I used to enjoy travelling in the bus on the 9, 120, 127, 128, 129 because of the space and the relative comfort of those vehicles, and because there was always a level of consistency. You knew what you were going to flag down most of the time.
Recently though, things have gone really bad. On the 127/128/129 they replaced the comfy Wrightbus Eclipse with bloody awful Scania Ominlinks with their cramped seating (no joke I have to sit sideways taking up two seats as I'm 6'2" tall!) and occasionally some age old ADL envro 200's have been doing the route - almost as uncomfortable. Sometimes you get lucky and an Enviro400 or a B10 appears but those Ominlinks are terrible.
On the 9 something weird was going on. Initially we were settled with Enviro400 for a while. It was comfortable, pretty smooth, with plenty of space, and it made my bus journey's enjoyable - and made me an advocate for the buses in Brum.
Then no sooner had they introduced that fleet, new Enviro400 mk2(?) models appeared. Great, they update the fleet - I thought.
Then as soon as they switched to Platinum services, the 9 got these bloody awful Volvo Wrightbus(? - double deckers.) These are so shockingly bad for a high density showcase route. Worse than the OminLinks, they are cramped, always dangerously packed if put on in the morning and to top it off it seems to be powered by a engine out of a turbocharged cement mixer. Absolutely shocking. Vibration is terrible, and the chap(ess) I feel sorry for the most is the driver! It looks like they've got less space in there than a London taxi!
It's so shockingly bad that I've had to return to using my car for some journeys because of the level of discomfort. But I only have to endure it for 20 minutes twice a day... I feel sorry for the driver who has 8-9 hours of it at least 5 days a week!
Comment?
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 05:24:33 PM
I used to enjoy travelling in the bus on the 9, 120, 127, 128, 129 because of the space and the relative comfort of those vehicles, and because there was always a level of consistency. You knew what you were going to flag down most of the time.
Recently though, things have gone really bad. On the 127/128/129 they replaced the comfy Wrightbus Eclipse with bloody awful Scania Ominlinks with their cramped seating (no joke I have to sit sideways taking up two seats as I'm 6'2" tall!) and occasionally some age old ADL envro 200's have been doing the route - almost as uncomfortable. Sometimes you get lucky and an Enviro400 or a B10 appears but those Ominlinks are terrible.
On the 9 something weird was going on. Initially we were settled with Enviro400 for a while. It was comfortable, pretty smooth, with plenty of space, and it made my bus journey's enjoyable - and made me an advocate for the buses in Brum.
Then no sooner had they introduced that fleet, new Enviro400 mk2(?) models appeared. Great, they update the fleet - I thought.
Then as soon as they switched to Platinum services, the 9 got these bloody awful Volvo Wrightbus(? - double deckers.) These are so shockingly bad for a high density showcase route. Worse than the OminLinks, they are cramped, always dangerously packed if put on in the morning and to top it off it seems to be powered by a engine out of a turbocharged cement mixer. Absolutely shocking. Vibration is terrible, and the chap(ess) I feel sorry for the most is the driver! It looks like they've got less space in there than a London taxi!
It's so shockingly bad that I've had to return to using my car for some journeys because of the level of discomfort. But I only have to endure it for 20 minutes twice a day... I feel sorry for the driver who has 8-9 hours of it at least 5 days a week!
Comment?
What a load of nonsense. What are you complaining about, there are new buses on the 9, 126 and X10 (the Hagley Roads express service).
For a start the 127/128/129 are not majority Omnilinks operated, main allocation from what I've seen its B7TL ALX400 on the 127/8 (as they have been for years) and Tridents on the 129 as PN have it.
The E200 are not old and must have at least another good 10 years with NX. If you want to see an old tatty bus go and have a look at 4226 and 4304.
The 127/8/9 don't use B10Ls the last of them went in 2015.
The 9 got new E400 in 2009, the MMC didn't come till 2015, hardly straight after.
The MMC are still on the 9 alongside the Streetdexks.
The 120A uses Omnilinks though.
If you want to check vehicle type names that can be found on the vehicle types section of the usual allocations spreadsheet or on the main site.
Hang on, why am I always sat on a cramped B7, certainly of evening/night time? And why even use these god awful buses on such a high density route in any case? Are the on evaluation? I'm sure the drivers must also hate being cooped up in them.
And why use a mix.of buses? Sure it makes economic sense to reduce bus types in order to keep parts costs low (economies of scale) and maintenance training simple?
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 05:50:55 PM
Hang on, why am I always sat on a cramped B7, certainly of evening/night time? And why even use these god awful buses on such a high density route in any case? Are the on evaluation? I'm sure the drivers must also hate being cooped up in them.
