WM Bus Photos Forum

Couple of updates have been added to the TfWM Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

Looks like the 46/46A and 169 services are to be withdrawn.

For the 46/46A it just states at present:
"From 20th July, these services will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

It would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

The 61 service is also being revised:
"From 20th July, this service will operate a revised route and timetable. It will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane and instead operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

This withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27"

Service 169:
"From 20th July, this service will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

The amount of typing errors on that website is unbelievable! For a start, it says that the changes will be happening from June 20th and the withdrawn 48A will apparently be operating a revised route and timetable to cover for the 46/46A and if it not mistaken, the frequency of the 48 is already 20 mins. 

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 07:40:45 PMCouple of updates have been added to the TfWM Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

Looks like the 46/46A and 169 services are to be withdrawn.

For the 46/46A it just states at present:
"From 20th July, these services will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

It would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

The 61 service is also being revised:
"From 20th July, this service will operate a revised route and timetable. It will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane and instead operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

This withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27"

Service 169:
"From 20th July, this service will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 07:40:45 PMCouple of updates have been added to the TfWM Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

Looks like the 46/46A and 169 services are to be withdrawn.

For the 46/46A it just states at present:
"From 20th July, these services will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

It would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

The 61 service is also being revised:
"From 20th July, this service will operate a revised route and timetable. It will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane and instead operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

This withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27"

Service 169:
"From 20th July, this service will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 07:40:45 PMCouple of updates have been added to the TfWM Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

Looks like the 46/46A and 169 services are to be withdrawn.

For the 46/46A it just states at present:
"From 20th July, these services will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

It would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

The 61 service is also being revised:
"From 20th July, this service will operate a revised route and timetable. It will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane and instead operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

This withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27"

Service 169:
"From 20th July, this service will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

I hope they don't do the same to the A9, presuming the 169 and 46/46A don't make enough, never see anyone get on the 169

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 07:40:45 PMIt would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

Actually, now I read that page again, unless there's some 'crossed-wires', there will be a 48A instead?

"From Sunday 20th June, service 48A will be operating a revised timetable and route. Due to the withdrawal of services 46 and 46A, the frequency of which this service operates will be increased to every 20 minutes the route will also be extended past Northfield to Frankley to maintain service coverage. "

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 08:04:28 PMActually, now I read that page again, unless there's some 'crossed-wires', there will be a 48A instead?

"From Sunday 20th June, service 48A will be operating a revised timetable and route. Due to the withdrawal of services 46 and 46A, the frequency of which this service operates will be increased to every 20 minutes the route will also be extended past Northfield to Frankley to maintain service coverage. "

Why withdraw the 48A only to bring it back again???????

Quote from: Ingleboro261F on June 05, 2025, 08:06:17 PMWhy withdraw the 48A only to bring it back again???????

Guessing there could be an error here somewhere. I'm guessing either the 27 will cover the Northfield to Hawkesley link and the 48 will go to Frankley maybe.

Also the A9 would be the only Birmingham route still to run from Rugby it it remains unchanged?
Edit - I forgot for a minute, there is the 41 also as well.

Quote from: 2206 on June 05, 2025, 08:09:54 PMGuessing there is could be an error here somewhere. I'm guessing either the 27 will cover the Hawkesley link and the 48 will go to Frankley maybe.

Also the A9 would be the only Birmingham route still to run from Rugby it it remains unchanged?

Must be making good money for tfwm 

I think the 48 is being extended to Hawkesley to replace the 46/46A - not too sure of the frequency of the extension - and the 27 is being switched with the 61 on the section of route mentioned.

The text explaining these changes needs a complete rewrite, it's all over the place.
 

Quote from: Ingleboro261F on June 05, 2025, 08:02:02 PMI hope they don't do the same to the A9, presuming the 169 and 46/46A don't make enough, never see anyone get on the 169

I do occasionally get the 169 - mainly on Saturdays if I need to go to Kings Heath or Shirley.

It was very convenient for me when it ran along Westridge Road, but just as useful now it serves Trittiford Road.

It is not very well used though, that is true, but the main issue I see is the reliability - it regularly runs late due to traffic delays, so people just can't rely on it to turn up as scheduled. Kings Heath is not a bus-friendly terminus point any more!

Also now, there are few parts of the route that are not covered by other services, and even on those parts, there are no marked bus stops, and very few passengers use it. 

If there must be a bus service serving those roads between Yardley Wood station and Haslucks Green Road, it would be better off using mini-buses due to all the parked cars round there.

QuoteGuessing there could be an error here somewhere. I'm guessing either the 27 will cover the Northfield to Hawkesley link and the 48 will go to Frankley maybe.

Also the A9 would be the only Birmingham route still to run from Rugby it it remains unchanged?
Edit - I forgot for a minute, there is the 41 also as well.

Watch... this space...

The incompetence of TfWM is truly staggering. They couldn't have got those updates more wrong even if they'd deliberately set out to mislead.

Quote from: Mike K on June 05, 2025, 08:35:53 PMThe incompetence of TfWM is truly staggering. They couldn't have got those updates more wrong even if they'd deliberately set out to mislead.

I assume the page will be updated and corrected once other details get confirmed. It's early days yet!

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 08:46:31 PMI assume the page will be updated and corrected once other details get confirmed. It's early days yet!

No doubt it will be.  It would have been better for TfWM to wait a week or two until more details of any replacements were known before announcing route withdrawals.

Another regrettable inaccuracy is that the 46/46A do not serve Frankley.  Did they mean Hawkesley?

Quote from: SO6597 on June 05, 2025, 08:19:47 PMI think the 48 is being extended to Hawkesley to replace the 46/46A - not too sure of the frequency of the extension - and the 27 is being switched with the 61 on the section of route mentioned.

The text explaining these changes needs a complete rewrite, it's all over the place.
 

Did the 61 and 27 not swap routes in this area previously?

Quote from: MasterPlan on June 05, 2025, 09:36:41 PMDid the 61 and 27 not swap routes in this area previously?

Yes, they did. 

Fitting that the announcement of the 46/A withdrawal is mired in confusion - much like the chequered history of the route itself. A curious episode from start to finish!

Quote from: MasterPlan on June 05, 2025, 09:36:41 PMDid the 61 and 27 not swap routes in this area previously?

It's quite the change for some roads going from a service direct to the city every 10/12 minutes to a service to Bournville and Kings Heath every 30 minutes.

As a Bristol road driver, I'm happy for the 61 changes.

QuoteCouple of updates have been added to the TfWM Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

Looks like the 46/46A and 169 services are to be withdrawn.

For the 46/46A it just states at present:
"From 20th July, these services will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

It would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

The 61 service is also being revised:
"From 20th July, this service will operate a revised route and timetable. It will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane and instead operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

This withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27"

Service 169:
"From 20th July, this service will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

These look like theyve disappeared from the website

With the 46,46A & 169 destined to be withdrawn, what does this leave the 41 and A9 at? New operator?
Edit: the 41 appears to be admin cancelled alongside the A9

QuoteMust be making good money for tfwm

Also forgot the 41 that goes QE to Heartlands 

Quote from: the trainbasher on June 06, 2025, 09:13:56 AMThese look like theyve disappeared from the website

I'm going to assume that while updating that page, someone at TfWM mistakenly published the update before it was ready.

Quote from: BBS on June 06, 2025, 10:30:09 AMWith the 46,46A & 169 destined to be withdrawn, what does this leave the 41 and A9 at? New operator?

I guess we'll have to wait and see for now, undoubtedly there are further changes expected as Stagecoach had all those tendered contracts as a package.

QuoteI'm going to assume that while updating that page, someone at TfWM mistakenly published the update before it was ready.
I guess we'll have to wait and see for now, undoubtedly there are further changes expected as Stagecoach had all those tendered contracts as a package.

As checked, the 41 and A9 are admin cancelled too

Quote from: BBS on June 06, 2025, 10:41:11 AMAs checked, the 41 and A9 are admin cancelled too

All bus routes operating wholly within the West Midlands area were Admin Cancelled in 2023 when TfWM took over the role as registration authority.

Quote from: BBS on June 06, 2025, 10:30:09 AMWith the 46,46A & 169 destined to be withdrawn, what does this leave the 41 and A9 at? New operator?
Edit: the 41 appears to be admin cancelled alongside the A9

What does admin cancelled mean?

13 Birmingham to Oldbury, axed
13A Birmingham to Blackheath, to become 13 with change of route between Hurst Road and Bleakhouse Road, every 20 minutes 
12 Birmingham to Dudley, every 20 minutes 
12A axed

Quote from: Stu on June 05, 2025, 07:40:45 PMCouple of updates have been added to the TfWM Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

Looks like the 46/46A and 169 services are to be withdrawn.

For the 46/46A it just states at present:
"From 20th July, these services will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

It would appear that the 48 is going to be extended further, from Northfield to Frankley, as a result of the 46/46A withdrawal.

The 61 service is also being revised:
"From 20th July, this service will operate a revised route and timetable. It will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane and instead operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

This withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27"

Service 169:
"From 20th July, this service will be withdrawn and replaced by services operating a revised route and/or timetable."

i wonder if the "revised timetable" 46/46A is the X20 increasing to every 20 minutes to account between bell hill and the QE, and then to fit in with the X21/X22. and then the 48 is to go to hawkesley maybe?? i can't see why they would extend the 48 to frankley when there's already a number of routes between northfield and frankley.

wonder if they'll also send the X20 in to weoley castle square to make it the fastest route from WC to the city centre as it goes straight to the QE instead of the long route that the X21 does.

