Did stagecoach get a feel for Birmingham during the commonwealth and want to change strategy and bring some competition for future growth
Quote from: monkeyjoe on December 08, 2022, 10:00:13 PMDid stagecoach get a feel for Birmingham during the commonwealth and want to change strategy and bring some competition for future growth
Does make you wonder, mind you stagecoach have been after the west mids for a long time
Quote from: cris 99 on December 08, 2022, 09:12:02 PMWell shocked to see the 41/46 58 will be operated by Stagecoach from january be weird seeing Stagecoach in Northfield and Yardley
Given the dead mileage from either Nuneaton or Rugby , It does make you wonder how they can manage to Undercut more local operators
Crew changeovers will be quite challenging also but That will be factored into the price which emphasises my first bit
Quote from: Lukeee on December 09, 2022, 12:21:06 AMDoes make you wonder, mind you stagecoach have been after the west mids for a long time
Stagecoach have been after NXWM for a long time, they could have broken in to the West Midlands bus market long before now if they had wanted too...
Quote from: winston on December 09, 2022, 08:49:26 AMStagecoach have been after NXWM for a long time, they could have broken in to the West Midlands bus market long before now if they had wanted too...
It makes you wonder now they have a parent company with far deeper pockets than their own, if they now "want to"
I don't know how long these tenders run for , but they surely can't be ran long term from Warwickshire. Surely there must be a plan to operate from somewhere more local?
That said the existing local Coventry and Solihull work seems well ran - but would be easier with a local depot.
Quote from: gc802002 on December 09, 2022, 08:54:24 AMIt makes you wonder now they have a parent company with far deeper pockets than their own, if they now "want to"
I don't know how long these tenders run for , but they surely can't be ran long term from Warwickshire. Surely there must be a plan to operate from somewhere more local?
That said the existing local Coventry and Solihull work seems well ran - but would be easier with a local depot.
It's unlikely that NX Group would consider selling NXWM, DWS would likely have to buy the entire Group if Stagecoach want it bad enough.
The tenders are typically over 2-3 year periods
Stagecoach Warwickshire are already struggling to cover their existing work including work in Stratford recently won off Diamond - but we're heading well off topic now.
You would think Stagecoach may have spare capacity at Rugby and not at Nuneaton or Leamington (particularly staff). Thus picking up tenders to keep resources busy.
Quote from: cris 99 on December 08, 2022, 09:12:02 PMWell shocked to see the 41/46 58 will be operated by Stagecoach from january be weird seeing Stagecoach in Northfield and Yardley
Will the times for these route change as a result?
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on December 09, 2022, 07:13:50 PMWill the times for these route change as a result?
Most probably, the 46 route gets an alteration as part of the tender spec.
But please, use other topics for such discussions, and lets keep this on-topic for Acocks Green garage discussion.
QuoteWell shocked to see the 41/46 58 will be operated by Stagecoach from january be weird seeing Stagecoach in Northfield and Yardley
Shocking to even see stagecoach in Acocks green...
Shocking to see Stagecoach past my front door in Olton :cheesy:
Seems like a few new services in Birmingham
-
41
46
A9
Can anyone confirm this? What vehicles will be used any timetables?
Quote from: Jack D on December 09, 2022, 11:33:40 PMWhat vehicles will be used
Would guess E200. Standard Stagecoach single deck
QuoteWould guess E200. Standard Stagecoach single deck
41 and 46 are able to have double deckers
Quote from: BBS on December 10, 2022, 10:26:59 AM41 and 46 are able to have double deckers
Probably don't need them though I guess.
Not sure Rugby have any double decks either.
Bus times say Kettering, Northampton and Leamington have double decks.
Fleet list – Stagecoach Midlands – bustimes.org (https://bustimes.org/operators/stagecoach-northamptonshire/vehicles)
The 82 can have double decks as well, as they were used regularly when ran by Diamond/Johnsons, however as the Nuneaton depot doesn't have any you will never see one on there.
Quote from: BBS on December 10, 2022, 10:26:59 AM41 and 46 are able to have double deckers
Doesn't mean Stagecoach will choose to use them.
Quote from: 2206 on December 10, 2022, 11:05:29 AMProbably don't need them though I guess.
Not sure Rugby have any double decks either.
Bus times say Kettering, Northampton and Leamington have double decks.
Fleet list – Stagecoach Midlands – bustimes.org (https://bustimes.org/operators/stagecoach-northamptonshire/vehicles)
The 82 can have double decks as well, as they were used regularly when ran by Diamond/Johnsons, however as the Nuneaton depot doesn't have any you will never see one on there.
The buses used on these new TfWM contracts will need to be Euro 6 too.
QuoteThe buses used on these new TfWM contracts will need to be Euro 6 too.
And I don't believe any of the current Rugby fleet is Euro 6, so ex London E200s would seem one option available, another would be E200MMCs (or converted E200s) transferred from another subsiduary
Quote from: Tony on December 10, 2022, 11:29:39 AMAnd I don't believe any of the current Rugby fleet is Euro 6, so ex London E200s would seem one option available, another would be E200MMCs (or converted E200s) transferred from another subsiduary
The 63 reg ones like SN63KGO appear to be. They show as no charge on the Birmingham CAZ site.
Quote from: 2206 on December 10, 2022, 11:42:30 AMThe 63 reg ones like SN63KGO appear to be. They show as no charge on the Birmingham CAZ site.
Stagecoach will need approx 15 extra buses + spares to cover the tenders they are thought to have gained.
When will the new bus timetables be up for the new routes like the 58?
Quote from: Tony on December 10, 2022, 11:29:39 AMAnd I don't believe any of the current Rugby fleet is Euro 6, so ex London E200s would seem one option available, another would be E200MMCs (or converted E200s) transferred from another subsiduary
I believe some of Leamington's are possibly Euro 6. Will be interesting to see what happens though.
Quote from: 2206 on December 10, 2022, 11:42:30 AMThe 63 reg ones like SN63KGO appear to be. They show as no charge on the Birmingham CAZ site.
What about others of a similar vintage ie the 62/13 plates?
Could we see the 48 branded gold buses be transferred from Nuneaton to ruby
QuoteWhat about others of a similar vintage ie the 62/13 plates?
No Classic shape E200s were built as Euro 6, but many have had exhaust systems fitted over the last few years.
QuoteWhen will the new bus timetables be up for the new routes like the 58?
Most likely when stagecoach registers the routes
Taken from the Blink, There are 4 routes to be registered and they will be looking for a local outstation.
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Heartlands Hospital
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Kings Heath
Kings Heath to Shirley
Shirley to Kingshsurst
Not mentioned in the post , But I would presume if local premises are indeed found , That it might be cheaper to Run the 82/87 and 88 from their?
Quote from: gc802002 on December 10, 2022, 03:50:25 PMTaken from the Blink, There are 4 routes to be registered and they will be looking for a local outstation.
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Heartlands Hospital
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Kings Heath
Kings Heath to Shirley
Shirley to Kingshsurst
Not mentioned in the post , But I would presume if local premises are indeed found , That it might be cheaper to Run the 82/87 and 88 from their?
Somewhere near Shirley or Solihull would probably be ideal for them, they could bring in the X20 as well.
Quote from: Stu on December 10, 2022, 03:59:50 PMSomewhere near Shirley or Solihull would probably be ideal for them, they could bring in the X20 as well.
And with the Solihull - Coventry work would be quite an operation , Around 20 Vehicles?
Quote from: gc802002 on December 10, 2022, 03:50:25 PMTaken from the Blink, There are 4 routes to be registered and they will be looking for a local outstation.
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Heartlands Hospital
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Kings Heath
Kings Heath to Shirley
Shirley to Kingshsurst
Not mentioned in the post , But I would presume if local premises are indeed found , That it might be cheaper to Run the 82/87 and 88 from their?
Do you mean Solihull to kingshurst ? Or is that correct
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on December 10, 2022, 04:18:09 PMDo you mean Solihull to kingshurst ? Or is that correct
It says Shirley to Kingshurst on the screenshot but that is not to say that might not be wrong?
Quote from: gc802002 on December 10, 2022, 04:25:23 PMIt says Shirley to Kingshurst on the screenshot but that is not to say that might not be wrong?
No, it's correct. The new A9 is Kingshurst to Blyth Valley Park.
Just a point, what is the point of the A suffix on the solihull routes what does it mean? "S" I get but "A"?
A for Arden
So is there still a bus that is replacing the current 58 route operated by national express
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on December 10, 2022, 12:12:47 PMSo is there still a bus that is replacing the current 58 route operated by national express
They're coming off as its no longer commercially viable I think.
Hence TFWM put it out to tender as the A9.
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on December 10, 2022, 05:04:29 PMSo is there still a bus that is replacing the current 58 route operated by national express
The new A9 service replaces the 58.
Quote from: gc802002 on December 10, 2022, 03:50:25 PMTaken from the Blink, There are 4 routes to be registered and they will be looking for a local outstation.
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Heartlands Hospital
Queen Elizabeth Hospital to Kings Heath
Kings Heath to Shirley
Shirley to Kingshsurst
41 - QE Hospital to Heartlands Hospital - no change to route
46 - QE Hospital to Kings Heath - partly replaces withdrawn 48 route from QE to Northfield, then reverse of current 46 route to Hawkesley, extended to Kings Heath via Brandwood End to replace withdrawn 69 service
169 - Kings Heath to Shirley, mostly replaces withdrawn 69 service and operates via Solihull town centre
A9 - Kingshurst to Blythe Valley Business Park, replaces withdrawn 58 service, extends to Blythe Valley via Monkspath Hall Road and Creynolds Lane.
Quote from: Stu on December 10, 2022, 05:49:21 PM41 - QE Hospital to Heartlands Hospital - no change to route
46 - QE Hospital to Kings Heath - partly replaces withdrawn 48 route from QE to Northfield, then reverse of current 46 route to Hawkesley, extended to Kings Heath via Brandwood End to replace withdrawn 69 service
169 - Kings Heath to Shirley, mostly replaces withdrawn 69 service and operates via Solihull town centre
A9 - Kingshurst to Blythe Valley Business Park, replaces withdrawn 58 service, extends to Blythe Valley via Monkspath Hall Road and Creynolds Lane.
Does that mean the A9 is going via Creynolds Lane way into Blythe Valley. Would have thought straight down Stratford Road. At least a nice scenic way ( if a bit longer) and would be another bus for the residents of nearby Cheswick Green!
QuoteThey're coming off as its no longer commercially viable I think.
Hence TFWM put it out to tender as the A9.
Landflight seem to have all the "A" routes
Quote from: BBS on December 10, 2022, 07:58:20 PMLandflight seem to have all the "A" routes
Apart from the new ones.
The new route of the 46 beyond Northfield similar to that of the old 27A/C South Circle?
Anywhere we can view route and timetables?
Quote from: Jack D on December 10, 2022, 11:24:52 PMAnywhere we can view route and timetables?
Not yet.
Details will be on the TfWM website when timetables are finalised.
I thought the NX 82/87 was going to be part of sprint route 2.
Quote from: Ginger66 on December 11, 2022, 10:54:10 AMI thought the NX 82/87 was going to be part of sprint route 2.
How is that relevant to Stagecoach?
QuoteI thought the NX 82/87 was going to be part of sprint route 2.
Who says they aren't?
Quote from: Stu on December 10, 2022, 05:49:21 PM41 - QE Hospital to Heartlands Hospital - no change to route
46 - QE Hospital to Kings Heath - partly replaces withdrawn 48 route from QE to Northfield, then reverse of current 46 route to Hawkesley, extended to Kings Heath via Brandwood End to replace withdrawn 69 service
169 - Kings Heath to Shirley, mostly replaces withdrawn 69 service and operates via Solihull town centre
A9 - Kingshurst to Blythe Valley Business Park, replaces withdrawn 58 service, extends to Blythe Valley via Monkspath Hall Road and Creynolds Lane.
I'm wondering where the 46 and 169 are going use a terminus in Kings Heath, I know All Saints Road was used as a terminus but that was years ago and I don't think that can be used now.
Quote from: Steve3229vp on December 11, 2022, 12:01:06 PMI'm wondering where the 46 and 169 are going use a terminus in Kings Heath, I know All Saints Road was used as a terminus but that was years ago and I don't think that can be used now.
Possibly interworked? If so, the stops at the end of Vicarage Rd would be the obvious place.
Quote from: Steve3229vp on December 11, 2022, 12:01:06 PMI'm wondering where the 46 and 169 are going use a terminus in Kings Heath, I know All Saints Road was used as a terminus but that was years ago and I don't think that can be used now.
The 46 should do the 'loop' via Heathfield Road, Springfield Road and Poplar Road to terminate on High Street (Institute Road).
The 169 should do a 'loop' via Heathfield Road and Melton Road to terminate on Institute Road.
If Stagecoach are planning to interwork the services, then there may end up being a revision of the final routes in Kings Heath, we'll know this when the timetables and route details are confirmed and published.
Poplar Rd wouldn't be an option as it has modal filters halfway down as part of the LTN scheme in Kings Heath.
All Saints Road could technically still be used, but the buses would have to turn right instead of kinking to the left. Oh and also fight their way through the cars (although it looks like the buses had to do that when they last used it around 2009).
Quote from: ellspurs on December 11, 2022, 03:18:54 PMAll Saints Road could technically still be used, but the buses would have to turn right instead of kinking to the left. Oh and also fight their way through the cars (although it looks like the buses had to do that when they last used it around 2009).
This was the route the old route 2 (Kings Heath to Selly Oak, later Weoley Castle - that eventually got swallowed up into the 69) and the 27 used to take, turning right out of All Saints Road onto Abbots Road. The 165 Chelmsley Wood route and the 164 that replaced it used to continue down All Saints Road and onto Howard Road - now no longer possible.
I used to like that All Saints Road terminus as a kid, you'd see an interesting variety of buses laying over there.
Quote from: Mike K on December 11, 2022, 06:22:18 PMThis was the route the old route 2 (Kings Heath to Selly Oak, later Weoley Castle - that eventually got swallowed up into the 69) and the 27 used to take, turning right out of All Saints Road onto Abbots Road. The 165 Chelmsley Wood route and the 164 that replaced it used to continue down All Saints Road and onto Howard Road - now no longer possible.
I used to like that All Saints Road terminus as a kid, you'd see an interesting variety of buses laying over there.
Interestingly, when MRW operated the tendered evening journeys on the 69 that terminated in All Saints Rd, they continued onto Howard Rd and then did a loop along the Alcester Rd and then back onto Vicarage Rd rather than turning immediately right onto Abbots Road (unlike the 27).
Quote from: Ginger66 on December 11, 2022, 10:54:10 AMI thought the NX 82/87 was going to be part of sprint route 2.
They didn't say nx 82/87 , I think they were referring to the solihull 82/87
SC Christmas & New Yr service summary has been updated to include now include "Birmingham".
https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-02/12/2022-13:58:09:067
However the Birmingham timetable info is not yet on the website.
Quote from: Rachvince53 on December 14, 2022, 06:01:17 PMHowever the Birmingham timetable info is not yet on the website.
There is no Birmingham section yet, it will need to be added. :rolleyes:
Any timetables yet?
Quote from: Jack D on December 17, 2022, 01:37:51 PMAny timetables yet?
Timetables for 41 and 46 are now on the TfWM website.
Quote from: Stu on December 17, 2022, 01:41:15 PMTimetables for 41 and 46 are now on the TfWM website.
If the turn point in Kings Heath is accurate for the 46 ho boy they're going to have fun doing that.
QuoteIf the turn point in Kings Heath is accurate for the 46 ho boy they're going to have fun doing that.
Damn that turn point sounds difficult as hell.
Agreed, re: 46 turning in Kings Heath.
From the map, it looks like Springfield Rd and Woodville Rd are being used to turn around.
The former, fine. As for the latter...it'd be far better to reinstate the All Saints Rd terminus.
I don't think a bus has ever been routed down this road before. The turns at both ends of the road are very tight and cars are always parked on both sides (it's not a one way road either).
Quote from: SO6597 on December 18, 2022, 10:49:15 AMAgreed, re: 46 turning in Kings Heath.
From the map, it looks like Springfield Rd and Woodville Rd are being used to turn around.
The former, fine. As for the latter...it'd be far better to reinstate the All Saints Rd terminus.
I don't think a bus has ever been routed down this road before. The turns at both ends of the road are very tight and cars are always parked on both sides (it's not a one way road either).
The current 34 uses Springfield Road, Poplar Road, Woodville Road and Heathfield Road before terminating on High Street, according to the TfWM map.
However looking on BusTimes, it seems the drivers are using Valentine Road instead to get onto the High Street.
Quote from: Stu on December 18, 2022, 10:59:41 AMThe current 34 uses Springfield Road, Poplar Road, Woodville Road and Heathfield Road before terminating on High Street, according to the TfWM map.
However looking on BusTimes, it seems the drivers are using Valentine Road instead to get onto the High Street.
Agree with previous posts re All Saints Road being a more sensible option. Poplar Road and Woodville Road can be a pain in the backside when driving a car due to the parking on both sides and meeting traffic coming on the opposite direction. I can't see that routing working.
What size buses does the 34 use? As that turn from Valentine Road back onto Kings Heath High Street would be too tight for a full sized single decker (assuming that's what Stagecoach would use?).
Quote from: Mike K on December 18, 2022, 11:34:11 AMAgree with previous posts re All Saints Road being a more sensible option. Poplar Road and Woodville Road can be a pain in the backside when driving a car due to the parking on both sides and meeting traffic coming on the opposite direction. I can't see that routing working.
What size buses does the 34 use? As that turn from Valentine Road back onto Kings Heath High Street would be too tight for a full sized single decker (assuming that's what Stagecoach would use?).
rugby doesnt have any full size singles iirc only 2 darts with the rest being e200s
Quote from: Mike K on December 18, 2022, 11:34:11 AMWhat size buses does the 34 use? As that turn from Valentine Road back onto Kings Heath High Street would be too tight for a full sized single decker (assuming that's what Stagecoach would use?).
The 34 is mainly Mellor operated. The 69 also does the same approach now it seems, and that is mostly Mellor and Solo operated.
Sunday 1st January
No service, except on routes 60, 46, A9 & 7(C) will run a Sunday service
Taken from stagecoach website suggesting, A9 has a Sunday service which the 58 did not.
Quote from: Jack D on December 19, 2022, 07:08:52 PMSunday 1st January
No service, except on routes 60, 46, A9 & 7(C) will run a Sunday service
Taken from stagecoach website suggesting, A9 has a Sunday service which the 58 did not.
Yes, it appears to be the case, the tender spec for the A9 included addition of Sunday journeys.
The other bonus is that the 46 does the full route on Sundays, which includes the section from QE to Northfield via Weoley Castle not currently served by the 48 on Sundays.
Any updates regarding maps and timetables for A9 or any Birmingham mentioned on the Stagecoach website with 9 days to go!
Quote from: Jack D on December 21, 2022, 04:05:16 PMAny updates regarding maps and timetables for A9 or any Birmingham mentioned on the Stagecoach website with 9 days to go!
Timetables now on Stagecoach's website.
They have been route learning the last couple of days, but Twitter suggests still numerous journeys not operating on their current routes...
Quote from: Matt.N0056 on December 21, 2022, 04:10:18 PMTimetables now on Stagecoach's website.
They have been route learning the last couple of days, but Twitter suggests still numerous journeys not operating on their current routes...
A bus packed full of drivers learning the routes yesterday aswell from what I can gather - how bizzare !
Not sure about the Sunday timetable on the A9...
The current A8 takes 20 mins from Solihull to Blythe Valley whilst the A9 takes 26 mins, despite the A9 being the more direct and relatively traffic free route.
Similarly, the return journey from Blythe Valley to Solihull takes 23 mins on the A7, and 33 mins on the A9.
Interesting to see an hour gap in service, on the A9. Going into Solihull around 8am with arrivals from Fordbirdge arriving in Solihull at 0810 and 0917.
Quote from: GoldenSquid on December 21, 2022, 07:30:05 PMInteresting to see an hour gap in service, on the A9. Going into Solihull around 8am with arrivals from Fordbirdge arriving in Solihull at 0810 and 0917.
Always been that was on the 58
Just seen the map of route it's taking, posted on a local group by a councillor . It was a bit blurry but noticed a slight change of route. This A9 seems to be going Lode Lane, Dovehouse Lane, Highwood Avenue to joinng Castle Lane rather then the current NX58 that carries on upto Olton Tavern Island.
For the first 3 months a single fare will be £2 in line with the national scheme by the government, also Nbus will be able to bought onboard. Route funded by TFWM untill March 2025 when it be decided if its commercially viable to continue.
Quote from: Jack D on December 21, 2022, 07:55:09 PMAlways been that was on the 58
But there use to be an extra bus at that time on school days due it being very busy at that time
Any rumours where the local base might be eventually?
QuoteAny rumours where the local base might be eventually?
No, because as I said they haven't identified one!
Quote from: monkeyjoe on December 21, 2022, 08:38:44 PMAny rumours where the local base might be eventually?
Tony has confirmed in another post that nothing has been found as of yet.
At a guess I'd say East Birmingham with close proximity to the M42 is the most logical and ideal location, to position vehicles at Solihull, Blythe Valley & Kings Heath; yet close enough to get to Heartlands/Kingshurst for 41/A9 services.
Possibly rent one of the unused car parks at the NEC if they're pressed for time.
That's why I used the word "eventually".
Issued today - New / Improved routes from 3rd January 2023.Includes Coventry also.https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923We are delighted to announce that we have been awarded new tenders and will be running the following new routes from 3rd January 2023
41 - Queen Elizabeth Hospital - Headlands Hospital Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R41%20TT%20230103.pdf)
169 - Kings Heath - Shirley Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R169%20TT%20230101.pdf)
A9 - Kingshurst - Blyth Valley Park Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/RA9%20TT%20230103.pdf)
46 - Queen Elizabeth Hospital - Kings Heath Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R46%20TT%20230101.pdf)
71 - Chelmsley Wood - Sutton Coldfield Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R71%20TT%20230101.pdf)
7C - Pool Meadow - Brownshill Green Timetable COMING SOON
51 - Pool Meadow - Arena Retail Park Timetable COMING SOON
Additionally the following routes will see some changes : -
60 - Timetable COMING SOON
703 - Timetable COMING SOON
20A - Timetable COMING SOON
Quote from: Sandy Lane on December 22, 2022, 01:38:55 PMIssued today - New / Improved routes from 3rd January 2023.
Includes Coventry also.
https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923
We are delighted to announce that we have been awarded new tenders and will be running the following new routes from 3rd January 2023
41 - Queen Elizabeth Hospital - Headlands Hospital Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R41%20TT%20230103.pdf)
169 - Kings Heath - Shirley Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R169%20TT%20230101.pdf)
A9 - Kingshurst - Blyth Valley Park Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/RA9%20TT%20230103.pdf)
46 - Queen Elizabeth Hospital - Kings Heath Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R46%20TT%20230101.pdf)
71 - Chelmsley Wood - Sutton Coldfield Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R71%20TT%20230101.pdf)
7C - Pool Meadow - Brownshill Green Timetable COMING SOON
51 - Pool Meadow - Arena Retail Park Timetable COMING SOON
Additionally the following routes will see some changes : -
60 - Timetable COMING SOON
703 - Timetable COMING SOON
20A - Timetable COMING SOON
So its 7 monday- Saturday untill 6pm then after 6pm and all day sundays its the 7C
Quote from: Sandy Lane on December 22, 2022, 01:38:55 PMIssued today - New / Improved routes from 3rd January 2023.
