after selling wigan operations first are buying again in the area
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/greater_manchester/travel_news/news_initiatives/?item=12311&conf=0
Firstgroup PLC agree to acquire Finglands bus operations in Manchester
Thursday 01 August 2013
Firstgroup PLC is pleased to announce that First Manchester Limited, a wholly owned indirect subsidiary of FirstGroup, has agreed to acquire the Manchester bus business from Finglands Coachways Limited for £50,000.
The acquisition of Finglands, which operates a number of commercial bus services and school contracts to the South and East of Manchester, is subject to Office of Fair Trading (OFT) clearance and, if approved, is expected to be completed during autumn this year.
The Finglands business saw unaudited revenues of £3.8m for the year ending December 2012.
The acquisition includes the lease of the existing depot in Wilmslow Road, Rusholme, existing service registrations and the transfer of approximately 100 staff. The fleet of 41 vehicles would be excluded from the sale although some may be used in the short-term to meet current service commitments. The sale excludes Finglands coach business.
The acquisition allows First Manchester to expand its successful bus operations in the Greater Manchester region and to grow the number of passengers on its buses.
First Manchester currently operates around 700 buses and employs 2000 staff. In the past 12 months First has lowered a number of its fares in the Greater Manchester region by around 30% and saw passenger volume growth of around 8% in the three months between April and June.
The Finglands operations would become part of First Manchester, which is led by Regional Managing Director Dave Alexander.
Dave Alexander, Regional Managing Director for First in the North of England, said: "This acquisition demonstrates our commitment to Greater Manchester and represents an excellent opportunity to further grow bus passenger volumes. It reflects our strategy of focusing on those areas that offer the greatest potential for growth and will allow us to improve bus networks for the communities we serve.
"We are looking forward, subject to OFT clearance, to welcoming our new colleagues to FirstGroup."
__._,_.___
Quote from: bewminster on August 01, 2013, 11:16:10 AM
after selling wigan operations first are buying again in the area
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/greater_manchester/travel_news/news_initiatives/?item=12311&conf=0
Firstgroup PLC agree to acquire Finglands bus operations in Manchester
Thursday 01 August 2013
Firstgroup PLC is pleased to announce that First Manchester Limited, a wholly owned indirect subsidiary of FirstGroup, has agreed to acquire the Manchester bus business from Finglands Coachways Limited for £50,000.
The acquisition of Finglands, which operates a number of commercial bus services and school contracts to the South and East of Manchester, is subject to Office of Fair Trading (OFT) clearance and, if approved, is expected to be completed during autumn this year.
The Finglands business saw unaudited revenues of £3.8m for the year ending December 2012.
The acquisition includes the lease of the existing depot in Wilmslow Road, Rusholme, existing service registrations and the transfer of approximately 100 staff. The fleet of 41 vehicles would be excluded from the sale although some may be used in the short-term to meet current service commitments. The sale excludes Finglands coach business.
The acquisition allows First Manchester to expand its successful bus operations in the Greater Manchester region and to grow the number of passengers on its buses.
First Manchester currently operates around 700 buses and employs 2000 staff. In the past 12 months First has lowered a number of its fares in the Greater Manchester region by around 30% and saw passenger volume growth of around 8% in the three months between April and June.
The Finglands operations would become part of First Manchester, which is led by Regional Managing Director Dave Alexander.
Dave Alexander, Regional Managing Director for First in the North of England, said: "This acquisition demonstrates our commitment to Greater Manchester and represents an excellent opportunity to further grow bus passenger volumes. It reflects our strategy of focusing on those areas that offer the greatest potential for growth and will allow us to improve bus networks for the communities we serve.
"We are looking forward, subject to OFT clearance, to welcoming our new colleagues to FirstGroup."
__._,_.___
Must be a response to stagecoach's purchase of bluebirds of middleton right in their heartland. Wonder where the finglands buses will end up though if first arent buying them? Could they go to east yorkshire or whittles to raise the fight against rotala with bigger buses? We'll have to wait and see but cant help feeling first should sort out the core business first instead of buying more operations when what they have is failing.And the purchase price seems very low....
