Messages

Hi Simon & welcome,

Thanks for joining and giving us the ability to ask you questions, we appreciate as Rotala Plc CEO that your are tied by Stock market rules etc,

Couple of questions/points from me:

1. Do Rotala prefer to buy new buses generally from dealer stock as and when the need to upgrade/replace the existing fleet & new contract wins dictate, rather than ordering a larger batch of say 40 x B7RLE/Wright annually for fleet replacement for group and achieving a lower cost per unit for buying in bulk?

2. We were led to believe through Tony that 3 x B7RLE/Wright would be released from Wessex to Tividale upon receipt of their 4 x 13 plate examples (30936-30939) to complement their 4 new 13 plate examples & the 3 ex Midland Classic 57/08 plate examples, have plans changed or are they still expected?

3. We've noticed over the last couple of years that Diamond have withdrawn from a number of long standing commercial routes from both Long Acre i.e. 17, 37 & 97 & the 9 & 74 from Tividale, obviously the economy/reduced passenger journey's may have played some part, the B'ham City Centre omission zone (min Euro 3 requirement) another, has increased competition from NX also had an impact of your decision to withdraw?

4. Have Rotala Plc considered the 10 plate Scania Omnicity double decker ex Scania Demo or the batch of 08 plate dual door ex London Central Omnicity double deckers currently for sale at Ensign Bus & Coach as potential options to complement the examples currently at Wessex

5. How many additional B7RLE/Wright have been purchased for Wessex? I've seen a report of 2 allover white B7RLE registered BL13SWW and BL13SWX. The poster also goes on to say that there are two branded for route 13, not sure if they are also new or from the existing fleet, can you advise?

6. Have you had any more luck selling on any further redundant Levantes? I'm surprised another NX contractor didn't snap up a batch of that size for fleet replacement or even NX themselves for owned Op's

7. Do you intend to undertake a similar review of your Kidderminster operation in due course?

Thanks in advance for your reply,
 

1.   Since about 2010, the market for buying buses has changed.  There has been no need for stock orders.  We have however made orders for buses to Optare for Hybrid Single Decks, to Volvo for the Hybrid double decks, and the 4 normal Deckers we acquired last year.  We will shortly be ordering another 2 new Double Deckers for the South West, and we are looking at options for at present for next year.  Our rates for new buses are the same (excluding extras) whether we buy 1 or 50. 

2.    The plan was for 3 Ex Park & Ride Volvo Centros to come to the West Midlands.  There are a large number of service frequencies increases in the South West.  All but one of these vehicles will now go back to Keynsham. 

3.   There are two reasons why

1.   We expected the Competition Commission report, to have a greater impact on the Multi-Operator ticketing in the West Midlands.  It didn't.   

2.   We wanted to improve and focus on the quality of the rest of our service provision

4.   Having acquired and operated a large number of Ex-London vehicles, I am not a fan hence my reluctance on the 08 plate buses.  On the 10 plate bus, I made Ross an offer which he refused.  We seem to both have a different view on its worth.

5.   The 2 you have mentioned have been purchased, plus 2 "59" plate Volvo Centro's, plus BX62FGD will be transferred (one "59" plate will replace this)  The rebranded ones are from existing fleet.

6.   At the end of this week, I should have a better idea of what is happening.

7.   Yes

Hi again Simon,

Thanks for your reply

From observations, it appears that a lot of the focus for new vehicle investment is dictated by the needs/growth of Wessex & the South West Business and to a lesser degree the Preston business, whilst Diamond @ Long Acre & Tividale which is Rotala's biggest subsidiary appears to be the poorer relation which generally losses newer buses to Wessex or receives older cascades. Even the entire batch of Hybrid Versas were originally destined for Wessex according to the Green bus funding announcement as I understood it.

Are there any plans to grow the business/allocation at Long Acre? As that depot has seen the most loss of work i.e. withdrawal from commercial routes, Centro tender losses, exit from NX work, loss of NEC shuttle work etc   

With the impressive growth Scott has achieved @ Yourbus in just 4 years, going from start-up to a 100 vehicle operation / second-hand Darts/B10B's/Olympians being replaced by brand new Mercedes Citaros/Streetlights on newly launched routes etc. Were Scott & team unable to achieve similar growth results at the Diamond business? From observations the Diamond business doesn't appear to be as strong as it was during the period Scott was in charge and appears to be losing ground to new entrants such as Arriva & WMSNT. Are the operating conditions in the West Midlands much tougher?