Includes Coventry also.
https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923
We are delighted to announce that we have been awarded new tenders and will be running the following new routes from 3rd January 2023
41 - Queen Elizabeth Hospital - Headlands Hospital Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R41%20TT%20230103.pdf)
169 - Kings Heath - Shirley Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R169%20TT%20230101.pdf)
A9 - Kingshurst - Blyth Valley Park Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/RA9%20TT%20230103.pdf)
46 - Queen Elizabeth Hospital - Kings Heath Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R46%20TT%20230101.pdf)
71 - Chelmsley Wood - Sutton Coldfield Timetable HERE (https://tiscon-maps-stagecoachbus.s3.amazonaws.com/Timetables/Midlands/Rugby%20Timetables/January%202023/R71%20TT%20230101.pdf)
7C - Pool Meadow - Brownshill Green Timetable COMING SOON
51 - Pool Meadow - Arena Retail Park Timetable COMING SOON
Additionally the following routes will see some changes : -
60 - Timetable COMING SOON
703 - Timetable COMING SOON
20A - Timetable COMING SOON
The 1 hour gap on the A9 at 7:26 and 8:33 does not make sense especially as this is the busiest time for people to get to work and school. On the old 58 it was always full at this time so they had to add an extra bus. Surely it makes sense to add an extra bus at this time.
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on December 22, 2022, 03:04:33 PMThe 1 hour gap on the A9 at 7:26 and 8:33 does not make sense especially as this is the busiest time for people to get to work and school. On the old 58 it was always full at this time so they had to add an extra bus. Surely it makes sense to add an extra bus at this time.
NX 58 shorts used to start at Yardley at those times.
I know why don't they include those in the new A9 route. The 7:27 one from Yardley is been included but why not he 8:04 or the 8:24, as those are where most people seem to be getting on .
Spotted E200 36952 route learning the 46 on Woodland Rd in Northfield this afternoon.
Got back home and had a look on bus times to see what it had been up to today and there are some differences with the information on TfWM site (the new timetable has been taken down from there):
-The turning loop used in Kings Heath was Heathfield Rd, Springfield Rd and Institute Road.
-It used the new road as per the 45 by Aldi in Kings Norton.
-Weoley Castle was by-passed with the turning from Middle Park Rd onto Shenley Fields Rd taken and then Gibbins Rd.
Please note that since the earlier post, reference to service 7C has been changed to 7 on the list of new routes.
It should also be noted that contrary to what was published earlier by TfWM, Stagecoach services on route 71 will NOT be a different route number.
So the talk of 71 being made into a 26 ; that's not happening now ?
Quote from: monkeyjoe on December 22, 2022, 07:15:07 PMSo the talk of 71 being made into a 26 ; that's not happening now ?
No.
Quote from: monkeyjoe on December 22, 2022, 07:15:07 PMSo the talk of 71 being made into a 26 ; that's not happening now ?
Its the Wolverhampton 26A being renumbered 26. I think it was put in the wrong place on the list.
26A – Wolverhampton to Stowlawn
From 1 January 2023, this service will be renumbered service 26 and will have a new timetable.
No. The reference to renumbering as 26 has been removed from the TfWM website.
I agree with the previous comment that the Wolves 26A is the one being renumbered 26.
Looks like SN63 KGJ/36948 is out route learning the new A9 today
Quote from: EK40 on December 28, 2022, 11:44:13 AMLooks like SN63 KGJ/36948 is out route learning the new A9 today
I saw a Stagecoach on the m6 going south in the last hour with a "recruiting bus drivers" sign on the front. Bustimes says it isn't this bus.
Are the services starting tomorrow? Stagecoach website says from 31st December
Quote from: Jack D on December 30, 2022, 07:23:04 PMAre the services starting tomorrow? Stagecoach website says from 31st December
1st January is when the contracts start.
Quote from: Jack D on December 30, 2022, 07:23:04 PMAre the services starting tomorrow? Stagecoach website says from 31st December
Stagecoach Warwickshire changes normally take place on a Saturday, so I guess that is why there is (an incorrect) reference to 31 December. As Stu says, it is actually 1 January.
The notice on the Service Updates page seems to be indecisive about the date of change! https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923 (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923)
---------------------------------------
Surprising as it may seem, Stagecoach has operated on the 169 road before. Between 1996 and 1998 it ran service 669 between Kings Heath and Shirley (Sainsburys) on tender to Centro. By sheer coincidence, as it was an emergency contract at first, the 669 was initially operated by Rugby garage too - just as the 169 will be.
Looks like Stagecoach buses on the new contracts aren't tracking on Bustimes yet
36427 & 36480 are in Kingshurst
36948 & 36952 are in Northfield
Quote from: Tony on January 01, 2023, 09:18:22 AMLooks like Stagecoach buses on the new contracts aren't tracking on Bustimes yet
36427 & 36480 are in Kingshurst
36948 & 36952 are in Northfield
They are tracking, but none have any route assigned to them:
https://bustimes.org/operators/stagecoach-northamptonshire/map
QuoteThey are tracking, but none have any route assigned to them:
https://bustimes.org/operators/stagecoach-northamptonshire/map
That's what I meant, nothing showing if you call the route up which I expected someone to think they weren't running
It appears that some of the Stagecoach timetables haven't been linked fully yet or uploaded. They are not showing on the TfWM website either.
Quote from: Justin Tyme on December 30, 2022, 08:49:34 PMStagecoach Warwickshire changes normally take place on a Saturday, so I guess that is why there is (an incorrect) reference to 31 December. As Stu says, it is actually 1 January.
The notice on the Service Updates page seems to be indecisive about the date of change! https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923 (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-28/11/2022-15:47:44:923)
---------------------------------------
Surprising as it may seem, Stagecoach has operated on the 169 road before. Between 1996 and 1998 it ran service 669 between Kings Heath and Shirley (Sainsburys) on tender to Centro. By sheer coincidence, as it was an emergency contract at first, the 669 was initially operated by Rugby garage too - just as the 169 will be.
I guess the previous operator had failed.
Was that the era of Caves or had they gone already?
Stagecoach Midlands is weird on bustimes anyway, as the only registrations they show is for the Northamptonshire part of the company. It's like they've merged two companies, but kept them on different registrations, which isn't reflected on bustimes.
Is there 2 or 3 buses on a9 today?
Quote from: Jack D on January 01, 2023, 10:59:18 AMIs there 2 or 3 buses on a9 today?
On bustimes I see one at Blythe Valley (36427), one by Clay Lane (36426) and one on Lea Hall Road (36951).
Quote from: Westy on January 01, 2023, 10:12:03 AMI guess the previous operator had failed.
Was that the era of Caves or had they gone already?
Caves ceased in 1999. I think it was Communicare/Buzzways that ran the 669 until giving it up at short notice in 1996.
It would appear that the 'new' 46 route is not fully replacing the 48 between QE Hospital and Northfield - as claimed by both NX and TfWM - but is only operating the route specified in the contract tender, essentially missing out Weoley Castle.
Quote from: Stu on January 01, 2023, 05:47:21 PMIt would appear that the 'new' 46 route is not fully replacing the 48 between QE Hospital and Northfield - as claimed by both NX and TfWM - but is only operating the route specified in the contract tender, essentially missing out Weoley Castle.
Yes the map has been on on bus times for a while now. Basically misses out the parts already served by the X21.
46 - Kings Heath - QE Hospital – Stagecoach Midlands – bustimes.org (https://bustimes.org/services/46-kings-heath-qe-hospital#map)
& There is another minor route change in the Kings Norton/Hawkesley area to. Where it is to use Foyle Road, Redditch Road, Wharf Road. Instead of Shannon Road, Masshouse Lane.
Quote from: 2206 on January 01, 2023, 06:09:36 PMYes the map has been on on bus times for a while now. Basically misses out the parts already served by the X21.
46 - Kings Heath - QE Hospital – Stagecoach Midlands – bustimes.org (https://bustimes.org/services/46-kings-heath-qe-hospital#map)
& There is another minor route change in the Kings Norton/Hawkesley area to. Where it is to use Foyle Road, Redditch Road, Wharf Road. Instead of Shannon Road, Masshouse Lane.
It's not available now on the TfWM website, but when I saw this before, their map showed the 46 going via Weoley Castle, same as the 48 did.
The change in Kings Norton to use Wharf Road is to accommodate the rerouting to Brandwood End.
Quote from: 2206 on January 01, 2023, 06:09:36 PMYes the map has been on on bus times for a while now. Basically misses out the parts already served by the X21.
46 - Kings Heath - QE Hospital – Stagecoach Midlands – bustimes.org (https://bustimes.org/services/46-kings-heath-qe-hospital#map)
& There is another minor route change in the Kings Norton/Hawkesley area to. Where it is to use Foyle Road, Redditch Road, Wharf Road. Instead of Shannon Road, Masshouse Lane.
Weoley Castle was missed out when route learning for the 46 took place just before Christmas. Regular services return to Shenley Fields Rd for the first time since the demise of the old 69.
I'll be interested to see whether the route through Northfield remains the same as it is now. I took a look today and, as the maps suggest, buses continued from Church Road across Bristol Rd South and the A38 onto Bell Hill rather than through the centre of Northfield. While the distances of the stops passengers must use from the centre are not huge, they are a bit more out of the way than before.
I caught the new 46 today for a few stops because well, why not! Everything was fine but the driver said that the card reader was not yet accepting nBus swift tickets so, as was to be expected, the reader decline it although the driver let me on anyway. I'm not sure if the problem is unique to that bus or whether the ticket machines haven't yet been configured to accept nBus tickets...
Quote from: bususer28 on January 02, 2023, 04:42:08 PMI caught the new 46 today for a few stops because well, why not! Everything was fine but the driver said that the card reader was not yet accepting nBus swift tickets so, as was to be expected, the reader decline it although the driver let me on anyway. I'm not sure if the problem is unique to that bus or whether the ticket machines haven't yet been configured to accept nBus tickets...
Probably the ticket machines need a software update; Stagecoach already operate services into Coventry so buses should be able to accept nBus Swift passes, however these vehicles being used are recent transfers from Manchester as previously noted by Tony.
Still, this is something that should have been sorted out before the vehicles entered active service.
The buses are coming from the rugby depot who I don't believe run anything else into the west midlands.
To get the machines configured they would need the coding data from Tfwm & well it's Christmas/new year isn't it so no doubt there's been a delay in receiving the data.
QuoteThe buses are coming from the rugby depot who I don't believe run anything else into the west midlands.
To get the machines configured they would need the coding data from Tfwm & well it's Christmas/new year isn't it so no doubt there's been a delay in receiving the data.
Rugby depot have run the 86 into the West Midlands for many years
Quote from: Steveminor on January 02, 2023, 09:58:35 PMThe buses are coming from the rugby depot who I don't believe run anything else into the west midlands.
To get the machines configured they would need the coding data from Tfwm & well it's Christmas/new year isn't it so no doubt there's been a delay in receiving the data.
A cursory glance around the various Stagecoach operations on bustimes indicated virtually no, or nil Nuneaton based buses showing any service information whatsoever (but buses tracking); the same for the handful in Birmingham; some Leamington and some Rugby vehicles showing service information. Hopefully their info will be fixed before too long!!!
Interesting to hear a suite of new Stagecoach radio adverts airing across West Midlands radio stations. No mention specifically of the new tendered services, but generic Stagecoach bus and ticket info.
The last time Stagecoach made any real attempt with radio campaigns was late 90s on Mercia FM.
Quote from: Wumpty on January 03, 2023, 07:48:16 AMInteresting to hear a suite of new Stagecoach radio adverts airing across West Midlands radio stations. No mention specifically of the new tendered services, but generic Stagecoach bus and ticket info.
The last time Stagecoach made any real attempt with radio campaigns was late 90s on Mercia FM.
It'll be interesting to see which frequencies those ads are on.
I guess they are only on Birmingham & Coventry Dab & Fm as there's no point
on the Wolves Dab & Fm?
QuoteInteresting to hear a suite of new Stagecoach radio adverts airing across West Midlands radio stations. No mention specifically of the new tendered services, but generic Stagecoach bus and ticket info.
The last time Stagecoach made any real attempt with radio campaigns was late 90s on Mercia FM.
Which station out of interest?
I caught a Stagecoach Rugby A9 for the first time this morning.
Drivers changed over in Solihull and cash box stays with driver when they change over & card reader on the bus wasn't working at all.
The relief Driver followed normal route to the Journeys End then went the wrong way. Turned from Woodcock Lane North into Clay Lane then back down Barn Lane, were it reversed into Amberley Road, then followed the 58 route back the Journeys End, where it again went the wrong way, down Clay Lane and Bosworth Road then down Linclon Road North, where it again reversed into Pierce Avenue to go back. Then back down 58 route up to the Swan. The third time it came past the Journeys End an elderly woman hailed it to ask, why she'd seen 3 buses go towards Kingshurst and non towards Solihull. Probably the first time he's drove this route I guess.
Was weird travelling down Lode Lane to on a Stagecoach bus, on the same road I travelled down on 7527 only a short while before. Was 36948 operating the 9.00 from Blythe Valley.
Also theres a D1/D2/D3 branded bus that went through Solihull a few times earlier, a long way from Daventry. I take it was on 169.
It is a bit of a shame as well the excellent £1 pre 9.30 concession fare Landflight/NX have will have ceased on the 58 with change of operator.
Does anybody know why the 69 was renumbered to 169? Is there a point behind it?
Quote from: Westy on January 03, 2023, 10:38:39 AMIt'll be interesting to see which frequencies those ads are on.
I guess they are only on Birmingham & Coventry Dab & Fm as there's no point
on the Wolves Dab & Fm?
Quote from: the trainbasher on January 03, 2023, 10:52:43 AMWhich station out of interest?
Currently playing on Greatest Hits radio across Brum 105.2FM, across Black Country & Shropshire on 107.7/107.4FM as fillers and all DAB.
Due to launch, if not already on Capital, Heart & Smooth across the Midlands.
Quote from: Wumpty on January 03, 2023, 11:34:13 AMCurrently playing on Greatest Hits radio across Brum 105.2FM, across Black Country & Shropshire on 107.7/107.4FM as fillers and all DAB.
Due to launch, if not already on Capital, Heart & Smooth across the Midlands.
As Stagecoach currently have no routes outside Brum & Coventry, I'm surprised ad time was bought on the Wolves/Shropshire transmitters!
Quote from: Westy on January 03, 2023, 03:30:08 PMAs Stagecoach currently have no routes outside Brum & Coventry, I'm surprised ad time was bought on the Wolves/Shropshire transmitters!
They wouldn't necessarily buy airtime for BC&S - if there's a timing gap and the Stagecoach ad fits (e.g. 36" gap and it's a 34-36" ad, and it's a neighbour fit station, then they'll drop it in. Bearing in mind that their definition of the Black Country stretches as far down as the Halesowen/M5 J3 border!).
Saying that, they could've dropped this as an add-on for £XXX as a way to sell slow airtime.
Quote from: MasterPlan on January 03, 2023, 11:19:39 AMDoes anybody know why the 69 was renumbered to 169? Is there a point behind it?
Probably to differentiate it from the withdrawn 69, as the route is not quite the same.
I'm baffled as to why TfWM chose this though, especially considering all the moves in recent years to 'simplify' route numbers.
Quote from: Stu on January 03, 2023, 06:40:59 PMProbably to differentiate it from the withdrawn 69, as the route is not quite the same.
I'm baffled as to why TfWM chose this though, especially considering all the moves in recent years to 'simplify' route numbers.
They were going to renumber it the '25' but I glared at them too much.
Looks like the drivers are struggling on the 46. I think there's a closure on Redhill Rd which doesn't help, so diverting around it is probably difficult as they don't know the area well.
https://bustimes.org/services/46-kings-heath-qe-hospital/vehicles?date=2023-01-04#journeys/362076320
Most of the Stagecoach E200s are in the new livery. It's very strange to see them come past my house on the new A9. Local bus stop signs in Olton still say 58.
It's been 3 days in a row where the 7:26 A9 to illshaw heath hasn't turned up. Had to wait an hour for the next bus.
Seen on the TFWM website when you look at the A9 timetable it has a warning that due to driver availability that services could be cancelled at short notice. Mentions all the new Birmingham and Solihull routes and the 51 and 7 Coventry Route. They have not even been running it a week!. Shouldn't be mega surprised, my sister has had more bus no shows on the 87/88 getting to Knowle under stagecoach than Johnsons and Diamond.
https://legacy.wmnetwork.co.uk/plan-your-journey/find-a-timetable/#/route/cen_390A9_%20_H_y11_1-1
It's strange how stagecoach still took these 3 new routes even though they were struggling to cope with driver shortage already.
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 06, 2023, 10:06:30 PMIt's strange how stagecoach still took these 3 new routes even though they were struggling to cope with driver shortage already.
Wonder if its anything to do with the new owners trying to gain new opportunities without knowing how many drivers they have
Quote from: Wumpty on January 03, 2023, 03:35:01 PMThey wouldn't necessarily buy airtime for BC&S - if there's a timing gap and the Stagecoach ad fits (e.g. 36" gap and it's a 34-36" ad, and it's a neighbour fit station, then they'll drop it in. Bearing in mind that their definition of the Black Country stretches as far down as the Halesowen/M5 J3 border!).
Saying that, they could've dropped this as an add-on for £XXX as a way to sell slow airtime.
Are we sure this isn't a national campaign? The Stagecoach ads are on radio in the south east also, majoring on the £2 max single fare and quoting the Government initiative to assist with the cost of living.
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 06, 2023, 10:06:30 PMIt's strange how stagecoach still took these 3 new routes even though they were struggling to cope with driver shortage already.
Presumably the resources were already available from Rugby - at the end of the day its M6 J1 to J4 running dead, not a massive length (although obviously that could be subject to delays when there's disruption).
Quote from: don on January 06, 2023, 10:57:19 PMPresumably the resources were already available from Rugby - at the end of the day its M6 J1 to J4 running dead, not a massive length (although obviously that could be subject to delays when there's disruption).
The ones I've looked at on bustimes have ran up the a45 to m42 j6 when coming from Rugby.
QuoteThe ones I've looked at on bustimes have ran up the a45 to m42 j6 when coming from Rugby.
I believe the drivers have been told they cannot use the M6
Has anyone seen how they're doing driver changeovers? I know Nuneaton have got buses constantly running out of service between Nuneaton and Coventry. I can't imagine any other way than doing the same between Rugby and Birmingham.
Quote from: ellspurs on January 07, 2023, 03:07:03 PMHas anyone seen how they're doing driver changeovers? I know Nuneaton have got buses constantly running out of service between Nuneaton and Coventry. I can't imagine any other way than doing the same between Rugby and Birmingham.
There's a Ford Transit minibus which is almost always parked in Solihull Station. Presumably used to ferry drivers in between depot and Solihull and remains parked for drivers to use during breaks.
Quote from: MW on January 07, 2023, 03:10:05 PMThere's a Ford Transit minibus which is almost always parked in Solihull Station. Presumably used to ferry drivers in between depot and Solihull and remains parked for drivers to use during breaks.
That's highly likely. I believe Diamond used to do something similar at one time.
Quote from: MW on January 07, 2023, 03:10:05 PMThere's a Ford Transit minibus which is almost always parked in Solihull Station. Presumably used to ferry drivers in between depot and Solihull and remains parked for drivers to use during breaks.
Having been in Solihull this time last week I can confirm that is exactly what it's used for....
QuoteThere's a Ford Transit minibus which is almost always parked in Solihull Station. Presumably used to ferry drivers in between depot and Solihull and remains parked for drivers to use during breaks.
What about for 41/46 since they don't go solihull
Quote from: BBS on January 07, 2023, 07:13:27 PMWhat about for 41/46 since they don't go solihull
Driver could do 169 Change at kings heath do 46 & change again at qe to do 41 at qe have 30 min break there
Or possibly there's another minibus at Queen Elizabeth Hospital. Has anyone seen one kicking around there?
Quote from: ellspurs on January 08, 2023, 09:13:51 AMOr possibly there's another minibus at Queen Elizabeth Hospital. Has anyone seen one kicking around there?
True
Nothing tracking in Birmingham today apart from 2 A9
Quote from: Jack D on January 08, 2023, 12:27:01 PMNothing tracking in Birmingham today apart from 2 A9
One on 46
Quote from: Jack D on January 08, 2023, 12:27:01 PMNothing tracking in Birmingham today apart from 2 A9
Probably not running. They seem to be having some teething problems.
Quote from: Jack D on January 08, 2023, 12:27:01 PMNothing tracking in Birmingham today apart from 2 A9
2 on the 46 now, one in service, another is parked up on the A45 by Birmingham Aiport
Quote from: don on January 06, 2023, 10:57:19 PMAre we sure this isn't a national campaign? The Stagecoach ads are on radio in the south east also, majoring on the £2 max single fare and quoting the Government initiative to assist with the cost of living.
Potentially - unsure of who their ad agency is - though they do seem to be concentrating in certain areas, with some non-target overspill into other TSA's.
I hope it is bad tracking, but on both Bustimes and Stagecoach's own tracker there's currently only 1 bus on the 41, 2 on the 46 and 3 on the A9
Quote from: Tony on January 09, 2023, 09:15:04 AMI hope it is bad tracking, but on both Bustimes and Stagecoach's own tracker there's currently only 1 bus on the 41, 2 on the 46 and 3 on the A9
There's 4 tracking on the A9 now + 2 on the 169
QuoteThere's 4 tracking on the A9 now + 2 on the 169
The forth one just came from Rugby and should have done the 09:33 from Kingshurst so the 'twirlies' at Kingshurst have a long wait. The one bus that was on the 41 has just parked up at the hospital and not done the 08:55 departure like it should have done so currently no buses on the 41
The 46 now showing on the TfWM app as stopping at Weoley Castle Square for some reason even though it doesn't come round here.
Not only that, 48 has been replaced with 46 at bus stop flags.
Stagecoach have tweeted that there are several journeys on the 41 not running today due to "circumstances beyond their control". Not the best for an hourly service.
Quote from: BMJ1970 on January 09, 2023, 10:44:24 AMStagecoach have tweeted that there are several journeys on the 41 not running today due to "circumstances beyond their control". Not the best for an hourly service.
Makes you wonder if they have bitten off more then they can chew with the new tenders being ran from rugby
Quote from: BMJ1970 on January 09, 2023, 10:44:24 AMStagecoach have tweeted that there are several journeys on the 41 not running today due to "circumstances beyond their control". Not the best for an hourly service.
At least the Bus Service 'Improvement' Plan (BSIP) funding should last abit longer...
One of the buses was missing a panel on its nearside behind the front wheel, I think it was 36425.
Quote from: Tony on January 09, 2023, 09:15:04 AMI hope it is bad tracking, but on both Bustimes and Stagecoach's own tracker there's currently only 1 bus on the 41, 2 on the 46 and 3 on the A9
There was nothing tracking on the 71 yesterday when I checked.
However looking now at the history, it shows 36950 as operating half the journeys, though there is no map data available, so presumably this vehicle is not reporting location data:
https://bustimes.org/vehicles/scnh-36950?date=2023-01-08
I don't live on or use the route, so I don't know if there was actually another vehicle out which wasn't tracking at all.
36950 has operated journeys on the A9 today.
I know it's still early days, and that some of these tenders were awarded at short notice, but surely operators should not be bidding on contracts that they don't have the resources to operate.
It is pretty poor on Stagecoach's part that less than a week into operating these new contracts, they are missing out journeys already due to driver shortages or "circumstances beyond our control". And yes, I know these services require subsidy because they are not commercially viable due to low patronage, but still, its not leaving a good impression on the few people who do indeed rely on these services.
On Saturday afternoon, I was planning on travelling to Solihull, and I thought I'd give the 169 a try, as it is actually the route that stops closest to my home, though when it was the 69 it only ran about four times a day and was finished before 3pm so was little use to me. Before leaving the house, I checked the timetable, and then found out that journey wasn't running. Well, I wasn't going to sit around for another hour to wait for the next one, so I walked down Trittiford Road to get the 76 instead (as I would normally do if going into Shirley or Solihull for anything). So before I even stepped on board this service for the first time, I didn't have a very good first impression.
I hope it is the case that Stagecoach receive a pro-rata deduction from the subsidy paid to them by TfWM for the journeys they fail to operate, because I would be angry if taxpayers money is being given to big private companies like Stagecoach who fail to provide the service they're being funded to operate.
Quote from: Stu on January 09, 2023, 07:24:16 PMThere was nothing tracking on the 71 yesterday when I checked.
