Rotala Management - Questions & Answers

[PM]

Hi Simon-have done away with the quoting as it wasnt really working for me so here goes

1) Definitely can't find the 146 on the network review

2) Could branding eg summer sale be photocopied or copied and printed to put by the door/on the cab door/at the bottom of the windscreens to promote the offers which are really good value!!

3) Great plan about possibly promoting returns on some buses

4) Might arrange a depot visit for a couple of weeks time and is any depot possible and can withdrawn stuff be photoed?

5) Could I pick up a Kidderminster guide if I visited kidderminster depot?

6)Could timetables be made for some birmingham routes?

This was the only other thing:

Also, don't know to what extent you were involved with diamond buses in the early days of rotala ownership but I've got timetables for diamond 144/002/56 and connect 10/904/37/17/97/119. Were any other timetables produced out of interest-if you don't know this no worries-but Im thinking 301/404 as it was then or anything else and does rotala still have copies of these old timetables printed and possibly available to those of us who collect anything diamond buses

1.  Where are you looking?
2.  We intend to carry it on.
4.  It is not a problem to photograph any buses at any depot. 
5.  Yes
6.  We have timetables for most routes, if not all.

Last week we cleared out our stores of old timetables.  There were timetables, which were out of date for all those services, unfortunately they have now been recycled.

1)Oh its been changed I think-different to how it was a couple of days ago with way more routes on there

4) Thanks

6) Sorry I meant timetable/leaflet guides available on buses

And no worries about the old timetables-guess I will be able to pick them up at rallies etc in the future and I understand that things like that can't be kept for ever but if any old ones do appear/remain then I would still remain interested

Thanks for your reply  :)

[PM]

Simon,

I assume you aready aware of the 03 plate E300 currently for sale at Southdown PSV?

http://www.southdownpsv.co.uk/sales/bus_details.php?bus=247

Or

2007 Scania/Wright (3 ex Reading) & 4 x Scania Omnicity (56 plate)?

http://www.nigelmccree.com/

Do the turnover figures released today with Rotala Plc half yearly report included much of a contribution from the newly acquired RH & KR operations?

1.  I want to upgrade the fleet, although I have acquired older buses my preference is to look at newer vehicles than these. 
2.  There are a number of reasons why, these are of no interest
      I made an offer recently on some Scania's (not these).  I don't value the vehicles as being worth what Mr McCree wants for them. 
     The Scania's that we operate, are poor on fuel. 
     Priority for long buses in our fleet is Redditch, and these would represent another variation of vehicle.
     We have made an offer on 15 vehicles for wihch we are awaiting a response.
   
3.  Interim Numbers.

Redditch was acquired on 2nd March @ 2359 hrs.  The interims represent the period up to 31st May 2013, and therefore are nearly 3 months.

Obviously you can't say what buses they are but can't find any batch of buses that big for sale on route one trader or any of the usual dealers, not even on coach and bus market. Well, I tell a lie I did find one fairly large batch of buses for sale at www.sigmaplantfinder.com/transportation/buses/dennis-dart-pointer-9-3m-35088.html but you have already said that you do not favour ex london vehicles and I imagine the buses are long ones as opposed to these shorter ones of which rotala already seem to have enough? What do you make of these buses Simon as I've never heard of this seller before-are they well known in the industry? I am aware also that you sold the acquired ex travel london MPDs though not quite sure why-was this more in a dealer capacity and also you mention this batch of buses which don't seem to be in trade magazines and the same with the volvo/centros-they don't appear anywhere online either so I guess the question I'm really asking is are there specific companies which approach you offering to sell certain buses or a special magazine or something listing them as certainly the 59 reg centros I never saw advertised anywhere?

[Ash]

15 vehicles and I think the PVR for the 4/4H/4M is 15, but guess any new acquired buses will be for Redditch unless any buses for Tividale will allow buses such as the 30832-4 and 30940-3 to move to Redditch.

Will any of the cadets get repainted into the new diamond livery as i guess the 51 and 02 reg ones are DDA compliant.

