http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-26647266
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:13:51 PM
http://www.bbc.com/news/uk-scotland-scotland-business-26647266
Oh joy, a fleet full of ADL products to look forward to for the foreseeable......
On the plus side, NX have committed to keep buying 125 new buses per year for the next five years, so NXWM & NXD fleets will have very low average ages, once the first generation low floor buses are withdrawn
The first 100-plus low-emission vehicles will be delivered during 2014.
A further 125 buses are expected to be delivered each year between 2015 and 2018.
Not sure how this fits with the Centro commitment for 300 (less 26 x E400 delivered to PB) new buses in 2014/5
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:18:06 PM
The first 100-plus low-emission vehicles will be delivered during 2014.
A further 125 buses are expected to be delivered each year between 2015 and 2018.
Not sure how this fits with the Centro commitment for 300 (less 26 x E400 delivered to PB) new buses in 2014/5
Unless the terms on the Centro agreement have since been changed or extended, NX have agreed to deliver the 300 new buses by June 2015. To achieve that they need to deliver 150 in 2014 and a further 126 within the first six months of 2015. Which is more than than article quotes being due during that period
http://www.centro.org.uk/media/20865/TBT-Partnership-Plus-Agreement-July-2013-Final-.pdf
300 new buses, of which at least 15 will be hybrid
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:27:26 PM
http://www.centro.org.uk/media/20865/TBT-Partnership-Plus-Agreement-July-2013-Final-.pdf
300 new buses, of which at least 15 will be hybrid
NX missed out on the last round of Greenbus funding, so unless there is a round 5 of funds planned, then, I can't see any more hybrids coming for a while. Again you'd expect any hybrids to be ADL E400H's and form part of that deal/those quantities.
I'm a little surprised NX have signed up to ADL for 5 years before trying out any other manufacturers Euro 6 products, some are still yet to be launched
Fantastic news, thanks for sharing.
News report states:-
'The vehicles, which will be a mix of double deck and midi buses, will join National Express's fleets in the West Midlands and Dundee'
So I assume if any more full size single deckers are needed then these will not be from ADL, there are still lots of Volvos and Mercs to withdraw
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
News report states:-
'The vehicles, which will be a mix of double deck and midi buses, will join National Express's fleets in the West Midlands and Dundee'
So I assume if any more full size single deckers are needed then these will not be from ADL, there are still lots of Volvos and Mercs to withdraw
This article quotes that Dundee are due some of them before the 23rd July Commonwealth games this year
http://www.scotsman.com/business/alexander-dennis-secures-100m-bus-order-1-3346223
Don't quote me but I was told whilst at WN that before some of the new buses are destined for NXWM they will be used at NXD for the commonwealth games. Just going off what was said to me so I don't know how true that is?
Quote from: Nathan on March 19, 2014, 03:46:38 PM
Don't quote me but I was told whilst at WN that before some of the new buses are destined for NXWM they will be used at NXD for the commonwealth games. Just going off what was said to me so I don't know how true that is?
I did wonder if that might happen, I guess it depends if the new buses are to be used on work specific to the Commonwealth Games like when NXWM's E400's went to the Olympics.
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 02:53:33 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
News report states:-
'The vehicles, which will be a mix of double deck and midi buses, will join National Express's fleets in the West Midlands and Dundee'
So I assume if any more full size single deckers are needed then these will not be from ADL, there are still lots of Volvos and Mercs to withdraw
This article quotes that Dundee are due some of them before the 23rd July Commonwealth games this year
http://www.scotsman.com/business/alexander-dennis-secures-100m-bus-order-1-3346223
Very impressed by this. More investment in the Dundee division by NX which hopefully they continue instead of bringing crap buses up from WM.
Quote from: Kiewii on March 19, 2014, 03:54:36 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 02:53:33 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
News report states:-
'The vehicles, which will be a mix of double deck and midi buses, will join National Express's fleets in the West Midlands and Dundee'
So I assume if any more full size single deckers are needed then these will not be from ADL, there are still lots of Volvos and Mercs to withdraw
This article quotes that Dundee are due some of them before the 23rd July Commonwealth games this year
http://www.scotsman.com/business/alexander-dennis-secures-100m-bus-order-1-3346223
Very impressed by this. More investment in the Dundee division by NX which hopefully they continue instead of bringing crap buses up from WM.
I take it you're not a fan of the Presidents.
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 03:56:58 PM
Quote from: Kiewii on March 19, 2014, 03:54:36 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 02:53:33 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
News report states:-
'The vehicles, which will be a mix of double deck and midi buses, will join National Express's fleets in the West Midlands and Dundee'
So I assume if any more full size single deckers are needed then these will not be from ADL, there are still lots of Volvos and Mercs to withdraw
This article quotes that Dundee are due some of them before the 23rd July Commonwealth games this year
http://www.scotsman.com/business/alexander-dennis-secures-100m-bus-order-1-3346223
Very impressed by this. More investment in the Dundee division by NX which hopefully they continue instead of bringing crap buses up from WM.
I take it you're not a fan of the Presidents.
Of course not! They all terrible to me (but then I don't like ZF gearboxes anyway). Give me a Gemini anyday!!
Quote from: Kiewii on March 19, 2014, 03:54:36 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 02:53:33 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:51:11 PM
News report states:-
'The vehicles, which will be a mix of double deck and midi buses, will join National Express's fleets in the West Midlands and Dundee'
So I assume if any more full size single deckers are needed then these will not be from ADL, there are still lots of Volvos and Mercs to withdraw
This article quotes that Dundee are due some of them before the 23rd July Commonwealth games this year
http://www.scotsman.com/business/alexander-dennis-secures-100m-bus-order-1-3346223
Very impressed by this. More investment in the Dundee division by NX which hopefully they continue instead of bringing crap buses up from WM.
Other than the 10 x Presidents that were cascaded, Dundee has only had brand new since NX started ordering 120 new buses per year back in 2011
The only venue near Dundee for the commonwealth games is Barry Buddon Shooting Centre, Carnoustie
Is NXD providing park and ride and/or athlete's transport?
Really glad such an order has been announced. It certainly shows impressive investment by NX and will result in a very modern fleet indeed. Great they are also supporting British manufacturing!
It mentions midibuses and deckers-are we assuming this means e200 and e400's or could e300s be a feature? I personally don't see how NX could go without replacing some longer single decks like for like as there must surely be a limit as to how many routes they want/need to upgrade with deckers. Similarly, e200's are pretty small...
Nothing new for WN this year Nathan. More Tridents for us
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 04:26:40 PM
The only venue near Dundee for the commonwealth games is Barry Buddon Shooting Centre, Carnoustie
Is NXD providing park and ride and/or athlete's transport?