And why use a mix.of buses? Sure it makes economic sense to reduce bus types in order to keep parts costs low (economies of scale) and maintenance training simple?
When are you ever sat on a cramped B7?
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 05:50:55 PM
Hang on, why am I always sat on a cramped B7, certainly of evening/night time? And why even use these god awful buses on such a high density route in any case? Are the on evaluation? I'm sure the drivers must also hate being cooped up in them.
And why use a mix.of buses? Sure it makes economic sense to reduce bus types in order to keep parts costs low (economies of scale) and maintenance training simple?
Unfortunately there are emmisions for buses entering bham on a high frequency route, and a 7 year old omnilink meets those criterias
Quote from: Tony on September 22, 2017, 05:53:03 PM
When are you ever sat on a cramped B7?
I might have to take a photo to prove that lol
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 05:55:42 PM
I might have to take a photo to prove that lol
You were praising the B7/Eclipse in your first post today, critising their replace by Scanias on the 127/128 (and the 129 but that never has Scanias on it). Now all of a sudden they become the worst buses ever
Quote from: Tony on September 22, 2017, 05:58:58 PM
You were praising the B7/Eclipse in your first post today, critising their replace by Scanias on the 127/128 (and the 129 but that never has Scanias on it). Now all of a sudden they become the worst buses ever
I'm sure a large majority of people on the forum will agree Volvo b7rles are the best single deckers that are out there
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 05:24:33 PM
I used to enjoy travelling in the bus on the 9, 120, 127, 128, 129 because of the space and the relative comfort of those vehicles, and because there was always a level of consistency. You knew what you were going to flag down most of the time.
Recently though, things have gone really bad. On the 127/128/129 they replaced the comfy Wrightbus Eclipse with bloody awful Scania Ominlinks with their cramped seating (no joke I have to sit sideways taking up two seats as I'm 6'2" tall!) and occasionally some age old ADL envro 200's have been doing the route - almost as uncomfortable. Sometimes you get lucky and an Enviro400 or a B10 appears but those Ominlinks are terrible.
On the 9 something weird was going on. Initially we were settled with Enviro400 for a while. It was comfortable, pretty smooth, with plenty of space, and it made my bus journey's enjoyable - and made me an advocate for the buses in Brum.
Then no sooner had they introduced that fleet, new Enviro400 mk2(?) models appeared. Great, they update the fleet - I thought.
Then as soon as they switched to Platinum services, the 9 got these bloody awful Volvo Wrightbus(? - double deckers.) These are so shockingly bad for a high density showcase route. Worse than the OminLinks, they are cramped, always dangerously packed if put on in the morning and to top it off it seems to be powered by a engine out of a turbocharged cement mixer. Absolutely shocking. Vibration is terrible, and the chap(ess) I feel sorry for the most is the driver! It looks like they've got less space in there than a London taxi!
It's so shockingly bad that I've had to return to using my car for some journeys because of the level of discomfort. But I only have to endure it for 20 minutes twice a day... I feel sorry for the driver who has 8-9 hours of it at least 5 days a week!
Comment?
Stop moaning. First off, Omnilinks, you don't get them on the 129, just the 120A and the few on the 127/8 (Blame WB for not having enough compliant Deckers for that). The Streetdecks are the best new Deckers NX have, not sure how you can hate them.
So what if your 6 foot? NX aren't specially going to order buses that meet your needs. Don't post crap.
Quote from: Tony on September 22, 2017, 05:58:58 PM
You were praising the B7/Eclipse in your first post today, critising their replace by Scanias on the 127/128 (and the 129 but that never has Scanias on it). Now all of a sudden they become the worst buses ever
It appears he was praising the Gemini that used to be on the 127/8/9 and is now criticing the B7TL ALX400 that are still used on there today, though it's hard to tell without the actual names of the vehicle types?
Quote from: 2206 on September 22, 2017, 06:08:04 PM
It appears he was praising the Gemini that used to be on the 127/8/9 and is now criticing the B7TL ALX400 that are still used on there today, though it's hard to tell without the actual names of the vehicle types?
They are mostly the exact same, just some bad things about the ALX400 which lets them down, but other than that he's confusing me with B7RLEs and B7TLs as he just posts B7's.
Hang on, I might be getting the names and numbers confused here.
Gemini 3? - looks like. (Double deck on the 9 route) bad
OmniLink bad.
Eclipse (single deck?) Good
Enviro 400 and the lastest one Good.
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 06:13:26 PM
Hang on, I might be getting the names and numbers confused here.