Quote from: keyy927 on June 13, 2025, 11:22:57 AMi wonder if the "revised timetable" 46/46A is the X20 increasing to every 20 minutes to account between bell hill and the QE, and then to fit in with the X21/X22. and then the 48 is to go to hawkesley maybe?? i can't see why they would extend the 48 to frankley when there's already a number of routes between northfield and frankley.

wonder if they'll also send the X20 in to weoley castle square to make it the fastest route from WC to the city centre as it goes straight to the QE instead of the long route that the X21 does.

The X20 isn't being changed and Stu has posted the details off the TfWM page, so wondering why you're suggesting he has the 48 incorrect

Quote from: CJS47 on June 13, 2025, 12:59:44 AM13 Birmingham to Oldbury, axed
13A Birmingham to Blackheath, to become 13 with change of route between Hurst Road and Bleakhouse Road, every 20 minutes
12 Birmingham to Dudley, every 20 minutes
12A axed

Where can i find out more of this 

Quote from: Appleby on June 13, 2025, 01:38:44 PMWhere can i find out more of this

On the TfWM website, once details have been officially confirmed.  :rolleyes:

Quote from: Tony on June 13, 2025, 11:34:39 AMThe X20 isn't being changed and Stu has posted the details off the TfWM page, so wondering why you're suggesting he has the 48 incorrect

nobody said stu was incorrect hello..? the changes they posted obviously weren't complete because the spelling was horrible, the changes were taken down and things change? dunno why it seems to be a problem to you ??

Quote from: CJS47 on June 13, 2025, 12:59:44 AM13 Birmingham to Oldbury, axed
13A Birmingham to Blackheath, to become 13 with change of route between Hurst Road and Bleakhouse Road, every 20 minutes
12 Birmingham to Dudley, every 20 minutes
12A axed

yes saw this on WB drivers newsletter, been expecting major changes for a while now regarding 12s 13s

Quote from: 2900 on June 14, 2025, 09:31:34 AMyes saw this on WB drivers newsletter, been expecting major changes for a while now regarding 12s 13s

Those are certainly interesting changes, I presume there will be some other associated changes to accommodate the withdrawal of the 12A and 13.

One complaint I often hear is of overcrowding on these routes, particularly between city centre and Bearwood. I would hope that from September, then there may be additional peak-time journeys added to timetables.

Quote from: Stu on June 14, 2025, 10:09:09 AMThose are certainly interesting changes, I presume there will be some other associated changes to accommodate the withdrawal of the 12 and 13.

One complaint I often hear is of overcrowding on these routes, particularly between city centre and Bearwood. I would hope that from September, then there may be additional peak-time journeys added to timetables.

No need for extra boards imo. They're only overcrowded and skipping stops when singles are on, not an issue with deckers

Quote from: ZF B7 on June 14, 2025, 10:43:36 AMNo need for extra boards imo. They're only overcrowded and skipping stops when singles are on, not an issue with decker

Quote from: Stu on June 14, 2025, 10:09:09 AMThose are certainly interesting changes, I presume there will be some other associated changes to accommodate the withdrawal of the 12 and 13.

One complaint I often hear is of overcrowding on these routes, particularly between city centre and Bearwood. I would hope that from September, then there may be additional peak-time journeys added to timetables.

I'm hoping that when the new Electric order goes into service that more Omnilinks are withdrawn and reduce the use of single deckers on routes normally double deckers. It's better than it has been but to stop overcrowding more of these need to go

Quote from: ZF B7 on June 14, 2025, 10:43:36 AMNo need for extra boards imo. They're only overcrowded and skipping stops when singles are on, not an issue with deckers

Looks like they are reducing the frequency between Birmingham and Bearwood from 7/8 to 10 minutes, if so extra peak journeys may be required. 

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 14, 2025, 11:03:20 AMI'm hoping that when the new Electric order goes into service that more Omnilinks are withdrawn and reduce the use of single deckers on routes normally double deckers. It's better than it has been but to stop overcrowding more of these need to go

It's not just Omnilinks though is it? Look how many B7RLE's there are!

Quote from: Jack on June 14, 2025, 12:11:25 PMIt's not just Omnilinks though is it? Look how many B7RLE's there are!

To be fair I don't think those are going to be withdrawn anytime soon.

Quote from: Jack on June 14, 2025, 12:11:25 PMIt's not just Omnilinks though is it? Look how many B7RLE's there are!

Very true, the Ominlinks though are older, new in 2007-2010, the B7RE's were new 2011-2013

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 14, 2025, 12:18:05 PMVery true, the Ominlinks though are older, new in 2007-2010, the B7RE's were new 2011-2013

That doesn't excuse it, when a lot more of the Omnilinks are gone you still have the issue of too many singles! So I can't see much changing. 

You've still got the shed E200MMC's as well.

Quote from: Jack on June 14, 2025, 12:23:54 PMThat doesn't excuse it, when a lot more of the Omnilinks are gone you still have the issue of too many singles! So I can't see much changing.

You've still got the shed E200MMC's as well.

There are around 100 Omnilinks left, around 150 B7RE's and around 40 E200MMC's left. That's around 290 single deckers that seat 43-45 passengers. If most of the Ominlinks go then that's a big reduction.

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 14, 2025, 12:41:27 PMThere are around 100 Omnilinks left, around 150 B7RE's and around 40 E200MMC's left. That's around 290 single deckers that seat 43-45 passengers. If most of the Ominlinks go then that's a big reduction.

Plus 89 E200s (including the short ones) - so about 290 single deckers would remain once all the Omnilinks have gone (there's just short of 120 currently, including the remaining ex Scottish vehicles 70xx series), plus any electric single deckers which may appear (CV). 

13 going means that anyone wanting an alternate service in warley will have to walk 10 to 15mins extra. this isnt too big of a problem for the young but what about the elderly???

12A going means that people would have to walk downhill/uphill. a minor inconvenience for the youth but a major problem for the elderly and those with poorer mobillity

going from having effectively no walking to do to walking 15mins for the same bus is a good incentive to buy a car!

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 15, 2025, 10:39:46 PM13 going means that anyone wanting an alternate service in warley will have to walk 10 to 15mins extra. this isnt too big of a problem for the young but what about the elderly???

12A going means that people would have to walk downhill/uphill. a minor inconvenience for the youth but a major problem for the elderly and those with poorer mobillity

going from having effectively no walking to do to walking 15mins for the same bus is a good incentive to buy a car!

If you knew what finacial pressure the bus industry in under a whole then you wouldn't be making comments like this !

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 15, 2025, 10:58:17 PMIf you knew what finacial pressure the bus industry in under a whole then you wouldn't be making comments like this !

Not an untrue comment to make though was it?

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 15, 2025, 10:58:17 PMIf you knew what finacial pressure the bus industry in under a whole then you wouldn't be making comments like this !

both can be true though, no? as in the industry can be under pressure, but there is still a very heavy negative for elderly people who may not be able to drive and therefore do rely on buses like the 12A and 13. your comment is very monetary & quite honestly narrow minded, especially if this isn't a problem for you because you're not an OAP who has mobility issues. what should they do?

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 15, 2025, 10:58:17 PMIf you knew what finacial pressure the bus industry in under a whole then you wouldn't be making comments like this !

Completely narrow minded and selfish comment from you as per usual...

Nice to see NX are once again going to leave people stranded! Shame a local service like the 121 can't return to give Tower Road a bus, that's awfully steep hill and quite a walk to the nearest service especially if you live far enough up! Tower Road does also have custom so i'm surprised there's not a replacement service at least for that road. Salop Road lost the 48A and was given the 54 rerouted, surprised nothings been done for Tower Road!

Quote from: Jack on June 16, 2025, 12:31:07 AMCompletely narrow minded and selfish comment from you as per usual...

Nice to see NX are once again going to leave people stranded! Shame a local service like the 121 can't return to give Tower Road a bus, that's awfully steep hill and quite a walk to the nearest service especially if you live far enough up! Tower Road does also have custom so i'm surprised there's not a replacement service at least for that road. Salop Road lost the 48A and was given the 54 rerouted, surprised nothings been done for Tower Road!

The full details of the changes haven't even been announced yet. Might be good to wait and see before rushing ahead.

It could even be possible another service in that area will be rerouted to cover. 14?

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 15, 2025, 10:39:46 PM13 going means that anyone wanting an alternate service in warley will have to walk 10 to 15mins extra. this isnt too big of a problem for the young but what about the elderly???

The new 13 (13A) is Bleakhouse Road, then George Road, Bristnall Hall Road, Salop Road, Hurst Road, then Abbey Road. 

Is there any parts of the network that seem fairly stable?

One time they tried to do a major change on the Bloxwich routes, there was uproar & they ended up changing them back!

The arrangement of current services here seems pretty solid, so other than possible timetable changes, nothing major ought to happen?

Quote from: Westy on June 16, 2025, 04:23:45 AMIs there any parts of the network that seem fairly stable?

One time they tried to do a major change on the Bloxwich routes, there was uproar & they ended up changing them back!

The arrangement of current services here seems pretty solid, so other than possible timetable changes, nothing major ought to happen?

