Rotala Management - Questions & Answers

[Sh4318]

Hi Simon,

Speaking of the 002, are there any future plans for tha route?

[Westy]

Had a nice ride round the diamond network today and caught some of the new enviros which are nice and some of the ex yourbus darts

Couple of points:

Why did diamond initially try to sell all the ex first enviro300s?

One of the ex yourbus darts still has yourbus interior notices-could these be removed? Other than that, great buses and the ones at redditch/kidderminster seem to rattle a lot less than 20849.

Which buses are the priority for repaint at the moment?

Oh and in walsall bus station, I asked about the diamond 301 timetable which didnt seem to be there only to be told diamond didnt run the 301 anymore?? when I could see one outside-maybe this is the problem with bus information points ran by nx officials.

Thanks Simon

Thank you for your comments

In response to your questions

1.  Having acquire the two businesses based at Redditch and Kidderminster, I was approached and made an offer for the E300's.  I was not really interested in selling them, but as this offer was more than I viewed they were worth I decided to put them in the weekly advert we were running.  As if someone was prepared to pay more, maybe it made sense to dispose of them and replace with newer vehicles.
2.  Yes, the YourBus information should not be on.  Ironically I acquired these vehicles from Ensign Bus. 
3.  We must have about 6 vehicles going through paint at the moment.  We have now paid for the 3 x 59 plate Volvo's (they will go into paint soon), we agreed a deal with Wrights on Friday for 12 Streetlites.  We need to get all these vehicles into fleet to create capacity to repaint other vehicles.
4.  This is because we did not sign up to the Network review in this area.

Surely its not stopping you putting 301 leaflets in the travel shop?

[winston]

The Levantes were on an Operating Lease.  A subsidiary of National Express has taken assignment.

On an on going basis, we look at our fares.  What matters to us, is the money we take per trip, not what we charge.  Our whole pricing strategy is something we need to review again.  I agree with your comments that clearly a day ticket with ourselves with not worth the same value as on NX.  On the NBus panel, I tried to encourage the cost of the NBus product to be no more than NX (or less).  However, this is not something that any other operator or Centro would support.

Simon, Thanks for your responses,

A batch of 11 plate Levante that size was crying out to be snapped up by either NX or a major NX subcontractor, NX especially have large numbers of 06/56 plate Scania/Levate that will need removing from the network. I assume Rotala have still had to pay the monthly lease payments despite having no for them work.

I still think passenger numbers on Diamonds WM commercial services began to fall when fares were brought in line with those of NX, and ultimately those services began to be withdrawn. Obviously the economy has had an affect of passenger journeys across the board, the only thing to differentiate between the two competing operators is service & vehicle quality.

Good news of the 12 x Streetlites, will these be larger capacity DF versions? I take it Rotala are growing increasingly in favour of the Wright Streetlite with recent second-hand versions at Preston & Wessex

[PM]

Since Tony received his fleet list.  There has been some fleet changes, and I think some of you expressed a desire to take pictures of the buses before they go.  Since Monday of this week, we have accepted offer on the following

1.  Willenhall Commercials

K123/6URP, plus all 5 darts parked up at Redditch and Kidderminster

2.  Peter Reddish - for Scrap

The last lance at Kidderminster

3.  A Bristol operator with 1 or 2 vehicles.

These are planned to be removed after service on Monday

R220MSA
P401MLA

Thanks for this Simon so basically got the citybuses need to get the rest before end of service monday-stuff still in service till then is easy but some of the parked up darts and lances are more difficult

[bususer12]

Hi Simon, Diamond do seem to behave better now on the 226, although one thing that is annoying is the tendered timetable. It gives 15 minutes to get from Dudley to Wordsley Hospital, which in all the years that I have caught the bus, has never got to Wordsley on time(xx.30).  I understand that Centro have the say in tendered timetables, but If there was a way to show them that they have it wrong, it would be good.

When I set out for my bus, sometimes it will arrive at xx.35, or xx.45, depending on the driving sstyle of driver and type of day.

[PM]

Hi Simon,

Are you able to confirm who the Levantes have been sold too?

Interesting that the 3 x 59 plate Centros are the ex Go Whippet that operate on the guided busway, are these available immediately or are you having to wait for Go Whippet to receive new busway vehicles first?

This seems like the never ending story with the Levantes.  The vehicles should have gone a few weeks back, there has been some delays.  This should go through anyday

We are due to pay for the today/tomorrow/ in the next few days.  My understanding is that the equipment from the busway is being swapped from them to new buses and when this is complete we will pay and take delivery.

Thanks Simon,

Sounds as though you are nearly there with the Levantes  ;) obviously they are expensive assets to be sat around doing very little. Do you intend to re-invest the proceeds of the sale of these back in to upgrading the Diamond bus fleet?