Gemini 3? - looks like. (Double deck on the 9 route) bad
OmniLink bad.
Eclipse (single deck?) Good
Enviro 400 and the lastest one Good.
Yes, the type names are:
E200 - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/0501-0830/805.html
E400 - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/4700-4879/4809.html
Omnilink - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/1750-1953/1940.html
E400 MMC - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/5001-9959/6115.html - Found on the 9, 140, X10 and 126.
Streetdeck - used on the 9 - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/4001-4224/3302.html
B7TL Gemini - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/4475-4699/4663.html
Wright eclipse 2 B7RLE - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/2001-2129/2142.html - Found on the 120.
B7TL ALX400 - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/4225-4474/4295.html - Found on the 127/8.
Trident - http://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/4001-4224/4195.html - Found on the 129 and 140.
Quote from: Typhoon2000 on September 22, 2017, 06:13:26 PM
Hang on, I might be getting the names and numbers confused here.
Gemini 3? - looks like. (Double deck on the 9 route) bad
OmniLink bad.
Eclipse (single deck?) Good
Enviro 400 and the lastest one Good.
Gemini 3 a.k.a Streetdecks are loved by a lot tbh (their sound and comfort is what is loved by most on here). They are better then the sheds on the 9, sorry E400 MMCs. (Apart from 6103) :P
Omnilinks are good buses, just the legroom and doors put people off. WB have done something to their Omnilinks though, horrible horns and they sound dull.
Eclipse 2's are good, but by most they're quite boring, dull and slow, although it makes me think have people actually rode one to see how fast they go.
E400's are good buses, ZF E400 MMC's are sheds but the Voiths are beasts.
Quote from: 2206 on September 22, 2017, 05:37:45 PM
What a load of nonsense. What are you complaining about, there are new buses on the 9, 126 and X10 (the Hagley Roads express service).
For a start the 127/128/129 are not majority Omnilinks operated, main allocation from what I've seen its B7TL ALX400 on the 127/8 (as they have been for years) and Tridents on the 129 as PN have it.
The E200 are not old and must have at least another good 10 years with NX. If you want to see an old tatty bus go and have a look at 4226 and 4304.
The 127/8/9 don't use B10Ls the last of them went in 2015.
The 9 got new E400 in 2009, the MMC didn't come till 2015, hardly straight after.
The MMC are still on the 9 alongside the Streetdexks.
The 120A uses Omnilinks though. There are two platinum routes into the City Centre. 0-2 year old buses on the most frequent routes (9, 126). Why's @Typhoon2000 complaining again?
If you want to check vehicle type names that can be found on the vehicle types section of the usual allocations spreadsheet or on the main site.
You're right. 127/128 are solid B7TL, with the odd Enviro
ive travelled on other operators mk2 eclipse b7rles, and they don't half shift, so maybe nx have them tuned down?
Quote from: mranon on September 22, 2017, 08:17:39 PM
ive travelled on other operators mk2 eclipse b7rles, and they don't half shift, so maybe nx have them tuned down?
Or perhaps as a passenger you can never really tell because you don't know whether the driver is driving professionally and not putting his foot to the floor to pull away
Nxbus defense league to the rescue lol, I'd better not mention 94 corridor then pmsl, this is almost as funny as wilmont or whatever the name is brown returning in Enders
Quote from: mranon on September 22, 2017, 08:17:39 PM
ive travelled on other operators mk2 eclipse b7rles, and they don't half shift, so maybe nx have them tuned down?
The NX ones don't rev out. The NX ones do however shift. They're fast buses. They're also quiet buses. People think that just because it doesn't sound good, it's slow. That's not the case. In my opinion, they're the best single decker I've driven, and that's taking into account the performance, comfort, visibility and general driving experience.
I've driven the B10B/L, O405N, Scania Omnilink, Enviro 200 MMC, Diamond Plaxton Primo & the B7RLEs.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on September 23, 2017, 12:15:55 AM
Nxbus defense league to the rescue lol, I'd better not mention 94 corridor then pmsl, this is almost as funny as wilmont or whatever the name is brown returning in Enders
Nothing wrong with the current buses on the 94. Technically the 65 is still using the same buses that were new branded for the route 16 years ago, and 67 has had a downgrade from 2004 bendi-buses to Geminis and ALX400s. So the 94 is not doing bad compared to these. The Geminis don't look 14 years old with a refurb
Quote from: John on September 23, 2017, 08:58:34 AM
Nothing wrong with the current buses on the 94.
He means the shoeboxes, not the Gemini's.
