NXWM service changes 15th Nov

[Sh4318]

I'm going off the fact that is you were a bus company with a route that made healthy profits would you then go and withdraw it & tag bits on to other routes. The tagging bits on to other routes is usually designed to continue to provide a service to those areas but by stripping out the costs of providing a designated service such as the 444.

Your looking at the changes from your own point of view and how they will affect you, there may well be far more people in the Warley area set to benefit form the changes. Loading data will have been analysed before the changes & routing were approved.

I guess the travelling public will vote with their feet come Monday, it will be interesting to see how they are / aren't accepted

I'm trying to make the exact opposite point with the 289. All I know is there will be a lot of complaints because a lot of useful links have been cut off

One thing I find irritating is the fact that 90% of the time, we aren't given any actual reasons from NX or Centro as to why the changes are taking place.

Having said this, we all probably know the reasons and I can't say I ever expect to get any; they have no obligation to give reasons, although this doesn't mean they shouldn't!

There was no reason for the 444 withdrawal, and none for the 53, the 46 really didn't mean explaining. I don't think I'd be so angry if they at least explained it, for all I know, profit is probably the reason, but the withdrawal of the 289 then reintroduce makes me think differently

[r700a]

One thing I find irritating is the fact that 90% of the time, we aren't given any actual reasons from NX or Centro as to why the changes are taking place.

Having said this, we all probably know the reasons and I can't say I ever expect to get any; they have no obligation to give reasons, although this doesn't mean they shouldn't!

[winston]

There was no reason for the 444 withdrawal, and none for the 53, the 46 really didn't mean explaining. I don't think I'd be so angry if they at least explained it, for all I know, profit is probably the reason, but the withdrawal of the 289 then reintroduce makes me think differently

NX is a commercial business that has to make a profit, has shareholders to answer to and has to try & grow the turnover/profits annually to please the City (London Stock Exchange) etc. There will be reasons for the withdrawal of the 444, 53 & changes to others services and most of those reasons are likely to centre around them not operating profitably or a profitable as they could be, not operating efficiently in present form, changes in travelling patterns, congestion & unreliability etc. The changes are ultimately designed to improve the fortunes for NX's business, that is the harsh reality. The are other external factors such as political pressures that may have forced NX's hand with re-introducing part of the 289, local campaign groups / MP's / other stakeholders etc Similar to the 297 being re-instated back in to Stickley Estate for 6 months on a use it or loose it basis

Centro are the ones responsible for providing / funding socially necessary routes than don't carry sufficient passengers number / generate enough revenue to cover the operating costs.

[Sh4318]

NX is a commercial business that has to make a profit, has shareholders to answer to and has to try & grow the turnover/profits annually to please the City (London Stock Exchange) etc. There will be reasons for the withdrawal of the 444, 53 & changes to others services and most of those reasons are likely to centre around them not operating profitably or a profitable as they could be, not operating efficiently in present form, changes in travelling patterns, congestion & unreliability etc. The changes are ultimately designed to improve the fortunes for NX's business, that is the harsh reality. The are other external factors such as political pressures that may have forced NX's hand with re-introducing part of the 289, local campaign groups / MP's / other stakeholders etc Similar to the 297 being re-instated back in to Stickley Estate for 6 months on a use it or loose it basis

Centro are the ones responsible for providing / funding socially necessary routes than don't carry sufficient passengers number / generate enough revenue to cover the operating costs.

I just wanted to make my point, I have now, I understand yours, you clearly have more knowledge of the industry than I do. I respect your knowledge Winston. I've emailed NX asking for their reasons behind these withdrawals, I doubt I'll get an answer, but I'd really like an explanation

[winston]

I just wanted to make my point, I have now, I understand yours, you clearly have more knowledge of the industry than I do. I respect your knowledge Winston. I've emailed NX asking for their reasons behind these withdrawals, I doubt I'll get an answer, but I'd really like an explanation

I get that you're angry how the changes will effect you directly, and we've actually had a good debate with a big difference of opinion without it turning in to an argument, as it should be on here!

I don't know everything and I'm happy to be proven wrong if the changes do inconvenience the majority & only benefit the minority, I would hope that NX rectify the changes promptly if that is the case. I'm just pointing out that there is a much bigger picture to consider when changes are made.

[Eric Shaw]

The 73 timetable is now available and still shows Acocks Green as the garage for lost property.

[2206]

The 73 timetable is now available and still shows Acocks Green as the garage for lost property.

It shows its moved stops to the Priory Queensway to interworck with the 70
and the BY 55 still shows BC for lost property and hasn't been at BC for a couple of years now

[Westy]

NX is a commercial business that has to make a profit, has shareholders to answer to and has to try & grow the turnover/profits annually to please the City (London Stock Exchange) etc. There will be reasons for the withdrawal of the 444, 53 & changes to others services and most of those reasons are likely to centre around them not operating profitably or a profitable as they could be, not operating efficiently in present form, changes in travelling patterns, congestion & unreliability etc. The changes are ultimately designed to improve the fortunes for NX's business, that is the harsh reality. The are other external factors such as political pressures that may have forced NX's hand with re-introducing part of the 289, local campaign groups / MP's / other stakeholders etc Similar to the 297 being re-instated back in to Stickley Estate for 6 months on a use it or loose it basis

Centro are the ones responsible for providing / funding socially necessary routes than don't carry sufficient passengers number / generate enough revenue to cover the operating costs.