Quote from: Peter123 on August 01, 2013, 11:27:20 AM
Quote from: bewminster on August 01, 2013, 11:16:10 AM
after selling wigan operations first are buying again in the area
http://www.firstgroup.com/ukbus/greater_manchester/travel_news/news_initiatives/?item=12311&conf=0
Firstgroup PLC agree to acquire Finglands bus operations in Manchester
Thursday 01 August 2013
Firstgroup PLC is pleased to announce that First Manchester Limited, a wholly owned indirect subsidiary of FirstGroup, has agreed to acquire the Manchester bus business from Finglands Coachways Limited for £50,000.
The acquisition of Finglands, which operates a number of commercial bus services and school contracts to the South and East of Manchester, is subject to Office of Fair Trading (OFT) clearance and, if approved, is expected to be completed during autumn this year.
The Finglands business saw unaudited revenues of £3.8m for the year ending December 2012.
The acquisition includes the lease of the existing depot in Wilmslow Road, Rusholme, existing service registrations and the transfer of approximately 100 staff. The fleet of 41 vehicles would be excluded from the sale although some may be used in the short-term to meet current service commitments. The sale excludes Finglands coach business.
The acquisition allows First Manchester to expand its successful bus operations in the Greater Manchester region and to grow the number of passengers on its buses.
First Manchester currently operates around 700 buses and employs 2000 staff. In the past 12 months First has lowered a number of its fares in the Greater Manchester region by around 30% and saw passenger volume growth of around 8% in the three months between April and June.
The Finglands operations would become part of First Manchester, which is led by Regional Managing Director Dave Alexander.
Dave Alexander, Regional Managing Director for First in the North of England, said: "This acquisition demonstrates our commitment to Greater Manchester and represents an excellent opportunity to further grow bus passenger volumes. It reflects our strategy of focusing on those areas that offer the greatest potential for growth and will allow us to improve bus networks for the communities we serve.
"We are looking forward, subject to OFT clearance, to welcoming our new colleagues to FirstGroup."
__._,_.___
Must be a response to stagecoach's purchase of bluebirds of middleton right in their heartland. Wonder where the finglands buses will end up though if first arent buying them? Could they go to east yorkshire or whittles to raise the fight against rotala with bigger buses? We'll have to wait and see but cant help feeling first should sort out the core business first instead of buying more operations when what they have is failing.And the purchase price seems very low....
Sounds that way Peter123 and may be designed to show Stagecoach & others that First will strengthen its operations/put up a fight where appropriate, the purchase price is only £50k for a £3.8 million turnover, I notice no vehicles are included in deal, I wonder if some of the Finglands fleet may be disturbed to EYMS owned Whittles eventually? It begs the question why EMYS have now decided to dispose of Finglands; it obviously is a loss making business based on purchase price
Incidentally, Stagecoach & Go-Ahead are now/soon to be attacking First Group Plymouth routes, Go-Ahead is moving on to the Tavistock corridor (with new high spec ADL 400's) & Stagecoach on the Torquay - Plymouth X80 corridor with new Gold spec/branded vehicles
Finglands fleet , although not elderly, were ageing and given Greater Manchester ITAs 15-year age limit 30 of Finglands buses were going to need replacing by 2017. Its quite possible that the LF deckers will simply transfer to East Yorkshire as Volvo Olympian replacements. The single deckers will replace Mercedes and Optare Excels at EYMS. It would be interesting to see First would do with the coach fleet.
I cannot see them keeping Whittle for much longer- this could be sold to Rotala. This expansion is a surprise however. I still think First should buy NX Dundee in exchange for NX taking Stoke or Leicester.
sconehead85
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 01, 2013, 06:01:45 PM
Finglands fleet , although not elderly, were ageing and given Greater Manchester ITAs 15-year age limit 30 of Finglands buses were going to need replacing by 2017. Its quite possible that the LF deckers will simply transfer to East Yorkshire as Volvo Olympian replacements. The single deckers will replace Mercedes and Optare Excels at EYMS. It would be interesting to see First would do with the coach fleet.