However looking now at the history, it shows 36950 as operating half the journeys, though there is no map data available, so presumably this vehicle is not reporting location data:
https://bustimes.org/vehicles/scnh-36950?date=2023-01-08
I don't live on or use the route, so I don't know if there was actually another vehicle out which wasn't tracking at all.
36950 has operated journeys on the A9 today.
I know it's still early days, and that some of these tenders were awarded at short notice, but surely operators should not be bidding on contracts that they don't have the resources to operate.
It is pretty poor on Stagecoach's part that less than a week into operating these new contracts, they are missing out journeys already due to driver shortages or "circumstances beyond our control". And yes, I know these services require subsidy because they are not commercially viable due to low patronage, but still, its not leaving a good impression on the few people who do indeed rely on these services.
On Saturday afternoon, I was planning on travelling to Solihull, and I thought I'd give the 169 a try, as it is actually the route that stops closest to my home, though when it was the 69 it only ran about four times a day and was finished before 3pm so was little use to me. Before leaving the house, I checked the timetable, and then found out that journey wasn't running. Well, I wasn't going to sit around for another hour to wait for the next one, so I walked down Trittiford Road to get the 76 instead (as I would normally do if going into Shirley or Solihull for anything). So before I even stepped on board this service for the first time, I didn't have a very good first impression.
I hope it is the case that Stagecoach receive a pro-rata deduction from the subsidy paid to them by TfWM for the journeys they fail to operate, because I would be angry if taxpayers money is being given to big private companies like Stagecoach who fail to provide the service they're being funded to operate.
TFWM get automated reporting - so they won't be paid for journeys not operating.
What is more concerning is the long term damage they are doing to the passenger volumes on these services. There will be passengers lost to other modes of transport on a daily basis
QuoteTFWM get automated reporting - so they won't be paid for journeys not operating.
What is more concerning is the long term damage they are doing to the passenger volumes on these services. There will be passengers lost to other modes of transport on a daily basis
Yes, If the tracking is correct then there was a 6 hour gap in services on the 41. One of my colleagues son was waiting for the 46 this morning and there was definitely two consecutive buses missing on there creating a 90 minute gap in the service
Does anyone know how long these tender routes are contracted for?
Quote from: Tony on January 09, 2023, 07:58:13 PMYes, If the tracking is correct then there was a 6 hour gap in services on the 41. One of my colleagues son was waiting for the 46 this morning and there was definitely two consecutive buses missing on there creating a 90 minute gap in the service
Last week this was the case on the A9.
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 09, 2023, 07:58:53 PMDoes anyone know how long these tender routes are contracted for?
Normally 3 to 5 years but I'm sure someone has a definitive answer.
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 09, 2023, 08:01:10 PMLast week this was the case on the A9.
Same today with the A9. Gaps of an hour plus. It's a busy service but won't be for much longer
I had rides on the 46 and 169 today. One journey was on time, the other two were 5-10 mins late. I could see that there were gaps on the 46 and the A9 this morning, and Enviro 200 36952 travelled from Rugby to take up service on the 41 from QE Hospital at 1200.
I asked drivers how they were getting on after a week, and they said they knew the routes but drivers were not always turning up for work. That can make them late getting back to base at the end of a shift if a bus they rely on to return to Rugby is not running. There is a mix of agency and "native" Rugby depot drivers.
Not surprisingly loadings were low - just six passengers altogether on a lunchtime 46 from the QE to Kings Heath.
Quote from: metrocity on January 09, 2023, 07:54:17 PMTFWM get automated reporting - so they won't be paid for journeys not operating.
What is more concerning is the long term damage they are doing to the passenger volumes on these services. There will be passengers lost to other modes of transport on a daily basis
Exactly. Operators awarded these contracts should be doing what they can to increase passenger volumes, and thus increase their revenues, which would make those services more viable and not reliant on subsidies.
Losing the few existing passengers these routes currently attract just ends up making them even more unviable.
Quote from: metrocity on January 09, 2023, 08:42:24 PMSame today with the A9. Gaps of an hour plus. It's a busy service but won't be for much longer
The Solihull - Journeys End/ The Lyndon - Yarldey bit which is the traditional 58 bit is busy paticularly. Driver said 7.26 ex Kingshurst had 40 people on this morning at one point on Lode Lane and is busy with people going into Solihull/Lode Heath school kids etc.
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on January 09, 2023, 11:17:45 AMMakes you wonder if they have bitten off more then they can chew with the new tenders being ran from rugby
SC have tweeted this am that a no of 41 & 46 services will not run today. "due too circumstances beyond .........."
Stagecoach Midlands (@StagecoachMids) / Twitter (https://twitter.com/stagecoachmids)
Quote from: Sandy Lane on January 10, 2023, 09:24:04 AMSC have tweeted this am that a no of 41 & 46 services will not run today. "due too circumstances beyond .........."
Stagecoach Midlands (@StagecoachMids) / Twitter (https://twitter.com/stagecoachmids)
At this stage you have to wonder what
is under their control.
QuoteSC have tweeted this am that a no of 41 & 46 services will not run today. "due too circumstances beyond .........."
Stagecoach Midlands (@StagecoachMids) / Twitter (https://twitter.com/stagecoachmids)
Only one bus showing on the 169 as well
It seems as though all there drivers have gone to drive the A9 as all the A9 routes seem to be running normal today with no vehicles missing.
Would it not be easier to sub contract the routes till they have enough drivers/ a depot in brum
Card readers seem to be rejecting nBus tickets once again, at least on the 46 anyway. They did work for a short while at the end of last week so who knows what's going on!
Stagecoach's twitter feed is just full of "Due to circumstances beyond our control the following services will not be running:"
Quote from: ellspurs on January 10, 2023, 04:46:01 PMStagecoach's twitter feed is just full of "Due to circumstances beyond our control the following services will not be running:"
Circumstances are fully within Stagecoach's control.
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on January 10, 2023, 10:04:03 AMWould it not be easier to sub contract the routes till they have enough drivers/ a depot in brum
Or not bid on work they cannot operate
I know its been only just over a week since they took over these services, but how long would it take TfWM to deem Stagecoach in breach of their contract terms and conditions and retender these contracts?
I'm not saying I want this to happen of course. I do hope that Stagecoach get their act together fairly soon and sort things out, but I hope that whoever is responsible for bidding on these contracts is held accountable and takes ownership of the issues in order to get them resolved.
QuoteI know its been only just over a week since they took over these services, but how long would it take TfWM to deem Stagecoach in breach of their contract terms and conditions and retender these contracts?
I'm not saying I want this to happen of course. I do hope that Stagecoach get their act together fairly soon and sort things out, but I hope that whoever is responsible for bidding on these contracts is held accountable and takes ownership of the issues in order to get them resolved.
I bet the person in Stockport has never heard of places like Kingshurst
Quote from: Steveminor on January 10, 2023, 06:38:18 PMOr not bid on work they cannot operate
...or awarded to a local operator with a much smaller "dead mileage carbon footprint".
Last A9 to kingshurst didn't run
Quote from: Tony on January 10, 2023, 06:59:36 PMI bet the person in Stockport has never heard of places like Kingshurst
I bet the person in Stockport isn't very popular with Stagecoach Midlands management...
The whole situation with Stagecoach running tendered services in Birmingham is a joke. It's farcical to be running buses dead from Rugby to the QE Hospital to take up service, and even worse that they're completely unable to fulfil their contractual commitments.
NX's performance with driver shortages hasn't been ideal, but some of the gaps reported in Stagecoach services is outrageous.
I wish Landflight had got the A9, I have used their services alot since moving to Solihull and they are generally pretty reliable, drivers nice and buses clean. They do some lovely routes, like the one to Wythall is my favourite. I have no idea if they bid for it but I personally feel they would have done a better job than the shambles stagecoach have run and we are only 10 days or so in!!
It would just make sense a Solihull based company running a route that mostly covers Solihull. The drivers would know the area well, the A7/A8 covers Blythe Valley and A10 runs into North Solihull on weekdays.
Quote from: Mike K on January 10, 2023, 08:16:13 PMThe whole situation with Stagecoach running tendered services in Birmingham is a joke. It's farcical to be running buses dead from Rugby to the QE Hospital to take up service, and even worse that they're completely unable to fulfil their contractual commitments.
NX's performance with driver shortages hasn't been ideal, but some of the gaps reported in Stagecoach services is outrageous.
Is it about time HRH the W. Midlands Mayor stepped in and kicked some butts? Last week I think someone said the Mayor was on the telly supporting Avanti trains yet their service has been 5 star cr** so what chance with the buses!!!
The ourcome of the tenders say stagecoach put a "Package Bid" in for the routes so they must have known what they was bidding for so would have thought they would have had the plans to cover it in place
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on January 10, 2023, 10:57:47 PMThe ourcome of the tenders say stagecoach put a "Package Bid" in for the routes so they must have known what they was bidding for so would have thought they would have had the plans to cover it in place
If you look at the A9 tender outcome, you will notice that Stagecoach were awarded it at the price of £14,500, but this wasn't the lowest price. The lowest price appears to be £14,200.
Stagecoach were only awarded the 41/46/169/A9 because they're overall "package" was slightly cheaper than the individual bids.
I wonder who the slightly cheaper £14,200 bid was from...
Quote from: MW on January 10, 2023, 11:07:32 PMIf you look at the A9 tender outcome, you will notice that Stagecoach were awarded it at the price of £14,500, but this wasn't the lowest price. The lowest price appears to be £14,200.
Stagecoach were only awarded the 41/46/169/A9 because they're overall "package" was slightly cheaper than the individual bids.
I wonder who the slightly cheaper £14,200 bid was from
£14,500 is probably their monthly hotel bill for housing the drivers they have drafted in from the across the country to oversee this debacle
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on January 10, 2023, 10:57:47 PMThe ourcome of the tenders say stagecoach put a "Package Bid" in for the routes so they must have known what they was bidding for so would have thought they would have had the plans to cover it in place
What does package bid mean?
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 11, 2023, 07:12:24 AMWhat does package bid mean?
Basically the overall cost is discounted if multiple tenders are awarded
Dissapointed with stagecoachs performance operating these routes. Only 2 weeks and theirs gaps which NX didn't even have even though they have the driver shortage. Stagecoach shouldn't have got these routes in the first place because their "Out of control" situation was still there. They just added more pressure to themselves.
Quote from: BBS on January 11, 2023, 04:37:46 PMDissapointed with stagecoachs performance operating these routes. Only 2 weeks and theirs gaps which NX didn't even have even though they have the driver shortage. Stagecoach shouldn't have got these routes in the first place because their "Out of control" situation was still there. They just added more pressure to themselves.
Agreed but presumably TfWM were assured they did have the human resources to meet the contract requirements. If this problem persists, presumably there's a clause allowing for an early termination of the contract and the routes being retendered.
QuoteAgreed but presumably TfWM were assured they did have the human resources to meet the contract requirements. If this problem persists, presumably there's a clause allowing for an early termination of the contract and the routes being retendered.
If things don't improve April's tenders might be interesting
QuoteIf things don't improve April's tenders might be interesting
Hopefully NX retain the 41 as now I'm paying extra just to get home everyday 🤣
QuoteHopefully NX retain the 41 as now I'm paying extra just to get home everyday 🤣
How can NX retain the 41 when
a) They currently don't operate it.
b) It has only just been awarded so isn't in the April round of tenders.
QuoteHow can NX retain the 41 when
a) They currently don't operate it.
b) It has only just been awarded so isn't in the April round of tenders.
But if stagecoach are unable to operate it because of driver shortage what will happen?
QuoteBut if stagecoach are unable to operate it because of driver shortage what will happen?
I am amazed Stagecoach are as bad as they are. They found hundreds of Drivers willing to drive in Birmingham for the Commonwealth games, I am sure some of them would probably come back if offered the chance, but this looks more like Stockport making a complete mess of bidding on prices that would work with local drivers and thinking there was a plentiful supply of agency drivers to cover in the meantime, and there isn't.
Quote from: Tony on January 11, 2023, 08:40:14 PMI am amazed Stagecoach are as bad as they are. They found hundreds of Drivers willing to drive in Birmingham for the Commonwealth games, I am sure some of them would probably come back if offered the chance, but this looks more like Stockport making a complete mess of bidding on prices that would work with local drivers and thinking there was a plentiful supply of agency drivers to cover in the meantime, and there isn't.
According to the grapevine, a Central Birmingham base is imminent
Quote from: Tony on January 11, 2023, 08:40:14 PMI am amazed Stagecoach are as bad as they are. They found hundreds of Drivers willing to drive in Birmingham for the Commonwealth games, I am sure some of them would probably come back if offered the chance, but this looks more like Stockport making a complete mess of bidding on prices that would work with local drivers and thinking there was a plentiful supply of agency drivers to cover in the meantime, and there isn't.
This might be me, but looking at it, Diamond seemed to win quite a few new services and yet they have the buses and drivers to operate them. I can only assume that Diamond ensured all of this before they bid, you have to ask the question, why didn't Stagecoach.
If you are trying to break into a new area, then surely you need to make a mega effort to ensure that you can operate all the services and to time. If the nearest garage is miles away and you are already experiencing problems with a driver shortage, then surely the logical thing to do is to not bid!
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 11, 2023, 09:34:42 PMDiamond seemed to win quite a few new services and yet they have the buses and drivers to operate them. I can only assume that Diamond ensured all of this before they bid, you have to ask the question, why didn't Stagecoach.
I presume Leamington is short of drivers as well, with all the ex Diamond Stratford routes now there to? I would have thought it would be nearer to Solihull/Blythe Valley at least, as Rugby is the other side of Coventry.There often seems to be a lot cancellations listed for Leamington ran services on the twitter page to.
diamond also lost some services I think with several service not retendered, commercial 94 withdrawn, Birmingham - Hamstead down is down from 2022 at every 20 minutes, and the 25/600 reduced from 2 to 1 pvr, 69 lost to stagecoach.
Presumably where some of the buses/drivers came from.
Quote from: Tony on January 11, 2023, 08:40:14 PMI am amazed Stagecoach are as bad as they are. They found hundreds of Drivers willing to drive in Birmingham for the Commonwealth games, I am sure some of them would probably come back if offered the chance, but this looks more like Stockport making a complete mess of bidding on prices that would work with local drivers and thinking there was a plentiful supply of agency drivers to cover in the meantime, and there isn't.
If the Stagecoach terms were as generous as with First at the 2012 Olympics - good pay rate, paid breaks, food allowance, free accommodation, cushy shuttle runs not having to transport the riff raff around, etc - then that is why they had plenty of driving volunteers for the Commonwealth Games.
I guess the thought of driving round the suburbs of the West Midlands is less enticing, particularly as I'd assume the duties would be rather long taking into account travelling time from the depot.
Another stellar start to the day - more unforeseen circumstances for SC and those needing to get to hospital/work/school!
When WILL TfWM step in on this car crash?Screenshot_2023-01-12-06-42-02-82_0b2fce7a16bf2b728d6ffa28c8d60efb.jpg Screenshot_2023-01-12-06-42-02-82_0b2fce7a16bf2b728d6ffa28c8d60efb.jpg
There seems to be an increase in the number of withdrawals each day
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 12, 2023, 07:22:40 AMThere seems to be an increase in the number of withdrawals each day
But thankfully, all Leamington and Stratford services are out and running :rolleyes:
Quote from: Wumpty on January 12, 2023, 06:46:16 AMAnother stellar start to the day - more unforeseen circumstances for SC and those needing to get to hospital/work/school!
When WILL TfWM step in on this car crash?Screenshot_2023-01-12-06-42-02-82_0b2fce7a16bf2b728d6ffa28c8d60efb.jpg (https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=4107;type=preview;file) Screenshot_2023-01-12-06-42-02-82_0b2fce7a16bf2b728d6ffa28c8d60efb.jpg (https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=4107;type=preview;file)
At the TDC meeting on 9th January, TFWM representives said they had been assured there would be a signfiicant improvement in Stagecoach performance from the following day (Tuesday). It appears to have got worse!
If TFWM dont step in soon then future bids from other operators for these contracts will increase substantially as the passenger volumes will be alot less given the damage this will have caused.
Quote from: Wumpty on January 12, 2023, 07:31:18 AMBut thankfully, all Leamington and Stratford services are out and running :rolleyes:
It's says everything when they tweet just to say services in them particular towns are operating as scheduled!. They make diamond look like world beaters in bus travel :grin:
Quote from: metrocity on January 12, 2023, 07:34:33 AMAt the TDC meeting on 9th January, TFWM representives said they had been assured there would be a signfiicant improvement in Stagecoach performance from the following day (Tuesday). It appears to have got worse!
If TFWM dont step in soon then future bids from other operators for these contracts will increase substantially as the passenger volumes will be alot less given the damage this will have caused.
What we dont know if this ridiculous situation if being dictated by central government to get more 'competition' in the West Mids despite the damage it is causing. If correct this will explain why HRH the West Mids Mayor is ducking this one and keeping stum. The mayor should be kicking ass big style - it is a disgrace and makes TfWM look stupid.
Rugby is 38 mins & Leamington Spa is 30 minutes to Solihull so not that far to come
Quote from: Solo1 on January 12, 2023, 09:27:04 AMRugby is 38 mins & Leamington Spa is 30 minutes to Solihull so not that far to come
What about Nuneaton
It's all well and good wanting TfWM to step in, but step in and do what ?, NX haven't got the drivers which is why they withdrew the routes and same could be said for other operators, so I can't see any other way of getting these routes covered.
QuoteRugby is 38 mins & Leamington Spa is 30 minutes to Solihull so not that far to come
It takes much longer than 38 minutes to get from Rugby to Solihull, you struggle to get from Coventry in 38 min!
Quote from: Tony on January 12, 2023, 10:14:42 AMIt takes much longer than 38 minutes to get from Rugby to Solihull, you struggle to get from Coventry in 38 min!
If you look at bustimes dead running is taking in excess of an hour each direction
Quote from: Sandy Lane on January 12, 2023, 09:03:51 AMWhat we dont know if this ridiculous situation if being dictated by central government to get more 'competition' in the West Mids despite the damage it is causing. If correct this will explain why HRH the West Mids Mayor is ducking this one and keeping stum. The mayor should be kicking ass big style - it is a disgrace and makes TfWM look stupid.
Probably more that Stagecoach thought "here's an opportunity to win tenders" after seeing the demise of Claribels and Johnsons Excelbus. TfWM were probably happy to see Stagecoach throw its hat into the ring, because more operators bidding for contracts ought to mean lower bid prices.
I wonder what will happen next - and how soon?
Quote from: Justin Tyme on January 12, 2023, 10:48:34 AMProbably more that Stagecoach thought "here's an opportunity to win tenders" after seeing the demise of Claribels and Johnsons Excelbus. TfWM were probably happy to see Stagecoach throw its hat into the ring, because more operators bidding for contracts ought to mean lower bid prices.
I wonder what will happen next - and how soon?
To add to that, I would imagine the relationship between Stagecoach and TFWM has been strengthened last year due to to working closely together for the Commonwealth Games. Stagecoach will also want to accelerate the business in other areas with the loss of Manchester operations.
Even with Stagecoach bidding for tenders, the number of bidders is still an issue for TFWM. A number of tenders in the last round only had one bidder.
10.30 A9 from Whitefields Road kicked the few passengers on it off in Solihull. The driver was on the phone for a few minutes before saying "what am I supposed to do, i've got passengers on".
More abysmal performance from Stagecoach. I doubt NX would have been this bad.
Quote from: Tony on January 12, 2023, 10:14:42 AMIt takes much longer than 38 minutes to get from Rugby to Solihull, you struggle to get from Coventry in 38 min!
I looked on aa route finder for the info
QuoteI looked on aa route finder for the info
Google is currently saying the fastest route is 54 minutes in a car and using the Motorway
Looks like anyone on the 41 route may have had a long wait.
First bus tracking wasn't until 13:00
Quote from: Tony on January 12, 2023, 02:42:13 PMGoogle is currently saying the fastest route is 54 minutes in a car and using the Motorway
And we know that they take the a45 from Rugby to Solihull which is slower
in a car.
https://bustimes.org/vehicles/scmn-36485?date=2023-01-12#journeys/366253430
This took an hour.
I was in Moseley Village last night (approx 00:45) and seen a Stagecoach vehicle running dead. Figured it was coming off the 46. The route it took back to depot was most interesting as I saw it on the A435 in the Village heading towards City. It obviously went on to the A45 via the Ring Road.
https://bustimes.org/services/46-kings-heath-qe-hospital/vehicles?date=2023-01-11#journeys/366190133
I would have thought M42 and A45 would have been far quicker. I've heard they're not allowed to use the motorway since.
Anyway, looks like it took that driver 1 hour to get back and that was past midnight. The buses that finish earlier in the evening must be around 1hr 20 mins in some cases.
Quote from: Tony on January 12, 2023, 02:48:06 PMLooks like anyone on the 41 route may have had a long wait.
First bus tracking wasn't until 13:00
The 41 has been like that the last few days.
Why do they keep saying "unforeseen circumstances", the point is the driver shortage isn't unforeseen, it has been going on since well before Stagecoach bid for these services.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 12, 2023, 03:29:35 PMWhy do they keep saying "unforeseen circumstances", the point is the driver shortage isn't unforeseen, it has been going on since well before Stagecoach bid for these services.
Could it be drivers refusing to do the routes more then a shortage
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on January 12, 2023, 03:30:27 PMCould it be drivers refusing to do the routes more then a shortage
Possibly......
On the other twitters (Stagecoach East Midlands as an example) it does just say "due to a driver shortage".
I guess since they're a new operator on these services they didn't think it would look right to take over a service and then immediately go "due to driver shortage".
On the Leamington/Stratford front, in the first few days of the year they were showing a lot of "unforeseen circumstances" tweets, probably to get a full roster on the new services.
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 12, 2023, 03:29:35 PMWhy do they keep saying "unforeseen circumstances", the point is the driver shortage isn't unforeseen, it has been going on since well before Stagecoach bid for these services.
So you and the public give them sympathy.
QuoteLooks like anyone on the 41 route may have had a long wait.
First bus tracking wasn't until 13:00
Yeah, had to walk all the way from Acocks green to formans road today. Quite disappointed
QuoteYeah, had to walk all the way from Acocks green to formans road today. Quite disappointed
Could have just caught the 1 and walked down one of the many roads that link Shaftmoor Lane and Foremans Road
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 12, 2023, 03:29:35 PMWhy do they keep saying "unforeseen circumstances", the point is the driver shortage isn't unforeseen, it has been going on since well before Stagecoach bid for these services.
Probably the booked driver phoned in sick or failed to show up for some other reason.
Quote from: MW on January 12, 2023, 03:02:28 PMI was in Moseley Village last night (approx 00:45) and seen a Stagecoach vehicle running dead. Figured it was coming off the 46. The route it took back to depot was most interesting as I saw it on the A435 in the Village heading towards City. It obviously went on to the A45 via the Ring Road.
https://bustimes.org/services/46-kings-heath-qe-hospital/vehicles?date=2023-01-11#journeys/366190133
I would have thought M42 and A45 would have been far quicker. I've heard they're not allowed to use the motorway since.
Anyway, looks like it took that driver 1 hour to get back and that was past midnight. The buses that finish earlier in the evening must be around 1hr 20 mins in some cases.
Interesting. So with 10 driving hours available, 30% are spent on dead running - meaning additional drivers are required which they havent got !
QuoteCould have just caught the 1 and walked down one of the many roads that link Shaftmoor Lane and Foremans Road
Was tight on time, i checked the 1 but coudnt wait 23 minutes for it
Quote from: Stuharris 6360 on January 12, 2023, 03:29:35 PMWhy do they keep saying "unforeseen circumstances", the point is the driver shortage isn't unforeseen, it has been going on since well before Stagecoach bid for these services.
Driver shortage will be one challenge, but there are other possibilities.
I gather from elsewhere that Stagecoach are using agency drivers to drive these routes - now I've worked for companies that have used agency drivers and I don't want to tar them all with the same brush, some that we used before were good and reliable, and some even became full-time employees. But then again, some have been terrible.