NX are providing some of the services in Glasgow
Quote from: Tony on March 19, 2014, 06:13:01 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 04:26:40 PM
The only venue near Dundee for the commonwealth games is Barry Buddon Shooting Centre, Carnoustie
Is NXD providing park and ride and/or athlete's transport?
NX are providing some of the services in Glasgow
Well done them on securing contracts in First heartland...!
Quote from: Ashley on March 19, 2014, 06:08:40 PM
Nothing new for WN this year Nathan. More Tridents for us
Didn't say there was Ash :) (I was aware there are no new buses for PL) The plan is to get rid of mercs with cascaded tridents from other garages if the cascade process goes to plan. I can see a gradual withdrawal of the Spectra's (Like the Excels). I would think 4001 and even 4002 would be candidates for preservation?
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 02:23:08 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:18:06 PM
The first 100-plus low-emission vehicles will be delivered during 2014.
A further 125 buses are expected to be delivered each year between 2015 and 2018.
Not sure how this fits with the Centro commitment for 300 (less 26 x E400 delivered to PB) new buses in 2014/5
Unless the terms on the Centro agreement have since been changed or extended, NX have agreed to deliver the 300 new buses by June 2015. To achieve that they need to deliver 150 in 2014 and a further 126 within the first six months of 2015. Which is more than than article quotes being due during that period
Will NXWM be looking at dual sourcing, with some buses coming from Wrights?
Generally while having a standard fleet helps with spares and maintenance, it can be dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket, and some bus operators learn this the hard way.
The days of the Spectras, Mercs and Plaxton Presidents must surely be numbered and one would hope a batch of vehicles is allocated to AG to allow the Outer Circle to be overhauled.
Glad to see this actually; The ADL products are very good in my opinion; the 57 reg Enviros NX have are still excellent now; 4718 doesn't rattle and the engines on them are very good along with the suspension. The Enviro 300 and Enviro 200s are good as well; solid buses which will do their job well. Plus NX are supporting a British business which is good news as well; only thing is no Citaros still ;D
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 07:09:23 PM
Glad to see this actually; The ADL products are very good in my opinion; the 57 reg Enviros NX have are still excellent now; 4718 doesn't rattle and the engines on them are very good along with the suspension. The Enviro 300 and Enviro 200s are good as well; solid buses which will do their job well. Plus NX are supporting a British business which is good news as well; only thing is no Citaros still ;D
NX are also lining the pockets of Brian Souter & Ann Gloag.....
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on March 19, 2014, 07:05:28 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 02:23:08 PM
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 19, 2014, 02:18:06 PM
The first 100-plus low-emission vehicles will be delivered during 2014.
A further 125 buses are expected to be delivered each year between 2015 and 2018.
Not sure how this fits with the Centro commitment for 300 (less 26 x E400 delivered to PB) new buses in 2014/5
Unless the terms on the Centro agreement have since been changed or extended, NX have agreed to deliver the 300 new buses by June 2015. To achieve that they need to deliver 150 in 2014 and a further 126 within the first six months of 2015. Which is more than than article quotes being due during that period
Will NXWM be looking at dual sourcing, with some buses coming from Wrights?
Generally while having a standard fleet helps with spares and maintenance, it can be dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket, and some bus operators learn this the hard way.
The days of the Spectras, Mercs and Plaxton Presidents must surely be numbered and one would hope a batch of vehicles is allocated to AG to allow the Outer Circle to be overhauled.
The 5 year deal signed wit ADL is 'exclusive', therefore NX will not be buying any other buses from any other manufacturers. I expect Wrightbus more than likely tendered for the the NX 5 year supply deal, but no doubt missed out on price I expect
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on March 19, 2014, 07:05:28 PM
Will NXWM be looking at dual sourcing, with some buses coming from Wrights?
Generally while having a standard fleet helps with spares and maintenance, it can be dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket, and some bus operators learn this the hard way.
The days of the Spectras, Mercs and Plaxton Presidents must surely be numbered and one would hope a batch of vehicles is allocated to AG to allow the Outer Circle to be overhauled.
It would be a shame if the Outer Circle ended up with Enviro400s, as I would have hoped NX might have gone with 'something different' to keep this classic route 'iconic'. Tell you what, let's replace the Presidents at AG with everyone else's Gemini cast-offs, that would make me happy! :)
Interesting though that the article only mentions double-decks and midi-buses, wonder if NX would still source some full-length single-decks from elsewhere, or could there be a long-term review of services which could see some current single-deck services be upgraded to double-deck (say for example, the 6, 37, 120) which could see existing single decks such as the Wright Eclipse 2s and Scania Omnilinks to be cascaded to replace older Volvo B10L and Mercedes O405Ns (for services that only justify full length single decks), while services currently using full-length singles that don't need them could be replaced with new midi-buses?
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 10:21:26 PM
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
100% Agree there, I think it was silly sending them to WB in the first place. I don't see any real reason why the 11 couldn't have Geminis back I mean after all they were new for that route in the first place... I don't really understand the obsession with the 11 having brand new buses again, okay it may be a "flagship" route but so is the 126, that manages fine with 10 year old tridents. Let's not forget before the Geminis came along it had the oldest buses in the fleet on it.
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:28:01 PM
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 10:21:26 PM
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
100% Agree there, I think it was silly sending them to WB in the first place. I don't see any real reason why the 11 couldn't have Geminis back I mean after all they were new for that route in the first place... I don't really understand the obsession with the 11 having brand new buses again, okay it may be a "flagship" route but so is the 126, that manages fine with 10 year old tridents. Let's not forget before the Geminis came along it had the oldest buses in the fleet on it.
WB needed more Euro 3 double deckers to allow its higher frequency services running in to Birmingham City Centre to be upgraded/comply with the QPS requirements. The AG Gemini's were the chosen source of those vehicles, as there were no restrictions on the type of vehicles that could be used on the 11 route
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:32:40 PM
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:28:01 PM
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 10:21:26 PM
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
100% Agree there, I think it was silly sending them to WB in the first place. I don't see any real reason why the 11 couldn't have Geminis back I mean after all they were new for that route in the first place... I don't really understand the obsession with the 11 having brand new buses again, okay it may be a "flagship" route but so is the 126, that manages fine with 10 year old tridents. Let's not forget before the Geminis came along it had the oldest buses in the fleet on it.