In an ideal world all areas would justify and warrant new fleets.  Each market is different, each market has its own requirements.  In the South West Area most of our work comes under either high contractual requirements or SQPS stipulations that require vehicles to a high standard.  These requirements and standards, influence cost of provision and quality of vehicles.  In the West Midlands, I believe over a period of time we have invested in our Commercial corridors, yes there is still room for improvement.  In terms of subsidised Contracts we are happy to provide whatever the client requires, ultimately though someone has to pay for it.

In relation to Long Acre, it is always disappointing to lose work.  I am responsible for doing what is right for the Rotala businesses, and in all honesty I regret losing none of what has gone.  Medium term we have opportunities in the pipeline. 

In relation to Scott.  His business operates in a different market with different opportunities.  It is difficult to compare what we are doing with him. 

Overall, from memory I think our operational fleet has an average age of 7.5 years.  From the last TAS report I saw (again from memory) I believe this would compare well with our Peers.

Hi again Simon.

Another question about the 226 if I may, just so satisfy some of the views held by residents of the area I live in.

Why did diamond initially launch on Monday to Saturday daytime services, initially within a couple of minutes of the Hansons journeys whereas surely creating a every 15 minute joint frequency would have been better initially.

Another view which is held locally was that the intention was not to promote diamond but to, as several people have said in my area, run Hansons off the road. This was inflamed by rumours of diamond drivers saying that this was the intention.

The 226 commenced whilst Scott (my brother) was overseeing the Diamond Bus operation.  In all honesty, I am not exactly sure the Commercial reasons why.  I believe, (it is a long time back now) that it was connected to what we perceived were some other opportunities we saw in the area at that time.

Unfortunately drivers will have banter, and there are always a few who create situations. 

My question therefore is to know if that was what was to happen or was it something that was hoped to be different but turned out to be just one of then things.

On a personal note I must say I like the blue livery on the Wright Eclipses.

(Please note I am not asking on behalf of Hansons however much some people probably think I am)

I hope you are doing a review of kidderminster services as there are quite a few routes that if they where tweak a bit on the route they take would be able to keep to time better , and most of the services finish around 6.00pm to 6.30 pm. when some people are still at work if the y finished around 7.00 pm would be better the other week I missed my last bus by about 2 mins the bus I came to Kidderminster got delay by a diversion and traffic at that was only 5.50pm which is my last bus a local service not out of town and I had to have a taxi . and at to wait for that as they are busy at that time taking people home from work who get together and share one and people who missed there last bus, I know quite a few taxi drivers who have all told me this


It is our intention to start the same exercise in Kidderminster we are currently doing in Redditch.

Hi Simon & welcome,

Thanks for joining and giving us the ability to ask you questions, we appreciate as Rotala Plc CEO that your are tied by Stock market rules etc,

Couple of questions/points from me:

1. Do Rotala prefer to buy new buses generally from dealer stock as and when the need to upgrade/replace the existing fleet & new contract wins dictate, rather than ordering a larger batch of say 40 x B7RLE/Wright annually for fleet replacement for group and achieving a lower cost per unit for buying in bulk?

2. We were led to believe through Tony that 3 x B7RLE/Wright would be released from Wessex to Tividale upon receipt of their 4 x 13 plate examples (30936-30939) to complement their 4 new 13 plate examples & the 3 ex Midland Classic 57/08 plate examples, have plans changed or are they still expected?

3. We've noticed over the last couple of years that Diamond have withdrawn from a number of long standing commercial routes from both Long Acre i.e. 17, 37 & 97 & the 9 & 74 from Tividale, obviously the economy/reduced passenger journey's may have played some part, the B'ham City Centre omission zone (min Euro 3 requirement) another, has increased competition from NX also had an impact of your decision to withdraw?

4. Have Rotala Plc considered the 10 plate Scania Omnicity double decker ex Scania Demo or the batch of 08 plate dual door ex London Central Omnicity double deckers currently for sale at Ensign Bus & Coach as potential options to complement the examples currently at Wessex

5. How many additional B7RLE/Wright have been purchased for Wessex? I've seen a report of 2 allover white B7RLE registered BL13SWW and BL13SWX. The poster also goes on to say that there are two branded for route 13, not sure if they are also new or from the existing fleet, can you advise?