I vividly remember the Bloxwich debacle that cost WMT/WMB (and some jobs!) and caused huge reputational damage to the business, though Choice and Chase were gifted a fantastic opportunity which paid dividends.

Much of the network that I use, know of and have experience with seems pretty stable - I know the changes to PN15 has caused a few issues, but you can't win them all!

Quote from: Wumpty on June 16, 2025, 08:35:04 AMI vividly remember the Bloxwich debacle that cost WMT/WMB (and some jobs!) and caused huge reputational damage to the business, though Choice and Chase were gifted a fantastic opportunity which paid dividends.

Much of the network that I use, know of and have experience with seems pretty stable - I know the changes to PN15 has caused a few issues, but you can't win them all!

Biggest problem with pn15 was lack of communication flags and timetables not changed in tfwm land 
As of last week flags still said 15/15A

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 15, 2025, 10:58:17 PMIf you knew what finacial pressure the bus industry in under a whole then you wouldn't be making comments like this !

Get a load of this guy

Quote from: frostjay974 on June 16, 2025, 10:01:45 AMGet a load of this guy

Well when the Government increases your biggest cost (labour) by 2% in one go without that Labour (staff) seeing a penny of it that is a massive pressure to absorb.

Quote from: Tony on June 16, 2025, 10:44:03 AMWell when the Government increases your biggest cost (labour) by 2% in one go without that Labour (staff) seeing a penny of it that is a massive pressure to absorb.

I was just making what I thought was a valid comment, my wording probably should have better.

Quote13 going means that anyone wanting an alternate service in warley will have to walk 10 to 15mins extra. this isnt too big of a problem for the young but what about the elderly???

12A going means that people would have to walk downhill/uphill. a minor inconvenience for the youth but a major problem for the elderly and those with poorer mobillity

going from having effectively no walking to do to walking 15mins for the same bus is a good incentive to buy a car!

I'm as disappointed as you. The 128 is older than I am, it's a route that I thought would outlive me. But with the cuts we've seen to the 15, 17, 126 - among several others, I can't say I'm too surprised

 I'm very interested in how the 13(A) will be changed between Hurst Road and Bleakhouse Road, the Plough - Bristnall Hall - Moat Farm section of the route will be affected by this withdrawal. Langley - Oldbury less so with the 12.

I wonder if Joinings Bank and Causeway Green Road are about to receive a bus service to Birmingham after 15 years 

QuoteWell when the Government increases your biggest cost (labour) by 2% in one go without that Labour (staff) seeing a penny of it that is a massive pressure to absorb.

Isn't that effectively making the NX bus operations into a full on loss ?

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 16, 2025, 11:38:20 AMI was just making what I thought was a valid comment, my wording probably should have better.

I was agreeing with you. The 2% NI increase is one massive handicap for businesses who make profits in single percentage points

Quote from: Tony on June 16, 2025, 12:28:06 PMI was agreeing with you. The 2% NI increase is one massive handicap for businesses who make profits in single percentage points

I know you was agreeing with me, it was some of the other comments

Quote from: CJS47 on June 16, 2025, 02:19:19 AMThe new 13 (13A) is Bleakhouse Road, then George Road, Bristnall Hall Road, Salop Road, Hurst Road, then Abbey Road.

does it cover the areas that 13 would have?

warley just looks like a maze of beautiful houses and hills...

depends if NX are struggling as is which is yes (evidenced by them stopping bus restoration, grey livery) as tony said 2% increase in national insurance is mad money for a big company which would obviously equate to less profit and someone has to suffer from this. i think they base profitabillity on routes themselves  

i believe 12/13s isnt tendered and according to someone on the forum the routes "break even", so presumably the routes are a victim of the massive cost to get profits back, also a frequency reduction unsuprisingly. also, i wouldnt be suprised if more routes end up going

im only a veg i know hardly anything just going off what i heard!!

Quote from: karl724223 on June 16, 2025, 08:53:54 AMBiggest problem with pn15 was lack of communication flags and timetables not changed in tfwm land
As of last week flags still said 15/15A

the flags were a big problem in northfield too, they were only updated yesterday. the road map boards in town centres (idk what its called but the one that shows the roads, bus stops with codes (LA = longbridge island etc)) still haven't been updated in northfield, longbridge or bearwood. 

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 12:50:15 AMdepends if NX are struggling as is which is yes (evidenced by them stopping bus restoration, grey livery) as tony said 2% increase in national insurance is mad money for a big company which would obviously equate to less profit and someone has to suffer from this. i think they base profitabillity on routes themselves 

i believe 12/13s isnt tendered and according to someone on the forum the routes "break even", so presumably the routes are a victim of the massive cost to get profits back, also a frequency reduction unsuprisingly. also, i wouldnt be suprised if more routes end up going

im only a veg i know hardly anything just going off what i heard!!

i wonder if we're gonna have another "south birmingham bus change" on the horizon. except instead of just south birmingham, the entire city will see its bus routes reworked.

i'm no expert but there are probably multiple areas which would benefit from more services and some which would see no monetary difference with less - i could also expect to see a lot of routes curtailed or even partially/fully subsidised by TfWM. 

idk i just remember the 2018 SB changes being particularly big for no obvious reason (i was 11 so i wasn't smart back then, so if anyone knows do tell), and idk i feel like a major network reform is in order soon anyway considering the seemingly endless stream of small changes, complaints, and issues. 

I wouldn't think wholesale changes will be implemented with the prospect of franchising looming on the horizon. Thats when major changes might occur.

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 12:35:34 AMdoes it cover the areas that 13 would have?

warley just looks like a maze of beautiful houses and hills...

Someone replied earlier about the new 13 route:

Quote from: CJS47 on June 16, 2025, 02:19:19 AMThe new 13 (13A) is Bleakhouse Road, then George Road, Bristnall Hall Road, Salop Road, Hurst Road, then Abbey Road.

As I said earlier, I assume there are further 'as yet undocumented' changes that will be happening to cover the rest of the route.

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 12:35:34 AMdoes it cover the areas that 13 would have?

warley just looks like a maze of beautiful houses and hills...

Only four stops on George Road and Bristnall Hall Road.

Quote from: keyy927 on June 17, 2025, 02:39:10 AMi wonder if we're gonna have another "south birmingham bus change" on the horizon. except instead of just south birmingham, the entire city will see its bus routes reworked.

i'm no expert but there are probably multiple areas which would benefit from more services and some which would see no monetary difference with less - i could also expect to see a lot of routes curtailed or even partially/fully subsidised by TfWM.

idk i just remember the 2018 SB changes being particularly big for no obvious reason (i was 11 so i wasn't smart back then, so if anyone knows do tell), and idk i feel like a major network reform is in order soon anyway considering the seemingly endless stream of small changes, complaints, and issues.

most of the complaints wouldnt be sorted by renumbering or rerouting routes because most routes, unless its so major that big roads like Alum Rock Road arent served to increase punctuality for example. the big double decker birmingham routes people dont seem to have a problem with so i dont see them changng

nxwm are constantly making trial and error in a attempt to cater for the changing demands which is probably why routes are often changed good example is the acocks green 1

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 09:48:16 AMunless its so major that big roads like Alum Rock Road arent served to increase punctuality for example

which is probably why routes are often changed good example is the acocks green 1

The core of that route Acocks Green to Five Ways has remained mostly unchanged for decades. I think over 100 years old that route is?

Alum Rock Road, yes the parking and traffic are terrible along there especially on the section from Highfield Rd to Saltley Gate. But a lot of those stops between the Pelham and Saltley Gate are very well used & I don't think there is really an ideal alternate route.

Anyway I guess with a lot of changes there will be winners as well as losers, as 13A passengers in Brandhall, Blackheath will be going from 2bph to 3bph to Birmingham it appears.

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 09:48:16 AMmost of the complaints wouldnt be sorted by renumbering or rerouting routes because most routes, unless its so major that big roads like Alum Rock Road arent served to increase punctuality for example. the big double decker birmingham routes people dont seem to have a problem with so i dont see them changng

nxwm are constantly making trial and error in a attempt to cater for the changing demands which is probably why routes are often changed good example is the acocks green 1

tbh i'm not entirely sure about everywhere else but i only really hear complaints about buses local to me and if i had a penny everytime someone complained about the 45/47/63, i would be loaded. biggest route problems i've seen with the 45 is the area between longbridge and west heath since they took the 45 off longbridge lane and stuck it on coombes lane, the section in kings norton between aldi and shannon road because it serves 1 stop and is just long for the sake of being long - coverage wouldn't change if they used used the other, smaller segment of teviot grove, and then the terminus at the bottom of lickey road, which is just the worst place you could park a bus and everyone is well aware of that. 

QuoteThe full details of the changes haven't even been announced yet. Might be good to wait and see before rushing ahead.

It could even be possible another service in that area will be rerouted to cover. 14?

Unless the 14 stops serving Portway Hill, diverting it down Tower Road would make the route convoluted 

Quotethe flags were a big problem in northfield too, they were only updated yesterday. the road map boards in town centres (idk what its called but the one that shows the roads, bus stops with codes (LA = longbridge island etc)) still haven't been updated in northfield, longbridge or bearwood.

When the solihull changes were made, the flags for the new 630 and 631 were changed , but came with a catch where only a few of them changed. There were some that stayed as A15 and A12 1 month later...