[winston]

Simon,

I assume you aready aware of the 03 plate E300 currently for sale at Southdown PSV?

http://www.southdownpsv.co.uk/sales/bus_details.php?bus=247

Or

2007 Scania/Wright (3 ex Reading) & 4 x Scania Omnicity (56 plate)?

http://www.nigelmccree.com/

Do the turnover figures released today with Rotala Plc half yearly report included much of a contribution from the newly acquired RH & KR operations?

1.  I want to upgrade the fleet, although I have acquired older buses my preference is to look at newer vehicles than these. 
2.  There are a number of reasons why, these are of no interest
      I made an offer recently on some Scania's (not these).  I don't value the vehicles as being worth what Mr McCree wants for them. 
     The Scania's that we operate, are poor on fuel. 
     Priority for long buses in our fleet is Redditch, and these would represent another variation of vehicle.
     We have made an offer on 15 vehicles for wihch we are awaiting a response.
   
3.  Interim Numbers.

Redditch was acquired on 2nd March @ 2359 hrs.  The interims represent the period up to 31st May 2013, and therefore are nearly 3 months.

Simon thanks for your reply,

1. Although the 03 plate E300 isn't that new, as I understand it there were limited numbers built during the 2003-8 period, the later ones were generally with 3 + 2 seating configuration for schools work
2. I was thinking more along the lines of any acquired Scania's going in to Wessex thus releasing similar aged Volvo's to Diamond whether it be Redditch or Tividale to keep the number of vehicle types to a minimum, obviously Scania's do have a reputation for being a bit thirsty on fuel.... but again there appear to be limited numbers of newer second-hand full size buses available, First Group are also after nearly new buses as well.
3. Rotala Plc turnover for the half year fell £1.850 Million to £26.665 Million over the same period a year earlier, obviously this was despite a 3 month contribution from the acquired RH & KR businesses. Is the majority of the drop in turnover attributed to reduced tendered work at Diamond and the loss of NX coach work by Flights Hallmark? Wessex & Preston both appear to be growing.
4. Do Rotala Plc anticipate / have sufficient headroom to make any further acquisitions or plan to setup in any new areas prior to year end?
5. Are the 15 vehicles you have made an offer for all the from a batch? or made up of a number of types?
6. Do you currently anticipate retaining Church Road depot in Redditch after the current lease expires?
7. Do the 4 x 13 plate B7RLE/Wright @ Tividale i.e. 30940-30943 form Rotala Plc's commitment to the Brierley Hill BBA bid? Or are others new buses due?

[Westy]

Why don't you make a timetable leaflet available for the Walsall 301, as the Network WM one only features the NX one? (And put them in Walsall Bus Station travel office. If Arriva can manage it, surely you can too?)

Ever thought about going onto the Walsall 302 as a 'compliment' to the 301?

I used to be able to use my NX pass & pay 50p to use your buses, which came in useful on several occasions.

How come you stopped it?

Surely it would put more bums on seats?

[andy]

Why don't you make a timetable leaflet available for the Walsall 301, as the Network WM one only features the NX one? (And put them in Walsall Bus Station travel office. If Arriva can manage it, surely you can too?)

Ever thought about going onto the Walsall 302 as a 'compliment' to the 301?

I used to be able to use my NX pass & pay 50p to use your buses, which came in useful on several occasions.

How come you stopped it?

Surely it would put more bums on seats?

I would imagine Rotala are 'biting the bullet' when it comes to the NX travelcard charge as did Arriva before.

It's all very well putting bums on seats but the policy is counterproductive, it keeps people buying the NX card. Once people stop having the flexibility of the option of jumping on Diamond for a small surcharge, they are forced to travel on NX. NX may be full or overcrowded. The passenger may then become aware that they are better off purchasing the Network WM product instead, or even just paying regular fares to increase flexibility.

I would hope they are attempting to play the long game!