6. Have you had any more luck selling on any further redundant Levantes? I'm surprised another NX contractor didn't snap up a batch of that size for fleet replacement or even NX themselves for owned Op's

7. Do you intend to undertake a similar review of your Kidderminster operation in due course?

Thanks in advance for your reply,
 

1.   Since about 2010, the market for buying buses has changed.  There has been no need for stock orders.  We have however made orders for buses to Optare for Hybrid Single Decks, to Volvo for the Hybrid double decks, and the 4 normal Deckers we acquired last year.  We will shortly be ordering another 2 new Double Deckers for the South West, and we are looking at options for at present for next year.  Our rates for new buses are the same (excluding extras) whether we buy 1 or 50. 

2.    The plan was for 3 Ex Park & Ride Volvo Centros to come to the West Midlands.  There are a large number of service frequencies increases in the South West.  All but one of these vehicles will now go back to Keynsham. 

3.   There are two reasons why

1.   We expected the Competition Commission report, to have a greater impact on the Multi-Operator ticketing in the West Midlands.  It didn't.   

2.   We wanted to improve and focus on the quality of the rest of our service provision

4.   Having acquired and operated a large number of Ex-London vehicles, I am not a fan hence my reluctance on the 08 plate buses.  On the 10 plate bus, I made Ross an offer which he refused.  We seem to both have a different view on its worth.

5.   The 2 you have mentioned have been purchased, plus 2 "59" plate Volvo Centro's, plus BX62FGD will be transferred (one "59" plate will replace this)  The rebranded ones are from existing fleet.

6.   At the end of this week, I should have a better idea of what is happening.

7.   Yes


 

Hi Simon.

I am a user of your 226(W) service and maybe you could answer a few questions

Why have the 2 Y plate darts been debranded?
What's with the collection of just about anything from Solos to Red Diamond pointers on the 226?
Will we be seeing newer vehicles/a new branding on the 226?

Also, why did Diamond just implement a West Bromwich extension on Sundays only for the 226W and throughout the week?
 
The bsues on this route, operate some of the highest mileages of all the buses from Tividale.  This was the reason for change.  The 226W is a Centro subsidised contract, and following the Sandwell network review they asked to change the route.

[This forum topic is provided for the benefit of asking direct questions to Simon Dunn regarding Rotala bus operations and services.]

This forum topic is provided for the benefit of asking direct questions to Simon Dunn regarding Rotala bus operations and services.

If you have a pertinent question to ask, please do so here, and Simon will respond when he is able to. General customer service related enquiries should of course continue to be sent through the appropriate channels.

West Midlands: https://www.diamondbuses.com/west-midlands/contact-us/
Worcestershire & Warwickshire: https://www.diamondbuses.com/worcester-warwickshire/contact-us/

Note to other members: this is not a general 'chit-chat' area, so any answers or replies you may post here yourself may be removed by the forum moderators and admins, in order to keep this topic 'clear' for Simon to answer.



Really glad that you have joined the forum Simon-great to have a member of rotala on here to answer our questions etc. I understand your initial reluctance but thanks for responding to the points!

2) It is good that you aware of having too many smaller buses and I am glad that you intend to address this-though isnt K126URP still in service? It was recently as really enjoyed a ride on it!!

The vehicle was removed from service on 1st September 2013. 

3) Understand this entirely but just think that an already well run and successful route could be further improved

4) Yes probably because people are buying it up to avoid the fact that soon buses will be more expensive euro6 buses And yes, i imagine the investigation made fleet changes a bit of an issue

There is capacity before Euro 6, in all bus builders at present.  As you say, the investigation delayed investment.

5) great news about the three centros and does make sense to standardise long acre on centros and send the only eclipse 2 there to wessex. though not so sure about solos for redditch-more small buses are definitely not needed there!! The enviros were a good buy though in my opinion and maybe rotala could look out for more of these?

We need to revise our plan with regards the buses that originally came from Wessex.  That being the 07 plate Centro's.  I am not sure I know which Enviro's you mean. 

6) To my knowledge these buses are DDA compliant!!