I cannot see them keeping Whittle for much longer- this could be sold to Rotala. This expansion is a surprise however. I still think First should buy NX Dundee in exchange for NX taking Stoke or Leicester.
sconehead85
Ey? First havent acquired the coach fleet?? Why would rotala want whittles when they already run most kidderminster routes? Would they even be allowed by competition authorities and why would NX want to swap dundee for stoke or leicester the former is a dump and the latter has seen 25 buses worth of cuts recently-theyre both ailing business whereas NX has tried hard in dundee with new eclipses and hybrids
Quote from: Peter123 on August 01, 2013, 06:09:01 PM
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 01, 2013, 06:01:45 PM
Finglands fleet , although not elderly, were ageing and given Greater Manchester ITAs 15-year age limit 30 of Finglands buses were going to need replacing by 2017. Its quite possible that the LF deckers will simply transfer to East Yorkshire as Volvo Olympian replacements. The single deckers will replace Mercedes and Optare Excels at EYMS. It would be interesting to see First would do with the coach fleet.
I cannot see them keeping Whittle for much longer- this could be sold to Rotala. This expansion is a surprise however. I still think First should buy NX Dundee in exchange for NX taking Stoke or Leicester.
sconehead85
Ey? First havent acquired the coach fleet?? Why would rotala want whittles when they already run most kidderminster routes? Would they even be allowed by competition authorities and why would NX want to swap dundee for stoke or leicester the former is a dump and the latter has seen 25 buses worth of cuts recently-theyre both ailing business whereas NX has tried hard in dundee with new eclipses and hybrids
Peter123, Rotala buying Whittle's off EYMS would remove all competition on core routes and they may actually stand a better chance of making some money in KR. I agree with all your comments re: the proposed swap between First Leicester & NX Dundee, the Leicester fleet needs quite a bit of investment the majority of which is now 10-12 years old
Quote from: Winston on August 01, 2013, 06:14:09 PM
Quote from: Peter123 on August 01, 2013, 06:09:01 PM
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 01, 2013, 06:01:45 PM
Finglands fleet , although not elderly, were ageing and given Greater Manchester ITAs 15-year age limit 30 of Finglands buses were going to need replacing by 2017. Its quite possible that the LF deckers will simply transfer to East Yorkshire as Volvo Olympian replacements. The single deckers will replace Mercedes and Optare Excels at EYMS. It would be interesting to see First would do with the coach fleet.
I cannot see them keeping Whittle for much longer- this could be sold to Rotala. This expansion is a surprise however. I still think First should buy NX Dundee in exchange for NX taking Stoke or Leicester.
sconehead85
Ey? First havent acquired the coach fleet?? Why would rotala want whittles when they already run most kidderminster routes? Would they even be allowed by competition authorities and why would NX want to swap dundee for stoke or leicester the former is a dump and the latter has seen 25 buses worth of cuts recently-theyre both ailing business whereas NX has tried hard in dundee with new eclipses and hybrids
Peter123, Rotala buying Whittle's off EYMS would remove all competition on core routes and they may actually stand a better chance of making some money in KR. I agree with all your comments re: the proposed swap between First Leicester & NX Dundee, the Leicester fleet needs quite a bit of investment the majority of which is now 10-12 years old
I agree Winston it would help rotala out but if they put up a fight there, Whittles will probably back off anyway-spend the potential cost of purchasing on 15 new buses for there and whittles will go. Cant see the MMC allowing it though-redditch after diamonds acquisition still has more competition than kidderminster would have if diamond bought whittles. It is surprising though how badly leicester seems to do. You would think as a fairly compact city with a university with a long established bus operator they would make an absolute killing there and the same in stoke but theyve managed to make a dogs dinner of another operation. First can't compete though to save their lives and EYMS was up against stagecoach-now the only competitive bus operator in south manchester after bullocks/dennis's etc all sold out and UK north was ordered off the road. Surely that must tell you something-competing with volvo olympians against one of stagecoach's flagship operations aint gonna end well tho I reckon for 50 grand its worth a punt
And do we think finglands is one of the operators rumoured at being sold in coach and bus week a while ago? Or are there more sales to come?
http://omnibuses.blogspot.co.uk/2013/07/rumour-cachet.html
Was going to post this link earlier but forgot
What is interesting though is people look at diamond and say it cant be making much money but it says a lot now that manchester-?bigger city than birmingham? not going to open that can of worms :) but now there is scarcely anyone competing small operator wise on the scale of rotala in the west midlands let alone making a return like rotala do so maybe we should applaud them a bit more? Maybe I was wrong for suggesting that splitting WMT would bring about more competition as in manchester there is less with lots of operators sold or folded-far more than West Midlands-weve only really had AMPM-even when it was split up.