Quote from: 2206 on June 17, 2025, 10:30:42 AMThe core of that route Acocks Green to Five Ways has remained mostly unchanged for decades. I think over 100 years old that route is?

Alum Rock Road, yes the parking and traffic are terrible along there especially on the section from Highfield Rd to Saltley Gate. But a lot of those stops between the Pelham and Saltley Gate are very well used & I don't think there is really an ideal alternate route.

Anyway I guess with a lot of changes there will be winners as well as losers, as 13A passengers in Brandhall, Blackheath will be going from 2bph to 3bph to Birmingham it appears.

agreed, but delays on the 14 for example would never really be fixed then. its either extreme overtiming, major delays at times or alum rock rd having no route. 

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 01:21:26 PMagreed, but delays on the 14 for example would never really be fixed then. its either extreme overtiming, major delays at times or alum rock rd having no route.

The only alternative I can think of that could maybe be done is having a short route terminating at Stechford or Ward End.

And then a longer route via Tile Cross either going via Washwood Heath Road with the 94/95 or taking Bordesley Green with the 97.

I'm not too sure that whoever thought it would be a good idea to get rid of the 13 had properly taken into consideration the fact that a very long and pretty steep Brookfields Road will no longer have a bus service. Depending on where you are, neither the 12 nor the 13* are exactly easily accessible, especially if we're talking elderly people.

And before anybody mentions 'the bus industry being under financial pressure' again, dare you try and say that to someone who will now have to struggle up a hill to get a bus!

in birmingham buses will get stuck on a daily and nothing can be done about it unless u make major changes that will cause major inconvenience. not easy to run a punctual service without extreme overtiming which is bad

good example is coventry rd
60 gets stuck on coventry rd, no real way to fix that but anyone beyond coventry rd can use X1/X2 for a quicker journey to brum.

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 04:36:31 PMin birmingham buses will get stuck on a daily and nothing can be done about it unless u make major changes that will cause major inconvenience. not easy to run a punctual service without extreme overtiming which is bad

good example is coventry rd
60 gets stuck on coventry rd, no real way to fix that but anyone beyond coventry rd can use X1/X2 for a quicker journey to brum.

Joe 90 has promised to sort it all out 

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 04:36:31 PMin birmingham buses will get stuck on a daily and nothing can be done about it unless u make major changes that will cause major inconvenience. not easy to run a punctual service without extreme overtiming which is bad

good example is coventry rd
60 gets stuck on coventry rd, no real way to fix that but anyone beyond coventry rd can use X1/X2 for a quicker journey to brum.

The routes concerned aren't exactly 'in Birmingham.' The roads concerned are have steep hills and are long roads.

These are in the Black Country (you should probably sort your geography out). which are ironically all on steep hills. So leave Tower Road and Brookfields Road without a bus at all with a lot of families and elderly who rely on these services that is purely awful.

Least on Salop Road which is another steep hill they've managed to reroute the 54 and keep it connected!

Also the 60 being compared to these services isn't a fair comparison, the 60 is main busy frequent service. The 12's and 13's etc are 2 buses an hour in their parts where they are standalone.

Quite unsure to why core East Brum services have actually been mentioned when they aren't even affected!

Quote from: Jack on June 17, 2025, 05:58:44 PMThe routes concerned aren't exactly 'in Birmingham.' The roads concerned are have steep hills and are long roads.

These are in the Black Country (you should probably sort your geography out). which are ironically all on steep hills. So leave Tower Road and Brookfields Road without a bus at all with a lot of families and elderly who rely on these services that is purely awful.

Least on Salop Road which is another steep hill they've managed to reroute the 54 and keep it connected!

Also the 60 being compared to these services isn't a fair comparison, the 60 is main busy frequent service. The 12's and 13's etc are 2 buses an hour in their parts where they are standalone.

Quite unsure to why core East Brum services have actually been mentioned when they aren't even affected!

was replying to @2206 regarding the delays, as i said in birmingham delays are inevitable, and giving the 60 as a example of what could possibly be done to help, remember service changes often come with timetabke improvements!. i agree with his idea of the 14E possibly. 

just because i didnt quote him doesnt mean i need your disrespctful remark.

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 17, 2025, 04:36:31 PMin birmingham buses will get stuck on a daily and nothing can be done about it unless u make major changes that will cause major inconvenience. not easy to run a punctual service without extreme overtiming which is bad

good example is coventry rd
60 gets stuck on coventry rd, no real way to fix that but anyone beyond coventry rd can use X1/X2 for a quicker journey to brum.

The entire road where the X1 & X2 can be a quicker alternative to getting to brum is Coventry Road JSYK

Quote from: hemmy on June 17, 2025, 06:21:07 PMThe entire road where the X1 & X2 can be a quicker alternative to getting to brum is Coventry Road JSYK

im talking about the small heath bit where 60 gets stuck

Quote from: 2206 on June 17, 2025, 01:55:48 PMThe alternative I can think of that could be done is having a short route terminating at Stechford or Ward End.

And then a longer route via Tile Cross either going via Washwood Heath Road with the 94/95 or taking Bordesley Green with the 97.

split the 14 like they do with the outer circus??
or make a x14 for those in chelmsely wood maybe
97a go along the 14 to stetchford maybe

Quote from: frostjay974 on June 17, 2025, 03:39:00 PMI'm not too sure that whoever thought it would be a good idea to get rid of the 13 took into consideration the fact that a very long and a pretty steep road in that of Brookfields Rd will no longer be served by a bus service. Depending on where you are, neither the 12 nor the 13* are exactly easily accessible, especially if we're talking elderly people. 

Quote from: Jack on June 17, 2025, 05:58:44 PMThe routes concerned aren't exactly 'in Birmingham.' The roads concerned are have steep hills and are long roads.

These are in the Black Country (you should probably sort your geography out). which are ironically all on steep hills. So leave Tower Road and Brookfields Road without a bus at all with a lot of families and elderly who rely on these services that is purely awful.

Least on Salop Road which is another steep hill they've managed to reroute the 54 and keep it connected!

No one has said that Brookfields Road or Tower Road are being left "without a bus service", because there are clearly going to be changes made to other services, that haven't been announced or detailed yet.

Quote from: Stu on June 17, 2025, 07:33:23 PMNo one has said that Brookfields Road or Tower Road are being left "without a bus service", because there are clearly going to be changes made to other services, that haven't been announced or detailed yet.

Details now on TfWM site

From TfWM site (Birmingham Changes)

Service 46/46A – QE Hospital to Kings Heath/Hawkesley via Northfield:
These services will be withdrawn and replaced by alternative services:

• 48 West Bromwich to Hawkesley via QE Hospital & Northfield – this service will be extended to Hawkesley every 20 minutes, following the route of the current between Northfield and Hawkesley.
• X20 Bromsgrove – Birmingham via QE Hospital every 30 minutes
• 27 Rubery, Great Park – Solihull via Northfield, Brandwood End, Kings Heath & Yardley Wood, every 30 minutes, with buses continuing beyond Yardley Wood to Solihull every 60 minutes.

The best alternative service will depend on where you currently travel to and from:

• Customers who currently board the 46/46A between Hawkesley and Northfield travelling towards QE Hospital and vice versa are advised to use the new 48 service
• Customers who board or alight on Black Haynes Road, Swarthmore Road, Middle Park Road, or Gibbins Road are advised to use the X20 service.
• Customers who board or alight in the Brandwood End area are advised to use the new 27 service.
• Travel between Hawkesley and Kings Heath will continue to be provided for by service 35 Hawkesley – Birmingham via Kings Heath.

Service 61 – Birmingham to Frankley via Selly Oak, Northfield:
This service will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane. Instead, it will operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

• The withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27, every 30 minutes.

Updated timetables to follow

Service 27 – Solihull/Yardley Wood to Rubery Great Park via Northfield:
This service will operate to a revised route and timetable.  The key changes are:

• Buses will continue beyond Frankley to Rubery Great Park, providing new direct links to Great Park
• Between Frankley and Northfield, the 27 will be re-routed via Allens Cross. Borrowdale Road, Trescott Road and Norrington Road will be served to provide an alternative to the 61 that will no longer serve these roads.
• Between Kings Heath and Yardley Wood, the 27 will follow a new route via Brandwood End (replacing the 46), then via Broad Lane / Warstock Road to rejoin the current route at Glastonbury Road.
• The service will extend beyond Yardley Wood Bus Garage to Solihull, providing a replacement for withdrawn service 169.

Buses will operate:

• Every 30 minutes between Rubery Great Park and Yardley Wood Station.
• Every 60 minutes beyond Yardley Wood to Solihull.

These route changes mean that Addison Road, Barn Lane and Hollybank Road will no longer be served by the 27.  Addison Road will remain served by the 11A/C Outer Circle and Hollybank Road by the 76 Solihull – QE Hospital via Kings Heath.
No replacement service will be provided on Barn Lane, as this will become a restricted access road in the next phase of the Low Traffic Neighbourhood plan for the area.

Service 169 – King's Heath to Solihull via Shirley:
This service will be withdrawn and substantially replaced by a revised 27 service operating every 60 minutes.
Service 27 will serve the majority of the current 169 route between Kings Heath and Solihull, with some exceptions:

• Brook Lane and Trittiford Road will no longer be served — passengers in these areas are advised to use services 3, 11A, or 11C.

