General Metro Thread

[uniquicity]

The CAF trams are rubbish anyway, the seats are like rocks and there's barely enough. I as many people would rather have the T69's back!

Yes! Let's go back to having teams with 25% less capacity, oh and having 16 (also unreliable) trams to run a 15 tram peak service

[BK63 YWP]

I'm glad they are getting new trams for the new extension @V89MOA the extension is needed from wednesbury to Brierley Hill as the traffic is becoming a nightmare as a local I would love in the future for an extension to Kingswinford or womborne  (There is an old railway line that used to run by Bromley lane. I know I have said TfWM have wasted some money on some pointless changes (still don't think the bus livery will stay as diamond aren't too happy with the idea but still giving it a whirl). Why is TfWM doing this when you have cities like Greater Manchester with stagecoach, first, northern and metro link using their own liveries regardless that its a combined authority

[V89MOA]

Yes! Let's go back to having teams with 25% less capacity, oh and having 16 (also unreliable) trams to run a 15 tram peak service

Most of the paying public don't generally accept standing room as capacity (yes I know technically it is). The T69 had more seats per vehicle than the Urbos 3 and that is what counts with most people, and as Jack said they were far comfier! A lesson west midlands failway will learn when the 323s are replaced with metro style rubbish and the complaints start rolling in.

[V89MOA]

I'm glad they are getting new trams for the new extension @V89MOA the extension is needed from wednesbury to Brierley Hill as the traffic is becoming a nightmare as a local I would love in the future for an extension to Kingswinford or womborne  (There is an old railway line that used to run by Bromley lane. I know I have said TfWM have wasted some money on some pointless changes (still don't think the bus livery will stay as diamond aren't too happy with the idea but still giving it a whirl). Why is TfWM doing this when you have cities like Greater Manchester with stagecoach, first, northern and metro link using their own liveries regardless that its a combined authority

Traffic is worse than ever in Birmingham but they are doing sod all about it. If they spent half as much extra on Bus infrastructure in Birmingham as they do on these tram extensions I genuinely wouldn't complain but it's an insult to the people of Birmingham that buses are pushed aside for these white elephants. Heck the powers that be couldn't even come up with a solution to the layout at the QE hospital so instead it loses public transport links!

[2206]

Most of the paying public don't generally accept standing room as capacity (yes I know technically it is). The T69 had more seats per vehicle than the Urbos 3 and that is what counts with most people, and as Jack said they were far comfier! A lesson west midlands failway will learn when the 323s are replaced with metro style rubbish and the complaints start rolling in.

On the 11 and 55/94 the majority of people will actually fill 1 bus making it overcrowded with lots of people standing, while there are another 2 empty buses right behind. Some people don't like having to stand, but there are clearly plenty who are willing to stand.

[V89MOA]

On the 11 and 55/94 the majority of people will actually fill 1 bus making it overcrowded with lots of people standing, while there are another 2 empty buses right behind. Some people don't like having to stand, but there are clearly plenty who are willing to stand.

A lot of the time though if you try and get the empty one they will just drive straight past and point to the one in front. Most people don't want to take the chance of being stranded if they have already waited so just accept it, there's a difference between choosing to do something and being willing to do it.

[Jack]

Most of the paying public don't generally accept standing room as capacity (yes I know technically it is). The T69 had more seats per vehicle than the Urbos 3 and that is what counts with most people, and as Jack said they were far comfier! A lesson west midlands failway will learn when the 323s are replaced with metro style rubbish and the complaints start rolling in.

Thank you! Some sense at last!

Traffic is worse than ever in Birmingham but they are doing sod all about it. If they spent half as much extra on Bus infrastructure in Birmingham as they do on these tram extensions I genuinely wouldn't complain but it's an insult to the people of Birmingham that buses are pushed aside for these white elephants. Heck the powers that be couldn't even come up with a solution to the layout at the QE hospital so instead it loses public transport links!

I agree, bloody tram means bus users are shoved where ever possible. The QE is like a pit stop for those taxis. Cough TfWM, everything is about the bloody metro.

[2206]

A lot of the time though if you try and get the empty one they will just drive straight past and point to the one in front. Most people don't want to take the chance of being stranded if they have already waited so just accept it, there's a difference between choosing to do something and being willing to do it.

I agree sometimes if you choose to try and stop the one behind some of the time they will just straight past you pointing and waving at the bus infront.
But even when 2 55's arrived in the City Centre together at exactly the same time and the first one drove straight past onto the X12/X70 stand, most the people waiting all went following each other walking towards that one rather than the one that pulled up behind it at exactly the same time, some people clearly don't mind it. The one at the front left with a standing load and the one at the back only a few passengers onboard.
Though at the same time there are plenty that do mind it and would prefer to wait for the next one or not to have to do it (but get on because the one at the back often just drives past) I personally would usually rather wait for the next one than squash myself into an overcrowded bus.