First buying Finglands sounds a good idea - I just hope they look after it! They haven't had a good track record in competitive environments, have they? However, others seem to reckon that First managers are now controlled less strictly from the top, so it could be a good move.
However, First look doomed in South Devon.
Firstly I must correct an error- Finglands coaches are not passing to First. I think Selwyns or Maynes could take over the ten coaches they own. Whittles is a bit of a problem but there are some areas where competition is unviable and pointless. Would they be too small for National Express?
sconehead85
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 02, 2013, 12:47:47 AM
Firstly I must correct an error- Finglands coaches are not passing to First. I think Selwyns or Maynes could take over the ten coaches they own. Whittles is a bit of a problem but there are some areas where competition is unviable and pointless. Would they be too small for National Express?
sconehead85
I wouldn't have thought NX would be interested in Whittle's due to size of the business / type of work they operate. They may only be interested in they ever wanted to turn up the heat on Rotala in Worcestershire, but as they didn't buy RH & KR from First, I would it is now unlikely
Quote from: Peter123 on August 01, 2013, 06:29:00 PM
What is interesting though is people look at diamond and say it cant be making much money but it says a lot now that manchester-?bigger city than birmingham? not going to open that can of worms :) but now there is scarcely anyone competing small operator wise on the scale of rotala in the west midlands let alone making a return like rotala do so maybe we should applaud them a bit more? Maybe I was wrong for suggesting that splitting WMT would bring about more competition as in manchester there is less with lots of operators sold or folded-far more than West Midlands-weve only really had AMPM-even when it was split up.
I think the major difference with brum and Manchester is stagecoach they push the rules to the limit and compete hard
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 02, 2013, 12:47:47 AM
Firstly I must correct an error- Finglands coaches are not passing to First. I think Selwyns or Maynes could take over the ten coaches they own. Whittles is a bit of a problem but there are some areas where competition is unviable and pointless. Would they be too small for National Express?
sconehead85
Why when they clearly want to keep it as it is a profit maker would they let someone else take over?? And way too small
If First Group have bought Finglands to go head to head with Stagecoach Manchester on the Wilmslow Road & Oxford Road corridors, they need to go straight in with a fleet of new buses at higher frequencies than at present
I assume the acquisition is designed to fire one back across Stagecoach's bow ;)
Given Stagecoach's frequency on the Wilmslow Road I would venture to suggest that this purchase is merely more evidence of first group's inept management.
Quote from: mikestone on August 02, 2013, 08:40:08 PM
Given Stagecoach's frequency on the Wilmslow Road I would venture to suggest that this purchase is merely more evidence of first group's inept management.
have to say i agree here mike they dont stand a chance
Quote from: mikestone on August 02, 2013, 08:40:08 PM
Given Stagecoach's frequency on the Wilmslow Road I would venture to suggest that this purchase is merely more evidence of first group's inept management.
Given that First have failed to turn around other loss making operations, what makes them think they can turn around the 250k loss on £3.8 million turnover that Finglands are currently loosing..... ?
Anyone think the stoke operation could be sold? Distinctly lacking in investment, no new buses since 2006!
Quote from: Winston on August 02, 2013, 09:32:02 PM
Quote from: mikestone on August 02, 2013, 08:40:08 PM
Given Stagecoach's frequency on the Wilmslow Road I would venture to suggest that this purchase is merely more evidence of first group's inept management.
