Vehicle Transfers

[Tony]

Well the us division is in the )hit isn't it

No

[winston]

Well the us division is in the )hit isn't it

The majority of NX Group is performing well, growing both profits & turnover including the US. NXWM part of the UK Bus Division (inc Dundee) are far from being in the sh*t, but profits have peaked and are now falling, whilst turnover growth is also now stagnating.....

As an example between NX UK Bus & First UK Bus:

NX (UK Bus):

Turnover = £287 Million
Operating Profit = £35.5 Million

First (UK Bus)

Turnover = £862 Million
Operating Profit = £37 Million

First's Bus Fleet is approx 4 x larger than NX

[BN]

WN is approaching it's all time high allocation of circa 220.

The overall NXWM allocation had been steadily growing, however, as a result of the East Birmingham cuts, it's going the opposite way again.

213 when all of BC's buses turn up.

[monkeyjoe]

i take it back though, but i will say those are not the greatest profits margins. No wonder you dont get that many independents these days.

[winston]

i take it back though, but i will say those are not the greatest profits margins. No wonder you dont get that many independents these days.

Long gone are the days of WMT/TWM earning 20-25% profit margins, Tayside produced similar margins in the early years following takeover, they are now generating approx 6% margins from memory.

[BK63 YWP]

Could Dundee be sold off as it's soo far from the West Midlands and giving them brums Geminis must have cost a lot to send up there ? It must cost a lot to have its own operations team i.e. directors, managers, HR and supervisors

[DavieDD2]

Who's to say that isn't in the pipeline? there's no NX branding on our buses now, it's Xplore Dundee

[don]

You have to remember we are 11 years into an austerity programme - two of the major groups are investigating wider use of minibuses - this is because making a profit from running buses is becoming harder especially in some types of areas like small towns.

This is not new - the last time such a government programme operated lots of areas were subjected to horrendous bread van type transport, eventually extending to larger built up areas such as Torbay etc, whilst other public services reached collapse.

So groups finding it harder to make profits is a phenomena likely to get worse, not better - as costs all around have increased and will eventually find their way into either reduced service standards, lower profit to turnover or higher customer costs - more likely a combination of the three.

[PM]

You have to remember we are 11 years into an austerity programme - two of the major groups are investigating wider use of minibuses - this is because making a profit from running buses is becoming harder especially in some types of areas like small towns.

This is not new - the last time such a government programme operated lots of areas were subjected to horrendous bread van type transport, eventually extending to larger built up areas such as Torbay etc, whilst other public services reached collapse.

So groups finding it harder to make profits is a phenomena likely to get worse, not better - as costs all around have increased and will eventually find their way into either reduced service standards, lower profit to turnover or higher customer costs - more likely a combination of the three.

Minibuses that greatly increased patronage you mean?

[GeminiFan1991]

@paulb1973 I must commend yourself for compiling a fairly easy to understand yet a concise list.

Quite surprised to see BC has gone down to 2nd in terms of vehicles allocated although if the B7RLE's transferred out then that number would further go down.

Nice to see AG getting more Geminis ;)

Little ol BY is just treading along with 49 buses !

[don]

Minibuses that greatly increased patronage you mean?

A moot point - if you have to wait until the 6th one to arrive to actually get on, and then get subjected to a bone shaking ride (no ride at all if you're disabled) and very likely to have to stand - then that is just a s**t service designed to line the pockets of the provider. I'm describing Torquay, which also has quite a large population of elderly people and for whom bus travel was pergatory at the hands of the entrepreneur.

Look at it now it's run by Stagecoach - modern vehicles for the most part - trunk routes on a high frequency and very good patronage (deckers running to capacity in the summer).

That is why I'm worried about going backwards. Remember back then the PM of the day was famously quoted as saying buses were provided for losers. I think the view of the Tory party may have shifted a bit since then as they seem willing to invest in rail to an extent these days but they're also not very clear on their overall transport policy.

Another big fan of Paul Burr's lists here.