Regarding the reliability issue, it's been stated several times on here about the Walsall to Wolverhampton 89 route.

At the time of the 2010 North Walsall review, it was the 560 Wolves to Bloxwich & the 346 & 348 Bloxwich, Pelsall to Walsall, which were joined into the 20 min frequency 908, then when the Wolves & West Walsall review came along, it was changed to the half hourly 89, citing reliability issues.

3 or 4 years down the line, it is still running late, according to posts on here.

Why isn't NX doing anything about that route, or aren't the reliability issues severe enough to act?

[Trident 4609]

Tbh, it makes it worse when the 89 gets caught up in the same traffic as the 59/69 on the Lichfield Rd then further down on Wednesfield Rd in Heath Town. Quite regulary, there are two together.

Also, Despite no publicity, a fair few passengers on the earlier Sunday trips on the 59 (WN) this morning.

[Stuharris 6360]

What irritates me is that they only consult people at the time of a bus review. Surely any changes that as classed as being more than minor ones, should be consulted on.

I know i talk about London a lot, but TFL do consult with people when they are going to alter routes, surely it wouldn't be difficult for this to happen within the West Midlands.   

How many people will turn up at there bus stops tomorrow to find that there bus service has changed and they don't know about it!

[winston]

What irritates me is that they only consult people at the time of a bus review. Surely any changes that as classed as being more than minor ones, should be consulted on.

I know i talk about London a lot, but TFL do consult with people when they are going to alter routes, surely it wouldn't be difficult for this to happen within the West Midlands.   

How many people will turn up at there bus stops tomorrow to find that there bus service has changed and they don't know about it!

TFL are not a commercial business

[Stuharris 6360]

TFL are not a commercial business

That is true @Winston , but surely even a commercial business has a duty to consult with its customers. NEs attitude (and they are not the only ones) is that we are going to change route X and if you don't like it, Tough! Is that the way you should treat your customers?

[winston]

That is true @Winston , but surely even a commercial business has a duty to consult with its customers. NEs attitude (and they are not the only ones) is that we are going to change route X and if you don't like it, Tough! Is that the way you should treat your customers?

TFL are more on a par with Centro (on a smaller scale)

They are well within their right to change a commercial service as they see fit, if the travel public don't like the changes they will vote with their feet / complaints will sky rocket, if NX have got it wrong they will be left red faced. They don't have a duty to consult, only inform of changes in plenty of time, so those impacted by the service changes can make alternative arrangements worst case scenario (which in this instance appears to have been left to the last minute for whatever reason).

[Stu]

What irritates me is that they only consult people at the time of a bus review. Surely any changes that as classed as being more than minor ones, should be consulted on.

I know i talk about London a lot, but TFL do consult with people when they are going to alter routes, surely it wouldn't be difficult for this to happen within the West Midlands.   

How many people will turn up at there bus stops tomorrow to find that there bus service has changed and they don't know about it!

I agree that the changes have been publicised at such short notice that it has been near impossible to sufficiently inform passengers adequately, already today I witnessed and had to inform a passenger on the 1 that it no longer went to Broad Street, and was terminating at Morrisons at Five Ways.

However, I do recall that there was a public consultation that took place earlier this year with regards to bus services in Dudley and Sandwell, which were well publicised at the time, so anyone who failed to offer their opinion, really shouldn't be moaning about the changes that have taken place.

And as we have seen previously, the number of people who have signed petitions after such changes have taken place do not normally add up to the number of passengers who use the services in question! Having said that, NX did quite quickly reverse the change made to the 31 last year when it was removed from Olton Boulevard East and the top part of Gospel Lane in Acocks Green, so it can and does happen.

[Stuharris 6360]

I agree that the changes have been publicised at such short notice that it has been near impossible to sufficiently inform passengers adequately, already today I witnessed and had to inform a passenger on the 1 that it no longer went to Broad Street, and was terminating at Morrisons at Five Ways.

However, I do recall that there was a public consultation that took place earlier this year with regards to bus services in Dudley and Sandwell, which were well publicised at the time, so anyone who failed to offer their opinion, really shouldn't be moaning about the changes that have taken place.

And as we have seen previously, the number of people who have signed petitions after such changes have taken place do not normally add up to the number of passengers who use the services in question! Having said that, NX did quite quickly reverse the change made to the 31 last year when it was removed from Olton Boulevard East and the top part of Gospel Lane in Acocks Green, so it can and does happen.

@Stu , these changes are not to do with the Dudley/Sandwell bus review, these changes are now due next year.

Sadly this particular time, we have seen that the changes have not been well publicised with the Network West Midland site not having timetables for some services until the latter end of this week.