Given that First have failed to turn around other loss making operations, what makes them think they can turn around the 250k loss on £3.8 million turnover that Finglands are currently loosing..... ?
i guess its not a massive loss to be honest tho i wonder how they could turn that around against stagecoach who are hard to compete against as many operators have discovered
Quote from: Peter123 on August 02, 2013, 10:04:39 PM
Quote from: Winston on August 02, 2013, 09:32:02 PM
Quote from: mikestone on August 02, 2013, 08:40:08 PM
Given Stagecoach's frequency on the Wilmslow Road I would venture to suggest that this purchase is merely more evidence of first group's inept management.
Given that First have failed to turn around other loss making operations, what makes them think they can turn around the 250k loss on £3.8 million turnover that Finglands are currently loosing..... ?
i guess its not a massive loss to be honest tho i wonder how they could turn that around against stagecoach who are hard to compete against as many operators have discovered
It's as much as RH & KR were loosing for First
bob- Remember my suggestion of a First/NatEx swap. OK it was shot down in flames but never mind!
sconehead85
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 03, 2013, 04:58:33 AM
bob- Remember my suggestion of a First/NatEx swap. OK it was shot down in flames but never mind!
sconehead85
There's no benefit for NX to swap, the Dundee business is doing well for NX, but I would have liked to have seen NX participate in the recent First Group sell offs. First Wyvern, Leicester, Scotland East & London would have been on my shopping list ;)
Quote from: Winston on August 03, 2013, 09:52:08 AM
Quote from: sconehead85 on August 03, 2013, 04:58:33 AM
bob- Remember my suggestion of a First/NatEx swap. OK it was shot down in flames but never mind!
sconehead85
There's no benefit for NX to swap, the Dundee business is doing well for NX, but I would have liked to have seen NX participate in the recent First Group sell offs. First Wyvern, Leicester, Scotland East & London would have been on my shopping list ;)
NX they may well have tried to aquire some of first's businesses we just don't know, london to expensive look what happened last time,stoke,leicester and Worcester could still come up for sale if first require additional funds to survive.
Quote from: Winston on August 03, 2013, 12:42:24 AM
Quote from: Peter123 on August 02, 2013, 10:04:39 PM
Quote from: Winston on August 02, 2013, 09:32:02 PM
Quote from: mikestone on August 02, 2013, 08:40:08 PM
Given Stagecoach's frequency on the Wilmslow Road I would venture to suggest that this purchase is merely more evidence of first group's inept management.
Given that First have failed to turn around other loss making operations, what makes them think they can turn around the 250k loss on £3.8 million turnover that Finglands are currently loosing..... ?
i guess its not a massive loss to be honest tho i wonder how they could turn that around against stagecoach who are hard to compete against as many operators have discovered
It's as much as RH & KR were loosing for First
If they had been owned by stagecoach then they could have easily been turned around compared to the loss stagecoach liverpool inherited with glenvale-that was massive and theyre well in profit now
Does anyone know when the sale of Finglands to First is likely to be completed please? So that their buses can be released back to EYMS to hopefully sort Whittle's bus shortage crisis. Whittle need about 1 or 2 more buses I think to cover their service, as demonstrated by buses not turning up or being replaced by coaches on the 3.
I see Bullocks or a similar name have bought the coach operation.
Quote from: StourportSam on November 15, 2013, 06:30:24 PM
Does anyone know when the sale of Finglands to First is likely to be completed please? So that their buses can be released back to EYMS to hopefully sort Whittle's bus shortage crisis. Whittle need about 1 or 2 more buses I think to cover their service, as demonstrated by buses not turning up or being replaced by coaches on the 3.
I see Bullocks or a similar name have bought the coach operation.
Oft site states decision date is T.b.c. I don't know why they're even bothering to investigate the acquisition, as it may lead to increased competition between First Group & Stagecoach
Quote from: Winston on November 15, 2013, 06:35:49 PMI don't know why they're even bothering to investigate the acquisition, as it may lead to increased competition between First Group & Stagecoach
Good Point!!
The OFT decision is to happen on 3rd December. I think Whittle may be sold, obviously not to First, as EYMS is probably going to focus on its own area.
If First are not allowed to buy Finglands then there will be a Stagecoach monopoly on the Manchester- Wilmslow Road corridor, so the OFT inquiry is a no-brainer.
sconehead85