One thing that did cross my mind, have Rotala/Diamond ever considered dropping the price of their cash fares to attract more passengers on your commercial competing services? Obviously they are set at exactly the same level as NXWM? And not everyone would be looking to buy a return ticket
Additionally, the Diamond day ticket is priced at £3.90 exactly the same as NXWM, but Diamond doesn't have the same network coverage or hours of operation

Have you ever looked at buying any MAN/Wright Meridian? There seems to be a number of late model examples around, not sure if that is a good thing or not....

The Levantes were on an Operating Lease.  A subsidiary of National Express has taken assignment.

On an on going basis, we look at our fares.  What matters to us, is the money we take per trip, not what we charge.  Our whole pricing strategy is something we need to review again.  I agree with your comments that clearly a day ticket with ourselves with not worth the same value as on NX.  On the NBus panel, I tried to encourage the cost of the NBus product to be no more than NX (or less).  However, this is not something that any other operator or Centro would support.

I did participate in an Auction for some MAN/Wright Meridian.  They went for more than I would like to pay. I am not particularly an MAN fan, and the reason why we sold the MAN MCV's was because the relationship failed with MAN.  In our opinion they made a catalogue of promises which they failed to keep.

Interesting as there do seem to be a lot around being sold by santander etc so many must have been leased. It seemed like there are quite a few operators with failed relationships with MAN buses-rotala and newport as well though I understand that has since been resolved

[PM]

On Bank Holiday monday when on the 50 line of route, I saw 30004 BX07AXO-I'm sure of it but havent seen it since. I was wondering if you could tell me if it was at long acre, if I was imagining things or got the reg totally wrong and if it is at long acre whether it will be out again

Thanks Simon

This vehicle was one, we intended to move to Long Acre.  Only one now be moved, and from memory I cant remember if this is going back to Bath or not

No worries so overall 3 07 centros have run here-brv, kpp and axo? But KPP one has gone back to be followed by BRV and will be replaced by a 59 reg

[PM]

Had a nice ride round the diamond network today and caught some of the new enviros which are nice and some of the ex yourbus darts

Couple of points:

Why did diamond initially try to sell all the ex first enviro300s?

One of the ex yourbus darts still has yourbus interior notices-could these be removed? Other than that, great buses and the ones at redditch/kidderminster seem to rattle a lot less than 20849.

Which buses are the priority for repaint at the moment?

Oh and in walsall bus station, I asked about the diamond 301 timetable which didnt seem to be there only to be told diamond didnt run the 301 anymore?? when I could see one outside-maybe this is the problem with bus information points ran by nx officials.

Thanks Simon

Thank you for your comments

In response to your questions

1.  Having acquire the two businesses based at Redditch and Kidderminster, I was approached and made an offer for the E300's.  I was not really interested in selling them, but as this offer was more than I viewed they were worth I decided to put them in the weekly advert we were running.  As if someone was prepared to pay more, maybe it made sense to dispose of them and replace with newer vehicles.
2.  Yes, the YourBus information should not be on.  Ironically I acquired these vehicles from Ensign Bus. 
3.  We must have about 6 vehicles going through paint at the moment.  We have now paid for the 3 x 59 plate Volvo's (they will go into paint soon), we agreed a deal with Wrights on Friday for 12 Streetlites.  We need to get all these vehicles into fleet to create capacity to repaint other vehicles.
4.  This is because we did not sign up to the Network review in this area.

Interesting about the enviro300s and do you still have a weekly advert thing as i havent seen this for a while-was it not worth it-that route one feature on the levantes was good though

Yeah I thought that was weird they were bought from ensignbus and that more weren't purchased as they are brilliant

Interesting about the streetlites-anything wrightbus will undoubtedly be well made and rattle and clatter less than the enviro200 that is at tividale/long acre-dont know at the moment where it is. What livery are the streetlites currently in and are they new/stock built/second hand ones or a mixture?

Understand this but a few timetables on buses would really help loadings I would reckon as people like diamond on the 301 and would wait around if they had a timetable in their pocket they could look at and think theres a diamond due at such and such a time as not everyone has the internet etc

[PM]

Hi Simon, Have you ever considered introducing a sunday service on the 002 with it being a popular service mon-sat and Merry Hill being as busy if not busier on a Sunday. Also may be extending the finishing time of the service monday-saturday.

The 4M mon-sat is every hour and when I have caught the service seems quite well used are there any plans to increasing the frequency may be to every 30 minutes.

Thank You.

We intend to review all our Black Diamond operations shortly.  Any comments you have would be appreciated.

