AM/PM

[T840MAK]

The only similarity, and its really not, is with Stagecoach, who will sometimes scrap a perfectly usable bus if it's involved in more than one fatal collision, which I guess makes sense, otherwise it's renumbered and moved away, but that's not because it's broken down...

[justlookingaround]

The MAN/MCV combo is very unreliable and has resulted in quite a lot being exported to New Zealand.

I believe some MCVs have been repowered with Cummins engines but that may also include other bodied similar MANs.

[countryliner]

@Tony @Bryan @T840MAK - Often it can be easier for bus operators to scrap newer buses that are unreliable or break down. They will often use a bus for spare parts to repair another bus that has broken down before sending it to the scrap yard to get scrapped. Sometimes depending on what problem that the bus has developed it can be very expensive to repair. I am not saying that this happens very regularly but it does certainly happen and i have personally known it to happen with quite a few vehicles.

@Steveminor - Thank you. Yes newer buses do get indeed get scrapped sometimes such as the example that you have given.

@justlookingaround - That is interesting to hear. From my experience i have never known for MAN 14.220 MCV Evolution buses to be that unreliable. I can certainly think of far more unreliable types of buses. Sometimes it can depend on the vehicle. Sometimes some buses can be very reliable whilst other buses from the same batch can be very unreliable.

[T840MAK]

The MAN/MCV combo is very unreliable and has resulted in quite a lot being exported to New Zealand.

I believe some MCVs have been repowered with Cummins engines but that may also include other bodied similar MANs.

I think it is a MAN thing in general to be unreliable tbh, especially in warmer weather. With Stagecoach's old MAN / Alexander (later Transbus and then ADL)s buying habit its quite fun to see the impact that warmer weather than what we have now has on the buses - on really warm days they start dropping like flies ;)

Seems to be becoming a common thing now I've noticed to be re-engining MAN's (of all modern day varieties!) with Cummins engines - again going back to the Stagecoach example they were starting to do the majority of theirs, although I'm not sure what the latest is as it seems to have stopped, in Yorkshire at least.

[countryliner]

@T840MAK - Thanks for the info. That is interesting to hear.

[Tony]

Yes, MAN buses seem to be very poor, but I am still waiting for @countryliner to tell me one bus scrapped ar near 6 years old because it had broken down, shouldn't be too difficult as there are 'plenty of them'

[countryliner]

@Tony - Sorry i forgot to answer that question. Here are some examples.

SN08 AAF - We had this bus at Sussex Bus however although that it was quite new it could be very unreliable and broke down many times. This bus was then stripped for spare parts and then it was scrapped (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

AE06 VPZ - We had this bus at Countryliner and then Sunray Travel and then Buses Excetera. This bus could also be quite unreliable and broke down and it was decided to strip it for spare parts (to repair AE06 VPY (J60 ETC) which had also broken down) and then scrap it (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2013).

GX56 BKY (S13 ETC) / GX56 BKZ (S12 ETC) / SN54 GRU (S40 ETC) - These three Transbus Enviro 200 prototypes at Buses Excetera were very unreliable and also very hard to repair as it was difficult to get the spare parts that were needed. It was then decided to send them to the scrap yard (they were sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

So as you can see quite a few newer buses do get scrapped when they have broken down because they can be very expensive and difficult to repair and often the spare parts are needed to repair other buses. I can think of about ten examples off the top of my head. I am not saying that it is a regular occurance but it certainly does happen.

Also i have driven quite a few MAN buses (including MAN 14.220 MCV Evolution buses) and whilst they can occasionaly be unreliable i do not think that they are that unreliable. I can certainly think of far more unreliable types of buses that i have driven.

[MW]

@Tony - Sorry i forgot to answer that question. Here are some examples.

SN08 AAF - We had this bus at Sussex Bus however although that it was quite new it could be very unreliable and broke down many times. This bus was then stripped for spare parts and then it was scrapped (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

AE06 VPZ - We had this bus at Countryliner and then Sunray Travel and then Buses Excetera. This bus could also be quite unreliable and broke down and it was decided to strip it for spare parts (to repair AE06 VPY (J60 ETC) which had also broken down) and then scrap it (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2013).