• Watwood Road and Haslucks Green Road will no longer be served – the 27 will instead serve nearby Delrene Road.
• Solihull Retail Park will also be omitted, with the route continuing via Longmore Road and Widney Lane, then terminating in Solihull Town Centre, rather than Solihull Interchange (railway station).

There will be additional buses provided on the 27 during the AM peak towards Solihull, providing earlier first arrivals in Solihull compared to the current 169.

From TfWM site (Black Country Changes)

Service 12A - Birmingham to Dudley: This service will be withdrawn. It will be replaced by:

• A more frequent 12 service
• A new amended Service 12A operating between Dudley and Oldbury, which will operate every hour alongside an amended service 14 between Dudley and Blackheath.

The new Diamond Bus 12A service will operate via Regent Road, Elm Terrace, Poplar Avenue and City Road in place of Diamond Bus 14, which will be re-routed.  It will continue to Oldbury via Tower Road to cover the withdrawal of the National Express West Midlands 12A service. 
Updated timetables to follow

Service 13 Birmingham to Oldbury & Service 13A Birmingham to Blackheath: This service will operate to a revised route and timetable
The section of route between Warley, The George and Oldbury (Service 13) will be withdrawn and all journeys will operate between Birmingham and Blackheath (the current 13A route) but will be numbered 13.
Alternative services are available on most roads currently served by the 13 between Warley, The George and Oldbury:

• George Road will continue to be served by services 22 and 54
• Bristnall Hall Road will continue to be served by service 54
• Vicarage Road will continue to be served by services 12 and 49

Brookfields Road, Tat Bank Road and Stone Street will be left unserved.
Updated timetables to follow
 
 Service 14 Dudley to Blackheath: This service will operate to a revised route and timetable.
Regent Road, Elm Terrace, Poplar Avenue and City Road will no longer be served – these will instead be covered by new Diamond Bus 12A service Dudley to Oldbury.
The 14 will be re-routed to serve Darbys Hill Road following the withdrawal of National Express West Midlands 12A Dudley to Birmingham service.
Updated timetables to follow

214 Dudley – Foxyards Estate: This service will operate to a revised timetable.
Early and late journeys have been discontinued due to extremely low passenger usage.
Updated timetables to follow

215 Dudley – Springfield via Kates Hill: This service will operate to a revised route and timetable.
Buses will no longer serve Warrens Hall estate due to extremely low passenger usage.
Buses will extend to Blackheath providing residents on the route with a new direct link.

From TfWM site (Bearwood 20, 21, 22 changes)

20 Bearwood – Oldbury: This service will operate to a revised route and timetable.
The key changes are:

• The service will no longer operate to Oldbury via Lion Farm, meaning Throne Road, Shelsley Avenue, Hartlebury Road, Martley Road, Newbury Lane, Portway Road, Churchbridge and Halesowen Street will no longer be served by service 20. Services 3 & 3A offer alternative options in these areas.
• Instead, the service will operate to Blackheath via Oldbury Road, offering greater links to retail opportunities.
• In Bearwood, Adkins Lane Terminus and a section of Bearwood Road will no longer be served, with buses instead terminating at Rutland Road to improve punctuality on this service.
• The timetable will be amended due to this but also to improve general punctuality across the route.

21 Bearwood – Oldbury
This service will operate to a revised route and timetable. The key changes are:

• The service will no longer operate along Bearwood Road between Bearwood and Cape Hill, instead operating along Willow Avenue, Dorset Road, Sycamore Road and Grange Road in this area, to provide an alternative to service 22, which will no longer serve these roads.
• The timetable will be amended due to this but also to improve general punctuality across the route.
• In Bearwood, Adkins Lane Terminus and a section of Bearwood Road will no longer be served, with buses instead terminating at Rutland Road to improve punctuality on this service.

22 Bearwood – Oldbury: This service will operate to a revised route and timetable. The key changes are:

• The service will no longer operate along Willow Avenue, Dorset Road, Sycamore Road, Grange Road, Waterloo Road, Bearwood Road, Church Road and Stanhope Road between Bearwood and Warley to improve reliability of the service
  
  
  • Willow Avenue, Dorset Road, Sycamore Road, Grange Road and Waterloo Road will be covered by service 21 between Bearwood and Oldbury.
  • Bearwood Road, Church Road and Stanhope Road will continue to be served by service 54 operating between West Bromwich and Worlds End.

• The service is extended beyond West Bromwich to Midland Metropolitan Hospital via Sandon Road, City Road, Shenstone Road, Dudley Road and Grove Lane to offer increased connections to the Hospital.

• As a result of this, in Bearwood, Adkins Lane Terminus and a section of Bearwood Road will no longer be served, with buses instead serving Rutland Road.

Quote from: Stu on June 17, 2025, 07:33:23 PMNo one has said that Brookfields Road or Tower Road are being left "without a bus service", because there are clearly going to be changes made to other services, that haven't been announced or detailed yet.

'Brookfields Road, Tat Bank Road and Stone Street will be left unserved.'  :rolleyes:

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 17, 2025, 07:57:34 PMFrom TfWM site (Birmingham Changes)

Service 46/46A – QE Hospital to Kings Heath/Hawkesley via Northfield:
These services will be withdrawn and replaced by alternative services:

• 48 West Bromwich to Hawkesley via QE Hospital & Northfield – this service will be extended to Hawkesley every 20 minutes, following the route of the current between Northfield and Hawkesley.
• X20 Bromsgrove – Birmingham via QE Hospital every 30 minutes
• 27 Rubery, Great Park – Solihull via Northfield, Brandwood End, Kings Heath & Yardley Wood, every 30 minutes, with buses continuing beyond Yardley Wood to Solihull every 60 minutes.

The best alternative service will depend on where you currently travel to and from:

• Customers who currently board the 46/46A between Hawkesley and Northfield travelling towards QE Hospital and vice versa are advised to use the new 48 service
• Customers who board or alight on Black Haynes Road, Swarthmore Road, Middle Park Road, or Gibbins Road are advised to use the X20 service.
• Customers who board or alight in the Brandwood End area are advised to use the new 27 service.
• Travel between Hawkesley and Kings Heath will continue to be provided for by service 35 Hawkesley – Birmingham via Kings Heath.

Service 61 – Birmingham to Frankley via Selly Oak, Northfield:
This service will no longer serve Egghill Lane, Borrowdale Road/Norrington Road, Trescott Road, or Hoggs Lane. Instead, it will operate directly via Frankley Beeches Road.

• The withdrawn section of the route will now be covered by the revised Service 27, every 30 minutes.

Updated timetables to follow

Service 27 – Solihull/Yardley Wood to Rubery Great Park via Northfield:
This service will operate to a revised route and timetable.  The key changes are:

• Buses will continue beyond Frankley to Rubery Great Park, providing new direct links to Great Park
• Between Frankley and Northfield, the 27 will be re-routed via Allens Cross. Borrowdale Road, Trescott Road and Norrington Road will be served to provide an alternative to the 61 that will no longer serve these roads.
• Between Kings Heath and Yardley Wood, the 27 will follow a new route via Brandwood End (replacing the 46), then via Broad Lane / Warstock Road to rejoin the current route at Glastonbury Road.
• The service will extend beyond Yardley Wood Bus Garage to Solihull, providing a replacement for withdrawn service 169.

Buses will operate:

• Every 30 minutes between Rubery Great Park and Yardley Wood Station.
• Every 60 minutes beyond Yardley Wood to Solihull.

These route changes mean that Addison Road, Barn Lane and Hollybank Road will no longer be served by the 27.  Addison Road will remain served by the 11A/C Outer Circle and Hollybank Road by the 76 Solihull – QE Hospital via Kings Heath.
No replacement service will be provided on Barn Lane, as this will become a restricted access road in the next phase of the Low Traffic Neighbourhood plan for the area.

Service 169 – King's Heath to Solihull via Shirley:
This service will be withdrawn and substantially replaced by a revised 27 service operating every 60 minutes.
Service 27 will serve the majority of the current 169 route between Kings Heath and Solihull, with some exceptions:

• Brook Lane and Trittiford Road will no longer be served — passengers in these areas are advised to use services 3, 11A, or 11C.

• Watwood Road and Haslucks Green Road will no longer be served – the 27 will instead serve nearby Delrene Road.
• Solihull Retail Park will also be omitted, with the route continuing via Longmore Road and Widney Lane, then terminating in Solihull Town Centre, rather than Solihull Interchange (railway station).

There will be additional buses provided on the 27 during the AM peak towards Solihull, providing earlier first arrivals in Solihull compared to the current 169.

oh that 27 is going to be awful. i wonder why they're extending it to rubery great park when that already has a direct connection to solihull, unless for the fact that it means less waiting at the terminus stop (e.g 10 min layover in rubery instead of 20 in frankley). at that point, it might as well be re-extended to longbridge station.

also noticed that the X20 still isn't being interworked with the X21/X22 - nxwm removed it originally for being the weakest of the three (which is crazy to me as the 98 was a very very strong bus route), then re-instated it and left it... deliberately weak in comparison? i wonder if/when that will be increased back to 20 minutes in frequency.

