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The WA Track drivers never used the rear blinds due to the frequency of interworking changes. Imagine walking down the then Station Street looking for your bus and seeing NO numbers!

In fact during most of the 1970s it was rare to see WA buses with the side number blinds in use either.  I expect this was mainly, or totally, because Walsall Corporation buses built from the early 1960s only had front blinds.

Birmingham Corporation's two-door Fleetlines - and rear-engined single deckers - were built without rear number blinds (as were West Bromwich Fleetlines), and this policy carried on into the early PTE era.  It became common for driver-only buses with to display blanks on the rear on those buses that had them, until (I understand) an agreement with drivers around 1979 brought them back into use.

I believe the agreement did not require rear number blinds to be used where route interworked, such as the WA track services.

Off at a slight tangent then.................

Where/when did the letters A, C, E (we know about), N, S, W become standard blind features/stand for, as I don't ever remember X being on there until well into the 90's?

This was in 1975 - at the same that A, C and E were changed to become what they generally still are today.

N was for Night Services, S for School Contracts and W for Works Contracts (contracts were not available to the general public).

One of the services WMPTE took over from Midland Red was the peak hours only X2, Hasbury - Birmingham Limited Stop.  This was run by Stourbridge garage from the takeover.  I think I recall seeing a PTE Leyland National, with 4 track number blinds, on the service in the mid 70s showing X2 - or is my memory playing tricks?  I don't think X was on the blinds when the change to A, C, E, N, S, W was made.

The 5 (Portland Road to Perry Common) went up to L (Perry Common/Enderby Road) which I think was the only service that did

There were a few others: 36L to Millhouse Road/Bierton Road, 48L to Maypole, 67L to Chester Road/Tangmere Drive, 90L to Lambeth Road/Queslett Road.

The letters D, G and I were not used, no doubt because they could have been mistaken for numbers.

It's worth pointing out that letters A, B and C (sometimes also others) were normally used for short workings from the outer terminus, not from city.  For example, at the Maypole there was at least one 50B working to Rea Street/Digbeth.

In the old roller blind era, did any of these Birmingham City Centre short workings 'exist' & if so, how were they displayed?

Was a generic 'City Centre' displayed & the drivers told the passengers what's what?

In WMPTE days at least buses would show the exact destinations, such as 'Ethel Street', 'St Martins Circus' and 'Lancaster Circus'. 

Until 1975 BCT and WMPTE South Division buses generally showed the outer destination in both directions.  When that was finally changed, buses initially showed 'City Centre' only if doing the city loop (New St, Corporation St, Bull St, Colmore Row) - otherwise they displayed 'City Terminus'.  In the late 1970s 'City Terminus' was replaced by more precise displays, such as 'City High Street' (with 'High' above 'Street').

The open top Fleetline, PDU 125M, was the very last Daimler bus built, and therefore the last full-size bus chassis built in Coventry.  Because of its history, West Midlands PTE donated it to the Coventry Motor Museum when it was withdrawn.

Then, when Coventry City won the FA cup in 1987, the museum ignored its history and controversially converted it to open top.  It was along time ago but even so I would hope that any operator donating a bus would include a clause requiring the vehicle to be kept complete.

N bus tickets valid in tfwm land all operators

Yes.  When I get an nBus day ticket on an NXWM bus, the ticket says:-

  "NOT VALID ON OTHER OPERATORS OUTSIDE OF THE WEST MIDLANDS"

So clearly, it's valid on all NXWM and NXC services everywhere plus all operators in TfWM land.  I have travelled on NX buses to Nuneaton and Rugby (among other "outside" towns) using nBus day tickets issued on NXWM buses without any issues.  What I haven't tried yet is doing the same using nBus tickets issued by other operators.

Daysaver extra valid on nx buses only issued outside tfwm land
When bus is outside tfwm land I think the nbus ticket goes of the ticket machine so only daysaver extra can be issued outside tfwm land

That makes sense to me.

A good point Stu.  I think this ought to be looked at nationally.

We could perhaps do with national policies being set for the best platforms to use (I think it's got to be social media unless anyone has better ideas).

