New Deliveries / New Livery & Branding Discussion

[Stuharris 6360]

Plus of course, would you really tell your competitors what you are up to?

[The Real 4778]

Plus of course, would you really tell your competitors what you are up to?

Of course not!

We certainly don't - do people think this is communist Russia!

[winston]

With localism rampant there was a leak/comment in the press the DfT might be on borrowed time!
Amazing how in other parts of the country operators in competitive situations have route led investment. An example is Trent buying new vehicles for the Red Arrow. Operators even run demonstrators to get feedback from customers and staff before deciding what to buy.

Unless anyone knows differently, those Red Arrow coaches are the only new vehicles Trent has on order thus far this year. They also haven't been ordering many new vehicles each of the last few years either.

National Express didn't state a list of routes and cities they were investing in for their customers by buying new vehicles and also stating those that would receive cascaded vehicles.
Name another company that has bought new vehicles for routes only to cascade them on a year later wasting money on the branding that is going to thrown in the bin as is going to happen on the 900/957.

NX don't need to disclose their plans, six/twelve months in advance,  they are announcing their investment on a route by route basis to good PR effect.

The new Platinum spec buses for the 900/957 are completely different to existing branded buses, they will be moved on to other routes to the benefit of passengers elsewhere

Debate i like it. Keep it coming.

I agree, makes a refreshing change....

[Tony]

National Express didn't state a list of routes and cities they were investing in for their customers by buying new vehicles and also stating those that would receive cascaded vehicles.
Name another company that has bought new vehicles for routes only to cascade them on a year later wasting money on the branding that is going to thrown in the bin as is going to happen on the 900/957.

And for a specific example of another operator spending a lot more money than NX on Vinyls that last for two years

Reading Buses..............

Gas Powered 423-429 - delivered in April 2014 in Pink - repainted in Generic livery (423) and Leopard livery (424-429) - before even entering service in June 2014

Gas Powered 430/431 - delivered in March 2014 - in Lime Green - repainted in PINK in July 2014

Gas Powered 416/417 - entered service in May 2013 -in Scarlet Red - repainted in PINK in July 2014 !

Note how 4 buses which hadn't even entered service were repainted out of PINK in June 2014 only for 4 identical vehicles (2 just over a year old, and two 4-month's old) were painted in the same pink livery in July (only a month later)

seeing as you asked!

[Stuharris 6360]

In reality, i doubt that branding is all that expensive anyway, it is just the damage to paint work when it is removed.

To me a route like the 900, (which services Birmingham Airport), should have the best buses possible. It will possibly be some visitors first sight of a Birmingham bus, do you really want them to be given a bad impression!!

[Ronnoc]

In reality, i doubt that branding is all that expensive anyway, it is just the damage to paint work when it is removed.

To me a route like the 900, (which services Birmingham Airport), should have the best buses possible. It will possibly be some visitors first sight of a Birmingham bus, do you really want them to be given a bad impression!!

Good point. I am actually really happy about Platinum as it will serve good to visitors and give a good impression of buses rather then just getting a bus with rubbish livery.

[monkeyjoe]

In reality, i doubt that branding is all that expensive anyway, it is just the damage to paint work when it is removed.

To me a route like the 900, (which services Birmingham Airport), should have the best buses possible. It will possibly be some visitors first sight of a Birmingham bus, do you really want them to be given a bad impression!!

Let's hope they don't get on the 97 by mistake. lol.

[JoNi]

From my recollection Trent have introduced new vehicles on Rainbow/rapid one, Skylink, Rushcliffe Greens, H1, before that on Threes and i4.
The Sixes north of Derby amongst other routes have benefited from cascaded vehicles fully refurbished to meet the needs of a specific route and fitted with power points for mobile phones making them as good as new.
Trent is less than a tenth of the size of NXWM, so you would expect relative smaller investment levels.
I've never seen a Trent bus with paint peeling and large areas of bare metal, or different seat moquette in the same vehicle whatever it's age and their standards mean in all likelihood I never will.

[Ronnoc]

Let's hope they don't get on the 97 by mistake. lol.

The airport should probably support Platinum.