[trident4370]

Hi Simon, Thanks for joining the forum and taking our questions. I have 3 questions that aren't really that "constructive", I am just asking for personal curiosity! Firstly now that 30804 is the only nifty fifty left, are there any plans to re-upgrade the 50 or will it continue to be a mish mash of any buses? Secondly I remember a while back you trialled a 35E service but the service seemed very short lived, I just wondered now that competition on the 50 has stepped up, would it be a considerable option to re introduce the 35 service to boost Diamonds overall frequency between Moseley/KH and Birmingham and combine day ticket options? Finally have Diamond ever looked at operating on the Outer Circle in the past or recently?
Looking forward to your reply!

[Simon Dunn]

Simon,

I assume you aready aware of the 03 plate E300 currently for sale at Southdown PSV?

http://www.southdownpsv.co.uk/sales/bus_details.php?bus=247

Or

2007 Scania/Wright (3 ex Reading) & 4 x Scania Omnicity (56 plate)?

http://www.nigelmccree.com/

Do the turnover figures released today with Rotala Plc half yearly report included much of a contribution from the newly acquired RH & KR operations?

1.  I want to upgrade the fleet, although I have acquired older buses my preference is to look at newer vehicles than these. 
2.  There are a number of reasons why, these are of no interest
      I made an offer recently on some Scania's (not these).  I don't value the vehicles as being worth what Mr McCree wants for them. 
     The Scania's that we operate, are poor on fuel. 
     Priority for long buses in our fleet is Redditch, and these would represent another variation of vehicle.
     We have made an offer on 15 vehicles for wihch we are awaiting a response.
   
3.  Interim Numbers.

Redditch was acquired on 2nd March @ 2359 hrs.  The interims represent the period up to 31st May 2013, and therefore are nearly 3 months.

Obviously you can't say what buses they are but can't find any batch of buses that big for sale on route one trader or any of the usual dealers, not even on coach and bus market. Well, I tell a lie I did find one fairly large batch of buses for sale at www.sigmaplantfinder.com/transportation/buses/dennis-dart-pointer-9-3m-35088.html but you have already said that you do not favour ex london vehicles and I imagine the buses are long ones as opposed to these shorter ones of which rotala already seem to have enough? What do you make of these buses Simon as I've never heard of this seller before-are they well known in the industry? I am aware also that you sold the acquired ex travel london MPDs though not quite sure why-was this more in a dealer capacity and also you mention this batch of buses which don't seem to be in trade magazines and the same with the volvo/centros-they don't appear anywhere online either so I guess the question I'm really asking is are there specific companies which approach you offering to sell certain buses or a special magazine or something listing them as certainly the 59 reg centros I never saw advertised anywhere?

Abellio is what was Tellings Golden Millar, then Travel London.  They have been in the London market now for a few years.  The buses in my opinion are over priced, they will struggle to sell them as they are 2 door, Ex-London, and not really suitable for provincial spec.  I sold the 2 x 2005 MPD's having acquired them we lost some work, and quality standards changed in the South West, were in effect there is now a 10 year age limit due to contractual specifications, Euro 4 in Bristol and the vehicles were only 18 months from this limit.  The only option would be somewhere in the West Midlands and we already have too many small vehicles.  Having been in this industry since I was 8, you get to know a lot of people, especially people who are selling something.  We were offered the 59 plate Centro's, they were taken as part exchange by a manufacturer.  A lot of people email me or one of my colleagues, if they believe they have something which we would be interested in.

[Simon Dunn]

15 vehicles and I think the PVR for the 4/4H/4M is 15, but guess any new acquired buses will be for Redditch unless any buses for Tividale will allow buses such as the 30832-4 and 30940-3 to move to Redditch.

Will any of the cadets get repainted into the new diamond livery as i guess the 51 and 02 reg ones are DDA compliant.

We need to acquire a few spare buses for the South West, however our main focus is Redditch/Kidderminster.  It may be that having acquired something it may make sense to re-shuffle things.  Until we know what we are doing it is difficult to comment.

Our priority in terms of painting is the Redditch/Kidderminster fleet we are keeping, and the new buses we have inbound for everywhere else. 