Quote from: Jack on September 23, 2017, 09:01:36 AM
He means the shoeboxes, not the Gemini's.
They are not on the 94 as often as they are on the 65/7
Quote from: John on September 23, 2017, 09:04:11 AM
They are not on the 94 as often as they are on the 65/7
I know they aren't. Everytime he see's them on the 94 he moans about them being on there. PB probably have the worst batch of them. Most of them haven't even received a refurb!
Rewind to 2012 and they were full allocation of the 94!
Quote from: Jack on September 23, 2017, 09:01:36 AM
He means the shoeboxes, not the Gemini's.
What shoeboxes? Didn't realise there were mechanical shoeboxes on the road.
Quote from: P419 EJW on September 23, 2017, 09:18:56 AM
What shoeboxes? Didn't realise there were mechanical shoeboxes on the road.
The ALX400 B7TL's, or as monkeyjoe calls them shoeboxes.
The ALX400 is if not the worst bodywork going.
Quote from: Jack on September 23, 2017, 09:21:52 AM
The ALX400 B7TL's, or as monkeyjoe calls them shoeboxes.
The ALX400 is if not the worst bodywork going.
Riiiight, okay. At least ALXs are symmetrical, unlike E200MMCs. B7 ALXs are lovely buses, even had many rides on First B7 ALXs in different places - that is my opinion, anyway.
Quote from: P419 EJW on September 23, 2017, 09:27:48 AM
Riiiight, okay. At least ALXs are symmetrical, unlike E200MMCs. B7 ALXs are lovely buses, even had many rides on First B7 ALXs in different places - that is my opinion, anyway.
I like the ALX/B7's too, but there are a good few sheds of them. They aren't the best buses but at the same time they aren't the worst.
Quote from: Jack on September 23, 2017, 09:21:52 AMThe ALX400 is if not the worst bodywork going.
Personally I'd give that award to the streetwreck. The ALX400 is a timeless classic!
Quote from: V89MOA on September 23, 2017, 09:35:56 AM
Personally I'd give that award to the streetwreck. The ALX400 is a timeless classic!
The Gemini is the best bodywork. Hard, rigid, tough and strong. Sorry to be rude but I think ALX400 was drawn by the designers son. So boxey. Not forgetting it has a crap IP sealing, water leaking everywhere!
Quote from: Jack on September 23, 2017, 09:38:11 AM
The Gemini is the best bodywork. Hard, rigid, tough and strong. Sorry to be rude but I think ALX400 was drawn by the designers son. So boxey. Not forgetting it has a crap IP sealing, water leaking everywhere!
I agree the Gemini 1 bodywork is the best bodywork. It's aesthetically pleasing and curvy. Any livery would suit the bodywork. Would be nice if TWM had chosen the bonded windows instead of gasket windows, but that's the personal preference.
Gemini 1 is perfection, Gemini 3 however is lipstick on a pig.
Quote from: V89MOA on September 23, 2017, 09:46:25 AM
Gemini 1 is perfection, Gemini 3 however is lipstick on a pig.
Agreed. Not too keen on Gemini 2 and 3 either.
Quote from: P419 EJW on September 23, 2017, 09:48:19 AM
Agreed. Not too keen on Gemini 2 and 3 either.
Nah nor am I, I'm not really keen anything Volvo or Wright post 2007.
Quote from: V89MOA on September 23, 2017, 09:51:56 AM
Nah nor am I, I'm not really keen anything Volvo or Wright post 2007.
Aye, Wrightbus has gone downhill with the bodywork designs from that year.
Quote from: P419 EJW on September 23, 2017, 09:55:13 AM
Aye, Wrightbus has gone downhill with the bodywork designs from that year.
100% agree!
Quote from: P419 EJW on September 23, 2017, 09:48:19 AM
Agreed. Not too keen on Gemini 2 and 3 either.
I love them. Yes lol, it's abit weird. But the Streetlite is horrible. But the B7RLE Bodywork (Urban 1 and 2) are great.
Quote from: P419 EJW on September 23, 2017, 09:48:19 AM
Agreed. Not too keen on Gemini 2 and 3 either.
What's wrong with the Gemini 2s? I rather like them personally.
The ALX400 is the best design going, the worst is the Streetdeck. The Gemini 1's are really solid as well but what I can agree on is that Wrightbus body designs have gone downhill since 2007.
Quote from: MasterPlan on September 23, 2017, 12:05:19 PM
What's wrong with the Gemini 2s? I rather like them personally.
Gemini 2 is smart. It's the Streetdecks that don't look right at the front but the rear is smart. The ALX400 is horrible, rattles like mad, bounce over a pot hole, the Euro 5 Omnilinks have a crappy suspension aswell.
