London Buses.

[Stuharris 6360]

Now. I'm not saying it's horrendous, but it's pretty damn ugly! What happened, ADL? Aesthetically, the front looks almost identical to the E200, and the side too reminiscent of the "New Routemaster". Of course, I assume it's only a mockup image, I hope they can re-evaluate the design a bit, to make it appear more like the current E400MMC... At the front at least. It won't be a "London exclusive" vehicle will it? Like the Wrightbus "Routemaster"?

My thoughts exactly, i do hope they do not use that paint scheme, the plain red that has appeared on London Buses for many many years would be 100% better!!

[barry619]

Now. I'm not saying it's horrendous, but it's pretty damn ugly! What happened, ADL? Aesthetically, the front looks almost identical to the E200, and the side too reminiscent of the "New Routemaster". Of course, I assume it's only a mockup image, I hope they can re-evaluate the design a bit, to make it appear more like the current E400MMC... At the front at least. It won't be a "London exclusive" vehicle will it? Like the Wrightbus "Routemaster"?

It has been designed in collaboration with TfL, hence the similarity with the New RM 'look'.

I believe this will extend to the inside as well.

[CL]

Found this on Flickr. I'm assuming it's mainly fictional, based on only ONE prototype CGI photo. :-\

[Stuharris 6360]

Lts 1, 2, & 3 are currently being prepared for a return to servce on route 38, Victoria to Clapton Pond.

[Stuharris 6360]

It seems that common sense is finally to prevail and the New Rotemasters (LTs) are to receive opening windows.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/new-routemasters-to-get-opening-windows-following-heat-complaints-tfl-announce-a2950441.html

[Bryan]

It seems that common sense is finally to prevail and the New Rotemasters (LTs) are to receive opening windows.

http://www.standard.co.uk/news/transport/new-routemasters-to-get-opening-windows-following-heat-complaints-tfl-announce-a2950441.html

That is very good news. The bad news is all the money spent in designing and rectifying an expensive vehicle which wasn't fit for purpose, or that London Transport could afford to man as originally intended.

[barry619]

This is a rather embarassing climb-down for TfL as Leon Daniels has repeatedly insisted that problems with excessive heat inside the New RMs were exaggerated, and that it had conducted tests that 'proved' claims were wrong. However, the Evening Standard continues to peddle the false line that New RMs are air-conditioned, which would suggest that the writer has little understanding of the situation. They are not air-conditioned and were never planned to be.

I believe there may be an announcement of note regarding electric double-deckers for London within the next month.

[Stuharris 6360]

The New Routemasters are becoming a thorny issue in London at the moment

Labour Mayoral Hopeful Sadiq Khan had said that if he is elected Mayor, he will suspend all orders for the New Routemaster until it is established as being value for money, sadly for him, all Routemasters on the current order will be delivered before the election.

Secondly the no windows issue, which is to be rectified at the cost of two millions pounds, strangely Leon has been very quiet since the news was announced.

Thirdly, it has been discovered that at the moment, Boris Johnson or the taxpayer do not own the rights to the design of the bus. That will only come when 1000 buses have been delivered, sadly with the current contract being only for 600 (plus 200 ordered later) and no prospect of a future order at the moment, the taxpayers of London may never own the rights for the buses that so much of there money has been spent on.

Fourthly, was in London yesterday and they seem to be still having trouble with the batteries, and only one of the numerous ones i rode on actually switched to battery power. May have been bad luck on my part, but these buses at the moment are not the environmentally friendly buses they were designed to be!!!

[Tony]

The New Routemasters are becoming a thorny issue in London at the moment

Labour Mayoral Hopeful Sadiq Khan had said that if he is elected Mayor, he will suspend all orders for the New Routemaster until it is established as being value for money, sadly for him, all Routemasters on the current order will be delivered before the election.

Secondly the no windows issue, which is to be rectified at the cost of two millions pounds, strangely Leon has been very quiet since the news was announced.

Thirdly, it has been discovered that at the moment, Boris Johnson or the taxpayer do not own the rights to the design of the bus. That will only come when 1000 buses have been delivered, sadly with the current contract being only for 600 (plus 200 ordered later) and no prospect of a future order at the moment, the taxpayers of London may never own the rights for the buses that so much of there money has been spent on.

Fourthly, was in London yesterday and they seem to be still having trouble with the batteries, and only one of the numerous ones i rode on actually switched to battery power. May have been bad luck on my part, but these buses at the moment are not the environmentally friendly buses they were designed to be!!!

They all run on battery power, there cannot run direct off the diesel engine, I presume you mean they were permanently charging.

[barry619]

Fourthly, was in London yesterday and they seem to be still having trouble with the batteries, and only one of the numerous ones i rode on actually switched to battery power. May have been bad luck on my part, but these buses at the moment are not the environmentally friendly buses they were designed to be!!!

