WILL ARRIVA EXPAND IN THE WEST MIDLANDS?

[andy]

I doubt Arriva would be allowed to have Leicester or anything in the Potteries if by some bizarre twist that was on the list?

[Discodave]

Maybe Arriva could take over Rotala as they did TGM-ie retain it as a smaller subsidary group. TGM-like Rotala-didnt make huge profits etc and there would be no CC/MMC/OFT issues. Dont forget also that first may sell Midland Red and Arriva could well wish to buy this. Also, dont forget Stagecoach. I imagine that they wouldnt mind a share of the WM action although acquisition of Rotala would raise the whole Preston issue again.

Or the same way as Arriva have retaining the Wardles brand and are running it as a seperate business within Arriva group. Yes there will be another round of First Group disposals / closures etc. FMR has rarely featured on any of the potential disposal lists that I've seen online, I think Worcester & Hereford at least makes good returns, but Kidderminster & Redditch garages may not be the most profitable. Generally it's always Devon & Cornwall, Northampton, Scotland East, London, & parts of East Anglia / Essex which keep cropping up.

I think you could rule out Stagecoach being interested in Rotala, they have had more than enough opportunities to takeover BCC / Pete's Travel prior to Go-Ahead acquisitions & then again when Go-ahead wanted out & sold to Rotala. Stagecoach have / will always have its sights set on the NXWM bus business, they lost out to the Employee buyout bid for WMT even though they offered more money & more recently tried to do a side deal with the Cosmen Family to buy NX group UK bus business when NX group was sinking under a mountain of debt. Stagecoach then tried again unsuccessfully to go it alone & takeover the entire NX group after the CVC / Cosmen bid collapsed due to CVC pulling out, they must have got quite close to pulling it off due to NXWM suspending NX repaints and instead painting vehicles allover white. Stagecoach are only interested in the star prize i.e. NXWM

Stagecoach have a very tidy fleet and run some good services espically in the south west if NXWM were bought out I would not see it being bought as on big concern but broken up (again the competition and mmc probs) stagecoach like others are big and like preston be forced to sell off other areas.  Not all of the nxwm network makes money I am no expert but the good bits like birmngham and coventry stagecoach may have but the black country area services (local area except a few) maybe arriva could expand that way taking up walsall, west brom, wolverhampton and pensnett

[winston]

Maybe Arriva could take over Rotala as they did TGM-ie retain it as a smaller subsidary group. TGM-like Rotala-didnt make huge profits etc and there would be no CC/MMC/OFT issues. Dont forget also that first may sell Midland Red and Arriva could well wish to buy this. Also, dont forget Stagecoach. I imagine that they wouldnt mind a share of the WM action although acquisition of Rotala would raise the whole Preston issue again.

Or the same way as Arriva have retaining the Wardles brand and are running it as a seperate business within Arriva group. Yes there will be another round of First Group disposals / closures etc. FMR has rarely featured on any of the potential disposal lists that I've seen online, I think Worcester & Hereford at least makes good returns, but Kidderminster & Redditch garages may not be the most profitable. Generally it's always Devon & Cornwall, Northampton, Scotland East, London, & parts of East Anglia / Essex which keep cropping up.

I think you could rule out Stagecoach being interested in Rotala, they have had more than enough opportunities to takeover BCC / Pete's Travel prior to Go-Ahead acquisitions & then again when Go-ahead wanted out & sold to Rotala. Stagecoach have / will always have its sights set on the NXWM bus business, they lost out to the Employee buyout bid for WMT even though they offered more money & more recently tried to do a side deal with the Cosmen Family to buy NX group UK bus business when NX group was sinking under a mountain of debt. Stagecoach then tried again unsuccessfully to go it alone & takeover the entire NX group after the CVC / Cosmen bid collapsed due to CVC pulling out, they must have got quite close to pulling it off due to NXWM suspending NX repaints and instead painting vehicles allover white. Stagecoach are only interested in the star prize i.e. NXWM