WB needed more Euro 3 double deckers to allow its higher frequency services running in to Birmingham City Centre to be upgraded/comply with the QPS requirements. The AG Gemini's were the chosen source of those vehicles, as there were no restrictions on the type of vehicles that could be used on the 11 route
Oh yeah don't get me wrong I understand the reason behind the moves, I just think they were the wrong choice, you now have the 74/75 split allocations between ALX400 and Gemini. Wouldn't it have been a better idea to use those geminis to 'upgrade' the 94 and have the Soho road ALX operated, I may be wrong but the numbers are about right aren't they give or take the spare geminis that get elsewhere in west brom.
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 10:21:26 PM
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
The 11 needs to go back to full Gemini, Geminis suit the 11 to a T
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:43:23 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:32:40 PM
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:28:01 PM
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 10:21:26 PM
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
100% Agree there, I think it was silly sending them to WB in the first place. I don't see any real reason why the 11 couldn't have Geminis back I mean after all they were new for that route in the first place... I don't really understand the obsession with the 11 having brand new buses again, okay it may be a "flagship" route but so is the 126, that manages fine with 10 year old tridents. Let's not forget before the Geminis came along it had the oldest buses in the fleet on it.
WB needed more Euro 3 double deckers to allow its higher frequency services running in to Birmingham City Centre to be upgraded/comply with the QPS requirements. The AG Gemini's were the chosen source of those vehicles, as there were no restrictions on the type of vehicles that could be used on the 11 route
Oh yeah don't get me wrong I understand the reason behind the moves, I just think they were the wrong choice, you now have the 74/75 split allocations between ALX400 and Gemini. Wouldn't it have been a better idea to use those geminis to 'upgrade' the 94 and have the Soho road ALX operated, I may be wrong but the numbers are about right aren't they give or take?
It's a shame the QPS scheme had to happen. You were getting a good mix of Presidents, Geminis and ALXs on the 74/75, 80,127/8 before the bulk of Geminis came to WB. Hopefully the new buses at WB will see cascades to either PB or AG
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:43:23 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:32:40 PM
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:28:01 PM
Quote from: Rob H on March 19, 2014, 10:21:26 PM
Quote from: Liberator9 on March 19, 2014, 08:29:25 PM
I too wouldn't mind the Outer Circle ending up with Geminis. Still excellent buses; aged better than the Tridents certainly. Rode one of the refurbished ones on the 5 the other day and it was very comfortable ride. The suspension was superb and no rattling from anywhere. Just brand the Geminis in some attractive livery (silver and black would suit them) and sorted. Would hope there are different buses ordered for full size single decks; despite being solid, ADL's Enviro 200s are quite loud unlike the Wrights or Scanias.
I too wouldn't mind the 11 being all Geminis and if that does happen I would love to see 4511-4514/4517-4534/4635-4642 back at AG at least. :)
100% Agree there, I think it was silly sending them to WB in the first place. I don't see any real reason why the 11 couldn't have Geminis back I mean after all they were new for that route in the first place... I don't really understand the obsession with the 11 having brand new buses again, okay it may be a "flagship" route but so is the 126, that manages fine with 10 year old tridents. Let's not forget before the Geminis came along it had the oldest buses in the fleet on it.
WB needed more Euro 3 double deckers to allow its higher frequency services running in to Birmingham City Centre to be upgraded/comply with the QPS requirements. The AG Gemini's were the chosen source of those vehicles, as there were no restrictions on the type of vehicles that could be used on the 11 route
Oh yeah don't get me wrong I understand the reason behind the moves, I just think they were the wrong choice, you now have the 74/75 split allocations between ALX400 and Gemini. Wouldn't it have been a better idea to use those geminis to 'upgrade' the 94 and have the Soho road ALX operated, I may be wrong but the numbers are about right aren't they give or take the spare geminis that get elsewhere in west brom.
Yes I can see your point. The only slight problem with that solution is that WB would of had an even older average age as there would be a big concentration of 51 plate ALX400's allocated there.
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:46:49 PM
Yes I can see your point. The only slight problem with that solution is that WB would of had an even older average age as there would be a big concentration of 51 plate ALX400's allocated there.
That's actually a fair point that I never even thought about tbh, BUT on the other hand you could argue with the average age that old, it would have surely put WB at the top of the list for new buses this year :P
That's another point in itself if ADL are supplying the deckers for the next 5 years, unless of course you used castoffs, that must mean that WB will have to start operating Enviro 400 at some point?
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:50:33 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:46:49 PM
Yes I can see your point. The only slight problem with that solution is that WB would of had an even older average age as there would be a big concentration of 51 plate ALX400's allocated there.
That's actually a fair point that I never even thought about tbh, BUT on the other hand you could argue with the average age that old, it would have surely put WB at the top of the list for new buses this year :P
That's another point in itself if ADL are supplying the deckers for the next 5 years, unless of course you used castoffs, that must mean that WB will have to start operating Enviro 400 at some point?
WB consistently being in pole position on Pete's average age list hasn't had much impact to date, I'm note sure the £3 million investment this year will propel WB that far up the league table either, as only 20 new buses were quoted in the advert which would only replace 12% of WB's fleet or could remove the entire Merc fleet of 21 if it was 20 E300 single deckers.
It looks as though both AG & WB will end up with E400's at some point, both garages have traditionally operated solid Volvo double decker fleets for a number of years
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 11:00:02 PM
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:50:33 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:46:49 PM
Yes I can see your point. The only slight problem with that solution is that WB would of had an even older average age as there would be a big concentration of 51 plate ALX400's allocated there.
That's actually a fair point that I never even thought about tbh, BUT on the other hand you could argue with the average age that old, it would have surely put WB at the top of the list for new buses this year :P
That's another point in itself if ADL are supplying the deckers for the next 5 years, unless of course you used castoffs, that must mean that WB will have to start operating Enviro 400 at some point?
WB consistently being in pole position on Pete's average age list hasn't had much impact to date, I'm note sure the £3 million investment this year will propel WB that far up the league table either, as only 20 new buses were quoted in the advert which would only replace 12% of WB's fleet or could remove the entire Merc fleet of 21 if it was 20 E300 single deckers.
It looks as though both AG & WB will end up with E400's at some point, both garages have traditionally operated solid Volvo double decker fleets for a number of years
Fair enough, I suppose WB hasn't got a great history for new buses over recent times. I guess we can just see what happens, will be interesting to see exactly how things stand in 5 years time.
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 11:02:21 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 11:00:02 PM
Quote from: trident4370 on March 19, 2014, 10:50:33 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 19, 2014, 10:46:49 PM
Yes I can see your point. The only slight problem with that solution is that WB would of had an even older average age as there would be a big concentration of 51 plate ALX400's allocated there.
That's actually a fair point that I never even thought about tbh, BUT on the other hand you could argue with the average age that old, it would have surely put WB at the top of the list for new buses this year :P
That's another point in itself if ADL are supplying the deckers for the next 5 years, unless of course you used castoffs, that must mean that WB will have to start operating Enviro 400 at some point?