@GoldenSquid said the other day that passengers along black haynes road and swarthmore road still preferred to use the 46/A - i wonder if the obvious increase in X20 passengers because it's the only one left will mean NXWM consider increasing the timetable. + there might be a couple more passengers from hawkesley - northfield who know the X20 is about twice as fast to the hospital than the QE and switch at bell lane.

do wonder what that means for those hawkesley - kings heath passengers who use the 46, and if they'll switch to the 35. all just speculation from my end anyways, i'm not a genius, just curious as to what this means later down the line.

does anyone know how long the 27 will be now from rubery to solihull? it's gotta be somewhere around 2 hours now and one of the longest bus routes in the city, right?

Quote from: frostjay974 on June 17, 2025, 08:31:57 PM'Brookfields Road, Tat Bank Road and Stone Street will be left unserved.'  :rolleyes:

okay but in all fairness he said "no one has said," because it was never made clear, especially considering that not a single person expected the 27 to change that drastically, we only knew of the 27/61 swap. we didn't know, now we do

Quite a radical change for the 27 and it must be the first time Broad Lane and Warstock Road have seen service buses. 

The Shirley changes make sense, Delrene Road is wider than the existing route's roads and missing out Union Road and the retail park will aid reliability.

Quote from: keyy927 on June 17, 2025, 08:38:58 PMoh that 27 is going to be awful. i wonder why they're extending it to rubery great park when that already has a direct connection to solihull, unless for the fact that it means less waiting at the terminus stop (e.g 10 min layover in rubery instead of 20 in frankley). at that point, it might as well be re-extended to longbridge station.

The extended 27 has not being done to create a new Solihull to Rubery connection, it was just the best or easiest way to replace the 169.

Any immediate changes to the A9?

Quote from: Jack D on June 17, 2025, 09:30:54 PMAny immediate changes to the A9?

It hasn't been listed, I think that changes in November

So, confirmation that the 48 is changing for the 2nd time in as many months.

Tfwm website also says changes to come in August.

Are there any more roads the 48 can cover?

How many times has the 48 changed beyond the QE now? There was the extension to Bartley Green to replace the then 21, the ridiculous section through most of south Birmingham in the 2018 changes, the current extension to Northfield to cover the 76 and now a further extension to cover West Heath and Hawkesley again. Was there also one to Northfield via Black Haynes Road at some point or have I imagined that? And on top of that it's also interworked at the QE with the 84 and the 20/20A.

Quote from: Mike K on June 17, 2025, 10:30:31 PMHow many times has the 48 changed beyond the QE now? There was the extension to Bartley Green to replace the then 21, the ridiculous section through most of south Birmingham in the 2018 changes, the current extension to Northfield to cover the 76 and now a further extension to cover West Heath and Hawkesley again. Was there also one to Northfield via Black Haynes Road at some point or have I imagined that? And on top of that it's also interworked at the QE with the 84 and the 20/20A.

Yes it swapped from going to Bartley Green to go to Northfield via Black Haynes Road before the 2018 changes. I think that was when the 29A disappeared. 

Quote from: Mike K on June 17, 2025, 10:30:31 PMHow many times has the 48 changed beyond the QE now? There was the extension to Bartley Green to replace the then 21, the ridiculous section through most of south Birmingham in the 2018 changes, the current extension to Northfield to cover the 76 and now a further extension to cover West Heath and Hawkesley again. Was there also one to Northfield via Black Haynes Road at some point or have I imagined that? And on top of that it's also interworked at the QE with the 84 and the 20/20A.

I think it's covered the Swarthmore/Black Haynes section on two separate occasions now? It's the flexible friend of the South Bham network!

Quote from: cardew on June 17, 2025, 08:46:21 PMQuite a radical change for the 27 and it must be the first time Broad Lane and Warstock Road have seen service buses.

The Shirley changes make sense, Delrene Road is wider than the existing route's roads and missing out Union Road and the retail park will aid reliability.

There was a Centro tendered 618 that covered Broad Lane (and maybe Warstock Rd) back in the early 1990s so it's certainly been a while.

Quote from: keyy927 on June 17, 2025, 08:38:58 PMoh that 27 is going to be awful. i wonder why they're extending it to rubery great park when that already has a direct connection to solihull, unless for the fact that it means less waiting at the terminus stop (e.g 10 min layover in rubery instead of 20 in frankley). at that point, it might as well be re-extended to longbridge station.

also noticed that the X20 still isn't being interworked with the X21/X22 - nxwm removed it originally for being the weakest of the three (which is crazy to me as the 98 was a very very strong bus route), then re-instated it and left it... deliberately weak in comparison? i wonder if/when that will be increased back to 20 minutes in frequency.

@GoldenSquid said the other day that passengers along black haynes road and swarthmore road still preferred to use the 46/A - i wonder if the obvious increase in X20 passengers because it's the only one left will mean NXWM consider increasing the timetable. + there might be a couple more passengers from hawkesley - northfield who know the X20 is about twice as fast to the hospital than the QE and switch at bell lane.

do wonder what that means for those hawkesley - kings heath passengers who use the 46, and if they'll switch to the 35. all just speculation from my end anyways, i'm not a genius, just curious as to what this means later down the line.

does anyone know how long the 27 will be now from rubery to solihull? it's gotta be somewhere around 2 hours now and one of the longest bus routes in the city, right?

- TfWM changed the tender for the 27, I think they wanted to increase connections, I see that route changing again soon, maybe to go through Rubery?

- I also see the X20/X21/X22 having a full timetable change in September, maybe some short journeys in the Uni campus or something - time will tell on that front.

- I think the X20 is starting to get busier now, I haven't done it since day 2. I'll try and get another duty on it soon and compare it.

- 1h40m according to the tendered timetable. 

Quote from: Jack D on June 17, 2025, 09:30:54 PMAny immediate changes to the A9?

Potentially new operator from November, New route from January.

Quote from: Mike K on June 17, 2025, 10:30:31 PMHow many times has the 48 changed beyond the QE now? There was the extension to Bartley Green to replace the then 21, the ridiculous section through most of south Birmingham in the 2018 changes, the current extension to Northfield to cover the 76 and now a further extension to cover West Heath and Hawkesley again. Was there also one to Northfield via Black Haynes Road at some point or have I imagined that? And on top of that it's also interworked at the QE with the 84 and the 20/20A.

Completely forgot the 48 went to Bartley Green for a bit, does anyone remember which way it went?

Does anyone know the variation for the 41?

Quote from: GoldenSquid on June 18, 2025, 01:54:39 AMCompletely forgot the 48 went to Bartley Green for a bit, does anyone remember which way it went?

From the QE via Selly Oak (or was it Gibbins Road?), Weoley Avenue, Weoley Castle, Woodcock Lane and Newman Uni to Bartley Green as I recall - replacing the withdrawn 21 over that section. The 48 was still the 448 at that time. 

The X21 now covers most of that section but serves Long Nuke Road between Weoley Castle and Woodcock Hill.

Quote from: GoldenSquid on June 18, 2025, 01:49:39 AM- TfWM changed the tender for the 27, I think they wanted to increase connections, I see that route changing again soon, maybe to go through Rubery?

- I also see the X20/X21/X22 having a full timetable change in September, maybe some short journeys in the Uni campus or something - time will tell on that front.

- I think the X20 is starting to get busier now, I haven't done it since day 2. I'll try and get another duty on it soon and compare it.

- 1h40m according to the tendered timetable.

thank you for all of this. i'm writing this on the X20 actually, i frequent it a lot, and considering that it's timetabled 1 minute behind the 63 between longbridge and northfield, and awkwardly between the X21/X22, it's actually been doing quite well. a lot more people than i'd expect. they just need to update the south road bus stop announcement from the old voice. 

Quote from: keyy927 on June 18, 2025, 12:16:57 PMthey just need to update the south road bus stop announcement from the old voice.

I'd prefer that voice, not a fan of the new one.

Quote from: GoldenSquid on June 18, 2025, 03:05:53 PMI'd prefer that voice, not a fan of the new one.

oh 110% but if they're gonna update it they might as well go all the way - there's a stop on the 9 just before quinton that used to do it, don't know if it still does.

the new bus voice sounds like she hates her job, at least the last one was enthusiastic to tell you the next stop is longbridge technology park. 

Quote from: GoldenSquid on June 18, 2025, 01:49:39 AM- I think the X20 is starting to get busier now, I haven't done it since day 2. I'll try and get another duty on it soon and compare it.

Are you sure it isn't just when there are gaps in service with delayed X21 & X22.

Also wonder if the stops on Weoley Park Road have been sorted yet. Hard to get people to use it if they don't know where to board the service lol.

Quote from: MasterPlan on June 18, 2025, 03:51:11 PMAlso wonder if the stops on Weoley Park Road have been sorted yet. Hard to get people to use it if they don't know where to board the service lol.

Just as a matter of interest, roughly how many bus stops do these extensive changes, which seem to be every three or four months, affect.

This is one aspect which would, most certainly be far better under a franchised system (I base this thought on the system in London where most of the routes I use are not subject to change and even still have the same service numbers - I know changes do happen however). The changes in South Birmingham are quite extensive and must affect a lot of journeys.

It must be an absolute nightmare keeping track of and implementing the bus stop changes resulting from this 'tinkering'. Also, from the Bearwood changes mentioned earlier, how much traffic is removed from Bearwood bus station, and this makes the new terminus of those routes far less accessible for interchange to Hagley Road services requiring quite a walk compared to Bearwood bus station?

Quote from: MasterPlan on June 18, 2025, 03:51:11 PMAre you sure it isn't just when there are gaps in service with delayed X21 & X22.