[paulb1973]

@paulb1973 I must commend yourself for compiling a fairly easy to understand yet a concise list.

Quite surprised to see BC has gone down to 2nd in terms of vehicles allocated although if the B7RLE's transferred out then that number would further go down.

Nice to see AG getting more Geminis ;)

Little ol BY is just treading along with 49 buses !

I have that list on a Word document, so easy to update - it was a actually a style used by Tony when lots of transfers occurred last year. I just carried it on.

For completeness this should be the Xplore Dundee active [bus & coach] fleet barring any further withdrawals:
2 Volvo B9R/Caetano (111-2)
5 Wright StreetLite (431-5)
4 Dennis Dart/E200 (731-4)
43 Volvo B7RLE (1774-87; 2030-58)
10 Volvo B7TL/President (4025-26/28/36/76/117/121-124)
43 Volvo B7TL/Wright Gemini (4680-6; 4700-17; 7001-18)
9 ADL E400H (5422-30)
1 Volvo B7L/Wright (7067)
___
117

Other Xplore Dundee vehicles:
Crew Bus 7427 (SP16 UZU) [1]
Trainers 1366/7151 [2]


I have 34 as the total for the NX Training fleet (one further 14xx example and 4131/4520/4697 are new additions) :
1344-45/49-50/55/68/77/84-86; 1408/21/32/34/50/52; 1462-Static Trainer; 1501/5/8-9/12/14; 1689; 3601; 4131; 4520; 4697; 9023 (M723 KPD);
9057 (BT57 ENJ); 9315 (P315 DVE); 9951/9959; 9xxx (BX54 ZWV).


The NXWM withdrawn/reserve fleet totals 69 (listed below) assuming no further sales have taken place:
687(PN) [1]

1427(PN)/1436(WA)/1447(MS)/1449(MS)/1461(MS) [5]

1507(MS) [1]

1589(PN)/1647(PN) [2]

4023(GB)/4032(PN)/4033(MS)/4062(MS)/4063(MS)/4065(PN)/4066(PN)/4067(MS)/4068(PN)/4070(MS)/4071(MS)/4072(PN)/4073(PN)/4079(PN)
4087(MS)/4094(MS)/4097(??)/4100(MS)/4104(GB) [19]
(GB = with Green Bus)

4128(PN)/4129res/4130r(??)/4132r(??)/4138(PN)/4156(??)/4158r(MS)/4159r(MS)/4160r(??)/4162r(??)/4165(??)/4174(BC)/4175r(MS)/4181r(??)/4182r(MS)
4183r(??)/4186(MS)/4187r(MS)/4188r(MS)/4189r(MS)/4191(PN)/4192res/4199(??)/4200(??)/4201res/4202(PN)/4205(CV) [27]
(Garage reserves: 4129 at CV / 4192 at CV / 4201 – unallocated)

4232(MS) [1]

6012(CV)/6016(CV) [2]

6022(MS)/6023(MS)/6024(MS)/6025(MS)/6026(MS)/6027(MS)/6028(MS)/6029(MS)/6030(MS)/6031(MS)/6032(MS) [11 - all in reserve]


Some of these locations may be out of date. Do the Green Bus still hold onto 4023/4104? - if they had those in the first place.

[Sayeed]

4023/4104?

Saw 4104 parked on Fellows lane earlier

[winston]

Quite surprised to see BC has gone down to 2nd in terms of vehicles allocated although if the B7RLE's transferred out then that number would further go down.

The reduced vehicle requirement at BC from 4th June has allowed all non-compliant  Y-reg Tridents to be cascaded elsewhere or withdrawn, the spare B7RLE's from the 58 & 59 are staying as a result

[Tony]

The following reserve Tridents are currently the 'active' reserve fleet so will turn up at various places

4129; 4192 (currently at Coventry but probably moving very soon)
4162; 4169; 4183 (currently at BC and may appear tomorrow on the 501, but will probably move elsewhere afterwards)