WB consistently being in pole position on Pete's average age list hasn't had much impact to date, I'm note sure the £3 million investment this year will propel WB that far up the league table either, as only 20 new buses were quoted in the advert which would only replace 12% of WB's fleet or could remove the entire Merc fleet of 21 if it was 20 E300 single deckers.
It looks as though both AG & WB will end up with E400's at some point, both garages have traditionally operated solid Volvo double decker fleets for a number of years
Fair enough, I suppose WB hasn't got a great history for new buses over recent times. I guess we can just see what happens, will be interesting to see exactly how things stand in 5 years time.
I don't understand why WB doesn't feature that highly on the priority list for new buses, they operate quite a few higher profile/high frequency routes. The Dudley Road services (82 & 87) were originally upgraded with the 06 plate Gemini as part of a quality corridor back then. Even those are now 8 years old this year
I'm still surprised NX haven't announced this order to the stock market via an RNS, the size/significance of it is worth jumping on the PR bandwagon. There isn't anything on NX Group website of NXWM either. it appears that it is ADL that announced they have won the NX rather than NX themselves
I think NX's bus fleet is approx 1650 buses (NXWM & NXD), with the latest order NX will be replacing 36% of its fleet in a 4.5 year period (with the first being due in June)
Responding to Nathan's comment
4001 and 4002 are candidates for preservation and i think there is interest however preservation is subject to numerous bog standard terms and conditions or excuses
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Orange? The current interior spec is red handrails.
Also have you noticed the different type of seats compared to the ones we usually have ie. The tridents (In blue) and the previous E200's (In grey).
http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602. (bottom photo)
Quote from: Nathan on March 20, 2014, 02:16:20 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Orange? The current interior spec is red handrails
the clips on tv also showed a view of the production line with the bus at the front painted red and white with 2 other buses without paint.
there's also this video filmed in Dudley https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=ze5scYQW3_g
Quote from: Nathan on March 20, 2014, 02:16:20 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Orange? The current interior spec is red handrails.
Also have you noticed the different type of seats compared to the ones we usually have ie. The tridents (In blue) and the previous E200's (In grey).
http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602. (bottom photo)
I disagree that they are red, but can't be bothered to argue.
Put it another way, there certainly not yellow.
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
That's what I thought - its got the wrong grey on the plastic in the front window as well
Quote from: N94 on March 20, 2014, 02:25:21 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
That's what I thought - its got the wrong grey on the plastic in the front window as well
It's already been confirmed that the first aren't due for delivery until June, therefore I doubt the one painted & those on the production line in the background will be for NX. I expect one was painted as part of the PR exercise
Why standardize the fleet then go and totally change the interior spec?
I wonder if the first batch of E200's that arrive are allocated to WA like it was said at our garage tour? I cold also now see the £3 million investment at WB being further E200's. (Just my thoughts :))
With 100 buses due this year which buses do you think will be withdrawn this year?
I can see PE and WN getting rid of their mercs this year. I have been told if the cascade process goes to plan WN are looking at replacing their mercs with cascaded tridents so:
My thoughts are new E400's new for BC (Wasn't it stated the first deliveries will be June at the earliest?) then tridents cascaded to WN to replace the mercs. I could also see PE gaining some more cascaded tridnts to join the ones already there
Personally I'd give Pensnett cascaded Coventry tridents (Coventry getting some enviros for the 11/12.
A few observations from the Central TV clips
1,The bus on video also has bonded glazing, NXWM normally chooses gasket glazing (as per current E200s)
2,In the video Peter Coates also states small and medium single deckers are included in the order
3,550 new buses to the West Midlands (so I assume 50 for NXD)
In addition we still need understand if an order was placed with another manufacture to make up the 274 vehicles promised for Centro
Quote from: Wolves256 on March 20, 2014, 03:21:44 PM
A few observations from the Central TV clips
1,The bus on video also has bonded glazing, NXWM normally chooses gasket glazing (as per current E200s)
2,In the video Peter Coates also states small and medium single deckers are included in the order
3,550 new buses to the West Midlands (so I assume 50 for NXD)
In addition we still need understand if an order was placed with another manufacture to make up the 274 vehicles promised for Centro
It was quoted in the video that 100 new buses are due during 2014 & a further 175 due during 2015. But those quantities only cover the Centro commitment what about Dundee?
Wolves256, well spotted on the bonded glazing, never clocked that one myself!
http://www.falkirkherald.co.uk/news/local-news/100m-bus-deal-for-camelon-company-1-3347931
http://www.themanufacturer.com/articles/alexander-dennis-lands-100m-national-express-eco-bus-contract/
Just to reiterate, ADL will be the sole supplier of new buses to NX group for the next 5 years.
Winston
The numbers are not adding up as yesterday's announcement on BBC sated 100 this year and 125 next year (no split between NXWM & NXD)
Tony maybe you could clarify:-
How many will be delivered per year?
Is the Centro commitment still valid?
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:23:36 PM
Quote from: Nathan on March 20, 2014, 02:16:20 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/ (http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/)
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Orange? The current interior spec is red handrails.
Also have you noticed the different type of seats compared to the ones we usually have ie. The tridents (In blue) and the previous E200's (In grey).
http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602 (http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602). (bottom photo)
I disagree that they are red, but can't be bothered to argue.
Put it another way, there certainly not yellow.
Thought they were off-pink/red?
Anyway, the mirrors are different to NX spec; The whole bus is well off NX spec! Look at where the destination is on the nearside. It's obviously a PR bus.
Quote from: Liverpool Street on March 20, 2014, 05:43:16 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:23:36 PM
Quote from: Nathan on March 20, 2014, 02:16:20 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/ (http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/)
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Orange? The current interior spec is red handrails.
Also have you noticed the different type of seats compared to the ones we usually have ie. The tridents (In blue) and the previous E200's (In grey).
http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602 (http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602). (bottom photo)
I disagree that they are red, but can't be bothered to argue.
Put it another way, there certainly not yellow.
Thought they were off-pink/red?
Anyway, the mirrors are different to NX spec; The whole bus is well off NX spec! Look at where the destination is on the nearside. It's obviously a PR bus.