Also wonder if the stops on Weoley Park Road have been sorted yet. Hard to get people to use it if they don't know where to board the service lol.

the flags on weoley park road have been updated but they're still hard to see on the side with the shrubs, and there are still no flags on the other side at all. 

it was really awkward thinking the bus driver was gonna go straight past me.

there is also a case for it being slightly due to delayed X21/X22, but the service is still quite busy between longbridge and the university anyways, as people are shifting from the 46/A to the X20

Quote from: keyy927 on June 18, 2025, 03:48:05 PMoh 110% but if they're gonna update it they might as well go all the way - there's a stop on the 9 just before quinton that used to do it, don't know if it still does.

the new bus voice sounds like she hates her job, at least the last one was enthusiastic to tell you the next stop is longbridge technology park.

man the old girl on the 16 sounded downright ecstatic to say that it goes to snow hill & the markets

Quote from: don on June 18, 2025, 04:14:12 PMAlso, from the Bearwood changes mentioned earlier, how much traffic is removed from Bearwood bus station, and this makes the new terminus of those routes far less accessible for interchange to Hagley Road services requiring quite a walk compared to Bearwood bus station?

It's a shame that the bus station will have lost 4 routes in a such short space of time. Not so long ago you could see a wide variety of buses using the facility and it was a good place to while away an hour or so. 

Quote from: keyy927 on June 18, 2025, 08:01:27 PMthere is also a case for it being slightly due to delayed X21/X22, but the service is still quite busy between longbridge and the university anyways, as people are shifting from the 46/A to the X20

I was on board this morning from Rednal into University, It was fairly empty however this one of 'short journeys' so it may of had something to do with it, Haven't seen what numbers are on from the services which start from Bromsgrove. 

Quote from: LiamsTransport1 on June 19, 2025, 03:01:59 PMI was on board this morning from Rednal into University, It was fairly empty however this one of 'short journeys' so it may of had something to do with it, Haven't seen what numbers are on from the services which start from Bromsgrove.

might also be the times you catch it, i've never got it in the morning, usually 12-2pm ish, once at 5pm. the bromsgrove service is definitely busier for sure, and i'm guessing that that has something to do with the fact that changes in rubery and longbridge to birmingham are no longer necessary 

Quote from: don on June 18, 2025, 04:14:12 PMIt must be an absolute nightmare keeping track of and implementing the bus stop changes resulting from this 'tinkering'. Also, from the Bearwood changes mentioned earlier, how much traffic is removed from Bearwood bus station, and this makes the new terminus of those routes far less accessible for interchange to Hagley Road services requiring quite a walk compared to Bearwood bus station?

It's three services that operate hourly during the daytime only.

I am going to assume that the decision to terminate the 20 and 21 services at Rutland Road is based on passenger boarding data, which probably suggests that not many people actually use those services from Bearwood bus station. 

For those who wish to interchange with Hagley Road services, there is always the option to hop on board the frequent 11A and 82 services. 

If I'm not mistaken, that leaves the 82 as the only bus service that actually uses the bus station. I'm now starting to wonder at what point Sandwell council decide to close it and sell off the land?

TfWM's latest registrations is saying the Tile Cross 17 service will extend to Chelmsley Wood and new variant 17A goes to Birmingham Airport.
In Coventry NXC will take over the evening and Sunday tender on service 7 to Brownshill Green from Stagecoach.

Quote from: JPC on June 19, 2025, 08:54:56 PMTfWM's latest registrations is saying the Tile Cross 17 service will extend to Chelmsley Wood and new variant 17A goes to Birmingham Airport.

Is that in addition to the 97A etc?
Didnt expect a 5th service to go to the Airport?

The Airparks bus service goes to Tile Cross area too I think, wonder if there's a way it could be merged so people travelling there use the 17A to increase passenger usage?

Quote from: Stu on June 19, 2025, 08:46:03 PMIt's three services that operate hourly during the daytime only.

I am going to assume that the decision to terminate the 20 and 21 services at Rutland Road is based on passenger boarding data, which probably suggests that not many people actually use those services from Bearwood bus station.

For those who wish to interchange with Hagley Road services, there is always the option to hop on board the frequent 11A and 82 services.

If I'm not mistaken, that leaves the 82 as the only bus service that actually uses the bus station. I'm now starting to wonder at what point Sandwell council decide to close it and sell off the land?

Yes I'm surprised the bus station in Bearwood has survived this long already.

Changes would need to be made to the 82 possibly looping round the back streets of Bearwood then onto Hagley Road then left back onto Bearwood High Street (like I think the 49 does).

I wonder has a 'circular' service ever been thought of for the 82 where it would do its current route to Bearwood then just turn left from Bearwood and head up Hagley Road back to the City centre. It would offer up quite a few new links and save having to change buses. It would obviously require additional vehicles though in both directions so such an idea would probably work better with every second or even bus terminating as now in Bearwood and running a circular every 20-30 minutes.

Another possibility I guess is also extend it again to Harborne like the old 82a used to run up to the Duke of York pub.

Quote from: j789 on June 19, 2025, 10:43:19 PMI wonder has a 'circular' service ever been thought of for the 82 where it would do its current route to Bearwood then just turn left from Bearwood and head up Hagley Road back to the City centre

Probably more than enough 9, X8, X10 & 126's already so no need to send even more buses that way.

Also the way it has worked for a long time is the 87 changes into a 82 at City as the WB relief point is in Oldbury

QuoteTfWM's latest registrations is saying the Tile Cross 17 service will extend to Chelmsley Wood and new variant 17A goes to Birmingham Airport.
In Coventry NXC will take over the evening and Sunday tender on service 7 to Brownshill Green from Stagecoach.

Does it include the NEC?

QuoteTfWM's latest registrations is saying the Tile Cross 17 service will extend to Chelmsley Wood and new variant 17A goes to Birmingham Airport.
In Coventry NXC will take over the evening and Sunday tender on service 7 to Brownshill Green from Stagecoach.

With the 17 now also being extended to the airport, I think it's time a more southern route also gets an extension to BHX. My best bet is on a 4, serving Stratford road, Acocks green, with an airport link. Maybe then follow the X2 up to wheatsheaf, and X1 way down to BHX. 

Quote from: BBS on June 19, 2025, 11:18:21 PMWith the 17 now also being extended to the airport, I think it's time a more southern route also gets an extension to BHX. My best bet is on a 4, serving Stratford road, Acocks green, with an airport link. Maybe then follow the X2 up to wheatsheaf, and X1 way down to BHX.

Will 17A go into Chelmsley or go through back roads of Marston green to bhx?

Quote from: BBS on June 19, 2025, 11:18:21 PMWith the 17 now also being extended to the airport, I think it's time a more southern route also gets an extension to BHX. My best bet is on a 4, serving Stratford road, Acocks green, with an airport link. Maybe then follow the X2 up to wheatsheaf, and X1 way down to BHX.

It's been done before, with the 6 being extended from Solihull to the airport via Damsonwood, with alternative buses terminating at Hermitage Road. Didn't last very long though.

QuoteWill 17A go into Chelmsley or go through back roads of Marston green to bhx?

It's going into Chelmsley wood, the 17 itself is terminating at Chelmsley wood, the 17A will carry on from there. Most likley either a new way or just the casual 96 way

Quote from: BBS on June 19, 2025, 11:18:21 PMWith the 17 now also being extended to the airport, I think it's time a more southern route also gets an extension to BHX. My best bet is on a 4, serving Stratford road, Acocks green, with an airport link. Maybe then follow the X2 up to wheatsheaf, and X1 way down to BHX.

doesnt the X12 go a similar way to airport?

72 could possibly be a loop service if it were extended to the airport then replacing the x12 between airport and solihul. just a thought

Quote from: BBS on June 19, 2025, 11:43:30 PMIt's going into Chelmsley wood, the 17 itself is terminating at Chelmsley wood, the 17A will carry on from there. Most likley either a new way or just the casual 96 way

What way is the 17 going to Chelmsley Moorend Avenue, Bosworth Drive like the old 71 used to, or Chapelhouse Road?

Wonder if the 97A is staying and it's an addition? Or if this is a way of improving the current route to serve more workers at the airport, if so overnight journeys on the 17 would be interesting?
Either way I guess it is subsidised by the Airport?

QuoteWhat way is the 17 going to Chelmsley Moorend Avenue, Bosworth Drive like the old 71 used to, or Chapelhouse Road?

Wonder if the 97A is staying and it's an addition? Or if this is a way of improving the current route to serve more workers at the airport?
Either way I guess it is subsidised by the Airport?

Why would the 97A go? That service is going extremely well. The 17A could do another way, it's a single decker route anyways due to green lane 

Quotedoesnt the X12 go a similar way to airport?

72 could possibly be a loop service if it were extended to the airport then replacing the x12 between airport and solihul. just a thought

The X12 goes via damson wood and JLR. The revised 4 can go via the X2 way ( lode lane ), take a right onto Coventry Road and follow the X1. Maybe reduces the need of the A10, although I wouldn't go that far 

Quote from: BBS on June 19, 2025, 11:54:34 PMWhy would the 97A go? That service is going extremely well. The 17A could do another way, it's a single decker route anyways due to green lane

Just because it'd mean 6bph to Chelmsley which I think is more than that has ever had?

It's single deck because of the radleys bridge not Green Lane. BC still run an 891 school down Green Lane in the morning.