Sounds like some of you are talking about the design and some of you are talking about wualityZ
With regards to the design of ALX400s, of course everyone will have their own opinion. It's subjective.
With quality. I don't think ADL are in the same league as Wright to be quite honest. Wrightbus definitely wi the quality argument. Although this is pre MMC era. I haven't really been on these 400MMCs/Streetdeck to comment on them.
I don't know how anyone can criticise the StreetDeck, it is the best modern decker by miles. It's the best bus I have ever driven and I wish we had more than the 4 we do have at Worcester. I have driven them many times and can honestly say that I have not heard one negative comment from passengers about them. The unusual bodywork is a plus point and they are well built. I have never driven an enviro 400 but have been a passenger on many NXWM examples and the ride quality is certainly not as good. I would hope that NXWM will purchase a significant number of StreetDecks in the future. However, do not get me started on the StreetLite single decker which is the complete opposite of all the StreetDecks positive points!
Sorry for the late reply guys.. trying to type stuff on a mobile phone is no fun. Back on a computer now..
So what I was getting at (I got my bus names and numbers totally confused)
(https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F4.bp.blogspot.com%2F-LHm7LHbWBZ0%2FVViLQFjBaII%2FAAAAAAAAAaQ%2FI1oiwy6HDm8%2Fs1600%2FDSC_0079_edited.jpg&hash=0523f78a89bb056ce6b775de0f703a682c4bd520)
ADL Enviro 400
(https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/proxy.php?request=http%3A%2F%2F3.bp.blogspot.com%2F-DQPeyDem5WY%2FVfasZ-Ub9sI%2FAAAAAAAATE4%2F8Ow8mhWzSf8%2Fs1600%2FEK%252BLondon%252BGeneral%252BWHV43.jpg&hash=df19b475ed473b5b5b6e11232656693bdb124cea)
Wrightbus Gemini3
As a passenger, and an advocate of the use of buses in Brum, to suddenly go from a smooth E400 to one of these awful sardine cans on wheels it's really put me off travelling by bus in this area. In some cases, when I wait at Lloyd House for a bus back home, I try to wait for another bus if a Gemini3 turns up, simply because it's just far too uncomfortable, cramped and feels like I'm riding on a cement mixer. I'm 6'2" and after a long physically demanding shift at work every weekday, the bus is usually a chance to sit and relax on the way home. Not on these. And as I've mentioned before, looking at the space the driver has to operate the bus with, it looks like they might run into the same problems London Taxi drivers end up after they've been at the job for a number of years. I only have to put up with it for a short while.. these drivers have hours. Every day... It's truly terrible.
Even these are preferable (at least in the summer - in the winter they seem to forget to open the heat flap at the start of the day)
(https://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/4001-4224/twm4128.091106.jpg)
ALX400
As for losing these to the Scania Omnilink:
(https://wmbusphotos.com/NXWM/2001-2129/twm2015.111203.jpg)
Vovlo B7RLE Eclipse(?)
Well I get it, fully, if it's for legal reasons such as exhaust emissions - that cannot be helped. However, my reasoning for not liking them is, again, a lot of legroom gets lost and in general the layout is pretty poorly thought out. The previous bus was very, very well laid out and there was good space to be able to be properly seated in all seat, and even the red tap disc was in a sensible place as you boarded the bus. I hate bad design and the idea that you need to redesign the man fit on the bus.. I mean this is the 21st century now, so I don't get why the badly designed and generally poor quality ride of the Gemini3 actually exists.
One thing I praise the newest ADL E400's MMC on his how they manage to re-engineer the original in order to make it easier for bus operating companies and their drivers to use. In fact there was a promo video demonstrating how they actually asked the drivers what they want (novel concept), maintenance guys what they wanted (again novel), and bus operators how they can make them cheaper and easier to run. I wonder what the drivers at NXWM make of these.
Here's a video that was uploaded to YouTube on the E400 MMC development (http://e400%20mmc%20development%20https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=rDdJPzqoc0o). Some good design and engineering here...
Anyway, again I do apologise for the confusion guys, the bus types/chassis types, names and numbers do get get a bit mixed up here. Hope this clears things up! :)
What's the difference between a Gemini 3 and a streetdeck?
From what I can see the Gemini 3 is the offering on the Volvo chasis.
NX have Wright Streetdecks on the 9 in Birmingham not Volvo Gemini 3s?
Regarding the ALX400s, the picture of the Trident is confusing me as you were complaining about them being taken of the 127/8 and Tridents have never been used on the 127/8. you seem to be confusing, the two different types with NX.