[PM]

Simon,

I assume you aready aware of the 03 plate E300 currently for sale at Southdown PSV?

http://www.southdownpsv.co.uk/sales/bus_details.php?bus=247

Or

2007 Scania/Wright (3 ex Reading) & 4 x Scania Omnicity (56 plate)?

http://www.nigelmccree.com/

Do the turnover figures released today with Rotala Plc half yearly report included much of a contribution from the newly acquired RH & KR operations?

1.  I want to upgrade the fleet, although I have acquired older buses my preference is to look at newer vehicles than these. 
2.  There are a number of reasons why, these are of no interest
      I made an offer recently on some Scania's (not these).  I don't value the vehicles as being worth what Mr McCree wants for them. 
     The Scania's that we operate, are poor on fuel. 
     Priority for long buses in our fleet is Redditch, and these would represent another variation of vehicle.
     We have made an offer on 15 vehicles for wihch we are awaiting a response.
   
3.  Interim Numbers.

Redditch was acquired on 2nd March @ 2359 hrs.  The interims represent the period up to 31st May 2013, and therefore are nearly 3 months.

Obviously you can't say what buses they are but can't find any batch of buses that big for sale on route one trader or any of the usual dealers, not even on coach and bus market. Well, I tell a lie I did find one fairly large batch of buses for sale at www.sigmaplantfinder.com/transportation/buses/dennis-dart-pointer-9-3m-35088.html but you have already said that you do not favour ex london vehicles and I imagine the buses are long ones as opposed to these shorter ones of which rotala already seem to have enough? What do you make of these buses Simon as I've never heard of this seller before-are they well known in the industry? I am aware also that you sold the acquired ex travel london MPDs though not quite sure why-was this more in a dealer capacity and also you mention this batch of buses which don't seem to be in trade magazines and the same with the volvo/centros-they don't appear anywhere online either so I guess the question I'm really asking is are there specific companies which approach you offering to sell certain buses or a special magazine or something listing them as certainly the 59 reg centros I never saw advertised anywhere?

Abellio is what was Tellings Golden Millar, then Travel London.  They have been in the London market now for a few years.  The buses in my opinion are over priced, they will struggle to sell them as they are 2 door, Ex-London, and not really suitable for provincial spec.  I sold the 2 x 2005 MPD's having acquired them we lost some work, and quality standards changed in the South West, were in effect there is now a 10 year age limit due to contractual specifications, Euro 4 in Bristol and the vehicles were only 18 months from this limit.  The only option would be somewhere in the West Midlands and we already have too many small vehicles.  Having been in this industry since I was 8, you get to know a lot of people, especially people who are selling something.  We were offered the 59 plate Centro's, they were taken as part exchange by a manufacturer.  A lot of people email me or one of my colleagues, if they believe they have something which we would be interested in.

Thanks again for your reply Simon These buses have been for sale for ages so clearly wrongly priced and I agree there are too many smaller buses in the west midlands. I thought as much as rotala have acquired buses which haven't appeared on the open market which I was just curious about.

[PM]

15 vehicles and I think the PVR for the 4/4H/4M is 15, but guess any new acquired buses will be for Redditch unless any buses for Tividale will allow buses such as the 30832-4 and 30940-3 to move to Redditch.

Will any of the cadets get repainted into the new diamond livery as i guess the 51 and 02 reg ones are DDA compliant.

We need to acquire a few spare buses for the South West, however our main focus is Redditch/Kidderminster.  It may be that having acquired something it may make sense to re-shuffle things.  Until we know what we are doing it is difficult to comment.

Our priority in terms of painting is the Redditch/Kidderminster fleet we are keeping, and the new buses we have inbound for everywhere else.

It really does sound like wessex is doing well at the moment with further contract wins etc and glad to hear that potentially 15 more buses will be acquired for the rotala group and some for redditch and kidderminster.

Would it be fair to say that the 15 buses are of the longer single deck variety and a type already operated?

Also, could similar to what happened in november 2011 to the central connect fleet-could all references to red diamond/black diamond/blue diamond be removed even if buses aren't repainted to give a more unified branding across the fleet?