LS,
Here's a clip of 4916 from Youtube with the NX interior, in the opening seconds it shows the handrails and they look distinctly more orange than red to me
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQhNbGQUqcg
From reply 39
With the link
The second to last picture if u scroll down
It's a (SWB) shirt wheel base, just like the 3600's
Possibly in the 1ST batch of new buses
Possibly to west brom (WB) and perry Barr (PB)
To withdraw the last of the 500,600& 3600's
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 05:50:36 PM
Quote from: Liverpool Street on March 20, 2014, 05:43:16 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:23:36 PM
Quote from: Nathan on March 20, 2014, 02:16:20 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 02:13:07 PM
Quote from: Andrew on March 20, 2014, 02:02:38 PM
If the clips on central news just are new, there are already enviro 200's on the production line with at least 1 painted.
http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/ (http://www.itv.com/news/central/update/2014-03-20/state-of-art-buses-on-the-way-for-the-west-midlands/)
Have you noticed that the E200 in the background has yellow handrails, NX's current interior spec is orange, could one have been painted in NX colours just for the benefit of the ADL order announcement?
Orange? The current interior spec is red handrails.
Also have you noticed the different type of seats compared to the ones we usually have ie. The tridents (In blue) and the previous E200's (In grey).
http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602 (http://www.itv.com/news/central/story/2014-03-20/100m-deal-for-550-new-buses-in-the-west-midlands/#new-west-midlands-buses-of-the-road-by-end-of-year_339602). (bottom photo)
I disagree that they are red, but can't be bothered to argue.
Put it another way, there certainly not yellow.
Thought they were off-pink/red?
Anyway, the mirrors are different to NX spec; The whole bus is well off NX spec! Look at where the destination is on the nearside. It's obviously a PR bus.
LS,
Here's a clip of 4916 from Youtube with the NX interior, in the opening seconds it shows the handrails and they look distinctly more orange than red to me
https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQhNbGQUqcg (https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=FQhNbGQUqcg)
Hm... odd. I'll have a look on a E400 tomorrow and get back to you. You've got me wondering now! Saying that, that's if I recall to do it or herein lack of!
Quote from: Rainman13 on March 20, 2014, 05:51:34 PM
From reply 39
With the link
The second to last picture if u scroll down
It's a (SWB) shirt wheel base, just like the 3600's
Possibly in the 1ST batch of new buses
Possibly to west brom (WB) and perry Barr (PB)
To withdraw the last of the 500,600& 3600's
Indeed it is a SWB. Doesn't get away from the fact that NXWM specifically asks for the destination to be on the upper first nearside window, and the nearside mirror to be on an arm in front of the bus, so the mirror is in the wiper swoop. And yellow mirrors as like in 80x series. For the serious SWB design, take a window or 2 from out of an in-service E20D. And it has bonded windows, a big no no for NX.
I always thought they were red ::)
"The Alexander Dennis site in Falkirk, where 900 staff are employed, will deliver 50% of the contract with the manufacture of double-deck buses, with the remaining half handled at its facility in Scarborough. The Yorkshire site will manufacture midi buses." - See more at: http://www.themanufacturer.com/articles/alexander-dennis-lands-100m-national-express-eco-bus-contract/#sthash.l7kdTVkV.dpuf
So reading that means there are to be 300 Doubles and 300 medium to midi buses for NX. Seems odd when I would have split it 450 DDs and 150 medium - midi.
Quote from: trident4370 on March 20, 2014, 06:01:26 PM
I always thought they were red ::)
To me at least it looks like a bright vivid shade of red ;) Anyway also the moquette inside the E200 shown in the clip is not the black dotted moquette either so as said by others most likely painted as a PR bus. I would assume NX would stick with the long wheelbase E200's like the current batch we have (801-830)?
Just on Alexandra Dennis factory with a brand new enviro 200 in nat ex red livery no fleet number
Quote from: Nathan on March 20, 2014, 06:12:00 PM
Quote from: trident4370 on March 20, 2014, 06:01:26 PM
I always thought they were red ::)
To me at least it looks like a bright vivid shade of red ;) Anyway also the moquette inside is not the black dotted moquette either so as said by others most likely painted as a PR bus. I would assume NX would stick with the long wheelbase E200's like they have now?
Same here, its a very in your face red to me... and yeah I just saw it, also looked like it had bonded glazing, tbh to me it looked like dealer stock.
Quote from: tank90 on March 20, 2014, 06:11:16 PM
"The Alexander Dennis site in Falkirk, where 900 staff are employed, will deliver 50% of the contract with the manufacture of double-deck buses, with the remaining half handled at its facility in Scarborough. The Yorkshire site will manufacture midi buses." - See more at: http://www.themanufacturer.com/articles/alexander-dennis-lands-100m-national-express-eco-bus-contract/#sthash.l7kdTVkV.dpuf
So reading that means there are to be 300 Doubles and 300 medium to midi buses for NX. Seems odd when I would have split it 450 DDs and 150 medium - midi.
Another thing that doesn't quite stack up from the split of vehicle types, is that NX has been moving away from midi buses in favour of full size single deckers & double deckers. At present NXWM only have 76 midi buses which includes Solo's, B6LE & Darts. 30 of the 76 are not much over 1 year old E200's, so why do NX need that many new midi buses?
Also if E300's are due as part of this order, they are build at Falkirk
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: tank90 on March 20, 2014, 06:11:16 PM
"The Alexander Dennis site in Falkirk, where 900 staff are employed, will deliver 50% of the contract with the manufacture of double-deck buses, with the remaining half handled at its facility in Scarborough. The Yorkshire site will manufacture midi buses." - See more at: http://www.themanufacturer.com/articles/alexander-dennis-lands-100m-national-express-eco-bus-contract/#sthash.l7kdTVkV.dpuf
So reading that means there are to be 300 Doubles and 300 medium to midi buses for NX. Seems odd when I would have split it 450 DDs and 150 medium - midi.
Another thing that doesn't quite stack up from the split of vehicle types, is that NX has been moving away from midi buses in favour of full size single deckers & double deckers. At present NXWM only have 76 midi buses which includes Solo's, B6LE & Darts. 30 of the 76 are not much over 1 year old E200's, so why do NX need that many new midi buses?
Also if E300's are due as part of this order, they are build at Falkirk
Unles there are to be 76 midi buses and the rest medium buses but still thats a lot of little buses in an area where more people are starting to go by bus
Brum garages and Walsall will have the new buses
West brom wolves pensnett will have cascaded buses
Pensnett will probably have tridents or early enviro 400s
Pensnett mercs will go on till the end of 2014 at least
Quote from: tank90 on March 20, 2014, 06:23:16 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: tank90 on March 20, 2014, 06:11:16 PM
"The Alexander Dennis site in Falkirk, where 900 staff are employed, will deliver 50% of the contract with the manufacture of double-deck buses, with the remaining half handled at its facility in Scarborough. The Yorkshire site will manufacture midi buses." - See more at: http://www.themanufacturer.com/articles/alexander-dennis-lands-100m-national-express-eco-bus-contract/#sthash.l7kdTVkV.dpuf
So reading that means there are to be 300 Doubles and 300 medium to midi buses for NX. Seems odd when I would have split it 450 DDs and 150 medium - midi.