B7TL's with ALX400 bodywork, these are the ones on the 127/8 and they are still the majority type on the 127/8 and have not been replaced by Omnilinks.
Tridents with ALX400 bodywork, the bus in your pic on the 51 is a Trident.
Mr Typhoon, I couldn't agree with you less on that exact batch of Wrightbus Gemini 3 shown in your photo. I travel on them quite frequently for a 40 minute journey and whilst no urban bus is particularly comfortable for that distance these are fast vehicles, and the bodywork does not rattle, and the suspension is not bad - a similar journey on an E200 mini MMC is awful is comparison in all ways, as is an E400 - the E400 are irritatingly sluggish also.
I'm not sure about comfort and leg room - I don't find it an issue but am average build.
The Wright bodywork on the Streetdeck and the London Volvo Hybrids are similar structures if not exactly the same in length, so in terms of its performance from a passenger perspective is likely to be similar - the Volvo has a longer rear overhang - so the seating spacing and layout may be different - it definitely will in London because of the extra door.
Yes, I'm 6'2" so no bus will be totally comfortable, as you say. However the unit being run on the 9 route is beyond a joke! As for the rattle - no, it's bad. However the rattle must be due to poorly designed engine mounts because the NVH gets transferred directly to the passenger compartment and it's not pleasant. Especially if you're sitting at the back. :o
When you talk about suspension, the Streetdeck and Gemini 3 will be different.
Same as how a B7TL ALX400 is generallly a smoother ride and a Trident ALX400 is generallly a crashier and firm ride.
It'd be helpful if you didn't mix them all up.
The B5LH in the picture will be more comparable to 5501-18 at BC, which, incidentally, are quick, have good suspension and generous legroom. The only thing in common with the Streetdeck will be the bodywork.
I can't comment on the Streetdeck as I've not been on one, but one review I read comparing the Streetdeck and B5TL on Gemini 3 bodywork favoured the B5TL. I personally think the Wright / Volvo combination is the best out there and would like to see some B5TL (or the new shape B8RLE) in the NX fleet. The Gemini 3 is a bit of a marmite body but with the right livery, e.g Lothian, Harrogate 36, it can look really impressive.
I've said it before but I must be the only one to like the Gemini 3/Streetdeck! I do agree though that the livery also makes the looks better, as some do not suit the body. I like then better than the MMCs on the 9, as they seem to be quicker and a lot smoother. I guess they are similar to our OmniCitys as there are only 5 of them only at one garage
I've always found that the ride and comfort in our Volvos and Scanias are superior to ADL buses which I find are awful over potholes and rough road. The MK1 Enviros make up with their sheer power but the gearbox setup in the MK2s are still awful changing up too early lacking acceleration when you need it
You get the right B7TL and you have a lovely day, especially our 44** Geminis, as they fly and are very smooth. The Coventry Geminis are more like the ALX400s because I think they have the same gearbox as each other and our native Geminis have the other. I have no interest in which gearbox they have like others do so no idea what they are
Quote from: John on September 24, 2017, 09:34:48 AM
I've said it before but I must be the only one to like the Gemini 3/Streetdeck! I do agree though that the livery also makes the looks better, as some do not suit the body. I like then better than the MMCs on the 9, as they seem to be quicker and a lot smoother. I guess they are similar to our OmniCitys as there are only 5 of them only at one garage
I've always found that the ride and comfort in our Volvos and Scanias are superior to ADL buses which I find are awful over potholes and rough road. The MK1 Enviros make up with their sheer power but the gearbox setup in the MK2s are still awful changing up too early lacking acceleration when you need it
You get the right B7TL and you have a lovely day, especially our 44** Geminis, as they fly and are very smooth. The Coventry Geminis are more like the ALX400s because I think they have the same gearbox as each other and our native Geminis have the other. I have no interest in which gearbox they have like others do so no idea what they are
I like the Streetdecks, guaranteed they may look abit ugly they're nice.
You bounce on the Scania's over potholes.
The 44** Gemini are my favourite batch. Pretty much like all of them apart from 4477 and 4490.
Quote from: John on September 24, 2017, 09:34:48 AM
I've said it before but I must be the only one to like the Gemini 3/Streetdeck!
I'm with you John, took me a little while to get used to it but I think it's a really smart design which, like most Wrightbus bodies, will look modern for longer than its more conservative ADL counterpart.
I don't recall reading a single post from a driver who preferred driving ADLs over Wright/Volvo equivalents.