You can just imagine some poor agency driver from the Rugby area being offered 'driving work', then having to pick up a bus in Rugby at ten past five in the morning, drive it all the way to the QE Hospital in Birmingham, then do a few trips between there and Kings Heath. The terrible ones are those that think "f**k this shit" and then don't turn up again.
The other challenge might be availability of vehicles. Rugby depot were sent a number of Euro6 spec single-decks from Manchester, I don't know how many they got, or how many were required, or indeed if any 'spares' were afforded. The contracts require Euro6 spec vehicles, so in the event that one or two of those vehicles require maintenance or attention, would any penalty be incurred if a non-Euro6 vehicle was sent out? (Do Rugby have much in the way of spare vehicles anyway? I don't know)
But in short, 'unforseen circumstances' is presented as a vague apology, and regardless of the circumstances, a general lack of forward thinking will result in all sorts of 'unforseen' situations.
QuoteDriver shortage will be one challenge, but there are other possibilities.
I gather from elsewhere that Stagecoach are using agency drivers to drive these routes - now I've worked for companies that have used agency drivers and I don't want to tar them all with the same brush, some that we used before were good and reliable, and some even became full-time employees. But then again, some have been terrible.
You can just imagine some poor agency driver from the Rugby area being offered 'driving work', then having to pick up a bus in Rugby at ten past five in the morning, drive it all the way to the QE Hospital in Birmingham, then do a few trips between there and Kings Heath. The terrible ones are those that think "f**k this shit" and then don't turn up again.
The other challenge might be availability of vehicles. Rugby depot were sent a number of Euro6 spec single-decks from Manchester, I don't know how many they got, or how many were required, or indeed if any 'spares' were afforded. The contracts require Euro6 spec vehicles, so in the event that one or two of those vehicles require maintenance or attention, would any penalty be incurred if a non-Euro6 vehicle was sent out? (Do Rugby have much in the way of spare vehicles anyway? I don't know)
But in short, 'unforseen circumstances' is presented as a vague apology, and regardless of the circumstances, a general lack of forward thinking will result in all sorts of 'unforseen' situations.
Euro 6 shouldn't be causing too much of a problem, I believe 13 vehicles have arrived from Manchester and 13 native vehicles are already Euro 6
Quote from: Tony on January 12, 2023, 07:22:13 PMEuro 6 shouldn't be causing too much of a problem, I believe 13 vehicles have arrived from Manchester and 13 native vehicles are already Euro 6
OK fair enough, there were some initial claims made that Rugby didn't have any Euro6 vehicles, though they must have had some already for the existing TfWM contracts that ran into Coventry.
So the 'unforseen circumstances' can only be down to lack of drivers.
Hopefully if they can get a depot or outstation in Birmingham/Solihull sorted out, then recruit some drivers from the local area, then these issues should soon be resolved.
But it will still then be an uphill climb to try and give passengers the confidence to use these services again.
Quote from: Stu on January 12, 2023, 08:40:59 PMOK fair enough, there were some initial claims made that Rugby didn't have any Euro6 vehicles, though they must have had some already for the existing TfWM contracts that ran into Coventry.
Rugby just run the 85/86 into Coventry.
The other stuff is ran by Nuneaton and Leamington/Stratford I think depending on which route. Which all have euro 6 vehicles as well.
Stagecoach Midlands have put out SEVEN tweets of cancellations of the 41,46 and A9 today
Quote from: BrumKev86 on January 13, 2023, 07:33:38 AMStagecoach Midlands have put out SEVEN tweets of cancellations of the 41,46 and A9 today
Wonder what and when TFWM will take action against stagecoach as this cant keep going on as its going to make less people use public transport
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on January 13, 2023, 08:08:53 AMWonder what and when TFWM will take action against stagecoach as this cant keep going on as its going to make less people use public transport
how many passengers complain though?
Quote from: 2206 on January 12, 2023, 11:02:35 PMRugby just run the 85/86 into Coventry.
Rugby only run the 85 on Sundays (Tis NXC rest of week at the moment but who knows in the future!)
While TfWM should be very much within their rights to take the contracts from Stagecoach, you've got to bring someone else into run them and they've got to have the resources to run them. Every operator has a driver shortage at the moment. Even if NXWM took over the routes tomorrow under a TfWM emergency tender, they've not got the full complement of drivers to operate the full timetable for their commercial route network, let alone for extra tendered work.
If this was a ruse to inject more competition between operators into urban West Midlands bus services, it has backfired very badly.
The Traffic Commissioner should also be looking at this and will hopefully be taking a dim view.
It maybe that Stagecoach end up in a public inquiry later on this year and end up having to pay back compensation to passengers in the Birmingham area. Remember Arriva ended up having to operate a free service in Derby once as a punishment from the Commissioner.
Arriva ordered to give free bus trips by traffic commissioner (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-21530168)
Why didn't stagecoach ensure they had the drivers & buses for the new services
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on January 13, 2023, 10:52:17 AMThe Traffic Commissioner should also be looking at this and will hopefully be taking a dim view.
It maybe that Stagecoach end up in a public inquiry later on this year and end up having to pay back compensation to passengers in the Birmingham area. Remember Arriva ended up having to operate a free service in Derby once as a punishment from the Commissioner.
Arriva ordered to give free bus trips by traffic commissioner (https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-england-derbyshire-21530168)
.....as did Stagecoach in Exeter before Christmas.....
Screenshot 2023-01-13 171830.jpg
Trying to blame NXWM now...
Quote from: Bus1237 on January 13, 2023, 05:21:18 PM[url="https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=4117;type=preview;file"]Screenshot 2023-01-13 171830.jpg[/url]
Trying to blame NXWM now...
Holy molly this is starting to look like a remake of on the buses 🤣🙄
Unbelievable! But I'm not laughing.
Quote from: markcf83 on January 13, 2023, 05:02:20 PM.....as did Stagecoach in Exeter before Christmas.....
One of the reasons for the Stagecoach failures in the South West Traffic Commissioner Area was given as diversion of resources to the Commonwealth Games, a contract bid for by their HQ. One wonders whether the Policy making centre of Stagecoach is divorced from the reality of their regions, or they're subject to very difficult financial targets since the recent takeover, which can only be met by diverting resources and the risk of failing on existing contract commitments. Presumably the resultant fines are accommodated as a risk by SC - hence TCs now imposing provision of free services to hit their financial performance more strongly. Whatever, it's a major indictment of the current system!
Anyone know what TfWM is up to on this issue? Or do they need Mayoral sign off and he's perhaps gone AWOL currently. Perhaps he might comment on the forum - I think he was a member at one point?!!
Quote from: Bus1237 on January 13, 2023, 05:21:18 PM[url="https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?action=dlattach;attach=4117;type=preview;file"]Screenshot 2023-01-13 171830.jpg[/url]
Trying to blame NXWM now...
That is marginally more embarrassing than NX Bus posting diversion details for the 58 this week. :rolleyes:
https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?msg=307897
It makes one wonder why they don't simply move a handful of buses from Rugby to Nuneaton (or Leamington) and mini bus the drivers there each day - and run the Birmingham services from either of those garages - probably beyond the cost centre beaurocracy of some private companies.
I guess if a harder hitter like the NHS (QE Hospital) complained it may have more impact than individuals - although the sway the NHS currently has with Tory Central Office is possibly limited!!
Quote from: Solo1 on January 13, 2023, 04:39:32 PMWhy didn't stagecoach ensure they had the manpower - buses for the new services
It not the buses they're short of but the physical drivers. Perhaps they need automonous buses?!
I've got a few things I'd like to say and ask on this topic.
Firstly, why was the contract bid for by Stockport? Bidding for tenders was done by local regions. When did this all move to Stockport and why? Regions still have commercial teams so this should be their job.
Secondly, with regards to loan drivers and so on, there are drivers at fully staffed depots around the country who would go on loan but not offered the opportunity. Is this area making use of loan drivers or are they just hoping it all sorts itself out in a while? Same as what South Wales did. I counted in South Wales posted 600 cancellations in a week.
Quote from: IMarkeh on January 16, 2023, 02:22:04 PMI've got a few things I'd like to say and ask on this topic.
Firstly, why was the contract bid for by Stockport? Bidding for tenders was done by local regions. When did this all move to Stockport and why? Regions still have commercial teams so this should be their job.
Secondly, with regards to loan drivers and so on, there are drivers at fully staffed depots around the country who would go on loan but not offered the opportunity. Is this area making use of loan drivers or are they just hoping it all sorts itself out in a while? Same as what South Wales did. I counted in South Wales posted 600 cancellations in a week.
Don't know for sure but do wonder if SC corporate level are underpricing tenders to start a bus war with NX?
I said earlier the HRH West Midlands Mayor needs to wade in and get it sorted.
Quote from: Rachvince53 on January 13, 2023, 09:46:55 PMIt not the buses they're short of but the physical drivers. Perhaps they need automonous buses?!
Good news earlier today from SC twitter
Everything is running.
QuoteGood news earlier today from SC twitter
Everything is running.
Three vehicles not tracking at the moment, One on the 46 and two on the A9. Doesn't mean they are not running, but three non-trackers is high for them
Quote from: Tony on January 17, 2023, 01:40:36 PMThree vehicles not tracking at the moment, One on the 46 and two on the A9. Doesn't mean they are not running, but three non-trackers is high for them
36484 is the vehicle on the 46 that wasn't tracking earlier. Caught it on the 41 just under an hour ago.
Quote from: Sandy Lane on January 16, 2023, 03:26:59 PMI said earlier the HRH West Midlands Mayor needs to wade in and get it sorted.
I have been informed privately that Mr Street is aware of the situation and is chairing a meeting with TfWM and Stagecoach management on Thursday.
Quote from: Stu on January 17, 2023, 06:55:08 PMI have been informed privately that Mr Street is aware of the situation and is chairing a meeting with TfWM and Stagecoach management on Thursday.
Good. Let's see what happens
If vehicles are running light from Rugby to Birmingham I don't no why Stagecoach can't run a few as limited stop services from Rugby to Birmingham perhaps via Coventry. I seem to remember many years ago stagecoach ran a limited stop X42 from Northampton to Birmingham via Coventry with very cheap fares within the West Midlands county presumably in competition with what then was West Midlands Travel who used delightful and fast dual purpose (coach seated) Metrobuses on the 900 Coventry - Birmingham
Quote from: sandboy20 on January 18, 2023, 11:08:54 AMIf vehicles are running light from Rugby to Birmingham I don't no why Stagecoach can't run a few as limited stop services from Rugby to Birmingham perhaps via Coventry. I seem to remember many years ago stagecoach ran a limited stop X42 from Northampton to Birmingham via Coventry with very cheap fares within the West Midlands county presumably in competition with what then was West Midlands Travel who used delightful and fast dual purpose (coach seated) Metrobuses on the 900 Coventry - Birmingham
I remember the 900. It would be a good way of using all that dead mileage but would they actually implicate it is a different question. Could have the buses go to brum through cov and then when they get to brum maybe interwork with some of the new routes they have over there since all this dead mileage probably isnt bringing them in much profit.
Quote from: Danthebusman on January 18, 2023, 04:16:54 PMI remember the 900. It would be a good way of using all that dead mileage but would they actually implicate it is a different question. Could have the buses go to brum through cov and then when they get to brum maybe interwork with some of the new routes they have over there since all this dead mileage probably isnt bringing them in much profit.
The plan is to have a base in Birmingham in the very near future
Quote from: Danthebusman on January 18, 2023, 04:16:54 PMI remember the 900. It would be a good way of using all that dead mileage but would they actually implicate it is a different question. Could have the buses go to brum through cov and then when they get to brum maybe interwork with some of the new routes they have over there since all this dead mileage probably isnt bringing them in much profit.
I don't think such routes would appeal with the amount of traffic these days and trains (when they run).
Quote from: sandboy20 on January 18, 2023, 11:08:54 AMIf vehicles are running light from Rugby to Birmingham I don't no why Stagecoach can't run a few as limited stop services from Rugby to Birmingham perhaps via Coventry. I seem to remember many years ago stagecoach ran a limited stop X42 from Northampton to Birmingham via Coventry with very cheap fares within the West Midlands county presumably in competition with what then was West Midlands Travel who used delightful and fast dual purpose (coach seated) Metrobuses on the 900 Coventry - Birmingham
The TfWM contracts were pretty much agreed "last minute", which is why we have this mess in the first place, let alone having time to plan and register a new limited-stop service from Rugby to Birmingham, which probably wouldn't be viable anyway.
As has been pointed out already, it seems that Stagecoach's plan was to operate these contracts initially from Rugby, but with a long-term aim to have a depot/outstation in Birmingham where they can store vehicles and from where they can recruit local drivers.
Quote from: sandboy20 on January 18, 2023, 11:08:54 AMIf vehicles are running light from Rugby to Birmingham I don't no why Stagecoach can't run a few as limited stop services from Rugby to Birmingham perhaps via Coventry. I seem to remember many years ago stagecoach ran a limited stop X42 from Northampton to Birmingham via Coventry with very cheap fares within the West Midlands county presumably in competition with what then was West Midlands Travel who used delightful and fast dual purpose (coach seated) Metrobuses on the 900 Coventry - Birmingham
The service was numbered X64 and was operated by Stagecoach United Counties under the Coachlinks brand. Most journeys ran between Birmingham, Coventry and Corby via Northampton. A basically hourly service was provided Mon-Sat, two hourly on Sundays if I recall. It was faster than the WMT 900 as it omitted Meriden. (There was also the competing Midland Fox 66 which ran between Birmingham and Leicester in between,) As others have said, surely they could run positioning journeys or would that have an adverse effect on drivers hours?
Quote from: Rachvince53 on January 18, 2023, 08:22:51 PMThe service was numbered X64 and was operated by Stagecoach United Counties under the Coachlinks brand. Most journeys ran between Birmingham, Coventry and Corby via Northampton. A basically hourly service was provided Mon-Sat, two hourly on Sundays if I recall. It was faster than the WMT 900 as it omitted Meriden. (There was also the competing Midland Fox 66 which ran between Birmingham and Leicester in between,) As others have said, surely they could run positioning journeys or would that have an adverse effect on drivers hours?
I have checked X64 timetables for the late 1980s and 1990s, and at best it ran two hourly Mon-Sat, with 2-3 journeys on Sundays. Its main purpose was to link Northamptonshire with the West Midlands rather than compete with WMT 900. As far as I can recall there was no attempt made to publicise a fast Birmingham - Coventry link.
No doubt the positioning journeys between Rugby and the Birmingham termini could be run in service, but if they run early, late or not at all, there's another stick with which to beat Stagecoach. There would virtually no demand unless buses called at Coventry city centre en route - and even then there are unlikely to be enough passengers at those times of day to make it worthwhile. That probably would affect drivers hours as well.
In fact it is quite rare anywhere in the country for operators to run positioning journeys in service unless they are on the line of route anyway (and by no means always even then).
Quote from: metrocity on January 18, 2023, 04:41:31 PMThe plan is to have a base in Birmingham in the very near future
Let's hope they have found,or at least have shortlisted,some suitable sites.
Quote from: markcf83 on January 19, 2023, 03:01:59 PMLet's hope they have found,or at least have shortlisted,some suitable sites.
As well as started advertising locally for driver jobs.
So, the first service failure tweet this morning:
#Birmingham#Solihul
Due to circumstances beyond our control the following services will not run this morning
#46-06.34 West Heath to QE
Apologies for any inconvenience
They're also failing on Leamington service U1 that s morning too......
Quote from: Stu on January 17, 2023, 06:55:08 PMI have been informed privately that Mr Street is aware of the situation and is chairing a meeting with TfWM and Stagecoach management on Thursday.
Oh Dear! HRH was not very happy if he met SC yesterday - due to other matters.
BBC News - Levelling up funding process is broken, says Tory mayor Andy Street
https://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-politics-64337596
Hope that SC survived the meeting.
You do wonder what the Stagecoach strategy is. If it was still a PLC and you were a shareholder based in Birmingham you'd be tempted to turn up at the AGM and ask the board!
If the Stagecoach plan is to challenge NXWM, bidding for a package of tendered routes, putting in a low bid and running them from an depot an more than an hour away seems like something they've come up with on the back of an envelope. Either that, or the people in Stockport who came up with the tender bid thought Rugby was near Birmingham!
You would have thought if they wanted to play the long game and see if "events "intervened" they would have bought the second biggest operator with a base in the metropolitan West Midlands i.e. Diamond, which if the TfWM/NXWM "partnership ended up in an acrimonious divorce because of poor performance/change of Mayor/economic factors/move of approach to franchising like Manchester/government intervention breaking up NXWM etc.
"Events" since 1990 have led to Stagecoach having operations in most of the big urban areas, big enough to result in two major groups serving them with the notable exception of Birmingham and the Black Country. That has enabled Stagecoach to take advantage of the move away from the 1986 Government policy of on street competition between bus operators, to the approaches that are now Government policy in "Bus Back Better" which acknowledged deregulation and the market had not delivered the desired results.
You would have thought Stagecoach wouldn't be touching any TfWM contracts in Birmingham until they had an operational base in the city. They seem to have lost both Brian Souter and their corporate memory.
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on January 20, 2023, 06:10:38 PMYou do wonder what the Stagecoach strategy is. If it was still a PLC and you were a shareholder based in Birmingham you'd be tempted to turn up at the AGM and ask the board!
If the Stagecoach plan is to challenge NXWM, bidding for a package of tendered routes, putting in a low bid and running them from an depot an more than an hour away seems like something they've come up with on the back of an envelope. Either that, or the people in Stockport who came up with the tender bid thought Rugby was near Birmingham!
You would have thought if they wanted to play the long game and see if "events "intervened" they would have bought the second biggest operator with a base in the metropolitan West Midlands i.e. Diamond, which if the TfWM/NXWM "partnership ended up in an acrimonious divorce because of poor performance/change of Mayor/economic factors/move of approach to franchising like Manchester/government intervention breaking up NXWM etc.
"Events" since 1990 have led to Stagecoach having operations in most of the big urban areas, big enough to result in two major groups serving them with the notable exception of Birmingham and the Black Country. That has enabled Stagecoach to take advantage of the move away from the 1986 Government policy of on street competition between bus operators, to the approaches that are now Government policy in "Bus Back Better" which acknowledged deregulation and the market had not delivered the desired results.
You would have thought Stagecoach wouldn't be touching any TfWM contracts in Birmingham until they had an operational base in the city. They seem to have lost both Brian Souter and their corporate memory.
Have a look see at a SC news update from a few days ago.
Some of the words from https://m.stagecoachgroup.com/media/news-releases/2023/2023-01-10.aspx
Stagecoach Group Limited ("the Company") today (10 January 2023) announced the transition to a new management team as the business evolves and looks to its next phase of growth.
In recent years, Stagecoach has moved from being a global multi-modal business with extensive overseas interests to a group focused principally on buses and the UK. The Company de-listed from the London Stock Exchange last summer, becoming a private company, and last month the Group reported a positive first set of financial results under its new ownership.
Today, Stagecoach has confirmed management changes as it looks to capitalise on the exciting opportunities ahead for greener public transport and the key role it can play in delivering on the country's ambitions.
Quote from: Kevin_Brum12 on January 20, 2023, 06:10:38 PMYou do wonder what the Stagecoach strategy is. If it was still a PLC and you were a shareholder based in Birmingham you'd be tempted to turn up at the AGM and ask the board!
If the Stagecoach plan is to challenge NXWM, bidding for a package of tendered routes, putting in a low bid and running them from an depot an more than an hour away seems like something they've come up with on the back of an envelope. Either that, or the people in Stockport who came up with the tender bid thought Rugby was near Birmingham!
You would have thought if they wanted to play the long game and see if "events "intervened" they would have bought the second biggest operator with a base in the metropolitan West Midlands i.e. Diamond, which if the TfWM/NXWM "partnership ended up in an acrimonious divorce because of poor performance/change of Mayor/economic factors/move of approach to franchising like Manchester/government intervention breaking up NXWM etc.
"Events" since 1990 have led to Stagecoach having operations in most of the big urban areas, big enough to result in two major groups serving them with the notable exception of Birmingham and the Black Country. That has enabled Stagecoach to take advantage of the move away from the 1986 Government policy of on street competition between bus operators, to the approaches that are now Government policy in "Bus Back Better" which acknowledged deregulation and the market had not delivered the desired results.
You would have thought Stagecoach wouldn't be touching any TfWM contracts in Birmingham until they had an operational base in the city. They seem to have lost both Brian Souter and their corporate memory.
Whatever you think about Stagecoach entering the West Midlands, it has raised concerns at higher levels at NX; I even understand that some of their more junior employees have been tasked with undertaking monitoring on their compliance and reporting findings to higher level management.
Quote from: Straightlines on January 20, 2023, 11:14:32 PMWhatever you think about Stagecoach entering the West Midlands, it has raised concerns at higher levels at NX; I even understand that some of their more junior employees have been tasked with undertaking monitoring on their compliance and reporting findings to higher level management.
Stagecoach are on borrowed time with their latest TfWM contracts & risk being stripped of them if performance doesn't improve.
Quote from: winston on January 20, 2023, 11:43:16 PMStagecoach are on borrowed time with their latest TfWM contracts & risk being stripped of them if performance doesn't improve.
Whilst I'm not disagreeing, I'm not really sure what that is pertinent to my point.
They also wouldn't be the first TfWM contractor to be 'on borrowed time' over the years...
Quote from: Straightlines on January 20, 2023, 11:51:05 PMWhilst I'm not disagreeing, I'm not really sure what that is pertinent to my point.
They also wouldn't be the first TfWM contractor to be 'on borrowed time' over the years...
They're hardly a threat based on their current performance, as it's all been a bit of a cock-up. Even if it has raised a few eyebrows at NX.
Quote from: winston on January 20, 2023, 11:54:56 PMThey're hardly a threat based on their current performance, as it's all been a bit of a cock-up. Even if it has raised a few eyebrows at NX.
Cock-up is an understatement, although the ultimate orchestrator of the cock-up is the ongoing incompetence that is TfWM!
Quote from: Straightlines on January 20, 2023, 11:57:50 PMCock-up is an understatement, although the ultimate orchestrator of the cock-up is the ongoing incompetence that is TfWM!
It seems that the left-hand doesn't talk to the right-hand within Stagecoach i.e. Stockport not telling Warwickshire that they were bidding for those TfWM contracts. TfWM have also been very poor awarding contracts with as little as two weeks notice to start date, late informing the public of changes & updating bus stop flags / timetables at bus stops which could be on-going to end of Feb....
QuoteIt seems that the left-hand doesn't talk to the right-hand within Stagecoach i.e. Stockport not telling Warwickshire that they were bidding for those TfWM contracts. TfWM have also been very poor awarding contracts with as little as two weeks notice to start date, late informing the public of changes & updating bus stop flags / timetables at bus stops which could be on-going to end of Feb....
The Acocks Green ones still haven't even been changed yet, but if stagecoach loses their Birmingham routes what will happen who will operate them?
Quote from: BBS on January 21, 2023, 11:08:32 AMThe Acocks Green ones still haven't even been changed yet, but if stagecoach loses their Birmingham routes what will happen who will operate them?
Should those routes be stripped from Stagecoach & they go back out on emergency tender, it will be down to which operator has the capacity to take them on, most likely Diamond or Landflight, but Solus Coaches could be a contender for future TfWM contracts too.
Despite what others have posted, Stagecoach didn't bid cheap to win the 41, 46, 169 & A9. They were slightly cheaper as they offered a package bid for all four vs individual prices for each route.
Quote from: winston on January 21, 2023, 12:03:23 AMIt seems that the left-hand doesn't talk to the right-hand within Stagecoach i.e. Stockport not telling Warwickshire that they were bidding for those TfWM contracts. TfWM have also been very poor awarding contracts with as little as two weeks notice to start date, late informing the public of changes & updating bus stop flags / timetables at bus stops which could be on-going to end of Feb....
I would say both are culpable to some extent.
Quote from: markcf83 on January 21, 2023, 01:49:39 PMI would say both are culpable to some extent.
Operators being given as little as 2 weeks notice to start date, wasn't confined to just Stagecoach.
Not sure why Rugby have changed there dests, noticed in Solihull today the A9/169 have now scrolling via, and the main destination is not bold anymore which isn't easy to see.