Glad to hear about the network review starting. In my view, theres a lot for rotala to be positive about in the west midlands, despite what people might say on here. Exisiting commercial routes after the poor ones were cut back seem to be doing okay, routes are popular, people are buying diamond weeklies and monthlies which is good and there is a fair bit of tendered stuff to support it as well but clearly it isnt being run at stupidly low prices. There is more of a network than there has ever been before and this will no doubt encourage people to buy diamond passes.

However certain routes could be looked at such as the 002/202/4 group and some of the capacity issues addressed eg MPDs on the 4H. There needs to be a clearout of some of the older darts-much as I like them!-and promotion and branding with leaflets for certain routes advertising weeklies etc to encourage people who dont already know about the returns etc.

[Tony]

Understand this but a few timetables on buses would really help loadings I would reckon as people like diamond on the 301 and would wait around if they had a timetable in their pocket they could look at and think theres a diamond due at such and such a time as not everyone has the internet etc

You are overestimating people there. Very few cash paying passengers wait for any company even if one charges lower fares. Nearly all of them will get on the first bus that comes.

On the 301 most get on the first bus that comes on their first journey, buy a return and most then wait for that company to go home on. The others try and use the first bus again either arguing with the driver about not being able to use the oppositions return or don't even realise they are two seperate companys.

If you think a timetable on that route is going to increase trade during the day I think you would be in for a shock

[Ash]

As some of the cadets are not going to be repainted for some time it would be nice to see the diamond fleet names reapplied to some vehicles as some have had panel replacements and either have no fleet names or parts missing on them. Also some of the displays are not working on the cadets one for example is the side destination blind on 30216 which hasn't worked for some time. I was on 30202 last week and when the driver put his foot on the break the interior lights kept going on and off with a loud beeping noise in the cab to warn the driver that there is some kind of issue. 

[Westy]

Understand this but a few timetables on buses would really help loadings I would reckon as people like diamond on the 301 and would wait around if they had a timetable in their pocket they could look at and think theres a diamond due at such and such a time as not everyone has the internet etc

You are overestimating people there. Very few cash paying passengers wait for any company even if one charges lower fares. Nearly all of them will get on the first bus that comes.

On the 301 most get on the first bus that comes on their first journey, buy a return and most then wait for that company to go home on. The others try and use the first bus again either arguing with the driver about not being able to use the oppositions return or don't even realise they are two seperate companys.

If you think a timetable on that route is going to increase trade during the day I think you would be in for a shock

I'll wait till the Swift's available on both NX & Diamond instead!

[Ash]

Understand this but a few timetables on buses would really help loadings I would reckon as people like diamond on the 301 and would wait around if they had a timetable in their pocket they could look at and think theres a diamond due at such and such a time as not everyone has the internet etc

You are overestimating people there. Very few cash paying passengers wait for any company even if one charges lower fares. Nearly all of them will get on the first bus that comes.

On the 301 most get on the first bus that comes on their first journey, buy a return and most then wait for that company to go home on. The others try and use the first bus again either arguing with the driver about not being able to use the oppositions return or don't even realise they are two seperate companys.

If you think a timetable on that route is going to increase trade during the day I think you would be in for a shock

From witnessing it myself I know of quite a few passengers that let the NXWM bus go and wait for diamond if there buying a return ticket as there cheaper, this happens on service 4 where diamond is every 6 minutes so you rarely have to wait long.

[PM]

Understand this but a few timetables on buses would really help loadings I would reckon as people like diamond on the 301 and would wait around if they had a timetable in their pocket they could look at and think theres a diamond due at such and such a time as not everyone has the internet etc

You are overestimating people there. Very few cash paying passengers wait for any company even if one charges lower fares. Nearly all of them will get on the first bus that comes.

On the 301 most get on the first bus that comes on their first journey, buy a return and most then wait for that company to go home on. The others try and use the first bus again either arguing with the driver about not being able to use the oppositions return or don't even realise they are two seperate companys.

If you think a timetable on that route is going to increase trade during the day I think you would be in for a shock

From witnessing it myself I know of quite a few passengers that let the NXWM bus go and wait for diamond if there buying a return ticket as there cheaper, this happens on service 4 where diamond is every 6 minutes so you rarely have to wait long.

Yeah same I know this for a start when you see a queue of cash payers stood by the diamond stand in west brom and ignore the nx bus ahead. A timetable would I am sure boost trade-inform people of weeklies and monthlies who are buying returns and also informing people potentially of other diamond routes-some sort of black country guide could be produced covering all the routes. What does need to happen on the 301-have seen it myself last week-people with diamond returns confused if they could use it on KV51KZH which is a bit of a problem

[PM]

Another question Simon-sorry! What is your opinion on route branding as we have seen a lot of it go at diamond even though it seemed popular and looked really smart Thanks