Stagecoach have a very tidy fleet and run some good services espically in the south west if NXWM were bought out I would not see it being bought as on big concern but broken up (again the competition and mmc probs) stagecoach like others are big and like preston be forced to sell off other areas.  Not all of the nxwm network makes money I am no expert but the good bits like birmngham and coventry stagecoach may have but the black country area services (local area except a few) maybe arriva could expand that way taking up walsall, west brom, wolverhampton and pensnett

NX Group aren't going to sell NXWM as it's a big contributor to group profits, it was once one of the most profitable bus companies in the UK with a 20%+ profit margin, so that's a non starter.
If NX continue to invest in new vehicles, refurbishment of existing, improve standard of service offered and quality & cleanliness of vehicles, they should hopefully grow patronage and earn NX even better returns on their investment.

As I see it NX group could potentially merge with either First Group or Go-Ahead in the UK, with little/if any overlap of services or neighbouring bus operations. There may competition concerns in the US where First & NX are No1 & No2 biggest school bus operators respectively. Any deal with either Arriva or Stagecoach would raise interest from the MMC and disposals/undertakings would not doubt be required.

There is always the potential that NX group & other UK business could attract interest from European Transport Groups such as Ned Railways (Abellio), RATP or Transdev

NX group look set to set up coach operations in Germany under the banner of Deutsche Express

[Nathan4775]

Arriva already operate into the West Midlands to an Extent you got service;

604 -Kingstanding - Mere Green
Dudley Routes
110/112/116 - 110 (Tamworth) 112 (Burton - on - Trent) 116 (Tamworth Via Kingsbury)

[winston]

Arriva already operate into the West Midlands to an Extent you got service;

604 -Kingstanding - Mere Green
Dudley Routes
110/112/116 - 110 (Tamworth) 112 (Burton - on - Trent) 116 (Tamworth Via Kingsbury)

That's not what was being discussed, it is whether Arriva are planning to launch competitive services against NXWM using the new tendered services/West Bromwich garage as a platform to expand in traditional NX territory

[Lukeee]

Also the 112 only operates as far as lichfield. Just saying  :).

[Bob]

I wonder what routes they could compete on? maybe the 51 or something or the 79 :-)

[Tomjusttom]

I have heared that Arriva have put in for a massive batch of tenders for the area. Wonder if Tamwortth will supply some B6s or will we see more E200s?

[winston]

I have heared that Arriva have put in for a massive batch of tenders for the area. Wonder if Tamwortth will supply some B6s or will we see more E200s?

Don't understand why Arriva are going for tenders, there is little profit in them for larger operators. Unless they are trying to weaken Rotala or other sizeable independents and force them to sell out to Arriva. Sounds as though things are developing behind closed doors.....

[MW]

I have heared that Arriva have put in for a massive batch of tenders for the area. Wonder if Tamwortth will supply some B6s or will we see more E200s?

Don't understand why Arriva are going for tenders, there is little profit in them for larger operators. Unless they are trying to weaken Rotala or other sizeable independents and force them to sell out to Arriva. Sounds as though things are developing behind closed doors.....

Obviously to create a presence in the Black Country. It's marketing. They're letting people know who they are, so when the expand, they'll be a familiar operator, unlike Joes and other operators popping out of nowhere. It does also make Rotala squirm I'd imagine as it's cutting off a key source of their revenue, as they're, as we know, based more on Centro work, rather than commercial.

If Arriva are going for a load again for the next round, Rotala will have no option to either sell out, become a loss and go out of business, or start some commercial work, in my opinion.

[Bob]

I wonder what routes theyve tendered for? hmmmmmmm

[Discodave]

Would be ironic if one was the 56A as arriva would be back to its old stomping ground

[Bob]

is that the once a day service?

[Jack Grove]

No, that's the X56.

[John]

is that the once a day service?

The 56A is the Sunday version of the 56, I think it covers some of the roads that the 935 would serve any other day around Streetly.