Another thing that doesn't quite stack up from the split of vehicle types, is that NX has been moving away from midi buses in favour of full size single deckers & double deckers. At present NXWM only have 76 midi buses which includes Solo's, B6LE & Darts. 30 of the 76 are not much over 1 year old E200's, so why do NX need that many new midi buses?
Also if E300's are due as part of this order, they are build at Falkirk
Unles there are to be 76 midi buses and the rest medium buses but still thats a lot of little buses in an area where more people are starting to go by bus
The 76 midi buses include 27/29 seat Solo's & Darts which could be replaced by short 29 seat E200's & the seat B6LE would be replaced by full length E200's also seating 37. To me the medium sized buses quoted would be full size E200's, but why does NX need so many of those over the 5 years? Over the last few years the proportions of double deckers in the fleet have been increasing with the total quantity getting close to 1000 deckers again. Over the next 5 years there are going to be quite a few deckers that will need replacing as large quantities were bought in the early 2000's
Quote from: karl724223 on March 20, 2014, 06:26:06 PM
Brum garages and Walsall will have the new buses
West brom wolves pensnett will have cascaded buses
Pensnett will probably have tridents or early enviro 400s
Pensnett mercs will go on till the end of 2014 at least
Is that all guess work?
It's was already confirmed in the early new year that WB are having £3 million of new buses this year
Just seen it and I agree looks like a demo just for the photo shoot
Winston can put it in that thread ta
The way I see this deal is from the day the contract was signed all buses to be ordered are from ADL any ordered before hand can be anything with the delivery date when ever, so the centro buses could have already been ordered and are in the pipeline.
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 06:29:11 PM
Quote from: tank90 on March 20, 2014, 06:23:16 PM
Quote from: Winston on March 20, 2014, 06:18:36 PM
Quote from: tank90 on March 20, 2014, 06:11:16 PM
"The Alexander Dennis site in Falkirk, where 900 staff are employed, will deliver 50% of the contract with the manufacture of double-deck buses, with the remaining half handled at its facility in Scarborough. The Yorkshire site will manufacture midi buses." - See more at: http://www.themanufacturer.com/articles/alexander-dennis-lands-100m-national-express-eco-bus-contract/#sthash.l7kdTVkV.dpuf
So reading that means there are to be 300 Doubles and 300 medium to midi buses for NX. Seems odd when I would have split it 450 DDs and 150 medium - midi.
Another thing that doesn't quite stack up from the split of vehicle types, is that NX has been moving away from midi buses in favour of full size single deckers & double deckers. At present NXWM only have 76 midi buses which includes Solo's, B6LE & Darts. 30 of the 76 are not much over 1 year old E200's, so why do NX need that many new midi buses?
Also if E300's are due as part of this order, they are build at Falkirk
Unles there are to be 76 midi buses and the rest medium buses but still thats a lot of little buses in an area where more people are starting to go by bus
The 76 midi buses include 27/29 seat Solo's & Darts which could be replaced by short 29 seat E200's & the seat B6LE would be replaced by full length E200's also seating 37. To me the medium sized buses quoted would be full size E200's, but why does NX need so many of those over the 5 years? Over the last few years the proportions of double deckers in the fleet have been increasing with the total quantity getting close to 1000 deckers again. Over the next 5 years there are going to be quite a few deckers that will need replacing as large quantities were bought in the early 2000's
Quote from: karl724223 on March 20, 2014, 06:26:06 PM
Brum garages and Walsall will have the new buses
West brom wolves pensnett will have cascaded buses
Pensnett will probably have tridents or early enviro 400s
Pensnett mercs will go on till the end of 2014 at least
Is that all guess work?
It's was already confirmed in the early new year that WB are having £3 million of new buses this year
I personally winston cant see this contract dealing with the 2000s 2001s 2002s 2003s DD replacements ontop of the 76 midis and the mercs. NX are going to run into a problem I think.
Quote from: karl724223 on March 20, 2014, 06:26:06 PM
Brum garages and Walsall will have the new buses
West brom wolves pensnett will have cascaded buses
Pensnett will probably have tridents or early enviro 400s
Pensnett mercs will go on till the end of 2014 at least
If they keep going that long.
Now that they have given 1515 a new engine, its a shame they couldn't afford a new coat of paint for it. Could be a sort of depot mascot for PM.
I wonder which, if any, of these are Euro 5 spec. As I understand it Euro 5s can be placed in service in the UK for most of 2014 but not afterwards. It's significant that ADL hasn't launched its Euro 6 double decker yet and we mustn't presume they'll all be E400s to the current spec. I wonder if ADL will go for a lightweight decker like the Volvo andWrightbus, with a four-cylinder engine.
Quite a few NX staff have been on the cummins euro 6 roadshow which I thought was excellent. The rear part of this order will have the 4cyc engine in both SD and DD.
It looks good, I was very impressed.
Quote from: BN on March 22, 2014, 11:19:00 AM
Quite a few NX staff have been on the cummins euro 6 roadshow which I thought was excellent. The rear part of this order will have the 4cyc engine in both SD and DD.
It looks good, I was very impressed.
Hi BN,
Did you get any indication from ADL on the timescale for the release of the re-styled E400 or will it be a completely new body design?
http://www.birminghammail.co.uk/news/midlands-news/100m-new-west-midlands-buses-6852424
Some local PR in case you missed it.
Winston, couldn't tell you much about styling but NX deliveries should start mid to end of June.
As usual there is confusion on the press releases, half the work for Falkirk makes more sense if you take into account that all the chassis will be made in Guildford, England. I think one thing that is clear that Dundee will have about 50 buses. This will eliminate the Solo's, B10L's, B10BLE's and Presidents and perhaps 7067 alias 1481. The oldest vehicles in the Dundee fleet would be the Gemini's 7001 to 7018. Full length E200's could replace some Merc's and B10L's and suitable routes.
Quote from: Eric Shaw on March 22, 2014, 07:04:12 PM
I think one thing that is clear that Dundee will have about 50 buses. This will eliminate the Solo's, B10L's, B10BLE's and Presidents and perhaps 7067 alias 1481. The oldest vehicles in the Dundee fleet would be the Gemini's 7001 to 7018.