[Tony]

From my recollection Trent have introduced new vehicles on Rainbow/rapid one, Skylink, Rushcliffe Greens, H1, before that on Threes and i4.
The Sixes north of Derby amongst other routes have benefited from cascaded vehicles fully refurbished to meet the needs of a specific route and fitted with power points for mobile phones making them as good as new.
Trent is less than a tenth of the size of NXWM, so you would expect relative smaller investment levels.
I've never seen a Trent bus with paint peeling and large areas of bare metal, or different seat moquette in the same vehicle whatever it's age and their standards mean in all likelihood I never will.

I presume you haven't ever looked too closely at the Notts & Derby Subsiduary then!  Or is it OK just to put all your nails under a different name. The B10Bs and Olympians are not in their prime regularly have odd panels & odd seats in them

[Stuharris 6360]

From my recollection Trent have introduced new vehicles on Rainbow/rapid one, Skylink, Rushcliffe Greens, H1, before that on Threes and i4.
The Sixes north of Derby amongst other routes have benefited from cascaded vehicles fully refurbished to meet the needs of a specific route and fitted with power points for mobile phones making them as good as new.
Trent is less than a tenth of the size of NXWM, so you would expect relative smaller investment levels.
I've never seen a Trent bus with paint peeling and large areas of bare metal, or different seat moquette in the same vehicle whatever it's age and their standards mean in all likelihood I never will.

Smaller companies can require higher standards because it is easier for them to achieve them.

If a NXWM bus requires a change of seat cushion, would you really take it out of service whilst awaiting the correct moquette to arrive, or would you replace it with a different moquette that is in stock and get it back on the road earning money asap!

If Trent took over NEs operations, would things change for the better, i doubt it!

[don]

The SQBP in the City Centre means that Birmingham will probably continue to receive the newest vehicles, either until the fleet catches up with the latest emission regulations, or another authority decides to implement an SQBP in its boundaries.

Bristol Road probably will never get brand new vehicles, owing to the Cross City line.  It is busy, but the rate of return in any business case for NXWM will be stronger where there is no rail competition, or where there is bus priority, or where there is a rapid way into and out of the city.

Bearing in mind the SQBP and the number of new buses NXWM have committed to over the next three or four years, I could envisage most of the non Platinum radial Birmingham corridors receiving Crimson vehicles in the next few years, freeing up many nearly new vehicles for use elsewhere, and unless NXWM expand elsewhere or have serious competition to deal with, hundreds of older vehicles will be withdrawn or put into reserve as a consequence.

[winston]

From my recollection Trent have introduced new vehicles on Rainbow/rapid one, Skylink, Rushcliffe Greens, H1, before that on Threes and i4.
The Sixes north of Derby amongst other routes have benefited from cascaded vehicles fully refurbished to meet the needs of a specific route and fitted with power points for mobile phones making them as good as new.
Trent is less than a tenth of the size of NXWM, so you would expect relative smaller investment levels.
I've never seen a Trent bus with paint peeling and large areas of bare metal, or different seat moquette in the same vehicle whatever it's age and their standards mean in all likelihood I never will.

I was talking the whole Wellglade Group, TM travel hardly get anything new / nearly new, Notts & Derby run an old fleet. The group doesn't buy new vehicles in the quantity it used to.  Only the core routes get the new stuff. They aren't even buying a complete new fleet of Red Arrow coaches, only 9 are due. Although Trent itself may be around a 10th the size of NXWM fleet, the group itself has in excess of 400 buses. Take a look at the attached fleetlist, it isn't as modern as you might expect. I'm going to leave it there at the risk of going further off topic
http://www.derbybusdepot.co.uk/trentfleetlist.html

[winston]

Bearing in mind the SQBP and the number of new buses NXWM have committed to over the next three or four years, I could envisage most of the non Platinum radial Birmingham corridors receiving Crimson vehicles in the next few years, freeing up many nearly new vehicles for use elsewhere, and unless NXWM expand elsewhere or have serious competition to deal with, hundreds of older vehicles will be withdrawn or put into reserve as a consequence.

Going forward NXWM will the option of selling vehicles on the used market, Presidents & Tridents especially will be suitable for schools / contract work & should be of more interest to prospective buyers over ex London dual door stuff

[monkeyjoe]

All this defensiveness for NXWM, let's face it they had it all handed to them on a plate a bit like BT and for years have under invested and only now starting to catch up.