Social Travel

[Stuharris 6360]

It's the 11C then!

Yes! a bus company that only runs one way. A registration with no other possible purpose that to milk another operator. If you can catch a bus one way but not home it is not going to encourage a single extra passenger onto the buses. Yes I know you can complete the circuit to get home, but if you are going half way round it is quicker to go across City.

True @Tony  and only 8 journeys anyway throughout the day, to be honest seems plain daft to me. See how long this registration lasts.

[Steveminor]

So your forgetting the work that's being done on Sundays running a 15 min service on 72 with nxwm.
The 97 would have been developed into more had nxwm not decided to hold buses in city for upto 10 mins to stop us getting passengers from brum.
So what if we're running head to head on the 11 not adding more passenger benefit.
At the end of the day a business needs to make money in order to survive & expand.
Yes we could run a completely new service but at this early stage in the companies history where will all the money to develop it come from?

[Stuharris 6360]

So your forgetting the work that's being done on Sundays running a 15 min service on 72 with nxwm.
The 97 would have been developed into more had nxwm not decided to hold buses in city for upto 10 mins to stop us getting passengers from brum.
So what if we're running head to head on the 11 not adding more passenger benefit.
At the end of the day a business needs to make money in order to survive & expand.
Yes we could run a completely new service but at this early stage in the companies history where will all the money to develop it come from?

Surely if you don't add passenger benefit, there is no point in running the service.

And why not develop a brand new service, if you do research and offer a decent reliable service, you stand a chance of it taking off.

Don't you think that just copying other operators services will only lead to failure!

[Tony]

So your forgetting the work that's being done on Sundays running a 15 min service on 72 with nxwm.
The 97 would have been developed into more had nxwm not decided to hold buses in city for upto 10 mins to stop us getting passengers from brum.
So what if we're running head to head on the 11 not adding more passenger benefit.
At the end of the day a business needs to make money in order to survive & expand.
Yes we could run a completely new service but at this early stage in the companies history where will all the money to develop it come from?

No, a small company can compete directly at the start to grow a business and at the same time increase total passenger numbers by getting their own loyal customers, remember North Birmingham Busways? They grew total passenger trade on routes by competing directly from a standing start.

All things like your registration on the 11C do is give politicians more reasons to want to bring in franchising to remove operators like Social who basically are adding to congestion & pollution without bringing a single benefit to the city!

[fleetline6477]

The 11C, honestly!!

Steve, I thought that you were heavily involved in AMPM Travel (although I may be wrong) who ran on 11A / 11C. I used to love riding AMPM's Olympians around the 11 route they were cracking buses. From my observations they had shorter running times than NXWM and spent most of their time catching up with NXWM buses and carried very few passengers. I seem to remember they went from driver's relieving by the cemetery between Acocks Green and the Swan to drivers taking breaks with their buses meaning a high number of short journeys. Joe's Travel and now GRS Travel ran limited journeys and carried very few passengers from what I've seen.

Good luck but I can't see it lasting or been successful.

[the trainbasher]

I've only one word to describe the move onto the 11C - Suicidal!

[Trident 4194]

Why would you register to go on a route when it's had so many failures? Absolute madness. Good luck with carrying round empty buses. I reckon it will last 4 months. Or am I being too ambitious?

[Steveminor]

Tony one question if north bham bus ways was such a success where are they now? Yes true it started off well till nx hit them back severely cutting there cash intake. Other routes that have been started by smaller operators have suddenly found nx competing against them. Back in petes days I started several brand new routes only to find once they had built up nx deciding we'll have a go at that. So why not run on an established route for a while to build up a healthy bank balance ready to start something new?

Ampm originally ran the 11 for in between TGB school contracts & when those finished looking at figures a decision was taken to run through the day.
Driver shortages inevitably led to missed reliefs & having to unload passengers so that's why the relief system was taken out & eventually buses were needed for the private hire side which was growing requiring more buses.
Current loadings of nxwm have been cross checked against ampm historic figures plus those from joes travel & a healthy profit can be made from the route.
Yes ampm's & joes buses didn't look overly busy but (& I can personally verify in ampm's case) the end of day figures are what matters not how busy the bus looks.

[Stu]

Good luck with the 11, I hope you can make it work! (competing with the battered old buses that GRS and NX operate!)

I still think the 8A/C would have been a good route to have better success on, maybe if only part of the route was focused on. Biggest complaint on that route is unreliability, with only operator NXWM offering a 15min frequency, but having to traverse the whole circle and get their buses caught up frequently in traffic hold-ups, there must be an opportunity somewhere for a smaller operator to sneak in and operate the parts of the route that are potentially more profitable, even if it means only running short journeys and turning around at convenient spots (say Sparkbrook/Highgate to Aston or Ladywood, via Nechells and Saltley, avoiding the Inner Ring Road sections). Cash-paying customers might be more inclined to get on a non-NX bus if it turns up first.

Just my thoughts.

[Stuharris 6360]

@Steveminor What are Social Travel doing to attract customers, why should i catch one of your buses on the 11C instead of an NE or GRS one? I would have said cheap day returns, but with so few journeys and only running in one direction that is not an option. Is the route going to be advertised?

[j789]

Are the 8 journeys evenly spaced out? If not and are only when the schools come out etc then the argument for 'milking' grows and grows. Why not go try against another operator too, maybe one with a penchant for running darts as well?

[Tony]

Tony one question if north bham bus ways was such a success where are they now? Yes true it started off well till nx hit them back severely cutting there cash intake. Other routes that have been started by smaller operators have suddenly found nx competing against them. Back in petes days I started several brand new routes only to find once they had built up nx deciding we'll have a go at that. So why not run on an established route for a while to build up a healthy bank balance ready to start something new?

North Birmingham Buses was sold to Central Connect  and made it's directors a retirement fund. It only sold out when a couple wanted to retire. So yes if you retire and sell your company to give yourself a nice lump sum in retirement, I would call that a success.

Now name one success in the companies you have been involved in. Yes I know there have been different reasons other than financial why some have finished

[justlookingaround]

Why not go try against another operator too, maybe one with a penchant for running darts as well?

And what's the route difference between this route and the GRS runs (an operator with a penchant for running darts)?

[j789]

I meant diamond but still works I guess!

[the trainbasher]

I'm surprised Social Travel havent tried to run on this route