Quote from: The Transport Youtuber on June 19, 2025, 11:44:18 PMdoesnt the X12 go a similar way to airport?

72 could possibly be a loop service if it were extended to the airport then replacing the x12 between airport and solihul. just a thought

Yea that would remove a connecting service to Solihull for everywhere north of Chelmsley Wood.

Quote from: 2206 on June 19, 2025, 11:47:08 PMWhat way is the 17 going to Chelmsley Moorend Avenue, Bosworth Drive like the old 71 used to, or Chapelhouse Road?

Wonder if the 97A is staying and it's an addition? Or if this is a way of improving the current route to serve more workers at the airport?
Either way I guess it is subsidised by the Airport?

Hopefully if it isn't just replacing the 14, then via the Old Old 71 route, up Coleshill Road and Berwicks Lane, as that is only served by the a10 and there's a large newish housing estate there which currently has quite poor service. Either that or send the bus up to the airport that way, via the old 91/676 route that the a10 no longer covers.

Quote from: ellspurs on June 19, 2025, 11:57:16 PMYea that would remove a connecting service to Solihull for everywhere north of Chelmsley Wood.
Hopefully if it isn't just replacing the 14, then via the Old Old 71 route, up Coleshill Road and Berwicks Lane, as that is only served by the a10 and there's a large newish housing estate there which currently has quite poor service. Either that or send the bus up to the airport that way, via the old 91/676 route that the a10 no longer covers.

What you mean replacing the 14?

Currently the 17 runs every 9 minutes, I would think the new timetable will be every 10 minutes to Chelmsley and every 20 minutes to Airport

I wish they'd tweak the times of the overnight journeys to the airport to make it possible to get from South Brum for one of the myriad early flights.

63 arrives city 03:03 
BOTH the X1 and 97A depart City at 03:05

No-ones gonna risk that so taxi is the only option.

Quote from: Steve3229vp on June 20, 2025, 07:30:39 AMCurrently the 17 runs every 9 minutes, I would think the new timetable will be every 10 minutes to Chelmsley and every 20 minutes to Airport

More likely half-hourly to the airport, I would imagine. Would then depend on how well the service takes off, if you'll excuse the pun lol

Quote from: cardew on June 20, 2025, 07:59:46 AMI wish they'd tweak the times of the overnight journeys to the airport to make it possible to get from South Brum for one of the myriad early flights.

63 arrives city 03:03
BOTH the X1 and 97A depart City at 03:05

No-ones gonna risk that so taxi is the only option.

and with the timings on the 63 twilight, if you are unlucky with traffic lights you are super late. when I did a few weeks ago Friday run I was on time and the Saturday run the bus went slow so ended up getting in 5 minutes late. 

Doesn't help that the X1 also leaves around the same time too, I think thats also xx:05.

Quote from: GoldenSquid on June 20, 2025, 11:50:30 AMDoesn't help that the X1 also leaves around the same time too, I think thats also xx:05.

Yes, both airport services leave at xx:05! 

Good to get first hand experience. Small hours Dutch-style flashing amber lights (i.e. treat it as a normal crossroads) or sensors that stop lights changing to red if a bus is approaching would be utopia here. 

I've veered off topic here so apologies.

Quote from: Jack D on June 19, 2025, 11:59:48 PMWhat you mean replacing the 14?

Just between Tile Cross and Chelmsley, given that the 17 terminates at Tile Cross. Hopefully that won't be happening.

Quote from: ellspurs on June 20, 2025, 03:47:14 PMJust between Tile Cross and Chelmsley, given that the 17 terminates at Tile Cross. Hopefully that won't be happening.

The 14 won't terminate at tile cross 

Quote from: Jack D on June 20, 2025, 04:34:55 PMThe 14 won't terminate at tile cross

There's no change to the 14, apart from the introduction of summer timetables.

It's not yet clear what routes the extended 17 and 17A will take, so lets wait and see.

61 no longer serving Boleyn and Ormond Road again, this was a change originally done at 2018 South Birmingham network review and it was so unpopular it was reversed in March 2019

Quote from: TGZac on June 20, 2025, 06:44:31 PM61 no longer serving Boleyn and Ormond Road again, this was a change originally done at 2018 South Birmingham network review and it was so unpopular it was reversed in March 2019

There's only one stop on Boleyn Road that gets missed out though.

Will be interesting to see what route the 27 will take, I also heard today that Kevs are revising their 55 in Frankley, it is going to serve New Street, Arden Road (for Holly Hill shops) and Ormond Road, before heading into Great Park. 

The changes have made it onto the TFWM website.....

https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/

rom Sunday 20th July, the following services will operate revised routes and/or timetables to improve reliability and better match passenger demand:
Service 46/46A – QE Hospital to Kings Heath/Hawkesley via Northfield: These services will be withdrawn and replaced by alternative services:

• 48 West Bromwich to Hawkesley via QE Hospital & Northfield – this service will be extended to Hawkesley every 20 minutes, following the route of the current 46 between Northfield and Hawkesley.
• X20 Bromsgrove – Birmingham via QE Hospital every 30 minutes
• 27 Rubery, Great Park – Solihull via Northfield, Brandwood End, Kings Heath & Yardley Wood, every 30 minutes, with buses continuing beyond Yardley Wood to Solihull every 60 minutes.

Quote from: Stu on June 19, 2025, 08:46:03 PMIt's three services that operate hourly during the daytime only.

I am going to assume that the decision to terminate the 20 and 21 services at Rutland Road is based on passenger boarding data, which probably suggests that not many people actually use those services from Bearwood bus station.

For those who wish to interchange with Hagley Road services, there is always the option to hop on board the frequent 11A and 82 services.

If I'm not mistaken, that leaves the 82 as the only bus service that actually uses the bus station. I'm now starting to wonder at what point Sandwell council decide to close it and sell off the land?

I wouldn't be inclined to make that assumption - perhaps operating convenience, cost reduction or maybe service reliability? With low frequency any traffic delays en route are likely to have knock on effects on reliability.

Going back many years (pre deregulation) quite a lot of services as well as the 82 used Bearwood bus station - routes through Warley to Oldbury, beyond the A4123 and to Handsworth. Bearwood High St was always a large attractor of passengers (as well as being a traffic hot spot - no doubt still the same owing to parking). I guess there are routes which used to terminate there which travel through the High St and beyond (eg Hawkesley!!!!! 😲) these days. 

Quote from: don on June 23, 2025, 07:27:58 PMI wouldn't be inclined to make that assumption - perhaps operating convenience, cost reduction or maybe service reliability? With low frequency any traffic delays en route are likely to have knock on effects on reliability.

If there was a significant number of passengers boarding and alighting from those services at the bus station, then I'm sure efforts would have been made to keep it as the terminus point.

But you're right, having them terminate at (or operate via) Rutland Road is no doubt a compromise that has had to be made, to keep the service operating costs down and to improve reliability.

Anymore news on changes?

Quote from: Jack D on Yesterday at 03:12:02 PMAnymore news on changes?

Some timetables now available on TfWM website. 

Quote from: CJS47 on Yesterday at 03:33:41 PMSome timetables now available on TfWM website.

Looks like 17 timetable on there is wrong for after 20/07 as it shows it terminating at Tile Cross still.

17 isn't listed as changing on the TfWM website's change list yet. (I know it was in the change log thing but they haven't announced it yet)

Quote from: Jack D on Yesterday at 03:12:02 PMAnymore news on changes?

https://wmbu.org.uk/2025/06/service-changes-from-20th-july-2025/

Quote from: 2206 on Yesterday at 04:11:00 PMLooks like 17 timetable on there is wrong for after 20/07 as it shows it terminating at Tile Cross still.

Or maybe the timetable is correct and the route isn't changing after all!  :rolleyes:

Quote from: JPC on June 19, 2025, 08:54:56 PMTfWM's latest registrations is saying the Tile Cross 17 service will extend to Chelmsley Wood and new variant 17A goes to Birmingham Airport.
In Coventry NXC will take over the evening and Sunday tender on service 7 to Brownshill Green from Stagecoach.

Quote from: Stu on Yesterday at 06:13:12 PMhttps://wmbu.org.uk/2025/06/service-changes-from-20th-july-2025/
Or maybe the timetable is correct and the route isn't changing after all!  :rolleyes:

Why would the TfWM state those details on the registration (which weren't there before) if there were no plans for them?

Quote from: ellspurs on Yesterday at 07:10:07 PMWhy would the TfWM state those details on the registration (which weren't there before) if there were no plans for them?

I don't know to be honest, maybe there was an error in the service registration which has subsequently been corrected, but not published yet.

Or perhaps the registration is correct, and NX haven't submitted the correct timetable data to TfWM yet, which has resulted in TfWM publishing incorrect future timetables.

Quote from: 2206 on Yesterday at 04:11:00 PMLooks like 17 timetable on there is wrong for after 20/07 as it shows it terminating at Tile Cross still.

I think its going to be a later change, like the 73/A9 changes aren't till January.

Quote from: Stu on Yesterday at 07:19:31 PMI don't know to be honest, maybe there was an error in the service registration which has subsequently been corrected, but not published yet.

Or perhaps the registration is correct, and NX haven't submitted the correct timetable data to TfWM yet, which has resulted in TfWM publishing incorrect future timetables.

17 extension happens on 3rd August