Quote from: Mike K on September 24, 2017, 10:34:37 AM
I'm with you John, took me a little while to get used to it but I think it's a really smart design which, like most Wrightbus bodies, will look modern for longer than its more conservative ADL counterpart.
I don't recall reading a single post from a driver who preferred driving ADLs over Wright/Volvo equivalents.
I have heard a few times drivers moaning when they get given a streetdeck instead of an mmc at stourbridge bus station. Don't know why however, the one thing that I don't like is they have that constant buzzing sound when the doors are open( don't know why this is and only happens on occasions)
It does make me wonder when people praise the 44XX Geminis, because the 45XX which are the same batch seem hit and miss at AG. The key difference being the lockdown isn't there and they aren't as smooth. The 46XX batch are much better in my opinion. 4507 is a sluggish one of the top of my head, whilst 4508 is one of the best.
Quote from: MW on September 24, 2017, 11:27:33 AM
It does make me wonder when people praise the 44XX Geminis, because the 45XX which are the same batch seem hit and miss at AG. The key difference being the lockdown isn't there and they aren't as smooth. The 46XX batch are much better in my opinion. 4507 is a sluggish one of the top of my head, whilst 4508 is one of the best.
I actually like 4507 lol. I rode it at PB when it came back and it is a beast. Whereas you have 4639 which barely moves. 4661 isn't that great either.
Quote from: Trident 4194 on September 24, 2017, 10:51:12 AM
I have heard a few times drivers moaning when they get given a streetdeck instead of an mmc at stourbridge bus station. Don't know why however, the one thing that I don't like is they have that constant buzzing sound when the doors are open( don't know why this is and only happens on occasions)
Because they take the handbrake off with the doors open.
Quote from: Jack on September 24, 2017, 11:41:00 AM
I actually like 4507 lol. I rode it at PB when it came back and it is a beast. Whereas you have 4639 which barely moves. 4661 isn't that great either.
4639 is an anomaly lol. It revs really slowly until around 1500 rpm and then it's fine. You really had to plan when moving in that bus. Camp Hill was scary in that. Can't remember 4661. 4507 was sluggish and it vibrates a lot. It may have been fixed since then, I don't know. The other slow one is either 4509 or 4510. 4511 is one with no lockdown, and 4522 is another slow one.
Quote from: MW on September 24, 2017, 12:52:31 PM
4639 is an anomaly lol. It revs really slowly until around 1500 rpm and then it's fine. You really had to plan when moving in that bus. Camp Hill was scary in that. Can't remember 4661. 4507 was sluggish and it vibrates a lot. It may have been fixed since then, I don't know. The other slow one is either 4509 or 4510. 4511 is one with no lockdown, and 4522 is another slow one.
Camp Hill Circus is dangerous. Especially coming off Camp Hill. I think the Island needs to be traffic signaled. I haven't ridden 4511 since 2015. 4507 was a good one at WB. Then AG ruined it. When it came back to PB it felt better. Haven't seen it since it went back to AG. 45** Gems aren't too bad. I'm fond of 4500-4507. Especially the '03' plates AG now have, 4500-4505. 4506 is good one. It would howl while coasting down hills. When the Presidents were on the 31 and 37 they would often struggle to get onto Camp Hill Circus as they were really slow.
Quote from: Jack on September 24, 2017, 01:08:14 PM
Camp Hill Circus is dangerous. Especially coming off Camp Hill. I think the Island needs to be traffic signaled. I haven't ridden 4511 since 2015. 4507 was a good one at WB. Then AG ruined it. When it came back to PB it felt better. Haven't seen it since it went back to AG. 45** Gems aren't too bad. I'm fond of 4500-4507. Especially the '03' plates AG now have, 4500-4505. 4506 is good one. It would howl while coasting down hills. When the Presidents were on the 31 and 37 they would often struggle to get onto Camp Hill Circus as they were really slow.
Lol the AG has ruined them politics is funny. According to an engineer at AG, as the 45xx and the handful of 46xx were returning to AG, he said West Brom have ruined these buses. Some had incorrect steering wheels fitted, and others had kickdown removed. They were immaculate when they left AG. The AG Geminis that have remained here since new are the ones that are fine basically. It's the ones that have spent time at WB that appear to be the less desirable ones.
Quote from: MW on September 24, 2017, 02:06:05 PM
Lol the AG has ruined them politics is funny. According to an engineer at AG, as the 45xx and the handful of 46xx were returning to AG, he said West Brom have ruined these buses. Some had incorrect steering wheels fitted, and others had kickdown removed. They were immaculate when they left AG. The AG Geminis that have remained here since new are the ones that are fine basically. It's the ones that have spent time at WB that appear to be the less desirable ones.