[V89MOA]

I agree sometimes if you choose to try and stop the some of the time they will just straight past you pointing and waving at the bus infront.
But even when 2 55's arrived in the City Centre together at exactly the same time and the first one drove straight past onto the X12/X70 stand, the passengers all went following each other walking towards that one rather than the one that pulled up behind it at exactly the same time, some people clearly don't mind it. The one at the front left with a standing load and the one at the back only a few passengers onboard.
Though at the same time there are plenty that do mind it and would prefer to wait for the next one or not to have to do it (but get on because the one at the back often just drives past) I personally would usually rather wait for the next one than squash myself into an overcrowded bus.

Again though that is probably habit, when two buses are in on one of those stands in town the one behind will usually tell you to wait while they change driver or signal at you through the windscreen not to get on, so out of habit most people just pounce for the one in front. I am the same as you, I will always try and choose the empty one but most of the time the driver's make it impossible and there is nothing we can do about it, most people just go for the safest option of getting home, doesn't mean they are happy about it.

Anyway I'm shutting up before this thread goes completely off topic 😂

[V89MOA]

Tram 36 now has batteries, old livery though.

[MW]

You guys aren't seeing it from the drivers point of view. On a busy service like the 11, say two buses arrive in Harborne on the 11C for example. If I'm driving the bus behind and I can see that there's a crowd and if I can tell that they'll all fit on the bus, I'll hang back and unload. I would point people boarding to the bus in front. If I let a few one then the entire crowd will split and start heading for my
emptier bus.

The reason I do this is once I'm done at this stop, I can depart before the bus in front who's most likely still loading. The full bus is likely to stop at most stops now between say Harborne and Bearwood due to people wanting to come off. Me in front, I can basically pave the way for the other bus. And I'll be faster because I've not got to constantly stop due to having little to no passengers.

If I had waited with the other bus and began loading passengers, we would both be slow and have no chance to get back on time.

Does that make sense? @V89MOA @2206

[Kevin]

Most of the paying public don't generally accept standing room as capacity (yes I know technically it is). The T69 had more seats per vehicle than the Urbos 3 and that is what counts with most people, and as Jack said they were far comfier! A lesson west midlands failway will learn when the 323s are replaced with metro style rubbish and the complaints start rolling in.

I'd argue against that. For a metro / tram style service standing is generally regarded (worldwide) as the norm. Would you say the Underground in London would be better off with normal train seating?

[Tony]

I'd argue against that. For a metro / tram style service standing is generally regarded (worldwide) as the norm. Would you say the Underground in London would be better off with normal train seating?

I agree with you Kevin

On this sort of work you provide enough seats for off-peak loading, but enough Capacity for peak loading. With the cross city going 6 car there will be more than enough seats off-peak.

Same with the trams. Off-peak it is not often there's more passengers than seats. That's not to say people aren't standing, because some prefer to do that rather than sit next to someone.

[V89MOA]

I'd argue against that. For a metro / tram style service standing is generally regarded (worldwide) as the norm. Would you say the Underground in London would be better off with normal train seating?

No comparison really, the underground is a properly coordinated network which has been running at maximum capacity for many years with trains up to every 90 seconds on most lines during the peak, they have no choice as they cannot physically fit anymore vehicles onto the network without the issue of bunching becoming uncontrollable. The cross city line is currently only running every 10 minutes, and the metro every 6 at peaks so there is no excuse.

You guys aren't seeing it from the drivers point of view. On a busy service like the 11, say two buses arrive in Harborne on the 11C for example. If I'm driving the bus behind and I can see that there's a crowd and if I can tell that they'll all fit on the bus, I'll hang back and unload. I would point people boarding to the bus in front. If I let a few one then the entire crowd will split and start heading for my
emptier bus.

The reason I do this is once I'm done at this stop, I can depart before the bus in front who's most likely still loading. The full bus is likely to stop at most stops now between say Harborne and Bearwood due to people wanting to come off. Me in front, I can basically pave the way for the other bus. And I'll be faster because I've not got to constantly stop due to having little to no passengers.

If I had waited with the other bus and began loading passengers, we would both be slow and have no chance to get back on time.

Does that make sense? @V89MOA @2206

I understand why you'd do it but the late one Infront will then be made even later anyway because he's got a full bus and is pretty much guaranteed to stop at every stop for the next 3 miles, while falling further behind in the traffic jams and having no hope of making time back without adjustment (which doesn't seem to happen as much these days anyway).

This is what annoys me, in any other commercial industry keeping the customer happy is generally the number 1 priority, if the customer isn't happy then something has gone wrong with the product/service, but for some reason in transport it tends to just be keeping profit margins maximized at all costs...

[uniquicity]

Tram 36 now has battery power