More than this, we also need policies and standards on what to say.  Messages should say not only which roads will not be served, but what the alternative route will be - with info on stopping places as well if not clear.  Many operators do this already, of course, but others could do better.  

Are the 182/183 tendered services?  If so, are they being withdrawn or are they being (or have they been) retendered?

Renumbering routes should not be considered lightly.

Passengers get used to service numbers, and there would probably be a mass "what have they done that for?" if they were renumbered unless there was a very good reason.

[Search for 'Chaserider' and look for the correct zone for your ticket]

Tried calling select earlier today, no answer, I was wondering if anyone would be able to help me, so tomorrow I will be getting the 96 from Shrewsbury to Telford then I may go on a Chaserider travel Telford route, then after that get a 96 back from Telford to Shrewsbury, will a select and Chaserider day saver cover this, will be the child ticket I'm after, anyone know of the price?

Looking at the Chaserider website, there is an "all routes" day ticket costing £4.50 for under 19s, valid on Chaserider and Select buses.

While there is no mention of this on the Select website, the Chaserider site mentions tickets being available on the myTrip app - Search for 'Chaserider' and look for the correct zone for your ticket.  Looking on this I see that Select is also there, and the £4.50 all routes ticket (£6.20 for over 19s) can be purchased.

So, it looks likely that Select do offer day tickets including the all routes one.  Good luck!

The 13A from Bearwood to Blackheath has plenty of seniors use this service i give them all the time in the world to be seated, experience and all the extra health/Safety training has brought on a different approach, somebody said some where you don't know what underlying health problems seniors could have, trips and falls could greatly do a lot of harm.
i wish i had this knowledge when i started as young naive kid back then.
Driving that bit slower also avoids excessive waiting at timing points, keep bus rolling if on time or minute or 2 down, punters thank you for it. As a kid it was hammer time between timing points and getting to terminus early different times eh.

Yep, different times. The days of get on the Fleetline quickly, hold tight as the bus moves off and brace yourself when the bus brakes (and the brakes could be fierce) are way in the past.

Not as fast-paced as it was, but smoother for everyone now as well as safer.

More of a comment about Dudley town centre than the bus stands.

I travelled on a 126 to Dudley on Sunday, arriving just before 12 noon.  There was alot of activity around the new stands but things seemed to be working OK, especially considering it was the first day.

What I found sad was that after Burnt Tree (Tesco), I was the only passenger on the bus.  I know of course that Merry Hill sucked the life out of Dudley town centre, but I hope this isn't typical.  Is Dudley normally worth visiting on a Sunday?

Details of the last bus promise are on the TfWM Bus Passengers Charter page here -

https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/west-midlands-bus-passenger-s-charter/west-midlands-bus-passenger-s-charter/

The promise appears under "Your bus journeys".

The promise is to reimburse reasonable costs for an equivalent journey so, as Stu indicates, I would assume that the starting point will be "could the journey be done using one or more other bus services?"

The subject will raise several questions, but I have other things to do with my spare time than think of a load of scenarios.  But one question - does another Combined Authority or similar offer a last bus of the day promise?

I think you may mis-understand what I mean about on-site marketing the X30. This is not about selling tickets at cut price. This is about TfWM spending a full day at each business at Ansty Park with a 'pop up' marketing stand talking to the employees and explaining about how good the X30 link is.

I appreciate what you're saying. I used the word 'subsidise' to mean funding the contract for the service. Do we know who lets the contract? I get the impression from earlier posts here that it isn't a TfWM contact.

Agree fully but it's no good just sitting back to see what happens. Should TfWM be regularly setting up their marketing stall? There is more than one market to consider. Done right could see demand increase.

Bear in mind that Ansty Park is located outside the TfWM area - it is in Warwickshire.  While the X30 is aimed at and benefits residents in the WMCA area, so do (or have) bus services from the Birmingham area to places such as Amazon at Rugeley and Boots at Burton-on-Trent.

I believe that TfWM policy has, rightly or wrongly, been not to subsidise works (or schools) services for several years, and I cannot recall when Warwickshire County Council last subsidised a works service.  I'm sure both authorities would say that it is up to the owners or managers of Ansty Park - or employers there - to decide whether or not to fund a service.