Which is a bit silly as 2 Presidents and 8 B10BLEs have been repainted within the last year, and two within the last few months
Quote from: Kiewii on March 22, 2014, 07:37:39 PM
Quote from: Eric Shaw on March 22, 2014, 07:04:12 PM
I think one thing that is clear that Dundee will have about 50 buses. This will eliminate the Solo's, B10L's, B10BLE's and Presidents and perhaps 7067 alias 1481. The oldest vehicles in the Dundee fleet would be the Gemini's 7001 to 7018.
Which is a bit silly as 2 Presidents and 8 B10BLEs have been repainted within the last year, and two within the last few months
It is over 5 years so they don't have to come straight away.
http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-birmingham-26665117
No exact figures given, but the above BBC article states that 'over 500' of the 600 new buses are for the West Midlands and Coventry.
Routeone NX article:
http://www.route-one.net/issues/531/index.html#/6/
So - all Euro 6, then, according to Route 1,which presumably means the Enviro 400's successor, with a 4-cylinder engine, which should be very interesting. I'm not sure that ADL is doing a Euro 6 6-cylinder for double deckers, though perhaps they'll do both..Apparently the Euro 6 Cummins 4-cylinder is quite different from the current Euro 5 unit, too.
Quote from: Stu on March 19, 2014, 07:26:27 PM
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on March 19, 2014, 07:05:28 PM
Will NXWM be looking at dual sourcing, with some buses coming from Wrights?
Generally while having a standard fleet helps with spares and maintenance, it can be dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket, and some bus operators learn this the hard way.
The days of the Spectras, Mercs and Plaxton Presidents must surely be numbered and one would hope a batch of vehicles is allocated to AG to allow the Outer Circle to be overhauled.
It would be a shame if the Outer Circle ended up with Enviro400s, as I would have hoped NX might have gone with 'something different' to keep this classic route 'iconic'. Tell you what, let's replace the Presidents at AG with everyone else's Gemini cast-offs, that would make me happy! :)
Interesting though that the article only mentions double-decks and midi-buses, wonder if NX would still source some full-length single-decks from elsewhere, or could there be a long-term review of services which could see some current single-deck services be upgraded to double-deck (say for example, the 6, 37, 120) which could see existing single decks such as the Wright Eclipse 2s and Scania Omnilinks to be cascaded to replace older Volvo B10L and Mercedes O405Ns (for services that only justify full length single decks), while services currently using full-length singles that don't need them could be replaced with new midi-buses?
Maybe some Gemini's will move to AG from WB when 4950-4982 enter service on the Soho Rd?
Quote from: Nathan on August 06, 2014, 03:39:54 PM
Quote from: Stu on March 19, 2014, 07:26:27 PM
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on March 19, 2014, 07:05:28 PM
Will NXWM be looking at dual sourcing, with some buses coming from Wrights?
Generally while having a standard fleet helps with spares and maintenance, it can be dangerous to put all your eggs in one basket, and some bus operators learn this the hard way.
The days of the Spectras, Mercs and Plaxton Presidents must surely be numbered and one would hope a batch of vehicles is allocated to AG to allow the Outer Circle to be overhauled.
It would be a shame if the Outer Circle ended up with Enviro400s, as I would have hoped NX might have gone with 'something different' to keep this classic route 'iconic'. Tell you what, let's replace the Presidents at AG with everyone else's Gemini cast-offs, that would make me happy! :)
Interesting though that the article only mentions double-decks and midi-buses, wonder if NX would still source some full-length single-decks from elsewhere, or could there be a long-term review of services which could see some current single-deck services be upgraded to double-deck (say for example, the 6, 37, 120) which could see existing single decks such as the Wright Eclipse 2s and Scania Omnilinks to be cascaded to replace older Volvo B10L and Mercedes O405Ns (for services that only justify full length single decks), while services currently using full-length singles that don't need them could be replaced with new midi-buses?
Maybe some Gemini's will move to AG from WB when 4950-4982 enter service on the Soho Rd?
Doing that would be abit of an extra expense when WB can just replace their own Presidents
Can we expect to see NX possesing only adl vehicles in the future, or will they keep the b7rles aswell. What buses can we get expect to be Gone from NX when we reach 2017? What was the reasoning for choosing adl over other manufacturers, and who made the decision to sign a five year deal with adl?
Spectras will probably be phased out this year, with Plaxton's going a bit later, with the new emissions policy coming to effect, expect to see a lot more ADL vehicles coming to NXWM !
I for 1 hope they have variety, I'm quite fond of AG and I like how they don't have ADL vehicles, would have loved them to have more Volvos, plus I don't see the B7RLEs going anywhere taking their age into account.
Quote from: Trident 4194 on April 13, 2015, 06:51:29 PM
Can we expect to see NX possesing only adl vehicles in the future, or will they keep the b7rles aswell. What buses can we get expect to be Gone from NX when we reach 2017? What was the reasoning for choosing adl over other manufacturers, and who made the decision to sign a five year deal with adl?
I doubt NX would sell anything non ADL unless life expired! I can't see them selling 13 plate b7rle's for the next 15 years at least, especially given how well regarded the Wright/Volvo combination is!
As for the rest, I imagine in a word, PRICE.
Quote from: Trident 4194 on April 13, 2015, 06:51:29 PM
Can we expect to see NX possesing only adl vehicles in the future, or will they keep the b7rles aswell. What buses can we get expect to be Gone from NX when we reach 2017? What was the reasoning for choosing adl over other manufacturers, and who made the decision to sign a five year deal with adl?
I'm sorry to say but that it is not a sensible question.
Most, if not all the non ADL vehicles in the fleet will last their lifetime in the fleet.
As to who signed the deal with ADL, why does it matter, it was done for financial reasons.
Plus it has already been discussed at length in a previous thread, Winston
Well us bus passengers have paid for the things via fares, passes etc, but what do we know?
Quote from: Westy on April 13, 2015, 09:19:39 PM
Well us bus passengers have paid for the things via fares, passes etc, but what do we know?
True That ! I've been catching buses since the days of the 96/ 97 and this is my own way of knowing where my money is going :P
Now the remaining WA Platinums are here and the majority of E200's for AG, is that the order completed or is there anymore due. If not what vehicles are next to come and does anybody know what routes they are for please?
Don't think they're going to be releasing allocations yet, only 2016 order announced I know of is 29 StreetDecks for First Leicester. Especially when they know competitors' bosses could use this information!
I'd hope for a Sutton Lines upgrade to Platinum, compete with Arriva or maybe 936 increased to compensate for 56 withdrawal could be Platinum as well?
Heard a rumour though that NX will be upgrading the 10 and 69 routes, Arriva really affecting the routes :P
Quote from: DiamondDart on September 12, 2015, 01:02:46 PM
Don't think they're going to be releasing allocations yet, only 2016 order announced I know of is 29 StreetDecks for First Leicester. Especially when they know competitors' bosses could use this information!