Quote from: winston on January 21, 2023, 02:50:51 PMOperators being given as little as 2 weeks notice to start date, wasn't confined to just Stagecoach.
TfWM signed it all off so IMO they are to blame. Someone wants sacking within TfWM.
QuoteWhatever you think about Stagecoach entering the West Midlands, it has raised concerns at higher levels at NX; I even understand that some of their more junior employees have been tasked with undertaking monitoring on their compliance and reporting findings to higher level management.
After (yet) another 45+ minute wait for a 97 yesterday evening & (yet) another FTO of my early morning 97 to work during the week, maybe some monitoring of their own service compliance might be more beneficial?
Football was on yesterday as 97 goes past the ground will get delayed by football traffic unless it diverted away from the ground after the match
Quote from: Sandy Lane on January 22, 2023, 09:18:32 AMTfWM signed it all off so IMO they are to blame. Someone wants sacking within TfWM.
I've since learnt that Stagecoach were awarded their tenders much earlier on, it was Diamond that were awarded some contracts with only two week notice.
Quote from: Sandy Lane on January 22, 2023, 09:18:32 AMTfWM signed it all off so IMO they are to blame. Someone wants sacking within TfWM.
Unfortunately, there is too much deadwood at Summer Lane and the status quo will remain!
They knew entirely what they were getting into.
Quote from: GoldenSquid on January 22, 2023, 12:50:08 AMNot sure why Rugby have changed there dests, noticed in Solihull today the A9/169 have now scrolling via, and the main destination is not bold anymore which isn't easy to see.
Last Saturday, I observed a 169 passing through Billesley which showed "Sainsburys" and "via Solihull Town Centre" on the lower line. Which I thought was a bit unhelpful, which Sainsburys? (there are stores also in Kings Heath and Maypole!)
Yesterday, the one I spotted on Westridge Road did actually show 'Shirley Sainsburys'.
On both occasions, the buses were empty!
Quote from: Stu on January 22, 2023, 08:23:51 PMLast Saturday, I observed a 169 passing through Billesley which showed "Sainsburys" and "via Solihull Town Centre" on the lower line. Which I thought was a bit unhelpful, which Sainsburys? (there are stores also in Kings Heath and Maypole!)
Yesterday, the one I spotted on Westridge Road did actually show 'Shirley Sainsburys'.
On both occasions, the buses were empty!
Same with a lot of the other BSIP funded services which seem to be carrying fresh air now but did have reasonable usage in their previous guises prior to the route changes
Quote from: metrocity on January 22, 2023, 08:36:07 PMSame with a lot of the other BSIP funded services which seem to be carrying fresh air now but did have reasonable usage in their previous guises prior to the route changes
Times are very hard for lots of people.
Ticket interchangeability could be putting people off? Journeys may be costing more money if you need to use both operators?
Maybe NXWM £4 daysaver would have been better value when they ran all the routes?
Did TfWM consider this for both Birmingham and Coventry (the 60 taking over some of the 3 route)?
Quote from: Sandy Lane on January 22, 2023, 09:16:11 PMTimes are very hard for lots of people.
Ticket interchangeability could be putting people off? Journeys may be costing more money if you need to use both operators?
Maybe NXWM £4 daysaver would have been better value when they ran all the routes?
Did TfWM consider this for both Birmingham and Coventry (the 60 taking over some of the 3 route)?
It's possible, but an nBus day ticket costs £4.20, so only 20p more than an NX Daysaver.
Where TfWM have shot themselves in the foot is their failure to actively promote their Swift Go product more.
The local councillor for the Lyndon Ward of Solihull Council contacted TFWM last week about the A9 service and this was TFWM response:
QuoteA9 Bus Service
I finally got a reply from TfWM (Transport for West Midlands), regarding the reliability issues. I am still outstanding a response with regards to the S16 changes.
"I am sorry to hear of residents concerns about this route and apologise for the inconvenience.
We are aware of the performance of the A9 service last week, which has not met the high standards that customers rightly expect. TfWM are closely monitoring the situation daily and are actively working with Stagecoach to stabilise this service to ensure that residents can rely upon the service provided.
Unfortunately, the issues experienced are related to driver availability which is a problem to varying degrees across much of the bus industry. Additional drivers are being recruited and we are expecting to see a significant improvement going forward.
Quote from: Stu on January 22, 2023, 09:41:14 PMIt's possible, but an nBus day ticket costs £4.20, so only 20p more than an NX Daysaver.
Where TfWM have shot themselves in the foot is their failure to actively promote their Swift Go product more.
Swift Go would have been innovative 15 years ago. Customers expect capping on contactless bank card across all operators, instead ironically customers can easily get over charged rather than getting best value if using more than one operator. Sadly this desired milestone is now incredibly difficult to achieve due to TfWM allowing operators to procure different types of ticket machines!
Quote from: metrocity on January 22, 2023, 09:59:14 PMSwift Go would have been innovative 15 years ago. Customers expect capping on contactless bank card across all operators, instead ironically customers can easily get over charged rather than getting best value if using more than one operator. Sadly this desired milestone is now incredibly difficult to achieve due to TfWM allowing operators to procure different types of ticket machines!
I agree, this system is a bit 'outdated' compared to Oyster in London.
But still, TfWM have spent a fair bit developing it, and launching it in 2020 before 'capping' was introduced in 2021.
Despite the initial promotion, there was not much said about it since then.
And you're right, the current situation has come about as TfWM allowed operators to use different on-bus ticketing systems.
But I still think that money would be better spent on promoting Swift Go, rather than the millions set to be spent on developing a whole new system for bank cards, which then ultimately makes Swift Go a complete waste of taxpayers money.
https://wmbu.org.uk/2023/01/opinion-risk-of-passengers-being-overcharged-when-using-contactless-but-theres-already-a-solution/
Quote#Birmingham#Solihull Unfortunately due to a mechanical issue, the service is running late and the following will not run today.
#A9 (https://mobile.twitter.com/hashtag/A9?src=hashtag_click) - 07.26 Kinghurst - Blythe Valley
Apologies for any inconvenience caused
5 minutes before the bus was due they tell me its not running
QuoteThe local councillor for the Lyndon Ward of Solihull Council contacted TFWM last week about the A9 service and this was TFWM response:
That's a quicker response than what one of the Brierley Hill cllrs got about the 25 service!
Quite a few of stagecoch services not running for some reason because of a mechanical issue
Quote from: HARVEYCLLEE on January 23, 2023, 10:20:11 AMQuite a few of stagecoch services not running for some reason because of a mechanical issue
When it's not the drivers letting them down, it's their own buses!
Quote from: Stu on January 22, 2023, 08:23:51 PMLast Saturday, I observed a 169 passing through Billesley which showed "Sainsburys" and "via Solihull Town Centre" on the lower line. Which I thought was a bit unhelpful, which Sainsburys? (there are stores also in Kings Heath and Maypole!)
Yesterday, the one I spotted on Westridge Road did actually show 'Shirley Sainsburys'.
On both occasions, the buses were empty!
I've noticed a lot of 169s being empty, especially in the evening. I am not sure why the service runs to 6PM, when the 69 used to finish around 2PM.
I think a lot of customers are being put off these new routes as the bus stops
have still not been updated. I noticed that the stops near Lea Hall/Kits Green LIDL, have had the timetables updated for the 72/97 and had the 58 removed but they didn't add the A9 onto it.
Quote from: GoldenSquid on January 23, 2023, 11:39:16 PMI've noticed a lot of 169s being empty, especially in the evening. I am not sure why the service runs to 6PM, when the 69 used to finish around 2PM.
I think a lot of customers are being put off these new routes as the bus stops have still not been updated. I noticed that the stops near Lea Hall/Kits Green LIDL, have had the timetables updated for the 72/97 and had the 58 removed but they didn't add the A9 onto it.
The later journeys have been introduced because TFWM have used the BSIP funds for this tender. Therefore there has to be an improvement of some sort on the previous contract. Same reason why A9, 142, 96 etc have all seen enhanced operating hours and / or days
Hope it stays this way with some good news from SC Twit feed -
all birmingham services as of now are all running, enjoy your day
QuoteHope it stays this way with some good news from SC Twit feed -
all birmingham services as of now are all running, enjoy your day
They must have two buses that don't track on the A9. I know one has ben reported a couple of time, must be a second that doesn't as well
Quote from: Tony on January 24, 2023, 11:00:31 AMThey must have two buses that don't track on the A9. I know one has ben reported a couple of time, must be a second that doesn't as well
36484 is recorded as operating journeys but isn't providing location data:
https://bustimes.org/services/a9-kinghurst-blyth-valley-park/vehicles
36485 is on the 46 at the moment and took the line of the 48 from QE to Northfield (went via Weoley Castle Square).
Reported in Manchester Evening News that Stagecoach have been missing out parts of service 328 due to using buses too heavy for part of the route known locally as "little Europe" so its not just in Birmingham that buses omit parts of routes.
Quote from: SO6597 on January 26, 2023, 05:05:55 PM36485 is on the 46 at the moment and took the line of the 48 from QE to Northfield (went via Weoley Castle Square).
Oh dear.
Not quite sure what happened yesterday but there were 2 46s running together towards Kings Heath at about 08:30. As you can imagine, both ran completely empty (surprise, surprise!); who knows what must've happened for them to run two buses together...
Quote from: bususer28 on January 26, 2023, 08:29:25 PMNot quite sure what happened yesterday but there were 2 46s running together towards Kings Heath at about 08:30. As you can imagine, both ran completely empty (surprise, surprise!); who knows what must've happened for them to run two buses together...
Isn't that a diamond trick, we following the leader
Quote from: Ginger66 on January 27, 2023, 06:56:11 AMIsn't that a diamond trick, we following the leader
That's what happened with Diamond 27 on Wednesday! Two 27s arrived in Wolves within minutes.
Quote from: bususer28 on January 26, 2023, 08:29:25 PMNot quite sure what happened yesterday but there were 2 46s running together towards Kings Heath at about 08:30. As you can imagine, both ran completely empty (surprise, surprise!); who knows what must've happened for them to run two buses together...
"Congestion on route" caused some later journeys to be cancelled, perhaps that was why...
https://twitter.com/StagecoachMids/status/1618587690856742913
Quote from: Stu on January 27, 2023, 12:40:48 PM"Congestion on route" caused some later journeys to be cancelled, perhaps that was why...
https://twitter.com/StagecoachMids/status/1618587690856742913
In defence of Stagecoach, the TfWM designed timetable for the service is somewhat of a joke and tight even on a Sunday.
Vast majority of journeys on the 46 have operated via Weoley Castle Square today so looks like that part of the route is now following where the bus stops have 46 on them, the Bus Times map has also altered too. A tweak in the route through Northfield needed next.
I travelled on the 46 today. He was 15 minute late arriving into kings Heath by the time he'd gone round to come back towards QE he was 30 minutes late. 3 passengers the entire journey. He was giving that e200 some whack. Timetable is a joke. The journey behind was 10 minutes behind and missed out some of the route arriving into the QE on time
Just seen this anti bus claim one bus every 30 minutes is "causing congestion on Vicarage Road".
Catherine Hubbard on Twitter: "@David4BKH Hi @David4BKH where will it be rerouted to? As per my tweet to @LisaTrickett41 the 46 route seems to be permanently empty and also adds to the congestion on Vicarage road - we were also not consulted about this additional bus route which seems utterly unnecessary! https://t.co/baqTmhZszH" / Twitter (https://twitter.com/cathub80/status/1620408315728592896)
"Buses driving unsafely on inappropriate roads" where said roads are full of poorly and illegally parked cars.
Also Vicarage Road has the 11A/C on it. The congestion is caused by the prats trying to turn right at the lights when they're not allowed to do so, as well as poorly and illegally parked cars.
Kings Heath has always been a difficult place for buses to terminate, due to the lack of 'turning points'.
In my opinion, the 169 when approaching Kings Heath should go via Brook Lane then onto Springfield Road, before terminating on Institute Road, that stop is close enough to the High Street for arriving passengers to walk to. The outbound journey can then pick up at the Alcester Road stop, before turning onto Addison Road, then onto Brook Lane, as per the 11A/C route.
The 46 should do similar, unload at Vicarage Road and/or Alcester Road, then go via Addison Road and onto Springfield Road before terminating on Institute Road. Outbound journey then starts there, and picks up passengers from Vicarage Road.
Quote from: Stu on January 31, 2023, 07:34:09 PMKings Heath has always been a difficult place for buses to terminate, due to the lack of 'turning points'.
In my opinion, the 169 when approaching Kings Heath should go via Brook Lane then onto Springfield Road, before terminating on Institute Road, that stop is close enough to the High Street for arriving passengers to walk to. The outbound journey can then pick up at the Alcester Road stop, before turning onto Addison Road, then onto Brook Lane, as per the 11A/C route.
The 46 should do similar, unload at Vicarage Road and/or Alcester Road, then go via Addison Road and onto Springfield Road before terminating on Institute Road. Outbound journey then starts there, and picks up passengers from Vicarage Road.
I agree with you - that is the logical solution.
At the moment roadworks in Kings Heath High Street mean one lane is out by Institute Road and Silver Street, causing long delays. No doubt NXWM 35 and 50 (at least) are badly affected too.
Quote from: Stu on January 31, 2023, 07:34:09 PMThe 46 should do similar, unload at Vicarage Road and/or Alcester Road, then go via Addison Road and onto Springfield Road before terminating on Institute Road. Outbound journey then starts there, and picks up passengers from Vicarage Road.
Looking on BusTimes, it would seem that Diamond's 150 service uses Addison Road, Goldsmith Road then Institute Road to turn around, so that's another possibility for the 46.
Quote from: Justin Tyme on January 31, 2023, 07:48:19 PMAt the moment roadworks in Kings Heath High Street mean one lane is out by Institute Road and Silver Street, causing long delays. No doubt NXWM 35 and 50 (at least) are badly affected too.
Blocking off access to side roads for the LTN probably isn't helping traffic matters either!
There was a short time between the demise of the 27's All Saints Rd terminus and its extension to Alcester Lanes End where it still terminated at Kings Heath. All I know is that it turned right at the Vicarage Rd/High St junction, not sure where it went after that to turn around.
I think the use of any alternative back streets around Kings Heath by the 46 will inevitably meet with the same kind of opposition we see here, I also wonder how much time gets lost sitting in the constant traffic jams on the High St. Perhaps routing it along Howard Rd onto Alcester Rd Sth and then turning right into Vicarage Rd is a possibility?
Quote from: SO6597 on January 31, 2023, 09:07:25 PMThere was a short time between the demise of the 27's All Saints Rd terminus and its extension to Alcester Lanes End where it still terminated at Kings Heath. All I know is that it turned right at the Vicarage Rd/High St junction, not sure where it went after that to turn around.
I think the use of any alternative back streets around Kings Heath by the 46 will inevitably meet with the same kind of opposition we see here, I also wonder how much time gets lost sitting in the constant traffic jams on the High St. Perhaps routing it along Howard Rd onto Alcester Rd Sth and then turning right into Vicarage Rd is a possibility?
Looks like the new route may be getting tested, this evening a 46 turned right onto Alcester Rd South and left at Howard Rd East, turning round at the roundabout on Wheelers Lane/Haunch Lane and returning the same way.
Quote from: SO6597 on January 31, 2023, 10:41:52 PMLooks like the new route may be getting tested, this evening a 46 turned right onto Alcester Rd South and left at Howard Rd East, turning round at the roundabout on Wheelers Lane/Haunch Lane and returning the same way.
I can't imagine they would test it in passenger service, as it should be following the registered and timetabled route/stops and at present that it is that it starts/finishes at Bishop Challoner School.
And if you look at the tracking for that vehicle it also took the wrong route in Brandwood following the 35 route.
36482 - MX12 GCK – Stagecoach Midlands – bustimes.org (https://bustimes.org/vehicles/scmn-36482?date=2023-01-31#journeys/377148110)
Neither is it helpful for any passengers who could have potentially been waiting at the stop/stops missed out and wondering why their bus hasn't turned up.
Saturday afternoon it took a 46 20 minutes to get round kings Heath. The service desperately needs a timetable change or a re routing
The 46 route change looks to be official.
The Upcoming Bus Service Changes on the TfWM website now shows a change from 26 January: "Amendment to route with service now serving Weoley Castle Square".
Also, the 46 route map on the Stagecoach website (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/routes/midlands/46/qe-hospital-kings-heath/xlao046.i (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/routes/midlands/46/qe-hospital-kings-heath/xlao046.i)) now shows the same, following the former 48 route between Gibbins Road and Swarthmore Road.
Quote from: Justin Tyme on February 01, 2023, 09:00:40 PMThe 46 route change looks to be official.
The Upcoming Bus Service Changes on the TfWM website now shows a change from 26 January: "Amendment to route with service now serving Weoley Castle Square".
Also, the 46 route map on the Stagecoach website (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/routes/midlands/46/qe-hospital-kings-heath/xlao046.i (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/routes/midlands/46/qe-hospital-kings-heath/xlao046.i)) now shows the same, following the former 48 route between Gibbins Road and Swarthmore Road.
Common sense has prevailed then.
Quote from: MasterPlan on February 01, 2023, 09:36:55 PMCommon sense has prevailed then.
Quote from: Justin Tyme on February 01, 2023, 09:00:40 PMThe 46 route change looks to be official.
The Upcoming Bus Service Changes on the TfWM website now shows a change from 26 January: "Amendment to route with service now serving Weoley Castle Square".
Also, the 46 route map on the Stagecoach website (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/routes/midlands/46/qe-hospital-kings-heath/xlao046.i (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/routes/midlands/46/qe-hospital-kings-heath/xlao046.i)) now shows the same, following the former 48 route between Gibbins Road and Swarthmore Road.
Another masterclass in planning good local bus services by TfWM!
Some of the flags in the Olton/Lyndon area have changed again from showing 58 and A15/A16 to just showing A15 and A16. Second attempt it appears for these. How many attempts will it take to get it right?
Same on the Coventry Road 58 removed but A9 not added.
Not a single flag enroute between Whitefields Road and Yardley Yew Tree has A9 on the flag yet, 5 weeks in to it operating.
Also the stop at Monkspath Hall Road, Princes Way has a new timetable for the 169/A3 but A9 isn't on there.
QuoteSome of the flags in the Olton/Lyndon area have changed again from showing 58 and A15/A16 to just showing A15 and A16. Second attempt it appears for these. How many attempts will it take to get it right?
Same on the Coventry Road 58 removed but A9 not added.
Not a single flag enroute between Whitefields Road and Yardley Yew Tree has A9 on the flag yet, 5 weeks in to it operating.
Also the stop at Monkspath Hall Road, Princes Way has a new timetable for the 169/A3 but A9 isn't on there.
I wonder who's making these flags and if their aware of all the changes
Quote from: BBS on February 03, 2023, 12:37:56 PMI wonder who's making these flags and if their aware of all the changes
It will be a company contracted to TfWM, and they just print the flags from the data provided to them by TfWM.
Quote from: Stu on February 03, 2023, 12:59:26 PMIt will be a company contracted to TfWM, and they just print the flags from the data provided to them by TfWM.
Out of interest what happens to the old flags? Are they stacked up in field somewhere or do they get recycled?
Quote from: Sandy Lane on February 03, 2023, 04:32:03 PMOut of interest what happens to the old flags? Are they stacked up in field somewhere or do they get recycled?
It is just a piece of printed adhesive vinyl applied to the metal flag. They either peel off the old one, or just stick the new one over it.
The flag itself is not changed.
Quote from: Stu on February 03, 2023, 09:17:29 PMIt is just a piece of printed adhesive vinyl applied to the metal flag. They either peel off the old one, or just stick the new one over it.
The flag itself is not changed.
Didn't know that. Thks.
Quote from: Sandy Lane on February 03, 2023, 04:32:03 PMOut of interest what happens to the old flags? Are they stacked up in field somewhere or do they get recycled?
Sometimes you can tell they've been used else where
TfWM have been out observing in Solihull the past week, in the town centre and along Lode Lane.
Usual service for the A9 today though... A passenger was complaining to Stagecoach drivers that his A9 didn't show up, and he'd been waiting over an hour.
He wanted answers but wasn't getting them, so I asked him what time and what stop.
Turns out that his bus went past his stop (Widney, Kingsbrook Drive) 13 minutes early. Upon looking at the tracking, it also turns out that this specific vehicle went down an alternative route between Blythe Valley and Solihull completely missing out Cheswick Green and failing to observe multiple timing points.
https://bustimes.org/services/a9-kinghurst-blyth-valley-park/vehicles?date=2023-02-05#journeys/379524420
This seems to be a regular occurrence (buses running early, if they're running at all)
Very poor service, running early over so much of the route.
Sometimes running over 20 minutes late as well
2 46s leaving the QE within a minute of each other just after half 5.
Unless I'm blind, which I don't think I am, Stagecoach 36481 has just gone past me on the 41 to Heartlands Hospital, with the side destination reading "41 Kings Heath".
I had to look twice. The 41 doesn't go to Kings Heath...
Quote from: MW on February 10, 2023, 07:18:06 AMUnless I'm blind, which I don't think I am, Stagecoach 36481 has just gone past me on the 41 to Heartlands Hospital, with the side destination reading "41 Kings Heath".
I had to look twice. The 41 doesn't go to Kings Heath...
36427 has just passed me; exactly as the same as above. Definitely not blind! 41 to Kings Heath!
And now 36427 is broken down in Acocks Green, with an external Maintenance vehicle from a firm based in Leicester at the scene.
So the buses are coming from Rugby, and the engineers who attend breakdowns are coming from Leicester...
QuoteUnless I'm blind, which I don't think I am, Stagecoach 36481 has just gone past me on the 41 to Heartlands Hospital, with the side destination reading "41 Kings Heath".
I had to look twice. The 41 doesn't go to Kings Heath...
I seen HHD also displaying 41 kings heath the other day
Quote from: MW on February 10, 2023, 01:39:04 PMAnd now 36427 is broken down in Acocks Green, with an external Maintenance vehicle from a firm based in Leicester at the scene.
So the buses are coming from Rugby, and the engineers who attend breakdowns are coming from Leicester...
Avenger?
Quote from: BBS on February 10, 2023, 05:07:49 PMI seen HHD also displaying 41 kings heath the other day
Obviously been misprogrammed when the displays were set up. Whoever set up the displays put in a "41 Kings Heath" by mistake, possibly assuming that as the 46 goes to Kings Heath, the 41 must as well!
QuoteObviously been misprogrammed when the displays were set up. Whoever set up the displays put in a "41 Kings Heath" by mistake, possibly assuming that as the 46 goes to Kings Heath, the 41 must as well!
There's 3 destination boards actually, I've seen a QE , Heartlands and a Kings Heath one
One of the local Councillors for Kings Heath tweeted a letter yesterday sent to residents on roads used by the 46/169 which said that buses will be turning around 'further up the High Street on Queensbridge Rd' from February 24th.
If true, I've no idea where this suitable turning point is unless they do a loop past Highbury Hall. Furthermore, it's only going to exacerbate reliability issues if buses have to negotiate the full length of the High Street.
Quote from: SO6597 on February 12, 2023, 04:09:44 PMOne of the local Councillors for Kings Heath tweeted a letter yesterday sent to residents on roads used by the 46/169 which said that buses will be turning around 'further up the High Street on Queensbridge Rd' from February 24th.
If true, I've no idea where this suitable turning point is unless they do a loop past Highbury Hall. Furthermore, it's only going to exacerbate reliability issues if buses have to negotiate the full length of the High Street.
Another solution is merge both services into one. Have the "short journeys" terminate at The Billesley/Swanshurst School roundabout.
Looking at the timetable, the full journey should take around 106 mins. You can shave a few off that if the services were merged. Would leave 7-8 mins drop back on each end based on an hourly frequency.
Quote from: SO6597 on February 12, 2023, 04:09:44 PMOne of the local Councillors for Kings Heath tweeted a letter yesterday sent to residents on roads used by the 46/169 which said that buses will be turning around 'further up the High Street on Queensbridge Rd' from February 24th.