Could fleet numberings be tidied up a bit-for instance all MPDs put in the 2050. series and buses of a similar type all put together?

In time, will all the plaxton primos be sold-are they just not as good as solos-just interested as never actually been on one

Thanks

[Simon Dunn]

Simon,

I assume you aready aware of the 03 plate E300 currently for sale at Southdown PSV?

http://www.southdownpsv.co.uk/sales/bus_details.php?bus=247

Or

2007 Scania/Wright (3 ex Reading) & 4 x Scania Omnicity (56 plate)?

http://www.nigelmccree.com/

Do the turnover figures released today with Rotala Plc half yearly report included much of a contribution from the newly acquired RH & KR operations?

1.  I want to upgrade the fleet, although I have acquired older buses my preference is to look at newer vehicles than these. 
2.  There are a number of reasons why, these are of no interest
      I made an offer recently on some Scania's (not these).  I don't value the vehicles as being worth what Mr McCree wants for them. 
     The Scania's that we operate, are poor on fuel. 
     Priority for long buses in our fleet is Redditch, and these would represent another variation of vehicle.
     We have made an offer on 15 vehicles for wihch we are awaiting a response.
   
3.  Interim Numbers.

Redditch was acquired on 2nd March @ 2359 hrs.  The interims represent the period up to 31st May 2013, and therefore are nearly 3 months.

Simon thanks for your reply,

1. Although the 03 plate E300 isn't that new, as I understand it there were limited numbers built during the 2003-8 period, the later ones were generally with 3 + 2 seating configuration for schools work
2. I was thinking more along the lines of any acquired Scania's going in to Wessex thus releasing similar aged Volvo's to Diamond whether it be Redditch or Tividale to keep the number of vehicle types to a minimum, obviously Scania's do have a reputation for being a bit thirsty on fuel.... but again there appear to be limited numbers of newer second-hand full size buses available, First Group are also after nearly new buses as well.
3. Rotala Plc turnover for the half year fell £1.850 Million to £26.665 Million over the same period a year earlier, obviously this was despite a 3 month contribution from the acquired RH & KR businesses. Is the majority of the drop in turnover attributed to reduced tendered work at Diamond and the loss of NX coach work by Flights Hallmark? Wessex & Preston both appear to be growing.
4. Do Rotala Plc anticipate / have sufficient headroom to make any further acquisitions or plan to setup in any new areas prior to year end?
5. Are the 15 vehicles you have made an offer for all the from a batch? or made up of a number of types?
6. Do you currently anticipate retaining Church Road depot in Redditch after the current lease expires?
7. Do the 4 x 13 plate B7RLE/Wright @ Tividale i.e. 30940-30943 form Rotala Plc's commitment to the Brierley Hill BBA bid? Or are others new buses due?

1.  I believe some were built in 2009. 
2.  The Scania's are too big for the Contracts or not new enough for replacing the 57 plates.
3.  In the Interim Announcement which is available on our Plc Web site, it gives a list of areas were the revenue has dropped.  The West Midlands features on that list, but the poor weather has contributed also.
4.  Yes
5.  We have recieved feed back today from the manufacturer.  Of the batch some are New, 1 year old and 3 years old.  We are not interested in the price on the 3 year old kit.  We believe there is better value in the New and 1 year old, we are at present still negotiating the final price.
6.  At the present moment in time to service the fleet, Church Road is required.  We have 3 options, 1 maintain the current position, 2.  Invest in the current depot, extend the workshop and facilities.  3.  Move somewhere different altogether.  Now we have the OFT result, we need to review and consider our options.
7.  We are not part of any BBA bid.

[Simon Dunn]

Hi Simon, Thanks for joining the forum and taking our questions. I have 3 questions that aren't really that "constructive", I am just asking for personal curiosity! Firstly now that 30804 is the only nifty fifty left, are there any plans to re-upgrade the 50 or will it continue to be a mish mash of any buses? Secondly I remember a while back you trialled a 35E service but the service seemed very short lived, I just wondered now that competition on the 50 has stepped up, would it be a considerable option to re introduce the 35 service to boost Diamonds overall frequency between Moseley/KH and Birmingham and combine day ticket options? Finally have Diamond ever looked at operating on the Outer Circle in the past or recently?
Looking forward to your reply!