Not quite.  They are missing an interlock.  This would not cost much, and we will fit it to the buses in service.  The ones currently missing from service, we need to review and evaluate.

Good news about the netowork review but it doesnt seem to have every redditch bus route actually on it which is a shame


I have looked at the marketing material, and I cannot see any Redditch Bus route missing.  It certainly wasn't our intention

9) to be honest, with regards to the 192 I would only like it to be reinstated on entusiasts grounds-i understand it is probably not financially viable

10) Great and about point 11 all I would say here is that the new buses gets it wrong again-tonnes of mistakes in this magazine recently and the quality seems to have gone downhill or is that just me that thinks that?

Thanks for answering these points but just a couple more

Can withdrawal dates for the cadets/KS03 solos be given?

Not at present

Also, how long do you think rotala will keep W567JVV, the AKW darts and the SVV and JUA and MNH darts-just interested as I like them and need to photo a couple more

We have lost a number of Centro tenders from October.  We need to assess what we need on going, this has not happened yet.

And the same with the first darts and presidents-where are they being stored and when will some be withdrawn from service and also could I email rotala seperately about a depot visit to photo some of the withdrawn stuff. Is that ok?

They are being stored between Redditch and Kidderminster.  Depots visits are not a problem, and you should contact dave.russell@rotala.co.uk  (he is away for 2 weeks from Yesterday).  A number have been withdrawn, a number will exit when either we have a buyer or we acquire the buses to replace them.
Love the new style rotala branding eg for summer sale!! Next time, could this be put by the entrance to buses or at the bottom of the windscreen to advertise it a bit more?


Thanks very much for reading this and best of luck with improving diamond buses in the coming months

I have decided following the recent comments to join the forum.  My reluctance previously has centred around my responsibilities as an Officer of a Publicly quoted business, and the implications of potentially acting outside market guidelines in disclosing privileged information.  It has always therefore been easier not to be a member.
In response to recent comments I have picked up.

1.   Dunn Motor Traction Ltd t/a YourBus

I do not believe, nor am I aware that Scott has a financial backer.  I am not sure why you believe he needs one.  You can always obtain a copy of the company accounts by paying £1 to Companies House.

2.   Redditch/Kidderminster

We can always do things better.  We do have a shortage of long vehicles in our fleet and this is something we are looking to address. 
So far, we have removed all step entrance vehicles and have taken out of fleet a large number of Non DDA vehicles.  We do need to continually invest in the fleet.

3.    002

There is a certain amount of confidentiality around this, and I am unable to comment.

4.    New Buses

There is limited immediate new stock vehicle availability
Lead times now for new buses are into the New Year, we have some definite requirements for which we are looking at options for, but these relate to other parts of the West Midlands.
In terms of Redditch, we need to change a number of buses.  Until, the investigation became clearer on Friday it was difficult to take any action.

5.    Late Second Hand Buses into Fleet

We have agreed to acquire 3 x 59 plate Volvo's B7RLE Plaxton Centro's from Volvo Bus & Coach Ltd.  2 of these three buses will go into the South West, the third will be used at Long Acre to replace BX62FGD which will go to Avonmouth to service the UWE contract.
We have also agreed to acquire 2 x 2006 Optare Solo 10.2m buses from Plaxtons.  These buses will go into Redditch.

6.   W901/4JNF

My preference is to dispose of all Non DDA vehicles.
 

7.   Buses For Sale

We will accept reasonable offers.  Since 2008, most financers have charged their lending criteria, this means older buses are not able to be financed.  This stops a number of people
concluding acquisitions and hence why we offer Rent to Buy options.

8.    Network Review – Redditch

This is being launched today.

9.    192

When we acquired the Diamond Bus Company Ltd in 2008, the 192 was operated by Central Connect Ltd.  I have no knowledge of the commercial relationship previously.  From my knowledge, the 192 was always supported by Worcestershire County Council.

10.    Wessex Branded MPD's

These vehicles will be painted shortly.

11.    W336VGX

We have this vehicle parked up in our yard.  We are awaiting a third party insurance assessor, as we believe the vehicle is a write off.  The vehicle I believe has been spotted in Clay Cross is W338VGX which we sold I think last year.

I think I have answered all the points, I have seen recently. 



Simon