If true, I've no idea where this suitable turning point is unless they do a loop past Highbury Hall. Furthermore, it's only going to exacerbate reliability issues if buses have to negotiate the full length of the High Street.
Yeah, that idea definitely won't impact service reliability at all. :rolleyes:
Still think it is a better idea for the 46 to go via Addison Road then onto Institute Road via Goldsmith Road or Springfield Road.
Or send them back down All Saints' Road like they used to. The parking doesn't look any different to how it was when the buses used to go down there.
Quote from: ellspurs on February 12, 2023, 04:48:48 PMOr send them back down All Saints' Road like they used to. The parking doesn't look any different to how it was when the buses used to go down there.
Where do they go from there though? Thanks to the LTN, there's no access at the other end onto Howard Road.
Stick some double yellow lines on the junction and send them right up Abbots Road to Vicarage Road. 46 goes left, 169 goes right. As a bonus it'll annoy that person complaining about traffic on Vicarage Road some more!
I'm pretty sure the 27/35 used to do that in the past, as I remember catching the bus from All Saints' Road with my nan to Pineapple Road, and we were only on it for a few stops. Would've took a lot longer if it went the other way.
Quote from: Stu on February 12, 2023, 05:19:11 PMWhere do they go from there though? Thanks to the LTN, there's no access at the other end onto Howard Road.
Turn right onto Abbots Road and the left to rejoin Vicarage Road. That's what the 27 and the old 2 (replaced by the 69) used to do, although they crossed Vicarage Road onto Avenue Road.
Quote from: Stu on February 12, 2023, 05:19:11 PMWhere do they go from there though? Thanks to the LTN, there's no access at the other end onto Howard Road.
Buses using All Saints Road would turn right onto Abbots Rd which is not LTN'd.
I think a far better alternative to sending 46s in the direction of Queensbridge Rd (if All Saints Rd isn't an option) would be to go the other way and use the Alcester Lanes End turning circle as the 27 did for a while back in 2009/2010ish (5 mins away with most of the return journey back to Kings Heath being bus lanes).
Quote from: ellspurs on February 12, 2023, 05:28:31 PMStick some double yellow lines on the junction and send them right up Abbots Road to Vicarage Road. 46 goes left, 169 goes right. As a bonus it'll annoy that person complaining about traffic on Vicarage Road some more!
I'm pretty sure the 27/35 used to do that in the past, as I remember catching the bus from All Saints' Road with my nan to Pineapple Road, and we were only on it for a few stops. Would've took a lot longer if it went the other way.
Your memory is correct - the 27 and 35, along with the 2, did turn right from All Saints Road into Abbots Road to reach Vicarage Road or Avenue Road. Short workings to Kings Heath on the 50 (and 48, along with the peak hour 49) used to turn using All Saints Road, left into Abbots Road and left into Howard Road (terminus), afterwards. This route was also followed by Kings Heath - Maypole - Solihull services in the 1970s and 80s.
IF I remember correctly, I think pressure from residents brought an end to buses using All Saints Road. If so, I doubt they would be able to return.
Seems Stagecoach have alot of mechanical issues with their buses. Quite a few journeys cancelled today on 41/46 and a few on the A9 mainly for that but a couple it seems for no drivers. How long are TFWM gonna let this carry on for?
Have they got the Chaserider bug, or is "mechanical failure" code for something else?
Quote from: BrumKev86 on February 22, 2023, 04:27:45 PMSeems Stagecoach have alot of mechanical issues with their buses. Quite a few journeys cancelled today on 41/46 and a few on the A9 mainly for that but a couple it seems for no drivers. How long are TFWM gonna let this carry on for?
Lets just say that TfWM are 'aware' and are 'monitoring' the situation closely.
Quote from: Stu on February 22, 2023, 07:03:31 PMLets just say that TfWM are 'aware' and are 'monitoring' the situation closely.
I appreciate TFWM coming out with that but we need a much stronger response. Stagecoach need to be given a time frame by if there is no reasonable improvement then the routes go back out to tender. We heard about the driver shortage but today there have been so many mechanical issues. So it's not just lack of drivers, it's failings with/within their vehicles or depots. I got the A9 this evening from Solihull and there were about 15 of us aboard which I thought was good but you have to ask if this persists will there be less and less passengers.
It's not just these new areas of Solihull and Birmingham, they were talking about Stagecoach on BBC CWR the other week in relation to Leamington. Lots of services getting cancelled, they talked about the X17. If they can't get Leamington right then what a hope in hell is there for new areas.
QuoteI appreciate TFWM coming out with that but we need a much stronger response. Stagecoach need to be given a time frame by if there is no reasonable improvement then the routes go back out to tender. We heard about the driver shortage but today there have been so many mechanical issues. So it's not just lack of drivers, it's failings with/within their vehicles or depots. I got the A9 this evening from Solihull and there were about 15 of us aboard which I thought was good but you have to ask if this persists will there be less and less passengers.
It's not just these new areas of Solihull and Birmingham, they were talking about Stagecoach on BBC CWR the other week in relation to Leamington. Lots of services getting cancelled, they talked about the X17. If they can't get Leamington right then what a hope in hell is there for new areas.
If Leamington isn't getting it right then how will Rugby get it right
Quote from: BrumKev86 on February 22, 2023, 09:18:46 PMI appreciate TFWM coming out with that but we need a much stronger response. Stagecoach need to be given a time frame by if there is no reasonable improvement then the routes go back out to tender. We heard about the driver shortage but today there have been so many mechanical issues. So it's not just lack of drivers, it's failings with/within their vehicles or depots. I got the A9 this evening from Solihull and there were about 15 of us aboard which I thought was good but you have to ask if this persists will there be less and less passengers.
It's not just these new areas of Solihull and Birmingham, they were talking about Stagecoach on BBC CWR the other week in relation to Leamington. Lots of services getting cancelled, they talked about the X17. If they can't get Leamington right then what a hope in hell is there for new areas.
There are several reasons for poor service
1) Vehicles breakdown so if the original bus breakdown in Brum, it's going to take an hour for a replacement bus to get Brum so services can continue, like wise it could take the same time for maintenance to get over to Brum and added time to fix bus.
2) Staff sickness, so first driver of the day could be off sick, and it could take a little extra time to get replacement driver so first two trips could be missed.
Would it not be easier to transfer the routes to Nuneaton from rugby as it would be less dead mileage
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on February 23, 2023, 07:53:05 PMWould it not be easier to transfer the routes to Nuneaton from rugby as it would be less dead mileage
It's possibly that Nuneaton doesn't have the drivers to spare and Rugby does.
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on February 23, 2023, 07:53:05 PMWould it not be easier to transfer the routes to Nuneaton from rugby as it would be less dead mileage
The plan is to transfer the routes to a new depot/outstation in Birmingham, I don't know how far away they are from achieving this ambition, but they are running out of time to get these services operating satisfactorily.
Quote from: BrumKev86 on February 22, 2023, 09:18:46 PMI appreciate TFWM coming out with that but we need a much stronger response. Stagecoach need to be given a time frame by if there is no reasonable improvement then the routes go back out to tender. We heard about the driver shortage but today there have been so many mechanical issues. So it's not just lack of drivers, it's failings with/within their vehicles or depots. I got the A9 this evening from Solihull and there were about 15 of us aboard which I thought was good but you have to ask if this persists will there be less and less passengers.
It's not just these new areas of Solihull and Birmingham, they were talking about Stagecoach on BBC CWR the other week in relation to Leamington. Lots of services getting cancelled, they talked about the X17. If they can't get Leamington right then what a hope in hell is there for new areas.
What response do you expect?
The larger operator in the TfWM area has been no better of late!
QuoteThe plan is to transfer the routes to a new depot/outstation in Birmingham, I don't know how far away they are from achieving this ambition, but they are running out of time to get these services operating satisfactorily.
I believe they will try to keep using rugbys buses for Birmingham, however use a depot in Birmingham and move the drivers / buses & engineers to the new depot
Again another driver I've had to try and tell me Nbus pass is invalid on the 41... absolute joke I'be never had an issue with them on the 82/87/88. Any idea why this is?
Quote from: Jack on February 25, 2023, 01:20:22 PMAgain another driver I've had to try and tell me Nbus pass is invalid on the 41... absolute joke I'be never had an issue with them on the 82/87/88. Any idea why this is?
Probably not been informed by the depot manager about it covering there services
Or is it the ticket machine that rejects it?
Quote from: mikestone on February 25, 2023, 04:25:18 PMOr is it the ticket machine that rejects it?
Exactly, they've been on the 41 long enough to know that Nbus passes are valid.
Quote from: Jack on February 25, 2023, 01:20:22 PMAgain another driver I've had to try and tell me Nbus pass is invalid on the 41... absolute joke I'be never had an issue with them on the 82/87/88. Any idea why this is?
Is it a paper ticket/NX App or is it a swift card?
Quote from: MW on February 25, 2023, 04:36:20 PMIs it a paper ticket/NX App or is it a swift card?
Swift. They seem to accept the app but not the cards, their drivers also need to learn some respect too, shouting saying it's my card and not the machine. Also the bus advertises it accepts Nbus swift...
Quote from: Jack on February 25, 2023, 04:52:42 PMSwift. They seem to accept the app but not the cards, their drivers also need to learn some respect too, shouting saying it's my card and not the machine. Also the bus advertises it accepts Nbus swift...
With Swift, on Ticketer, if you've got an NX ticket, the machine says Invalid or to that effect. I'm assuming it's showing the nbus ticket as invalid.
There is a function, again on Ticketer, where you can view what ticket is loaded on the card, as sometimes it can be an error.
Stagecoach machines; I've got no idea though.
From the drivers point of view, it must be showing Invalid, so he rightly believes that he is correct, even though he isn't.
I've used my Swift Nbus card on all the operators with Ticketer and it's been accepted, even on the routes in Solihull. They've obviously not updated their machines because I know it's happened to a few others. But still they are a joke, drivers stopping for a chat in the middle of Stratford Road was great.
Quote from: Jack on February 25, 2023, 04:52:42 PMSwift. They seem to accept the app but not the cards, their drivers also need to learn some respect too, shouting saying it's my card and not the machine. Also the bus advertises it accepts Nbus swift...
I've had that on Diamond between Bloxwich & Walsall, where my Nx branded Swiftcard didn't work, so I think 'Great, my card's f'd!', but it magically works on the NX 529, & bear in mind my card is preloaded with Nbus tickets, to save the faffing about between operators!
QuoteSwift. They seem to accept the app but not the cards, their drivers also need to learn some respect too, shouting saying it's my card and not the machine. Also the bus advertises it accepts Nbus swift...
Their drivers are really rude I agree with you
There was a meeting at Hobs Moat Library last week involving local residents and representatives from Stagecoach and TFWM to address people's concerns of the A9 service. Below is what was posted from a local councilior regarding the meeting:
Bus Meeting Minutes
Attendees
Richard Hardman - TfWM (Transport for West Midlands) Network and Subsidized Service Co-ordination
Dominic Davidson - TfWM Day to day bus service planning manager
Kam Gill - Stage Coach
Richard - Stage Coach Operations Manager
Charlie - Stage Coach Ticket Inspector
Why have we seen all these changes?
The government made it a legal requirement for a review of the entire bus network to be carried out by the 1st January 2023. This was when government post Covid subsidies came to an end and TfWM had to create a network that was financially viable without those subsidies. With the ending of these subsidies, some providers chose to withdraw services. This included both the 32 and 58.
The review left TfWM trying to mobilise 120 routes within 3 months (get a new provider ready to run a (new) route). This is the most intensive change they have ever tried to deliver. They weren't able to consult on the changes because the timelines were too tight, which meant there wasn't time to communicate.
Why was there a poor start to the A9 reliability and what are Stage Coach doing to tackle it?
By the time, Stage Coach were informed of their successful bid for the A9, they only had 3 weeks to get all the buses and recruit 42 drivers to run the service. This is their first venture into the West Midlands, so they are currently running services out of Rugby, which means driver have to drive over an hour before starting to run their first route.
This resulted in some no shows and discouraged drivers from joining them. They have had to rely on agency drivers. Action has been taken to address staffing levels and most of the missing routes are now being caused by breakdowns as opposed to staffing shortages
Stage Coach are looking for a local base and believe that when they relocate this should reduce their difficulties with attracting and retaining drivers.
Why didn't National Express bid to run the A9?
They declined to bid, because they are experiencing a nationwide shortage of drivers.
Bus Stop Signage Issues - TfWM have indicated that all bus stops should now have timetables and correct signage. However residents raised concerns about inconsistently labelled bus stops on Richmond Road, bus stops on Coverdale Road saying not in use, despite having a service, bus stops on Highwood Avenue and Summerfield Road having misleading directional signage. There was also a request to reinstate the bus stop in the middle of Dummerfield Road. TfWM have agreed to undertake a review of bus stop signage around Lyndon and address the issues.
TfWM had 10,000 bus stops to update and they prioritised those stops losing services
Could the A9 go up Highwood Avenue?
One of the reasons for supporting meetings like these is to get feedback. We will look into this.
Why doesn't the A16 go to Solihull?
(If TfWM hadn't got the message before that people want to go to Solihull, they certainly have now). The reason for the re-route was to cover the bit of the route that would otherwise have lost a service, when the 32 was withdrawn.
Why doesn't the A9 bus scanners read the Nbus pass?
The scanners work differently to those in National Express buses. On the national express buses you have to tap the pass on stage coach buses, you hover the pass above the machine.
Why are some Stage Coach fares more expensive?
Bus utilities have gone up 56%. Fuel is up 15.6% and wages up 10% (wages represent 46% of costs). This is making it really challenging for bus companies to hold fares. There is lots of work going on around fares
Is coventry not part of the west midlands in stagecoachs eyes?
Ooh I saw an elusive Stagecoach sat in Chelmsley Wood this morning (out of service), presumably for the 0910 71.
Never seen the 46 so busy, just seen one leave Weoley Castle absolutely full...
Quote from: MasterPlan on March 20, 2023, 07:41:09 AMNever seen the 46 so busy, just seen one leave Weoley Castle absolutely full...
NXWM are on strike.
I am aware of that lol. I'm just saying I bet Stagecoach are rubbing their hands at this.
SC should have brought some of the deckers up from Cheltenham Gold Cup they used last week. Could have made a fortune!
Just seen GEY absolutely full, quite rare to see this
QuoteSC should have brought some of the deckers up from Cheltenham Gold Cup they used last week. Could have made a fortune!
Their all operated by Rugby so they can't
Quote from: BBS on March 20, 2023, 11:26:09 AMTheir all operated by Rugby so they can't
Cant they transfer them temporarily
QuoteCant they transfer them temporarily
Rugby can't have double decks, and other garages have driver shortages
Quote from: BBS on March 20, 2023, 01:27:45 PMRugby can't have double decks, and other garages have driver shortages
Rugby can have double decks - Tridents and Enviro 400s have been allocated in the past. However, whether the routes are cleared for double decks and whether the drivers are typed trained for double decks is another matter.
QuoteRugby can have double decks - Tridents and Enviro 400s have been allocated in the past. However, whether the routes are cleared for double decks and whether the drivers are typed trained for double decks is another matter.
All Birmingham routes except A9 can have Double Decks, not sure about 46 since that was changed
Quote from: BBS on March 20, 2023, 03:48:52 PMAll Birmingham routes except A9 can have Double Decks, not sure about 46 since that was changed
Upon checking the map and Google Street View, there is a railway bridge with a 14'9" clearance in Church Hill near Northfield Station which might be a problem. All other bridges pass over the canal or railway line.
Quote from: Rachvince53 on March 20, 2023, 08:38:00 PMUpon checking the map and Google Street View, there is a railway bridge with a 14'9" clearance in Church Hill near Northfield Station which might be a problem. All other bridges pass over the canal or railway line.
Why is a 14'9" bridge a problem? I think the Harry Potter Knight Bus is the only bus in the world taller than 14'9"
Quote from: Rachvince53 on March 20, 2023, 08:38:00 PMUpon checking the map and Google Street View, there is a railway bridge with a 14'9" clearance in Church Hill near Northfield Station which might be a problem. All other bridges pass over the canal or railway line.
I don't think that part of the route has changed much, in which case NX did used to use E400MMCs on the 46 route when they operated it.
The bridge on Robin Hood Lane in Hall Green that the NX 5 goes under using the same vehicles is 14' 3".
BC run under that bridge to on the 878 normally. Definite they will use double decks.
Quote from: MasterPlan on March 20, 2023, 07:41:09 AMNever seen the 46 so busy, just seen one leave Weoley Castle absolutely full...
Saw an A9 going up Lode Lane absolutely rammed about 4ish. Wasn't a major surprise as I don't think any NX services are running up Lode Lane.
Quote from: BrumKev86 on March 21, 2023, 05:31:28 PMSaw an A9 going up Lode Lane absolutely rammed about 4ish. Wasn't a major surprise as I don't think any NX services are running up Lode Lane.
I think the X2 is the only NX service running along there during the strike.
Quote from: Rachvince53 on March 21, 2023, 09:09:10 PMI think the X2 is the only NX service running along there during the strike.
X2 is not running. Even the 877 along there is not running.
BC are running 97 and X21 only.
QuoteI think the X2 is the only NX service running along there during the strike.
X2 isn't being operated
Quote from: 2206 on March 21, 2023, 09:10:11 PMX2 is not running. Even the 877 along there is not running.
BC are running 97 and X21 only.
My mistake, bustimes.org is showing one bus tracking as an X2 (6948).
Quote from: Rachvince53 on March 22, 2023, 12:43:57 PMMy mistake, bustimes.org is showing one bus tracking as an X2 (6948).
At BC Garage.
QuoteAt BC Garage.
To be fair, it's been tracking like that since day one of the stike. I wonder if the electrics are still on
Anyway, getting this back on topic now...
I've been working from home today, and walking up to the shops this morning, I saw a bus on the 169 that actually had passengers on!
OK, so there were only 3 on board, but that's still 3 more than the last few times I've seen this bus in Billesley!
Quote from: Stu on March 23, 2023, 05:46:39 PMAnyway, getting this back on topic now...
I've been working from home today, and walking up to the shops this morning, I saw a bus on the 169 that actually had passengers on!
OK, so there were only 3 on board, but that's still 3 more than the last few times I've seen this bus in Billesley!
169's this week have been busy out of Solihull seen some with a decent load, the 76 not running has probably helped them.
Even the Green Bus 871 has been taking passengers including members of the public who have brought tickets through the my trip app. & Seen the 110 come into Town full to.
Think the strike has probably been good for non NX operators.
I imagine arriva have been raking it on the Sutton corridor. Good on them I say
Quote from: Trident 4194 on March 23, 2023, 06:42:28 PMI imagine arriva have been raking it on the Sutton corridor. Good on them I say
The one I had yesterday was rammed full, surprised the Pulsars have been out as they would be leaving people standing at stops.
Quote from: Trident 4194 on March 23, 2023, 06:42:28 PMI imagine arriva have been raking it on the Sutton corridor. Good on them I say
The one I photographed in the morning peak yesterday had a very sparse load on
Arriva 4407 (wmbusphotos.com) (http://www.wmbusphotos.com/Arriva/4407.html)
Quote from: Trident 4194 on March 23, 2023, 06:42:28 PMI imagine arriva have been raking it on the Sutton corridor. Good on them I say
They probably have......
Quote from: Trident 4194 on March 23, 2023, 06:42:28 PMI imagine arriva have been raking it on the Sutton corridor. Good on them I say
Quite a few were pretty much empty yesterday that I saw heading into Birmingham on the expressway
Meanwhile, the last A9 leaving Solihull at 18:40 for Blythe Valley has just shot past me in Cheswick Green running 7 mins early...
https://bustimes.org/services/a9-kinghurst-blyth-valley-park/vehicles?date=2023-03-25#journeys/404335769
Quote from: BBS on March 20, 2023, 01:27:45 PMRugby can't have double decks, and other garages have driver shortages
Just come past Rugby garage on the train and there's at least two Enviro 400 parked in there
QuoteRugby can't have double decks, and other garages have driver shortages
Yes they can, they used to have them on 63 and 64. The Leamington deckers go there for work and MOTs. If they can't have double deckers, why do they have the megabus buses in there which are JUST slightly shorter than normal double deckers
QuoteYes they can, they used to have them on 63 and 64. The Leamington deckers go there for work and MOTs. If they can't have double deckers, why do they have the megabus buses in there which are JUST slightly shorter than normal double deckers
So can't they get Enviro 400s now? Also I'm not too smart in Stagecoach but didn't rugby have those darts
Quote from: BBS on March 25, 2023, 08:12:03 PMSo can't they get Enviro 400s now? Also I'm not too smart in Stagecoach but didn't rugby have those darts
The routes in Rugby don't need double deckers, hence why they all have single deckers. There's no demand for double deckers in rugby. They did have darts, don't know if they've got them anymore. When me and my mrs both worked there back in 2021, they had them
Quote from: MW on March 25, 2023, 06:49:58 PMMeanwhile, the last A9 leaving Solihull at 18:40 for Blythe Valley has just shot past me in Cheswick Green running 7 mins early...
https://bustimes.org/services/a9-kinghurst-blyth-valley-park/vehicles?date=2023-03-25#journeys/404335769
I had that driver earlier today and he doesn't wait in timing points. We were running early on his previous run.
36482 appears to be on the A9 today and is driving around with "Not in Service" on the front dest and blank on side/rear. No paper displays either.
Looks like Stagecoach services are also back to 'normal' today! :laugh:
https://twitter.com/StagecoachMids/status/1640220259754946562
Quote from: Stu on March 27, 2023, 10:28:47 AMLooks like Stagecoach services are also back to 'normal' today! :laugh:
https://twitter.com/StagecoachMids/status/1640220259754946562
Don't worry, NXWMs are too! At least Stagecoach give their customers the heads up.
Quote from: Straightlines on March 27, 2023, 05:10:41 PMDon't worry, NXWMs are too! At least Stagecoach give their customers the heads up.
Nxbus do on there page
Quote from: Straightlines on March 27, 2023, 05:10:41 PMDon't worry, NXWMs are too! At least Stagecoach give their customers the heads up.
But how many people who go shopping, go to work or home from work, think I better check twitter to see if bus is running,
Quote from: Ginger66 on April 02, 2023, 11:09:34 AMBut how many people who go shopping, go to work or home from work, think I better check twitter to see if bus is running,
I use Twitter as part of everyday life, and so do many other people!
I'm more likely to see it on Twitter than I am hidden away on their website.
Quote from: GoldenSquid on March 25, 2023, 10:45:36 PMI had that driver earlier today and he doesn't wait in timing points. We were running early on his previous run.
Same driver, same time but two weeks later.
That same 18:40 A9 from Solihull to Blythe Valley has just shot past me in Cheswick Green running 5 mins early... does TfWM actually impose any penalties to them for this?
https://bustimes.org/services/a9-kinghurst-blyth-valley-park/vehicles?date=2023-04-08#journeys/410877637
Quote from: MW on April 08, 2023, 06:52:38 PMSame driver, same time but two weeks later.
That same 18:40 A9 from Solihull to Blythe Valley has just shot past me in Cheswick Green running 5 mins early... does TfWM actually impose any penalties to them for this?
https://bustimes.org/services/a9-kinghurst-blyth-valley-park/vehicles?date=2023-04-08#journeys/410877637
If TfWM's own service monitoring staff see early running then they will be penalised for it.
Currently sat on 36481 which is running 20 minutes late on the 46, and has to decided to miss out Weoley Castle and go straight up Shelley Fields Road without (to my knowledge) radioing in the depot...
Quote from: Jack on April 12, 2023, 01:44:24 PMCurrently sat on 36481 which is running 20 minutes late on the 46, and has to decided to miss out Weoley Castle and go straight up Shelley Fields Road without (to my knowledge) radioing in the depot...
In order to bring the service back on time or closer to the scheduled time?
The driver wouldn't need to radio the depot (do Stagecoach vehicles have radios?) however the depot would need to declare lost mileage to TfWM at some point.
Quote from: MW on April 12, 2023, 01:56:02 PMIn order to bring the service back on time or closer to the scheduled time?