It is clear that the New RM saga is not going quite to plan at the moment, and that the battery issues and climb-down on opening windows are highly embarassing for both TfL and Wrights. The appearance of the Enviro400H City could not have come at a worse time either, as ADL is making a lot of it being a cheaper alternative to the New RM.

But the battery and windows problems will be solved as they are relatively simple issues despite what the mainstream media like to point out (at the same time as often being without full posession of the facts, as shown by the Evening Standard article linked above). Additionally, the FOI figures for the New RM's fuel consumption, which Alan Millar in Buses got hold of, do prove it to be substantially more fuel efficient than the buses it has displaced - when it's working properly...

There was substantial testing of New RMs from each indivdual operator going on at Millbrook not long ago, which would suggest that some tweaking may also have happened/be in the works.

[Stuharris 6360]

It is clear that the New RM saga is not going quite to plan at the moment, and that the battery issues and climb-down on opening windows are highly embarassing for both TfL and Wrights. The appearance of the Enviro400H City could not have come at a worse time either, as ADL is making a lot of it being a cheaper alternative to the New RM.

But the battery and windows problems will be solved as they are relatively simple issues despite what the mainstream media like to point out (at the same time as often being without full posession of the facts, as shown by the Evening Standard article linked above). Additionally, the FOI figures for the New RM's fuel consumption, which Alan Millar in Buses got hold of, do prove it to be substantially more fuel efficient than the buses it has displaced - when it's working properly...

There was substantial testing of New RMs from each indivdual operator going on at Millbrook not long ago, which would suggest that some tweaking may also have happened/be in the works.

IMO, it is a very embarrasing saga all together.

Boris made a speech when the NRM was launched saying that London was getting back it's open platform doors, strangely only a limited number of services run in crew mode. Saturdays & Sundays it is only one service, the 11. I went on the 11 yesterday and the whole bus was far more comfortable temperature wise with the rear door open. Sadly if anything, I can see the number of crew operated services decreasing, after all it must be costing TFL a fortune for somebody to stand at the back door to say hello and remind people to touch in with there Oyster cards. TFL have a major advertising campaign at the moment saying that they do not make a profit, but reinvest any surplus money into the transport network.

Also now, most new NRMs are supplied with a modification meaning that it can't operate with the rear door open, so crew operation is impossible. Makes you wonder if this modification will be fitted to the rest of the fleet.

With Sadiq Khan for Labour and Caroline Pidgeon for the Lib Dems in the mayoral election both having serious concerns about these buses, what will be the future if one of them wins, mmmm Watch This Space.

[barry619]

The use of conductors was always as much of a politics gesture as the New RM itself. The various problems aside, it is an excellent vehicle, but for what one costs, so it should be. Nevertheless, the age-old thing of London needing its own bespoke bus returned to the fore, and mainstream hybrid products from ADL and Volvo would have worked equally well as the New RM and at substantially less cost.

Regardless of future Mayoral policy, I think they are destined to remain in service fir a long tine yet. Were they to be withdrawn like the artics, TfL would have a huge amount if money tied up in assets with little second-hand value and that would be a major political headache.

[Stuharris 6360]

The use of conductors was always as much of a politics gesture as the New RM itself. The various problems aside, it is an excellent vehicle, but for what one costs, so it should be. Nevertheless, the age-old thing of London needing its own bespoke bus returned to the fore, and mainstream hybrid products from ADL and Volvo would have worked equally well as the New RM and at substantially less cost.

Regardless of future Mayoral policy, I think they are destined to remain in service fir a long tine yet. Were they to be withdrawn like the artics, TfL would have a huge amount if money tied up in assets with little second-hand value and that would be a major political headache.

Oh they will survive, I understand that in the purchase price is included a mid life overhaul, but there role within London I think will change. Whether the new Mayor would stop using crew operation on all routes is debatable, making people redundant wouldn't go down to well with people.

[Steveminor]

Just passed a go ahead London gemini 3 on trade places at Bassett pole a38

[don]

Just passed a go ahead London gemini 3 on trade places at Bassett pole a38

There are quite a few of these on the 119 Bromley North to Croydon - taking the service over - strangely I've got used to the quirky front design after a couple of weeks - I watched one glide through the traffic in Croydon yesterday evening and my view of the front is now one of chiselled jaw manful ruggedness rather than plain fugly!! The shiny red certainly suits the design (it looks a bit more orangey than normal) and the use of black around the windows extending around the back of the bus looks great. I have also started to get used to the side proportions which seem to be based on the MCW Orion design - however the short wheelbase and long overhang gives the buses a very ungainly look when they approach downhill over traffic calming ramps - a sort of an airliner taking off stance.

The lower case font on the black and white roller blinds is illegible in daylight conditions so hopefully the RNIB will be complaining to TfL that their new retro blinds are disability discriminative.

These buses have the go ahead London logo in yellow rather than Metrobus on the ones they've replaced and although they have London style three letter type code as part of the fleet number, they have a Metrobus series fleet number above the fuel filler!!