1.  50 Service - What we currently do is under review.
2.  35E - I am not sure I remember this service.  What was it?
3.  No.

[Simon Dunn]

15 vehicles and I think the PVR for the 4/4H/4M is 15, but guess any new acquired buses will be for Redditch unless any buses for Tividale will allow buses such as the 30832-4 and 30940-3 to move to Redditch.

Will any of the cadets get repainted into the new diamond livery as i guess the 51 and 02 reg ones are DDA compliant.

We need to acquire a few spare buses for the South West, however our main focus is Redditch/Kidderminster.  It may be that having acquired something it may make sense to re-shuffle things.  Until we know what we are doing it is difficult to comment.

Our priority in terms of painting is the Redditch/Kidderminster fleet we are keeping, and the new buses we have inbound for everywhere else.

It really does sound like wessex is doing well at the moment with further contract wins etc and glad to hear that potentially 15 more buses will be acquired for the rotala group and some for redditch and kidderminster.

Would it be fair to say that the 15 buses are of the longer single deck variety and a type already operated?

Also, could similar to what happened in november 2011 to the central connect fleet-could all references to red diamond/black diamond/blue diamond be removed even if buses aren't repainted to give a more unified branding across the fleet?

Could fleet numberings be tidied up a bit-for instance all MPDs put in the 2050. series and buses of a similar type all put together?

In time, will all the plaxton primos be sold-are they just not as good as solos-just interested as never actually been on one

Thanks

1.  Of the buses we are looking at, they are all either 37 or 40 plus seats.
2.  The intention over time is that the fleet moves to all Blue
3.  It will be difficult to re-label fleet numbers, unless there is something which is in just wrongly in the wrong sequence.
4.  I believe the Mercedes Engine Solo is the best small bus.  We have some primo's left and we are working at putting them all into fleet.

[PM]

15 vehicles and I think the PVR for the 4/4H/4M is 15, but guess any new acquired buses will be for Redditch unless any buses for Tividale will allow buses such as the 30832-4 and 30940-3 to move to Redditch.

Will any of the cadets get repainted into the new diamond livery as i guess the 51 and 02 reg ones are DDA compliant.

We need to acquire a few spare buses for the South West, however our main focus is Redditch/Kidderminster.  It may be that having acquired something it may make sense to re-shuffle things.  Until we know what we are doing it is difficult to comment.

Our priority in terms of painting is the Redditch/Kidderminster fleet we are keeping, and the new buses we have inbound for everywhere else.

It really does sound like wessex is doing well at the moment with further contract wins etc and glad to hear that potentially 15 more buses will be acquired for the rotala group and some for redditch and kidderminster.

Would it be fair to say that the 15 buses are of the longer single deck variety and a type already operated?

Also, could similar to what happened in november 2011 to the central connect fleet-could all references to red diamond/black diamond/blue diamond be removed even if buses aren't repainted to give a more unified branding across the fleet?

Could fleet numberings be tidied up a bit-for instance all MPDs put in the 2050. series and buses of a similar type all put together?

In time, will all the plaxton primos be sold-are they just not as good as solos-just interested as never actually been on one

Thanks

1.  Of the buses we are looking at, they are all either 37 or 40 plus seats.
2.  The intention over time is that the fleet moves to all Blue
3.  It will be difficult to re-label fleet numbers, unless there is something which is in just wrongly in the wrong sequence.
4.  I believe the Mercedes Engine Solo is the best small bus.  We have some primo's left and we are working at putting them all into fleet.

1. So some adl e200s and e300s are on the way then or possibly streetlites/versas-not b7rles
2. great as the blue looks smart
3. Just thinking of 21009 which seems a bit of a random choice of number as it suggests it is non-dda?
4. I agree with you from a passenger perspective and when you say we are working at putting them all into fleet-does that mean some are going to re-enter service?

Thanks again