GX56 BKY (S13 ETC) / GX56 BKZ (S12 ETC) / SN54 GRU (S40 ETC) - These three Transbus Enviro 200 prototypes at Buses Excetera were very unreliable and also very hard to repair as it was difficult to get the spare parts that were needed. It was then decided to send them to the scrap yard (they were sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

So as you can see quite a few newer buses do get scrapped when they have broken down because they can be very expensive and difficult to repair and often the spare parts are needed to repair other buses. I can think of about ten examples off the top of my head. I am not saying that it is a regular occurance but it certainly does happen.

Also i have driven quite a few MAN buses (including MAN 14.220 MCV Evolution buses) and whilst they can occasionaly be unreliable i do not think that they are that unreliable. I can certainly think of far more unreliable types of buses that i have driven.

None of which are/were six years old at time on scrap

[Tony]

@Tony - Sorry i forgot to answer that question. Here are some examples.

SN08 AAF - We had this bus at Sussex Bus however although that it was quite new it could be very unreliable and broke down many times. This bus was then stripped for spare parts and then it was scrapped (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

AE06 VPZ - We had this bus at Countryliner and then Sunray Travel and then Buses Excetera. This bus could also be quite unreliable and broke down and it was decided to strip it for spare parts (to repair AE06 VPY (J60 ETC) which had also broken down) and then scrap it (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2013).

GX56 BKY (S13 ETC) / GX56 BKZ (S12 ETC) / SN54 GRU (S40 ETC) - These three Transbus Enviro 200 prototypes at Buses Excetera were very unreliable and also very hard to repair as it was difficult to get the spare parts that were needed. It was then decided to send them to the scrap yard (they were sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

So as you can see quite a few newer buses do get scrapped when they have broken down because they can be very expensive and difficult to repair and often the spare parts are needed to repair other buses. I can think of about ten examples off the top of my head. I am not saying that it is a regular occurance but it certainly does happen.

Also i have driven quite a few MAN buses (including MAN 14.220 MCV Evolution buses) and whilst they can occasionaly be unreliable i do not think that they are that unreliable. I can certainly think of far more unreliable types of buses that i have driven.

AE06 VPZ doesn't surprise me it is an MCV/MAN, S13 ETC; S12 ETC & S40 ETC were 12 years old (built 2013), so hardly scrapped young.

What on earth did Sussex bus do to SN08 AAF there was nothing wrong with this bus when it was in the Midlands. First were happy enough to use it on the 144 Birmingham-Worcester service and no other Enviro 200s have suffered this indignity

[winston]

AE06 VPZ doesn't surprise me it is an MCV/MAN, S13 ETC; S12 ETC & S40 ETC were 12 years old (built 2013), so hardly scrapped young.

What on earth did Sussex bus do to SN08 AAF there was nothing wrong with this bus when it was in the Midlands. First were happy enough to use it on the 144 Birmingham-Worcester service and no other Enviro 200s have suffered this indignity

E300 SN08AAF came to Sussex Bus from Lloyds Coaches via Ensign, it hasn't been that long since it was on demonstration with FMR @ WR. You can understand the prototypes going due to been non-standard, parts have to come by & I believe they were sat around the ADL factory for years

[646]

@Tony - Sorry i forgot to answer that question. Here are some examples.

SN08 AAF - We had this bus at Sussex Bus however although that it was quite new it could be very unreliable and broke down many times. This bus was then stripped for spare parts and then it was scrapped (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

AE06 VPZ - We had this bus at Countryliner and then Sunray Travel and then Buses Excetera. This bus could also be quite unreliable and broke down and it was decided to strip it for spare parts (to repair AE06 VPY (J60 ETC) which had also broken down) and then scrap it (it was sent to the scrap yard in 2013).

GX56 BKY (S13 ETC) / GX56 BKZ (S12 ETC) / SN54 GRU (S40 ETC) - These three Transbus Enviro 200 prototypes at Buses Excetera were very unreliable and also very hard to repair as it was difficult to get the spare parts that were needed. It was then decided to send them to the scrap yard (they were sent to the scrap yard in 2015).

So as you can see quite a few newer buses do get scrapped when they have broken down because they can be very expensive and difficult to repair and often the spare parts are needed to repair other buses. I can think of about ten examples off the top of my head. I am not saying that it is a regular occurance but it certainly does happen.

Also i have driven quite a few MAN buses (including MAN 14.220 MCV Evolution buses) and whilst they can occasionaly be unreliable i do not think that they are that unreliable. I can certainly think of far more unreliable types of buses that i have driven.