The driver wouldn't need to radio the depot (do Stagecoach vehicles have radios?) however the depot would need to declare lost mileage to TfWM at some point.
I guess the driver will call ruby to inform them
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on April 12, 2023, 02:24:08 PMI guess the driver will call ruby to inform them
I presume Ruby will pass the message on?
QuoteCurrently sat on 36481 which is running 20 minutes late on the 46, and has to decided to miss out Weoley Castle and go straight up Shelley Fields Road without (to my knowledge) radioing in the depot...
This happens alot on the 41, the bus skips the entire Acocks green area and goes into fox hollies road where it then goes on Stockfield road and head to heartlands
Quote from: BBS on April 14, 2023, 01:40:22 PMThis happens alot on the 41, the bus skips the entire Acocks green area and goes into fox hollies road where it then goes on Stockfield road and head to heartlands
This is no way to operate a bus service. Prospective passengers in the bypassed section (or who wanted to get off in it) should complain to TfWM. Only way to deal with cowboy operations like this!
Quote from: don on April 14, 2023, 08:55:06 PMThis is no way to operate a bus service. Prospective passengers in the bypassed section (or who wanted to get off in it) should complain to TfWM. Only way to deal with cowboy operations like this!
After speaking to a Stagecoach driver about their terrible service, he said to me that it's the Agency drivers who couldn't care less disrupting the services. Stagecoach Rugby are no longer recruiting agency drivers apparently. Those who remain aren't having their contracts renewed/extended. Let's hope it doesn't take them back to driver shortages.
I hear that plans to open a depot in Birmingham have been postponed until early next year. How true that is, I don't know.
Quote from: BBS on April 14, 2023, 01:40:22 PMThis happens alot on the 41, the bus skips the entire Acocks green area and goes into fox hollies road where it then goes on Stockfield road and head to heartlands
What didn't help is the bus was already arriving into Kings Heath Late by about 8 minutes, and now has to use the entire High Street to turn round which is obviously slow moving so that's added pressure and time to the route too.
Least they now accept NBus!
In another stunning endorsement for deregulation this afternoon, the last two A9 services to Kingshurst (& thus the return trips) failed to operate...
Quote from: Isle of Stroma on April 19, 2023, 07:33:26 PMIn another stunning endorsement for deregulation this afternoon, the last two A9 services to Kingshurst (& thus the return trips) failed to operate...
As they are tendered journies would it be any different under Manchester's Franchised version?
No driver = no buses, whether they are regulated or deregulated. I paid for a large deposit on my house from driving uncovered duties in WMPTE days. In the 1980s WMPTE was deleting as many miles as private operators are now.
It's been a shocking week on the services this week with loads of buses not running due to there operational issue.
QuoteAs they are tendered journies would it be any different under Manchester's Franchised version?
No driver = no buses, whether they are regulated or deregulated. I paid for a large deposit on my house from driving uncovered duties in WMPTE days. In the 1980s WMPTE was deleting as many miles as private operators are now.
Dunno. All I can say Is I'm not aware of the PTE relying unsuccessfully on agency Drivers from miles away. Nor did the PTE STILL fail to provide correct bus stop timetable information 4 months into a service. Nor did they outsource services to a major third party depot with woeful staff shortages & abysmal FTO figures in the first place.
Not that it was Stagecoach who were solely to blame. Finding the last two Kingshurst going AWOL made me all nostalgic about AG's operation of the 58...
I abandoned all hope of catching the last one back from Yardley when I saw that it was tracking on the A45 near Allesley heading back to Rugby. :wink:
Quote from: Isle of Stroma on April 19, 2023, 08:03:59 PMDunno. All I can say Is I'm not aware of the PTE relying unsuccessfully on agency Drivers from miles away. Nor did the PTE STILL fail to provide correct bus stop timetable information 4 months into a service. Nor did they outsource services to a major third party depot with woeful staff shortages & abysmal FTO figures in the first place.
Not that it was Stagecoach who were solely to blame. Finding the last two Kingshurst going AWOL made me all nostalgic about AG's operation of the 58...
I abandoned all hope of catching the last one back from Yardley when I saw that it was tracking on the A45 near Allesley heading back to Rugby. :wink:
Have you made a complaint to tfwm and stagecoach or just whinging on here
Quote from: Isle of Stroma on April 19, 2023, 08:03:59 PMDunno. All I can say Is I'm not aware of the PTE relying unsuccessfully on agency Drivers from miles away. Nor did the PTE STILL fail to provide correct bus stop timetable information 4 months into a service. Nor did they outsource services to a major third party depot with woeful staff shortages & abysmal FTO figures in the first place.
Not that it was Stagecoach who were solely to blame. Finding the last two Kingshurst going AWOL made me all nostalgic about AG's operation of the 58...
I abandoned all hope of catching the last one back from Yardley when I saw that it was tracking on the A45 near Allesley heading back to Rugby. :wink:
WMPTE didn't bring in agency drivers, couldn't be bothered with things like that, much easier to delete hundreds of hours of mileage. I could literally walk into any WMPTE garage any day and have my choice of what route I wanted to drive and what time I would work it was that bad. One week in 1985 when I was off from my wages job I did 80 hours overtime. As for timetables most bus stops in PTE days didn't have any timetable information on them, let alone up to date ones.
As for contracting routes out to opertors who couldn't run them properly remember Mid-Warwickshire motors?
QuoteHave you made a complaint to tfwm and stagecoach or just whinging on here
Both.
QuoteWMPTE didn't bring in agency drivers, couldn't be bothered with things like that, much easier to delete hundreds of hours of mileage. I could literally walk into any WMPTE garage any day and have my choice of what route I wanted to drive and what time I would work it was that bad. One week in 1985 when I was off from my wages job I did 80 hours overtime. As for timetables most bus stops in PTE days didn't have any timetable information on them, let alone up to date ones.
As for contracting routes out to opertors who couldn't run them properly remember Mid-Warwickshire motors?
MWM were a major operator???
Twitter is saying a number of cancellations this morning
https://twitter.com/StagecoachMids
Noticed today the A9 appears to run through the new estate at Blythe Valley and doesn't enter the way the A7/A8 do through the bus gate.
As well as using the Ilshaw Heath Road which was unused/unserved prior to January.
Quote from: 2206 on May 28, 2023, 12:22:05 AMNoticed today the A9 appears to run through the new estate at Blythe Valley and doesn't enter the way the A7/A8 do through the bus gate.
As well as using the Ilshaw Heath Road which was unused/unserved prior to January.
It's always gone that way.
Quote from: Stu on May 28, 2023, 10:22:50 AMIt's always gone that way.
Bus times strangely appears to be showing a revised stopping timetable from June 2023.
Blossomfield Road and Stratford Road stops.
Instead of Cheswick Green and Illshaw Heath Road.
https://bustimes.org/stops/43000154601?date=2023-06-06&time=08%3A00
https://bustimes.org/trips/271585494#stop-time-14917726548
Is that some sort of error in the timetable?
Also the 169 timetable seems to show it curtailed at Solihull.
Quote from: 2206 on May 28, 2023, 11:49:40 AMBus times strangely appears to be showing a revised stopping timetable from June 2023.
Blossomfield Road and Stratford Road stops.
Instead of Cheswick Green and Illshaw Heath Road.
https://bustimes.org/stops/43000154601?date=2023-06-06&time=08%3A00
https://bustimes.org/trips/271585494#stop-time-14917726548
Is that some sort of error in the timetable?
Also the 169 timetable seems to show it curtailed at Solihull.
Yes, it looks like there are changes to the A9 and 169, probably to help with reliability.
Pretty poor that there is nothing about this on either the Stagecoach or TfWM websites, though the new timetables are on the TfWM website and seem to concur with what is shown on BusTimes.
Quote from: Stu on May 28, 2023, 02:03:12 PMYes, it looks like there are changes to the A9 and 169, probably to help with reliability.
Pretty poor that there is nothing about this on either the Stagecoach or TfWM websites, though the new timetables are on the TfWM website and seem to concur with what is shown on BusTimes.
I wonder if its just a 'data error' now, as there are no 'variations' registered for either service.
https://www.vehicle-operator-licensing.service.gov.uk/search/find-registered-local-bus-services/details/606903/
https://www.vehicle-operator-licensing.service.gov.uk/search/find-registered-local-bus-services/details/606905/
Strangely, these and other TfWM contracts show a status of 'Admin Cancelled' from 25th Feb.
Quote from: Stu on May 28, 2023, 04:09:17 PMI wonder if its just a 'data error' now, as there are no 'variations' registered for either service.
https://www.vehicle-operator-licensing.service.gov.uk/search/find-registered-local-bus-services/details/606903/
https://www.vehicle-operator-licensing.service.gov.uk/search/find-registered-local-bus-services/details/606905/
Strangely, these and other TfWM contracts show a status of 'Admin Cancelled' from 25th Feb.
Could have TFWM terminated the contract due to poor performance?
It also appears on the new timetable the a9 goes up knighstbridge Road
Quote from: Stu on May 28, 2023, 04:09:17 PMStrangely, these and other TfWM contracts show a status of 'Admin Cancelled' from 25th Feb.
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on May 28, 2023, 04:27:11 PMCould have TFWM terminated the contract due to poor performance?
Actually I just remembered that TfWM themselves are now responsible for bus service registrations within the West Midlands, so that'll be why all West Mids bus services show as 'Admin Cancelled' on the VOLS website.
Still, nothing listed on the TfWM website:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/who-we-are/what-we-do/bus-services/bus-service-registrations-within-the-west-midlands/
QuoteI wonder if its just a 'data error' now, as there are no 'variations' registered for either service.
https://www.vehicle-operator-licensing.service.gov.uk/search/find-registered-local-bus-services/details/606903/
https://www.vehicle-operator-licensing.service.gov.uk/search/find-registered-local-bus-services/details/606905/
Strangely, these and other TfWM contracts show a status of 'Admin Cancelled' from 25th Feb.
If its services ran wholly within the TfWM area, then its no longer DVSA who administer bus service registrations, TfWM have had the powers devolved.
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/who-we-are/what-we-do/bus-services/bus-service-registrations-within-the-west-midlands/
EDIT - I didn't see your later post, sorry.
Quote from: Stu on May 28, 2023, 02:03:12 PMPretty poor that there is nothing about this on either the Stagecoach or TfWM websites, though the new timetables are on the TfWM website and seem to concur with what is shown on BusTimes.
Now showing on the Upcoming Bus Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/
Still no response to my tweet sent to Stagecoach and TfWM.
Quote from: Stu on May 30, 2023, 07:14:10 PMNow showing on the Upcoming Bus Service Changes page:
https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/
Still no response to my tweet sent to Stagecoach and TfWM.
New A9 seems very similar to the old S9 route mostly, very different to the current route. Using Stratford Road and Blossomfield Road.
Though I wonder if eventually the A7/A8 may be altered to serve the new estate and the A9 to go back to just doing what the 58 did.
Just heard about the crash of the Stagecoach E200, quite unfortunate
Quote from: 2206 on May 30, 2023, 09:50:03 PMNew A9 seems very similar to the old S9 route mostly, very different to the current route. Using Stratford Road and Blossomfield Road.
Though I wonder if eventually the A7/A8 may be altered to serve the new estate and the A9 to go back to just doing what the 58 did.
Also, the new 169 will be very similar to Diamond's 69 which it replaced at the start of the year.
I would expect that the A9 will continue to run through to Blythe Valley, because it provides a link between North Solihull and a large employment area in South Solihull.
Quote from: 2206 on May 30, 2023, 09:50:03 PMNew A9 seems very similar to the old S9 route mostly, very different to the current route. Using Stratford Road and Blossomfield Road.
Similar, but not quite the same, the S9/166 used to operate directly along Blossomfield Road and Marshall Lake Road to Stratford Road, the A9 will deviate along Cranmore Boulevard.
Quote from: 2206 on May 28, 2023, 11:49:40 AMBus times strangely appears to be showing a revised stopping timetable from June 2023.
Blossomfield Road and Stratford Road stops.
Instead of Cheswick Green and Illshaw Heath Road.
https://bustimes.org/stops/43000154601?date=2023-06-06&time=08%3A00
https://bustimes.org/trips/271585494#stop-time-14917726548
Is that some sort of error in the timetable?
Also the 169 timetable seems to show it curtailed at Solihull.
No that's the revised service beginning 3rd June and according to TfWM is at the request of Shirley residents.
Quote from: BBS on May 31, 2023, 08:04:55 PMJust heard about the crash of the Stagecoach E200, quite unfortunate
Seems to me like it's not the bus drivers fault. Looks like car swerved into the path of the bus.
Hopefully, everyone is okay!
QuoteSeems to me like it's not the bus drivers fault. Looks like car swerved into the path of the bus.
Hopefully, everyone is okay!
Heard that there were 6 injuries
Quote from: BBS on June 01, 2023, 05:19:22 PMHeard that there were 6 injuries
Correct, one serious. As you say the photo suggests the car swerved into the path of the bus.
QuoteCorrect, one serious. As you say the photo suggests the car swerved into the path of the bus.
So is there any chances of That bus surviving? I see it's a ex leamington which just joined rugby
Quote from: BBS on June 01, 2023, 08:06:35 PMSo is there any chances of That bus surviving? I see it's a ex leamington which just joined rugby
I've seen far worse damaged than this repaired-one of them locally to me in South Wales.
Quote from: BBS on June 01, 2023, 08:06:35 PMSo is there any chances of That bus surviving? I see it's a ex leamington which just joined rugby
Quote from: markcf83 on June 02, 2023, 03:39:07 PMI've seen far worse damaged than this repaired-one of them locally to me in South Wales.
The vehicle is coming up to ten years old now, the front end looks pretty wrecked from the photos I've seen, I'd think it highly unlikely that Stagecoach would consider paying to have this repaired/rebuilt.
QuoteThe vehicle is coming up to ten years old now, the front end looks pretty wrecked from the photos I've seen, I'd think it highly unlikely that Stagecoach would consider paying to have this repaired/rebuilt.
Judging the damage the Price of repair is also looking quite hefty
Quote from: Stu on June 02, 2023, 05:23:11 PMThe vehicle is coming up to ten years old now, the front end looks pretty wrecked from the photos I've seen, I'd think it highly unlikely that Stagecoach would consider paying to have this repaired/rebuilt.
If it's cheap enough to repair, they'd rather pay that than lose a bus which would result in reshuffling buses across the SC Midlands network
Quote from: mrboshell on June 02, 2023, 07:19:18 PMIf it's cheap enough to repair, they'd rather pay that than lose a bus which would result in reshuffling buses across the SC Midlands network
That will not be cheap
Quote from: Tony on June 02, 2023, 07:25:31 PMThat will not be cheap
Sadly, that is very true!
Just come across another petition on Facebook for the 46 to return to its original route..
Any Update on KGF, will it be repaired or written off?
The driver of 36482 has just said he doesn't know the new route of the 169... nice training...
https://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-12/07/2023-10:05:04:988
Route 46 is getting a timetable/route change, and a 46A variant between QE and Hawkeley introduced at the request of TfWM.
Quotehttps://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-12/07/2023-10:05:04:988
Route 46 is getting a timetable/route change, and a 46A variant between QE and Hawkeley introduced at the request of TfWM.
This also going to be Stagecoach too right
Quote from: ellspurs on July 19, 2023, 08:20:04 PMhttps://www.stagecoachbus.com/service-updates/serviceupdatesarticle?SituationId=ID-12/07/2023-10:05:04:988
Route 46 is getting a timetable/route change, and a 46A variant between QE and Hawkeley introduced at the request of TfWM.
Bustimes shows one of the changes as being a rerouting in Northfield. It will now run along the stretch of the Bristol Rd next to the shopping centre which is an improvement. Perhaps the shorter workings will help the reliability too.
In a surprising turn, TfWM have actually provided a lot more information (https://www.tfwm.org.uk/plan-your-journey/ways-to-travel/buses-in-the-west-midlands/upcoming-bus-service-changes/) about this change:
Quote from: TfWMFrom July 21st Stagecoach will be operating a revised timetable on service 46 to address the poor punctuality and travel demand on the service.
* Monday to Saturday, buses will run hourly between Kings Heath and Queen Elizabeth Hospital via Hawkesley. On the opposite half hour, short journeys will operate between Hawkesley and Queen Elizabeth Hospital.
* The route between Kings Norton and Hawkesley is amended slightly with Masshouse Lane now being served along with more of Shannon Road and Longdales Road.
* Last buses Monday to Saturday will be approximately two hours earlier with last bus from Queen Elizabeth Hospital at 21:30, due to extremely limited usage being made of later journeys.
* Sunday buses will operate between Brandwood End and Kings Heath direct along Brandwood Road, not serving the Doversley Road loop due to extremely limited use on this loop on Sundays and to make the schedule more robust.
We apologise to customers who have been affected by poor punctuality in recent months and expect that this change will significantly improve the service with the timetable much more closely matching traffic conditions. It was not viable to add another bus on the road into the timetable and so the half hourly frequency could not be maintained across the full route. Our analysis was that the Kings Heath to Kings Norton section is less well used and so reducing this section to hourly minimised the overall impact on customers, with our over-riding priority being to improve punctuality.
A number of Stagecoach drivers are saying their management has informed them of 9 new services in the Birmingham area from October...
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 05:57:27 PMA number of Stagecoach drivers are saying their management has informed them of 9 new services in the Birmingham area from October...
Lots of routes out to tender, I would imagine stagecoach have bid, but bids only had to be in this week so they will not have a clue if they have won them
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 05:57:27 PMA number of Stagecoach drivers are saying their management has informed them of 9 new services in the Birmingham area from October...
Interesting, maybe contract tender wins, but I would have thought it was too soon to have bid on and successfully won those contracts?
Also I would have thought that Stagecoach would have wanted to establish a depot/base in Birmingham before trying to take on any additional work here, unless something is very imminent?
Quote from: Tony on July 29, 2023, 06:11:16 PMLots of routes out to tender, I would imagine stagecoach have bid, but bids only had to be in this week so they will not have a clue if they have won them
The deadline was Friday 14th July.
TfWM tend to inform winners before it's officially announced, but once the bids are in that they are the "preferred bidder".
It may well be true.
Is there a way to see which routes are out for tender?
Quote from: BK63 YWP on July 29, 2023, 06:42:38 PMIs there a way to see which routes are out for tender?
530 Wolverhampton
19 Walsall
88 Stourbridge
13 Halesowen
A10 Solihull
62 62A Wolverhampton
22 Walsall
23 Bloxwich
66 Stone Cross
74 Walsall
20 21 Bearwood
64 Wednesbury
23 Wednesbury
303 Bilston
223 Bilston
25 Castle Vale
60 Warwick Uni
96 BHX
45 Walsall
A7 A8 Solihull
703 Arena Retail Park
002 Weoley Castle
There isn't actually 9 Birmingham area services. Perhaps it's 9 tender wins, or perhaps it's bollocks.
Those are the services anyway.
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 07:24:50 PM530 Wolverhampton
19 Walsall
88 Stourbridge
13 Halesowen
A10 Solihull
62 62A Wolverhampton
22 Walsall
23 Bloxwich
66 Stone Cross
74 Walsall
20 21 Bearwood
64 Wednesbury
23 Wednesbury
303 Bilston
223 Bilston
25 Castle Vale
60 Warwick Uni
96 BHX
45 Walsall
A7 A8 Solihull
703 Arena Retail Park
002 Weoley Castle
There isn't actually 9 Birmingham area services. Perhaps it's 9 tender wins, or perhaps it's bollocks.
Those are the services anyway.
I'll be surprised if any company other then stagecoach win the 2 Coventry routes
Just the 25 without including the 600? Or have they integrated the routes.
And imagine if Stagecoach win those routes on the other side of Walsall/Wolverhampton? They'll be needing to trundle up the a5 to get to them if they don't wish to take the motorway.
Quote from: Coventrybususer95 on July 29, 2023, 07:26:09 PMI'll be surprised if any company other then stagecoach win the 2 Coventry routes
Why not NXC?
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 07:24:50 PM530 Wolverhampton
19 Walsall
88 Stourbridge
13 Halesowen
A10 Solihull
62 62A Wolverhampton
22 Walsall
23 Bloxwich
66 Stone Cross
74 Walsall
20 21 Bearwood
64 Wednesbury
23 Wednesbury
303 Bilston
223 Bilston
25 Castle Vale
60 Warwick Uni
96 BHX
45 Walsall
A7 A8 Solihull
703 Arena Retail Park
002 Weoley Castle
There isn't actually 9 Birmingham area services. Perhaps it's 9 tender wins, or perhaps it's bollocks.
Those are the services anyway.
Is all the 19 tendered or just the Sunday service?
I know Nx had the one part after Igo, but can't remember the circumstances of them getting the other part.
Quote from: ellspurs on July 29, 2023, 07:30:07 PMJust the 25 without including the 600? Or have they integrated the routes.
And imagine if Stagecoach win those routes on the other side of Walsall/Wolverhampton? They'll be needing to trundle up the a5 to get to them if they don't wish to take the motorway.
The 25 was being merged / butchered together with another South Birmingham route
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 07:24:50 PMThere isn't actually 9 Birmingham area services. Perhaps it's 9 tender wins, or perhaps it's bollocks.
For office people based elsewhere with no/little knowledge of the West Midlands region, all of those services listed would be considered 'Birmingham area'. :laugh:
Realistically, they may have a chance at the 002, 25, 96 and the A7/A8/A10 Solihull services.
But seriously what are TfWM doing entertaining bids from bus operators who don't have an established operating centre in the area?
Quote from: Westy on July 29, 2023, 08:18:22 PMIs all the 19 tendered or just the Sunday service?
I know Nx had the one part after Igo, but can't remember the circumstances of them getting the other part.
The 19 is two separate tenders, one for the Monday to Saturday service and the other for Sundays. Not sure which one(s) are up for tender in this round though.
Quote from: Stu on July 29, 2023, 08:42:06 PMBut seriously what are TfWM doing entertaining bids from bus operators who don't have an established operating centre in the area?
It's purely down to price. The cheapest bidder wins. Stagecoach are utilising heavily depreciated 10 year old Enviro 200s which have been upgraded to Euro 6 (don't quote me on it but my presumption is that they've been upgraded for the Manchester Clean Air Zone, but of course with franchising kicking in and a large amount of new vehicles due in that region, there must be a hell of a lot of surplus vehicles).
Anyway, my point being is that these vehicles don't owe Stagecoach much, so naturally on the fleet costing side, their tender bids are going to be lower than those operators who tend to commit to brand new/leased vehicles.
I would imagine that Stagecoach bids are tailored around the potential of having a local operating centre, with the excessive dead running costs being subsidised by their head office.
A bit of rough maths below for those interested:
At the moment, 90 minutes (and approx 30 miles) are given to travel from Rugby to Solihull on their running boards.
30 miles x 2 = 60 miles in dead runs per bus. That's around 22 litres of fuel. I can't remember the exact number of buses but let's say 10.
220 litres a day in dead fuel. Let's say £1 a litre. That's £220 a day.
Now let's talk drivers wages.
90 minutes x 2 = 180 dead minutes (3 hours).
3 hours x £19.75 (agency rate) = let's call it £60.
£60 x 10 buses is £600.
So that's around £820 in dead costs a day.
We're around 30 weeks since they won these services, which is 180 days (excluding Sundays).
£820 per day x 180 days = £147,600 in dead costs. Now surely even the more expensive storage yards locally for 10 vehicles aren't going to be nearly £150,000 for half a year.
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 06:14:41 PMThe deadline was Friday 14th July.
TfWM tend to inform winners before it's officially announced, but once the bids are in that they are the "preferred bidder".
It may well be true.
TfWM will inform the winning bidders a few weeks before they're due to start like normal...
Far too early for any Winning bidders to be notified.
Quote from: metrocity on July 29, 2023, 08:30:19 PMThe 25 was being merged / butchered together with another South Birmingham route
MW posted a route description in this thread. Serving Castle Vale, The Fort, Bromford, Ward End, Stechford, Heartlands and Small Heath.
https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?topic=6490.msg314570#msg314570
In part a return of the old 24/28A/93 route it seemed to.