I never liked 4639. 4643 is a favourite of mine. AG's Presidents weren't the best but WB's were in wonderful condition. Tbh AG's 45** aren't the best. 4526? I think that's got no kickdown. But the ones that were at Walsall were great. 4529 is a good one. But the 11 branded 45** are quite generic. Pretty much why the 44** are more loved by people. Same for the 46**.
Quote from: John on September 24, 2017, 09:34:48 AM
You get the right B7TL and you have a lovely day, especially our 44** Geminis, as they fly and are very smooth. The Coventry Geminis are more like the ALX400s because I think they have the same gearbox as each other and our native Geminis have the other. I have no interest in which gearbox they have like others do so no idea what they are
Correct, the cov gems have voith boxes, same as the ALX400 B7s, PBs other gems have ZF boxes
Quote from: Jack on September 24, 2017, 02:12:45 PM
I never liked 4639. 4643 is a favourite of mine. AG's Presidents weren't the best but WB's were in wonderful condition. Tbh AG's 45** aren't the best. 4526? I think that's got no kickdown. But the ones that were at Walsall were great. 4529 is a good one. But the 11 branded 45** are quite generic. Pretty much why the 44** are more loved by people. Same for the 46**.
Try 4508. That's the best 45xx I've driven. It's a screamer if you get the right driver.
Quote from: MW on September 24, 2017, 07:44:56 PM
Try 4508. That's the best 45xx I've driven. It's a screamer if you get the right driver.
Lol, I rode it a WB a while ago, it sounds the same as any other Gemini, unless AG have gave it a transplant :P
Quote from: Jack on September 24, 2017, 07:46:34 PM
Lol, I rode it a WB a while ago, it sounds the same as any other Gemini, unless AG have gave it a transplant :P
It's a mint one. The steering wheel when I last drove it two years ago was brand new, all the controls felt light, the drivers seat was bang on, the cab was clean and it pulled strong. The cooling fans worked properly. So they'd basically come on and come off. It's a fast one. I remember rallying it up Marsh Hill on the C lol. Entering Marsh Hill at 30mph and having the fortune of nobody wanting to get on or off and by the time you get into Erdington, the thing is roaring. Lol
Quote from: MW on September 24, 2017, 07:59:50 PM
It's a mint one. The steering wheel when I last drove it two years ago was brand new, all the controls felt light, the drivers seat was bang on, the cab was clean and it pulled strong. The cooling fans worked properly. So they'd basically come on and come off. It's a fast one. I remember rallying it up Marsh Hill on the C lol. Entering Marsh Hill at 30mph and having the fortune of nobody wanting to get on or off and by the time you get into Erdington, the thing is roaring. Lol
Will have to go hunt it down soon then lol. 4529 is my favourite 45** at AG. Closely followed by 4503/4/5/6/.
Quote from: MW on September 24, 2017, 07:59:50 PM
It's a mint one. The steering wheel when I last drove it two years ago was brand new, all the controls felt light, the drivers seat was bang on, the cab was clean and it pulled strong. The cooling fans worked properly. So they'd basically come on and come off. It's a fast one. I remember rallying it up Marsh Hill on the C lol. Entering Marsh Hill at 30mph and having the fortune of nobody wanting to get on or off and by the time you get into Erdington, the thing is roaring. Lol
Lol I still remember you overtaking me in 4698 with fans roaring and with kickdown.
Quote from: 2206 on September 23, 2017, 11:29:37 PM
What's the difference between a Gemini 3 and a streetdeck?
From what I can see the Gemini 3 is the offering on the Volvo chasis.
NX have Wright Streetdecks on the 9 in Birmingham not Volvo Gemini 3s?
The Wright Streetdeck is a complete bus (both the body and chassis) built by Wrights: http://www.wrightsgroup.com/datasheets/A3%20streetdeck%20Update.pdf whereas the Gemini 3 is a Wright's body (very similar to the Streetdeck body) but on a Volvo B5LH or B5TL chassis: http://www.wrightsgroup.com/datasheets/A3%20B5TL%20Gemini%203%20UpdateGR.pdf
Ian Hardy
Quote from: Ronnoc on September 24, 2017, 09:40:20 PM
Lol I still remember you overtaking me in 4698 with fans roaring and with kickdown.
Ah you missed a trip there Ronnoc. Keep your eyes peeled on the Solihull Signatures lol
Quote from: MW on September 23, 2017, 03:43:56 PM
Sounds like some of you are talking about the design and some of you are talking about wualityZ
What is wualityZ, can I ask?