I'd hope for a Sutton Lines upgrade to Platinum, compete with Arriva or maybe 936 increased to compensate for 56 withdrawal could be Platinum as well?
Heard a rumour though that NX will be upgrading the 10 and 69 routes, Arriva really affecting the routes :P
Thanks for that DiamondDart. So is it fair to say thats it for 2015 do you think? I was always under the impression the 126 was going to have a new batch thats all.
Quote from: BN on September 12, 2015, 01:30:01 PM
Thanks for that DiamondDart. So is it fair to say thats it for 2015 do you think? I was always under the impression the 126 was going to have a new batch thats all.
Well it looks like it, except for the point Tony made of there possibly being a new non-ADL bus/buses arriving.
Quote from: Dom on September 12, 2015, 01:31:20 PM
Well it looks like it, except for the point Tony made of there possibly being a new non-ADL bus/buses arriving.
Hence the Hybrid demonstrator at BC, perhaps?
Quote from: clayderman on September 12, 2015, 01:33:51 PM
Hence the Hybrid demonstrator at BC, perhaps?
Well he said it after that arrived unless it is to be permanent?
Quote from: BN on September 12, 2015, 12:57:55 PM
Now the remaining WA Platinums are here and the majority of E200's for AG, is that the order completed or is there anymore due. If not what vehicles are next to come and does anybody know what routes they are for please?
@BN That's the lot this year once the last of the E200MMC's & Dundee's 5 x WF Streetlites have all been delivered. That delivery meets the 300 new buses delivered as part of the Centro/NXWM partnership agreement & NX's commitment. I believe that partnership is due to expire / be renewed this year, so we may have a better idea of future quantities & route upgrades going forward once that is announced.
Quote from: Winston on September 12, 2015, 02:21:13 PM
@BN That's the lot this year once the last of the E200MMC's & Dundee's 5 x WF Streetlites have all been delivered. That delivery meets the 300 new buses delivered as part of the Centro/NXWM partnership agreement & NX's commitment. I believe that partnership is due to expire / be renewed this year, so we may have a better idea of future quantities & route upgrades going forward once that is announced.
Thanks Winston, much clearer.
Quote from: Winston on September 12, 2015, 02:21:13 PM
@BN That's the lot this year once the last of the E200MMC's & Dundee's 5 x WF Streetlites have all been delivered. That delivery meets the 300 new buses delivered as part of the Centro/NXWM partnership agreement & NX's commitment. I believe that partnership is due to expire / be renewed this year, so we may have a better idea of future quantities & route upgrades going forward once that is announced.
The operative bit being 'this year'. I thought it was 600 vehicles over 5 years. I would think the remaining 3 years would see 100 buses a year or so.
However, with so many Volvos as some of the older vehicles left after all cascades and replacements from this year's deliveries (e.g. ALX B7TL) I wouldn't be surprised to see some dual sourcing happen over the next 3 years as well - apart from the 10 bendis at Coventry, the only buses to be replaced would be double deckers.
Quote from: don on September 12, 2015, 03:12:39 PM
The operative bit being 'this year'. I thought it was 600 vehicles over 5 years. I would think the remaining 3 years would see 100 buses a year or so.
However, with so many Volvos as some of the older vehicles left after all cascades and replacements from this year's deliveries (e.g. ALX B7TL) I wouldn't be surprised to see some dual sourcing happen over the next 3 years as well - apart from the 10 bendis at Coventry, the only buses to be replaced would be double deckers.
The original ADL deal was for 600 new buses over 5 years, some of the 300 new buses promised as part of the NX/Centro partnership commitment were delivered from previous orders.
Only E200's 751-764 & 831-875 (59)
E200MMC's 2201-50 (50)
E400's 4940-4995 (56)
E400MMC's 6101-48 (48)
E400MMC Platinum 6701-58 (58)
Total = 271
There should potentially be at least another 329 new buses to come from the ADL supply contract
Cheers
@Wolves256 - The 26 x PB E400's (4914-4939 were part of 300 bus commitment, but not the 600 ADL order)
Winston
Don't forget the 100 E200s & E400s delivered in 2014 were part of the order with ADL
In addition NX have not had 300 new buses delivered for West Midlands
2013 26 (E400 for pb)
2014 100
2015 171
Total 297
2014 and 2015 deliveries are from the ADL order
Winston is quite right - the Commonwealth games E400s, 4940 on, were the first deliveries from the order, making just the 56 E400s, not 100, plus the E200s that he mentions.
The "New Bus Update" page on the NXWM website says "What will be arriving in 2016? What this space."
I'm sure it should say Watch this space!
http://nxbus.co.uk/west-midlands/information/new-bus-update/
Quote from: Adam 404 on November 11, 2015, 06:25:24 PM
The "New Bus Update" page on the NXWM website says "What will be arriving in 2016? What this space."
I'm sure it should say Watch this space!
http://nxbus.co.uk/west-midlands/information/new-bus-update/
Haha good spot what a cock up
Got some Muppets or "Moppets" in the Marketing department I guess.
With the impending arrival of the StreetDeck as a demonstrator, and several Streetlites already being delivered to Dundee, I wonder if it is possible that NX may be looking to source additional buses beyond the requirements originally set out with the ADL order. Certainly it has previously been suggested that this was in no real way any 'exclusive' deal with ADL, so if NX's procurement team have decided they'll need more new buses in the interim, above what was agreed in this deal, there's nothing stopping them purchasing more buses elsewhere.
Also, I have previously been asked on my Facebook page which garages will also be getting new E200MMCs next year. With the single deck fleet being so relatively modern now, I can't really see myself NX needing to purchase any single-deck vehicles for a couple of years, the only single-deck route that I think might be considered for an upgrade would be Walsall's 4/M/H services.
Quote from: Stu on November 11, 2015, 07:11:14 PM
Also, I have previously been asked on my Facebook page which garages will also be getting new E200MMCs next year. With the single deck fleet being so relatively modern now, I can't really see myself NX needing to purchase any single-deck vehicles for a couple of years, the only single-deck route that I think might be considered for an upgrade would be Walsall's 4/M/H services.
Or the 6 to tie in with the e200's on the 37?
Quote from: BU07 LGO on November 11, 2015, 09:57:40 PM
Or the 6 to tie in with the e200's on the 37?
Nah that's getting Crimson'd next.
Maybe the 4/4M/4H could be platiumised to release scanias for 311/313 to cascade the remaining b7rles mark 1s to Dundee?
Quote from: MW on November 11, 2015, 10:14:39 PM
Nah that's getting Crimson'd next.
@MW So assume 1926 will be the first one to get that treatment then - good news