Is the 600 being scrapped possibly?
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 07:24:50 PM530 Wolverhampton
19 Walsall
88 Stourbridge
13 Halesowen
A10 Solihull
62 62A Wolverhampton
22 Walsall
23 Bloxwich
66 Stone Cross
74 Walsall
20 21 Bearwood
64 Wednesbury
23 Wednesbury
303 Bilston
223 Bilston
25 Castle Vale
60 Warwick Uni
96 BHX
45 Walsall
A7 A8 Solihull
703 Arena Retail Park
002 Weoley Castle
There isn't actually 9 Birmingham area services. Perhaps it's 9 tender wins, or perhaps it's bollocks.
Those are the services anyway.
Is it just the evening and Sundays 96 up for tender? Diamond haven't had this for even a year yet.
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 05:57:27 PMA number of Stagecoach drivers are saying their management has informed them of 9 new services in the Birmingham area from October...
If so, here's hoping they have a base in the TfWM area sorted by then.
Of note is a number of TfWM tenders are up for renewal then, including the emergency ones on the routes Diamond wanted to withdraw commercially....which Diamond won on tender...
I'm gathering all of those were "emergency tenders" and this is the actual tender cycle.
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 07:24:50 PM530 Wolverhampton
19 Walsall
88 Stourbridge
13 Halesowen
A10 Solihull
62 62A Wolverhampton
22 Walsall
23 Bloxwich
66 Stone Cross
74 Walsall
20 21 Bearwood
64 Wednesbury
23 Wednesbury
303 Bilston
223 Bilston
25 Castle Vale
60 Warwick Uni
96 BHX
45 Walsall
A7 A8 Solihull
703 Arena Retail Park
002 Weoley Castle
There isn't actually 9 Birmingham area services. Perhaps it's 9 tender wins, or perhaps it's bollocks.
Those are the services anyway.
Is it all of the 002, or just Sundays?
Quote from: MW on July 29, 2023, 05:57:27 PMA number of Stagecoach drivers are saying their management has informed them of 9 new services in the Birmingham area from October...
Interesting...... 👀
This also gives Stagecoach a great reason into why they should have a garage in Birmingham. The current garage being rugby is a bit inefficient
Quote from: Westy on July 29, 2023, 08:18:22 PMIs all the 19 tendered or just the Sunday service?
I know Nx had the one part after Igo, but can't remember the circumstances of them getting the other part.
Whole route is now tendered. Previously operated by Diamond.
Quote from: ellspurs on July 29, 2023, 07:30:07 PMJust the 25 without including the 600? Or have they integrated the routes.
And imagine if Stagecoach win those routes on the other side of Walsall/Wolverhampton? They'll be needing to trundle up the a5 to get to them if they don't wish to take the motorway.
530 is one early morning journey from Wolves bus station (currently operated by Banga who also operate daytime services commercially from Bilston Street) plus eves and Sunday journeys operated by Diamond.
Operators have been informed this morning which routes they are preferred bidder on
Quote from: Rachvince53 on August 01, 2023, 10:38:36 AMWhole route is now tendered. Previously operated by Diamond.
Yes, but is it 2 separate tenders or the whole service is under one tender?
Quote from: Westy on August 01, 2023, 03:55:34 PMYes, but is it 2 separate tenders or the whole service is under one tender?
The contract has been combined into one and as such, the whole service went out to tender.
44 journeys a day (M-F), 42 on Saturday and 17 on Sunday.
It's from October 23 to October 26.
Vehicle spec was Euro 6 & 25 seats.
Quote from: MW on August 01, 2023, 04:00:24 PMThe contract has been combined into one and as such, the whole service went out to tender.
44 journeys a day (M-F), 42 on Saturday and 17 on Sunday.
It's from October 23 to October 26.
Vehicle spec was Euro 6 & 25 seats.
Be surprised if Nx keep it!
They withdrew it (319) back in 2010, when the North Walsall Review happened, then nearly anyone you can think of has operated the route since then!
It'd seem not all of the Stagecoach buses work with nBus passes, as 36427 did not accept my pass when I scanned it.
Quote from: GoldenSquid on August 08, 2023, 12:24:20 PMIt'd seem not all of the Stagecoach buses work with nBus passes, as 36427 did not accept my pass when I scanned it.
I think it's just 36427 as my bus pass works on every other vehicle i've been on so far apart from 36427
Quote from: Westy on August 01, 2023, 04:04:31 PMBe surprised if Nx keep it!
They withdrew it (319) back in 2010, when the North Walsall Review happened, then nearly anyone you can think of has operated the route since then!
Arriva combined it with their 560 at one point which extended it to Wolverhampton. The last full journey ran the last journey on another Arriva contract, the Wolves 64 (to Penn, Wakeley Hill).
Quote from: Rachvince53 on August 08, 2023, 03:10:18 PMArriva combined it with their 560 at one point which extended it to Wolverhampton. The last full journey ran the last journey on another Arriva contract, the Wolves 64 (to Penn, Wakeley Hill).
I remember catching it once.
A squeaky double decker ISTR!
Strikes for stagecoach in Birmingham as well
Quote from: Secondary trigger 28 on September 01, 2023, 04:39:13 PMStrikes for stagecoach in Birmingham as well
It's all of stagecoach midlands
46A destination displays have Hawkesley misspelt on them, but at least the stop flags have been updated to include the 46A now.
Is this 82/87/88 transfer to rugby true?
Quote from: BBS on September 14, 2023, 10:51:13 PMIs this 82/87/88 transfer to rugby true?
What transfer?
QuoteWhat transfer?
The routes to rugby garage? Some gu on Facebook claims the garage managers and drivers and everyone has told him
Quote from: BBS on September 15, 2023, 11:35:10 AMThe routes to rugby garage? Some gu on Facebook claims the garage managers and drivers and everyone has told him
If it was posted on Facebook, it must definitely be true. :huh:
Is it the same person who said 864 was on loan to WB when it wasn't? :laugh:
Anyway please remember that not everybody here is on Facebook, or a member of the various bus-related groups there.
Just went on Stagecoach 41, I used a Swift card which the driver didn't accept. He says it wasn't topped it which it definitely was as I renewed it last week. The driver told me I had to pay £2.30 even though my card was working perfectly as I just got off the NX 6. Stagecoach really need to do something with Swift card acceptance
Why was the fare £2.30? Are they not doing the £2 fare?
QuoteWhy was the fare £2.30? Are they not doing the £2 fare?
I'm not too sure, I only got on Stratford road and got off at Acocks green
Quote from: ellspurs on September 30, 2023, 04:08:36 PMWhy was the fare £2.30? Are they not doing the £2 fare?
41 is listed as an exempt service on the GOV website.
CSS, 7C, A9, 41, 46, 51, 169, 71, 20A, 11
https://www.gov.uk/guidance/2-bus-fare-cap#west-midlands
Remember a load of diamond services are exempt also.
https://wmbusphotos.com/forum/index.php?topic=11.msg311853#msg311853
Oh I remember that now. I thought they removed that "service starting after this date" thing when they extended it in July. I can't see anything saying that on gov.uk at the moment.
Quote from: BBS on September 30, 2023, 03:47:00 PMJust went on Stagecoach 41, I used a Swift card which the driver didn't accept. He says it wasn't topped it which it definitely was as I renewed it last week. The driver told me I had to pay £2.30 even though my card was working perfectly as I just got off the NX 6. Stagecoach really need to do something with Swift card acceptance
Just to clarify, what Swift card do you have?
QuoteJust to clarify, what Swift card do you have?
It's a Swift card including zone 1-5, along with a add-on which includes rugby
I have an nbus card and it plays up as well only works on certain stagecoach buses.
QuoteI have an nbus card and it plays up as well only works on certain stagecoach buses.
Mine worked perfectly fine on the Nuneaton buses
QuoteI have an nbus card and it plays up as well only works on certain stagecoach buses.
Unlike on NX/Diamond etc buses (where you hold the card on the reader), try holding the card 2-3 inches over the sensor.
- Works for me every time on Stagecoach Rugby vehicles :wink:
[EDIT] - & Nuneaton vehicles.
QuoteUnlike on NX/Diamond etc buses (where you hold the card on the reader), try holding the card 2-3 inches over the sensor.
- Works for me every time on Stagecoach Rugby vehicles :wink:
Let's have a try!
Do they use the same machines as Diamond?
Quote from: Westy on October 01, 2023, 11:43:31 AMDo they use the same machines as Diamond?
No.
Diamond, First, Arriva have ticketer. Stagecoach don't.
Quote from: Westy on October 01, 2023, 11:43:31 AMDo they use the same machines as Diamond?
stagecoach uses vix machines which i think only stagecoach uses
Quote from: EK40 on October 01, 2023, 01:14:58 PMstagecoach uses vix machines which i think only stagecoach uses
There're a lot slower than Init to issue tickets when paying by cash or contactless.
Quote from: suavegarv on October 01, 2023, 11:11:21 PMThere're a lot slower than Init to issue tickets when paying by cash or contactless.
I thought they were quite quick when I was a driver for leamington
Quote from: EK40 on October 01, 2023, 01:14:58 PMstagecoach uses vix machines which i think only stagecoach uses
According to my search on the Web, Centrebus, Grant Palmer and Big Lemon use vix machines too
I saw an A9 today travelling along the Chester Road towards Kingshurst. I was amused to see branding on the side of the bus, although I couldn't work out which branding it was. Looking at bustimes, it seems that it is the "D1/D2/D3" branded 37064.
Which brings me onto the 48 branded buses at Nuneaton. The 48 as its stated route hasn't existed since around the start of Covid, and the 148 (https://wmbu.org.uk/2023/03/coventry-service-changes-from-15th-april-2023/) started in April.
I haven't seen any attempt for them to change the branding on these, just a few have been repainted.
Quote from: ellspurs on October 16, 2023, 04:57:34 PMI saw an A9 today travelling along the Chester Road towards Kingshurst. I was amused to see branding on the side of the bus, although I couldn't work out which branding it was. Looking at bustimes, it seems that it is the "D1/D2/D3" branded 37064.
Which brings me onto the 48 branded buses at Nuneaton. The 48 as its stated route hasn't existed since around the start of Covid, and the 148 (https://wmbu.org.uk/2023/03/coventry-service-changes-from-15th-april-2023/) started in April.
I haven't seen any attempt for them to change the branding on these, just a few have been repainted.
Even just debranding the Gold MMCs would be better than branding a route that no longer exists.
Might have asked this before so apologies if so,but can nBus tickets be bought on Stagecoach buses in Coventry?
Quote from: markcf83 on October 17, 2023, 03:40:33 PMMight have asked this before so apologies if so,but can nBus tickets be bought on Stagecoach buses in Coventry?
Yes it can be, so can the nNetwork and nMetro/Bus variants.
Quote from: markcf83 on October 17, 2023, 03:40:33 PMMight have asked this before so apologies if so,but can nBus tickets be bought on Stagecoach buses in Coventry?
Quote from: jc on October 19, 2023, 03:11:33 PMYes it can be, so can the nNetwork and nMetro/Bus variants.
I don't know if the information is incorrect or out-of-date, but according to TfWM's website, Stagecoach accept nBus and nNetwork but don't sell them:
https://journeyplanner.wmnetwork.co.uk/Operator/Stagecoach%20Midlands
Quote from: Stu on October 19, 2023, 08:12:04 PMI don't know if the information is incorrect or out-of-date, but according to TfWM's website, Stagecoach accept nBus and nNetwork but don't sell them:
https://journeyplanner.wmnetwork.co.uk/Operator/Stagecoach%20Midlands
TfWM's information is out-of-date. I bought an nBus day ticket on the 169 earlier this year, and I see that the Stagecoach website says that they do sell them - although you have to click on "Dayrider" tickets to get to the page: -
https://www.stagecoachbus.com/regionaltickets/midlands/birmingham/dayrider (https://www.stagecoachbus.com/regionaltickets/midlands/birmingham/dayrider)
I guess Stagecoach probably started selling them last year when they began to win TfWM contracts (starting with the 82, 87 and 88).
Quote from: markcf83 on October 17, 2023, 03:40:33 PMMight have asked this before so apologies if so,but can nBus tickets be bought on Stagecoach buses in Coventry?
Yes. Please note they can not be used on Stagecoach services beyond the nBus area.
Thanks to all who responded. Most grateful.
36217 KX60LJA making a rare appearance on the A9
Quote from: BBS on November 03, 2023, 03:35:51 PM36217 KX60LJA making a rare appearance on the A9
Are you sure? It's also tracking on routes in Rugby.
(If correct, it's been on the A9 a few times this week)
Quote from: Stu on November 03, 2023, 04:19:35 PMAre you sure? It's also tracking on routes in Rugby.
(If correct, it's been on the A9 a few times this week)
For some reason 36949 is tracking as 36217 that's why it's on more than one route
Followed 36424 along A45 up to Yardley underpass and very pleasing to see Stagecoach's Remembrance Poppy blinds.
Excellent effort Stagecoach!
They have got a bus fully wrapped in a Royal British Legion decal as well. I think I saw it around Oxford last week. A number of the buses there also had poppies on the front of their buses.
Quote from: ellspurs on November 09, 2023, 11:13:50 AMThey have got a bus fully wrapped in a Royal British Legion decal as well. I think I saw it around Oxford last week. A number of the buses there also had poppies on the front of their buses.
That will be one of the ex South Scanias or,possibly,be 50452-one of the recently transferred coaches for the Oxford Tube.
Only noticed today that the 169 has had another route change in Kings Heath, from Addison Road it continues onto Vicarage Road, then goes via Howard Road to terminate on Alcester Road South.
I would have thought it more beneficial 'connectivity-wise' for passengers if this was reversed, might have a chance of picking up people who might be waiting for the 76.
Quote from: Stu on December 09, 2023, 03:55:21 PMOnly noticed today that the 169 has had another route change in Kings Heath, from Addison Road it continues onto Vicarage Road, then goes via Howard Road to terminate on Alcester Road South.
Yes rerouted to better serve Camp Hill School it was said.
Given the time it takes to get through the lights by the Red Lion at school kicking out time it would be quicker for the kids to walk the quarter of a mile to the High Street.
(Please note, my comment is not a serious proposal)
Quote from: Stu on December 09, 2023, 03:55:21 PMOnly noticed today that the 169 has had another route change in Kings Heath, from Addison Road it continues onto Vicarage Road, then goes via Howard Road to terminate on Alcester Road South.
I would have thought it more beneficial 'connectivity-wise' for passengers if this was reversed, might have a chance of picking up people who might be waiting for the 76.
Despite the 'official' route, I've seen a number of buses carry on to Grove Road and turn on to Tenbury Road rather than turning onto Howard Road, most probably because of the traffic on Howard Road at rush hour.
I think the constant changing quite clearly shows that Kings Heath isn't really the place for buses to turn around, not with the LTN in force at least...
I'm surprised there isn't some wacky interworking with the 46/169 to avoid the buses turning around - and getting stuck in Kings Heath.
There was rumours going around that stagecoach was going to get the 002 (merry hill to weoley castle) on Sundays only, and also a rumour that they was getting the 18 (Dudley to merry hill) it hasent yet happened so I'm assuming it's not true.
Also heard that stagecoach was applying for a depot somewhere in Birmingham I think in hockley but not too sure all these was listed on a website I have a screenshot somewhere, I'm assuming this was not a genuine TFWM website and somone set it up.
Best indicator of Stagecoach having brought a depot in Birmingham would be finding job advertisements or a land purchase agreement/leasing document
Quote from: Wba_lad on January 05, 2024, 09:56:09 PMThere was rumours going around that stagecoach was going to get the 002 (merry hill to weoley castle) on Sundays only, and also a rumour that they was getting the 18 (Dudley to merry hill) it hasent yet happened so I'm assuming it's not true.
Also heard that stagecoach was applying for a depot somewhere in Birmingham I think in hockley but not too sure all these was listed on a website I have a screenshot somewhere, I'm assuming this was not a genuine TFWM website and somone set it up.
Can you provide a link to that website? If it is attempting to impersonate TfWM, then it should be reported to them. The real TfWM website does not deal in rumours.
The Sunday 002 contract was awarded to NX in November, I'm not sure when the 18 contract is up for renewal.
I would personally like to see Stagecoach commit to establishing a proper presence in the West Midlands before they are awarded any further contracts.
Quote from: Stu on January 06, 2024, 04:42:16 PMCan you provide a link to that website? If it is attempting to impersonate TfWM, then it should be reported to them. The real TfWM website does not deal in rumours.
The Sunday 002 contract was awarded to NX in November, I'm not sure when the 18 contract is up for renewal.
I would personally like to see Stagecoach commit to establishing a proper presence in the West Midlands before they are awarded any further contracts.
I'll try and find the website and link it, somewhere I was sent it by someone, I have a screenshot of it too, but not too sure how to link photos. I just wanted to know if it is true or not, but I'm assuming it's fake news because as you said national express covered the 002 route under the X21 route.
QuoteI'll try and find the website and link it, somewhere I was sent it by someone, I have a screenshot of it too, but not too sure how to link photos. I just wanted to know if it is true or not, but I'm assuming it's fake news because as you said national express covered the 002 route under the X21 route.
Attachment underneath a post reply to attach photos.
If it's fake news or you believe it is fake news don't post it unless you have firm evidence please
Quote from: Wba_lad on January 06, 2024, 07:12:57 PMI'll try and find the website and link it, somewhere I was sent it by someone, I have a screenshot of it too, but not too sure how to link photos. I just wanted to know if it is true or not, but I'm assuming it's fake news because as you said national express covered the 002 route under the X21 route.
Did you find it on discord?
It looks like Stagecoach have very subtly ammended the 46's timetable and route around Kings Heath. It looks like the service no longer offers a clockface 30-minute frequency towards the QE whilst it does on the way back. What's most impressive, however, is that TfWM seem completely unaware of it- no timetable posters have been changed and nothing has been posted on their website!
Quote from: bususer28 on January 09, 2024, 03:34:49 PMIt looks like Stagecoach have very subtly ammended the 46's timetable and route around Kings Heath. It looks like the service no longer offers a clockface 30-minute frequency towards the QE whilst it does on the way back. What's most impressive, however, is that TfWM seem completely unaware of it- no timetable posters have been changed and nothing has been posted on their website!
The timetable and route map on the TfWM website is correct.
36216 KX60LHZ making a rare appearance on the 41
Quote from: BBS on January 20, 2024, 01:38:36 PM36216 KX60LHZ making a rare appearance on the 41
According to the VRM lookup we use at work, this only meets Euro4 standards, so wouldn't normally be used on the TfWM contracts.
I notice that Stagecoach recently are back to their old form of cancelling journeys again, presumably this is being used today due to a shortage of Euro6 compliant vehicles.
If Stagecoach want to be taken seriously by TfWM then they need to show some commitment by investing in a local site and some decent vehicles.
Quote from: Stu on January 20, 2024, 05:17:28 PMAccording to the VRM lookup we use at work, this only meets Euro4 standards, so wouldn't normally be used on the TfWM contracts.
I notice that Stagecoach recently are back to their old form of cancelling journeys again, presumably this is being used today due to a shortage of Euro6 compliant vehicles.
If Stagecoach want to be taken seriously by TfWM then they need to show some commitment by investing in a local site and some decent vehicles.
Surely using a Euro 4 bus is better than no bus service at all?
I think most passengers would be more interested in the service running than the Euro rating of the bus! As bad as that sounds.
Quote from: Jack on January 20, 2024, 05:22:52 PMSurely using a Euro 4 bus is better than no bus service at all?
I think most passengers would be more interested in the service running than the Euro rating of the bus! As bad as that sounds.
I agree. I don't know what Stagecoach have been doing or why certain journeys are being cancelled due to 'mechanical issues'.
I know that Rugby only has a small pool of Euro6 vehicles specifically for use on these TfWM contracts. If they don't have enough compliant vehicles for use on them, surely all they have to do is to reach out to TfWM for a 'temporary exemption'.
Which they may have done already, if 36216 was used on the 41 today.
At the end of the day, the TfWM contract may specify using Euro6 buses, but it is better to have some kind of vehicle in use and fulfilling the contracted timetabled journeys in full.
Quote from: Stu on January 20, 2024, 05:32:33 PMI agree. I don't know what Stagecoach have been doing or why certain journeys are being cancelled due to 'mechanical issues'.
I know that Rugby only has a small pool of Euro6 vehicles specifically for use on these TfWM contracts. If they don't have enough compliant vehicles for use on them, surely all they have to do is to reach out to TfWM for a 'temporary exemption'.
Which they may have done already, if 36216 was used on the 41 today.
At the end of the day, the TfWM contract may specify using Euro6 buses, but it is better to have some kind of vehicle in use and fulfilling the contracted timetabled journeys in full.
According to bus times it looks like this was a change bus for 36425 and they had euro 6 buses out on some of the local Rugby routes.
I would guess this could be the only suitable bus available in the garage at short notice and could probably enter service quicker than having to pull a euro 6 bus off another route.
I doubt the passengers noticed anything different to their normal bus anyway.
Do the buses still travel from Rugby everyday or have the a depot in Birmingham now.
Quote from: Mayfield on February 08, 2024, 07:19:28 AMDo the buses still travel from Rugby everyday or have the a depot in Birmingham now.
Nope, still running from Rugby:
https://bustimes.org/vehicles/scmn-36428#journeys/537924195
Have stagecoach been re given the 71 on Sundays
Quote from: Secondary trigger 28 on March 03, 2024, 08:37:40 AMHave stagecoach been re given the 71 on Sundays
Short-term basis:
https://wmbu.org.uk/2024/03/changes-to-71-service-from-sunday-3rd-march-2024/
It's almost reassuring to know that it's not just NX that have issues with buses not tracking!
Took an incredible leap of faith this afternoon, I had need to pop into Kings Heath for some shopping, so I thought I'd whizz over on the 169.
When I checked on BusTimes, there was only one bus tracking towards Solihull with seemingly nothing else coming the other way. I checked on Twitter/X and Stagecoach hadn't reported any cancelled journeys on this route.
I didn't have anything to lose really, if nothing turned up after a bit, I'd just walk up to Billesley Fire Station to get the 11C.
So a few minutes before the 169 was scheduled to arrive, I made the very short walk from my home through to Westridge Road, where I waited at the junction with Dene Hollow.
Lo and behold, actually smack on time, I saw the welcome sight of a bus coming up the road.
I can confirm it is 36428 which is the second bus operating the 169 today, though it's not tracking on BusTimes. Maybe that's why it was empty when I boarded!
36483 noted today on back of Crouch recovery truck on the M6 around 18.00 presumably on the way to Rugby.
Rugby, Leamington and Nuneaton to get electrics, may see these Birmingham service get those too
Quote from: BBS on March 27, 2024, 06:44:02 PMRugby, Leamington and Nuneaton to get electrics, may see these Birmingham service get those too
Birmingham tendered services are Euro 6 spec. Why would Stagecoach allocate more expensive Electric vehicles to Birmingham when there's no obligation. That's without beginning to consider mileage and range!
Quote from: BBS on March 27, 2024, 06:44:02 PMRugby, Leamington and Nuneaton to get electrics, may see these Birmingham service get those too
Have you got any more gen?
If the funding is from ZEBRA 2 I believe it may only be intended for bus routes in Warwickshire so may not cover Birmingham as well?
Quote from: Sandy Lane on March 27, 2024, 09:24:18 PMHave you got any more gen?
If the funding is from ZEBRA 2 I believe it may only be intended for bus routes in Warwickshire so may not cover Birmingham as well?
Correct. According to Warwickshire County Council, the new buses will be used on certain local services in the Warwick District Council area plus Stratford-upon-Avon services 77/78 on Sundays when fewer buses are needed elsewhere.
Quote from: BBS on March 27, 2024, 06:44:02 PMRugby, Leamington and Nuneaton to get electrics, may see these Birmingham service get those too
Nope, not for Birmingham routes:
https://www.warwickshire.gov.uk/news/article/5090/zero-emission-buses-are-set-for-warwickshire-roads-thanks-to-new-funding