through the day
https://bustimes.org/services/163-piccadilly-gardens-bury-interchange/vehicles?date=2023-09-26

Also when travelling on the 8 from Salford to Bolton there were large gaps in the service in the opposite direction, Bustime shows gaps up to 40 minutes again on a 12 min frequency service
https://bustimes.org/services/8-shudehill-interchange-bolton-interchange/vehicles?date=2023-09-26

I didn't see any bad traffic along the routes I was travelling on so looks like a combination of a shortage of drivers, and drivers new to the route struggling to keep time.

I also went onto the Vantage routes at Pendleton to photograph the ex First vehicles, but didn't see a single bus for the 30 minutes I was stood there in either direction. Each is supposed to be every 15 minutes so should have seen 10 buses! Bus times shows gaps of up to 74 minutes in the 15 minute frequency V2.

If bustimes is to be believed today a new electric was on there this morning peak which would be interesting on guided section!

[winston]

I wanted photographs of the Scanias, but when I got to Bury I didn't see one for 45 minutes which is pretty awful for a 12 minute frequency service.

Bus times shows this was happening at various times through the day
https://bustimes.org/services/163-piccadilly-gardens-bury-interchange/vehicles?date=2023-09-26

Also when travelling on the 8 from Salford to Bolton there were large gaps in the service in the opposite direction, Bustime shows gaps up to 40 minutes again on a 12 min frequency service
https://bustimes.org/services/8-shudehill-interchange-bolton-interchange/vehicles?date=2023-09-26

I didn't see any bad traffic along the routes I was travelling on so looks like a combination of a shortage of drivers, and drivers new to the route struggling to keep time.

I also went onto the Vantage routes at Pendleton to photograph the ex First vehicles, but didn't see a single bus for the 30 minutes I was stood there in either direction. Each is supposed to be every 15 minutes so should have seen 10 buses! Bus times shows gaps of up to 74 minutes in the 15 minute frequency V2.

If bustimes is to be believed today a new electric was on there this morning peak which would be interesting on guided section!

There shouldn't be any issues with the 163, as its an existing GNW service, operated from the existing GNW Heywood depot.

[Tony]

There shouldn't be any issues with the 163, as its an existing GNW service, operated from the existing GNW Heywood depot.

There was plenty after I realised I hadn't photographed a Scania after standing in Bury for 30 minutes I looked on Bustimes map to see what was happening and almost every bus on the route was heading Manchester to Bury with no buses between Bury & Middleton. Looking at the map now, there's no buses either direction between Middleton & Manchester!