SN08 AAF isn't scrapped and is in service in Brighton: https://www.flickr.com/photos/119889737@N03/16459611093/in/photolist-s4dRVc-rJXqD4-rJXq84-rJXqtV-s4dSkR-r5tNWa-rNV2cZ-riq22B-rkb5CJ-r9oSsf-ruAkXg-rndqCg-pX5odm-pvR41E-oTn3ed-pbk8uU-i3MGvX-e3iYme-dYKceB-dYKbKe-eJ3J5Y-djxYw1-bWRmdk-c5csbJ-9UBC2G-bjYRbx-9FwQXP-t56JbK-78bZnR-dLLS53-738SAV-6ZowJc-pZhcJC-r5naLs-rmVyw2-6znYz2-6ugBtA-6tBoxe-6uFpSR-7B2zP3-6YFT9p-515smA-511fyi-ak9Yfx/

And no surprise with the three E200 prototypes given that they were a unique design with unusual chassis layout and bear little resemblance to the bread and butter E200.

[winston]

SN08 AAF isn't scrapped and is in service in Brighton: https://www.flickr.com/photos/119889737@N03/16459611093/in/photolist-s4dRVc-rJXqD4-rJXq84-rJXqtV-s4dSkR-r5tNWa-rNV2cZ-riq22B-rkb5CJ-r9oSsf-ruAkXg-rndqCg-pX5odm-pvR41E-oTn3ed-pbk8uU-i3MGvX-e3iYme-dYKceB-dYKbKe-eJ3J5Y-djxYw1-bWRmdk-c5csbJ-9UBC2G-bjYRbx-9FwQXP-t56JbK-78bZnR-dLLS53-738SAV-6ZowJc-pZhcJC-r5naLs-rmVyw2-6znYz2-6ugBtA-6tBoxe-6uFpSR-7B2zP3-6YFT9p-515smA-511fyi-ak9Yfx/

That photo was from April 2015 with Sussex Bus

[PM]

E300 SN08AAF came to Sussex Bus from Lloyds Coaches via Ensign, it hasn't been that long since it was on demonstration with FMR @ WR. You can understand the prototypes going due to been non-standard, parts have to come by & I believe they were sat around the ADL factory for years

I'd be astonished if SN08AAF has been scrapped, it's pretty new, of the newer E300 design and when I caught it on the 144 a few years back seemed a great motor, as Tony says it raises questions about the operator after Lloyds Coaches!

[countryliner]

@Tony @Winston @MW @646 @DiamondDart -

At Countryliner (and later at Sunray Travel and Buses Excetera) we had 8 MAN 14.220 MCV Evolution (and 2 Dennis Dart MCV Evolution) buses and although AE06 VPZ caused a lot of problems and broke down regularly some of the other ones ran very well and never caused any problems at all. So whilst these buses can be unreliable it does not mean that all of them are.

With the Transbus Enviro 200 prototypes - yes these are certainly very different to normal Enviro 200 buses - although it is a shame that they left as i remember i often drove these on rural countryside routes at Buses Excetera where they were very popular with the OAPs due to their full low floor design throughout the bus. I believe that the fourth (unregistered) prototype still exists and is in storage at Alexander Dennis in Guildford (we considered purchasing this as well at Buses Excetera but in the end we decided not to).

I am not sure why SN08 AAF became so unreliable. I remember driving it during its first week at Sussex Bus and it was fine but within a few months of purchasing SN08 AAF it started to become quite unreliable and broke down many times. I can confirm that this bus has definetly 100% been scrapped. I remember when it left the Sussex Bus depot to go to the scrap yard (although i can not remember which scrap yard it went to off the top off my head). It was in service until around May 2015 and it went off to the scrap yard a few months after that (some time around June / July / August 2015 - i cant remember off the top of my head). It is a shame as it was a very nice bus but they can be expensive and hard to repair.

[Tony]

Is someone going to tell ebay there is a fraudster on there?

He is advertising a bus that has been scrapped
http://www.ebay.co.uk/itm/Alexander-Dennis-Enviro-200-Prototype/172059781336?_trksid=p2045573.c100033.m2042&_trkparms=aid%3D111001%26algo%3DREC.SEED%26ao%3D1%26asc%3D20131017132637%26meid%3Dc167ae9ff3ad4deb91dc524dd196af52%26pid%3D100033%26rk%3D1%26rkt%3D4%26sd%3D172059781336